Question: Market manipulation or harassment on Queen Bed (C)?

Neil Stockton

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Neil Greenleaf Stockton
Does anyone know why someone is reselling the new Queen Bed Customisable (C) for a fraction of its cost to craft? This is not a "boohoo markup" thread. I'm not personally selling this bed (though I did discover it). There has been some targeted harassment lately in the furniture department, and I'd like to know if the same character is behind this odd market behavior as well.

The item is new, level 7, expensive to make, and limited in quantity. There have been 2 legitimate sales of the bed that I know of, plus 6 fake sales. I say fake because the MU is extremely low, ranging from 12 peds to 72 peds, far below cost to craft. To try and catch these underpriced beds, I put up orders to buy @ +100, and hours after they expired the player started selling more again at the low price.

I have not been able to catch the auctions while they're up, so I don't know who is doing it. I suspect they're using an alt to rebuy so they don't actually lose the MU, since again they are selling far below the cost to craft and refused to sell to my higher order. So far, the motive for this market manipulation is unclear to me... is it to harass a particular seller or does this individual just hate Toulan furniture? :unsure:

Finding out who is doing it is obviously the first step in understanding what's going on. If you saw any of these auctions, please PM me the name privately. Or post any other non-identifying details here. Thanks!
 
What you call market manipulation may be defined by others as a free market. If you look at markup not just on this item but on multiple items across the history of the virtual universe you may start to understand. Yes, it stinks when what you percieve to be worth something starts sinking in markup but peds talk...

Currently due to a variety of things including probably the very reasons you are on Toulan, I suspect there is a marekt saturation of supply for all things Toulan. Maybe it's time to try another planet for a while?

Most high markup on furniture type items are do to newness in the first few months, then prices drop like a rock typically. Patio furniture had same issue a few years ago.
 
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The OP states at least two reasons for suspecting manipulation, both of which, if genuine, are valid for suspiscion at least. There is some poor wording I would say when talking about cost and mu, but I will assume the OP means that the cost to craft requires higher mus to break even. Still, if +72 doesn't break even then there must be quite an mu currently on the mats. Maybe that is unrealistic and the crafter has his/her own sources at less mu? Just trying to be neutral - I've not seen the bp requirements. But I am on Toulan with an eye on mus at the moment, as I like the idea of all mat drops having a use, as has been stated as one of Toulan's aims. The question of what is a fair mu for a whole variety of mats that make clothing or furniture is one I find interesting.
 
One possible cause for extremely low markups could be two avatars on different planets using auction simply as a means of transporting things.

That would be a dick move of dubious legality, of course, but at least would explain it.
 
Could also be that the seller speculated on a bidding war, did set up low min-bid and then the bidding war just didn't happen and the item just sold for low MU. Seen stuff like that happening on several items.
 
In the low min-bid scenario the item would be in AH for at least 24 hrs. If several times, I would assume the OP would then have definitely caught sight of it at some point to be able to identify the seller. Sherlock Holmes says nope, assuming we believe the OP. Low mu transportation between friends would be a much more plausible explanation, but how often?
 
Does anyone know why someone is reselling the new Queen Bed Customisable (C) for a fraction of its cost to craft?

Your bolded statement is the entire crafting market, including mining amps.

People are not very smart.
 
Most high markup on furniture type items are do to newness in the first few months, then prices drop like a rock typically.

Not the situation here, please review the markup history of the item in question, along with its cost to craft.
 
I will assume the OP means that the cost to craft requires higher mus to break even. Still, if +72 doesn't break even then there must be quite an mu currently on the mats. Maybe that is unrealistic and the crafter has his/her own sources at less mu?

Yes, that is correct. The BP is moderately rare, limited, and the materials have very high MUs. It is possible that someone who had lots of materials sitting in storage randomly looted a level 7 BP, and said, hey, I can make 6 of these beds and then sell them for dirt cheap buyouts without looking at the current MU, and when one sells like a hotcake at +72, I'll list the next one at +12 peds. Possible, but I'm marking it on my list of very unlikely things in EU, beside me getting an ATH.
 
One possible cause for extremely low markups could be two avatars on different planets using auction simply as a means of transporting things.

Yes, that is possible, but against the interests of both buyer and seller as these prices are significantly below the long term markup I expect this item to settle at.
 
In the low min-bid scenario the item would be in AH for at least 24 hrs. If several times, I would assume the OP would then have definitely caught sight of it at some point to be able to identify the seller. Sherlock Holmes says nope, assuming we believe the OP. Low mu transportation between friends would be a much more plausible explanation, but how often?

Yes, that is the case here. The low sales were not minimum bids, they were buyouts that were of course picked up very quickly. Yes, if it was one or two low sales, I could see it as an interplanetary transport situation, but 6 in a row? Can't rule it out, but I suspect it's the same bed. It takes a lot of effort to collect mats for a few clicks.
 
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Your bolded statement is the entire crafting market, including mining amps.

People are not very smart.

Let's put it in different terms: You sell two level 13 amps at +85 ped, then someone lists 6 of them for about +2 ped BO. This is not the normal crafting market behavior. I fully agree there are crafters out there with abysmal math skills, not to mention the "reverse resellers" who buy high and sell low. But you can see those scenarios are unlikely in this case.
 
Without being aware of the specific situation, I agree with you. Because there is no free trade in the EU, only manipulated trade. And that will not change as long as there is hand-to-hand trade. As long as there is no Order War as in Sales, there will be no balance in the game. The fault of MA is as much as the fault of these "traders".

The EU has the most focking trading system that has ever existed and in the future.
 
Or someone drunk was thinking he/she put it in for +120 but got it wrong and did +12 instead.... stuff like that is not unheard of here in the forum ^^
 
Or someone drunk was thinking he/she put it in for +120 but got it wrong and did +12 instead.... stuff like that is not unheard of here in the forum ^^

If so, they drank way too much last week. Could be someone who got their account hacked and hasn't realized yet, or a small child or angry teenager guessed their password, or my favorite: multiple personality disorder where one personality has a vendetta against the personality who crafts. Could be a torture situation... I'll keep selling off your beds until you give me the access code to your secret lab! So many possibilities.
 

I think it is enough just to open a public topic after the next dubious situation. Don't expect a sensible conversation in this forum. Thinking people do not take part and stay away from any conflict situation in order to maintain their 'reputation', despite the fact that the platform in which they have invested a lot is rotten by rats.
 
... I suspect it's the same bed.
Finally EU gets some drama around the subject of beds ;). If it were a transportation thing then the buyer and seller wouldn't need to care much about the mu "between friends" upsetting the history, but when I had a brief look at the history from the order I presume you put up I saw it started at something like +1k. Maybe someone was indeed being spiteful by trying to destroy the mu by using one bed several times, but doesn't have access to more for trading at a profit themselves...
 
The item is new, level 7, expensive to make, and limited in quantity.

since wiki doesn't have the info yet.
Maybe show/tell us what it's made of.

I doubt it's made purely out of hansidian or rugaritz ingots.
 
since wiki doesn't have the info yet.
Maybe show/tell us what it's made of.

Good point, forgot you can't look up L BPs' ingredients. I don't have the BP on me and don't have the specifics written down, but it's high MU Toulan mats. I'll try to track it down and get that in the wiki.
 
define high MU. 5k% MU across the board?
Because if it's only something like 300% in average, then you're at 50-60 PED to make a bed.

I think you're getting hung up on the exact cost to craft (which would vary due to the shortness of these runs and how the mats are obtained). The point is that someone is selling an item, possibly a single item over and over, well outside the limits of normal behavior for sales of newly discovered items. The point is it's a red flag that TOS may be being violated.
 
well outside the limits of normal behavior for sales of newly discovered items.

Furniture is different to stuff like guns etc. Furniture looses value a lot faster.
Yellow relaxo chairs as example:

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When you have an item that sold 5 times over a course of a month with markup ranging from +10 to +1000 - you basically dont trust the figure shown in markup history.

Come here make a PC, try to sell it in a thread, or just list it at what you consider "fair price". Market for furniture and clothes is very very low volume and if you really want to sell a certain item fast you have to bring price down a lot. Same goes if you really want to buy an item fast - since there are prolly no sellers around at the time you are in a mood to buy.

I.
 
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