Suggestion: Open letter to MindArk: Fix Entropia Universe

[Azgarot]

ANY gamer that cycle over 100k per month has some UL gears, possibily 100% to reduce MU consumption
as i said ATM we just have Enhancers market but due to the fact that all ppl knows it, they kill for output and mine in PVP3
so... output fell to 120% and so did Pyrite....
we have a market for tiering up weapons, and for socket components as a second level of supply chain
RDI supply unlimited amoutns of emerald, opal, duamonds... again we need fresh money into game or prices and mu level will go flat to 101%

Msturlese, I forgot to reply to you earlier, you are generally correct in the way you observe the economy and I would like to thank you for your insight and for your involvement in the thread. Absolutely, we need more players and new money to be deposited. However, the reality is that it wouldn't be only new players who'd pour more money into the game, it would be all of us, old players as well but most of us are playing an economy game here in Entropia and the current state of the economy in Entropia is extremely bad. I can't justify putting a single cent into Entropia right now because I don't see a purpose to this in the current state of the game. This is why I am so focused on the oversupply of materials in my thread, natural demand can't consume all the materials being grinded by a huge margin. However, if the supply was brought down to natural means (i.e. manual grinding instead of botting), markups would naturally go a little higher. Surely not by too much but just about enough to give an opportunity to the playerbase overall to either make a small profit here and there or at the very least to reduce the cost to play significantly. The money would be going from hand to hand, of course because no new PED can be generated as you explained earlier but it would be a much healthier economy which would have the ability to attract new players and keep them around long enough to get hooked and join the rest of us degenerates

The way things are now, low and medium players have absolutely no way of surviving in this economy, they are getting slaughtered left and right. Their TT losses are higher and the markup is non-existent.

 

[Creo]

Msturlese, I forgot to reply to you earlier, you are generally correct in the way you observe the economy and I would like to thank you for your insight and for your involvement in the thread. Absolutely, we need more players and new money to be deposited. However, the reality is that it wouldn't be only new players who'd pour more money into the game, it would be all of us, old players as well but most of us are playing an economy game here in Entropia and the current state of the economy in Entropia is extremely bad. I can't justify putting a single cent into Entropia right now because I don't see a purpose to this in the current state of the game. This is why I am so focused on the oversupply of materials in my thread, natural demand can't consume all the materials being grinded by a huge margin. However, if the supply was brought down to natural means (i.e. manual grinding instead of botting), markups would naturally go a little higher. Surely not by too much but just about enough to give an opportunity to the playerbase overall to either make a small profit here and there or at the very least to reduce the cost to play significantly. The money would be going from hand to hand, of course because no new PED can be generated as you explained earlier but it would be a much healthier economy which would have the ability to attract new players and keep them around long enough to get hooked and join the rest of us degenerates

The way things are now, low and medium players have absolutely no way of surviving in this economy, they are getting slaughtered left and right. Their TT losses are higher and the markup is non-existent.

Those playing eco and responsibly knowing their risk of ruin are not being slaughtered.
It is the players who play casually or without regard to their deposits or spend that are getting massacred.

EU has always been a player war against the attrition of our ped card with or without bots.

If the current market is unsuitable for your play...recalculate your risk of ruin and go from there.
Re-evaluate how much you are willing to spend and lose as well as your goal of play.

Another large issue here is the vast majority of players INABILITY to be flexible and ADAPT to the changing market
as well as the changing game environment.

Now lowering UL item and material markup on the other hand is destroying us all as a whole.

 

[Azgarot]

Those playing eco and responsibly knowing their risk of ruin are not being slaughtered.
It is the players who play casually or without regard to their deposits or spend that are getting massacred.

EU has always been a player war against the attrition of our ped card with or without bots.

If the current market is unsuitable for your play...recalculate your risk of ruin and go from there.
Re-evaluate how much you are willing to spend and lose as well as your goal of play.

Another large issue here is the vast majority of players INABILITY to be flexible and ADAPT to the changing market
as well as the changing game environment.

If a new player has a return of 94%-96% at best (low efficiency and low looter levels) and their average markup is between 100.7% and 102%, they are getting slaughtered.

How do you adapt to automated oversupply in the market?
How does a human player compete in events?

Now lowering UL item and material markup on the other hand is destroying us all as a whole.

I don't understand what is your point here, can you please elaborate?

 

[Creo]

If a new player has a return of 94%-96% at best (low efficiency and low looter levels) and their average markup is between 100.7% and 102%, they are getting slaughtered.

How do you adapt to automated oversupply in the market?
How does a human player compete in events?



I don't understand what is your point here, can you please elaborate?

The expectation is that those with the lowest skill will also have the lowest returns.
Is your expectation different from this? If so, how do you think it actually works?

If those new players are cycling 100ped a day and losing 4-6ped. I hardly call this a slaughter.

i.e. With an HK110 you will not be able to cycle more than 100ped a day shooting continuously for 10+ hours.

Do you call this a slaughter? 4-6ped a day loss? This is a joke right?

There is no slaughter. Yes, the war of attrition is at a very high level now but you forget the basic key points:

• The player chooses how much and how long they cycle and the expected loss for that time period.
• The player chooses the weapon they use.
• The player chooses to wear armor or hunt naked.
• The player chooses the mob they hunt.
• The player chooses how much of a bank roll they will maintain and when to stop playing.
• etc...

Nobody is 'forced' into a slaughter here. If you cannot soak the potential loss with your given setup
for a specific mob over a given set of time and you're unwilling to change things up (INFLEXIBLE) the best move is to not play.

In the other statement I made I am stating that low material markup as well as declining Markup for UL
is truly destroying not only the game but our ped cards.


Now given... I hate auto-play, afk, botters who mercilessly grind this game into dust lowering
markups to the lowest of lows.

But lets be clear, we as players CHOOSE how much we allow this to affect our ped card.

 

[smoothee]

we as players CHOOSE how much we allow this to affect our ped card.

He's saying that the optimal strategy for playing this game is to not play at all. And you're defending it.

If there's no way to win, then what's the point? It stops being a "game" and becomes a "scam". Personally, my losses are unsustainable. The cost for entertainment I get is absurd

Ok so how did we get here?
Incompetence and complacency? certainly, 100%
Malice? I think that's the real question to be asked. Are they actively trying to cash out?

 

[Creo]

He's saying that the optimal strategy for playing this game is to not play at all. And you're defending it.

If there's no way to win, then what's the point? It stops being a "game" and becomes a "scam". Personally, my losses are unsustainable. The cost for entertainment I get is absurd

Ok so how did we get here?
Incompetence and complacency? certainly, 100%
Malice? I think that's the real question to be asked. Are they actively trying to cash out?

Damn straight. The player has the greatest responsibility for all the losses that they incur.

You are really asking how you got here? So you take no responsibility at all for the losses you have incurred?

Really mindblowing. If you get an amazing drop...oh you won!!! If you have losses... It's a SCAM! It's MA's fault! They are incompetent
and complacent! What's the point no way to win! Malice!

You chose your gear, your mob, your bank roll etc... but most of all YOU CHOSE TO PLAY knowing the RISK.

Why is there crying for losses sustained due to decisions made by the player?!

If you did everything right...how could you have not seen the potential for the losses you have incurred?

Totally speechless.

 

[flipflap]

EU is an "economic PVP" disguised with activities.
once a player cycles more than 300.000 ped per month it is perfectly visible that randomnes does not exist but return are mean reverting.
i come from WOW, Thang, D3, Cabal.

ideas to sink are easy.. we have in game code for SI increase of ships....
Want a lore for armor? 1 minute
"RDI Scientist have found a way to increase armor stats, deliver 3 rat tails, 4 rat theet and 1 rat eye to the ratmaster and your piece of armor will increase 1 stat of the desidered stat.
It can also be refined up to Perfected, each of adj, iomp, mod, aug, perf will decrease decay, add avoidance, critical rate, critical damage, decrease critical, block depending on level.... here it is 1 year grinding, just let one piece per week upgrade.. voila 7 weeks, upgrade capability will ahve a "service value".

same for pistols, let them be upgraded in pwoer, same tiers, each increase eff and damage or fire rate (better, so more amps are destroyed).

we have shitty melee items (cleric series, and such, let them be converted and upgrades... i want a "perfected Katsuichi"

add to armatrix craft a random "refinement" bonus, chance to craft mod, aug, perf that have 75/85/95% eff

so much to play with actuals to revive interest.

as per attracting players, well we need a NON GAMBLER service, maybe a planet with a monthly deposit that allow to grind, but profit made on that zone can not be withdrawn, i dont have a clear idea, but i think about some place with a 15 eur per month like WOW where people can skill, get SOULBOUND items that just work on that planetm create a non withdrawal economy of LOCAL resources, 100% return, where friends can "boost" friends,
as you exit the KINDERGARTEN, actual rules apply....

Finally, a message I like to read: we need to open up the possibility of customizing equipment!

Anyway, I'll stop here, I'm not going to repeat my message outside this summary.

just allow us to customize by obtaining upgrade plans obtained by opening boxes for rare tokens; these upgrades will have to be made as with tier up, by adding x x x and x materials ( it gives back MU ).
the upgrade can then be attached to a weapon armor plates finder extractor vehicle clothing ring ... depending on its type.
an upgrade will bring a bonus in damage, reload, range and efficiency for weapons.
protection for armor, increased durability, eco.

yes, we need to be able to customize and upgrade our equipment, improve efficiency and eco.

these improvements can be attached and detached freely, and sold too.


///////

another point is that of a loan or rental terminal; yes, a loan terminal too.
I'd like to lend a gun to a friend from time to time, but it's always dangerous, and neither of us is immune to an irl problem, with the risk of seeing a loaned item lost forever.
it can't be complicated, like with auctions, to have a terminal that would allow this!
I entrust my weapon to the terminal, I select the friend in question, he will be able to withdraw it, I will determine the duration and he will have to leave a quantity of ped equivalent to the maximum cost of repair; this sum will be returned to him in part or totality automatically; the lender will recover automatically, as with the auctions, his weapon and the tt in ped of the repairs.

It's unbelievable that we haven't yet developed the possibility of renting or lending out equipment in total security!

 

[Creo]

Finally, a message I like to read: we need to open up the possibility of customizing equipment!

Anyway, I'll stop here, I'm not going to repeat my message outside this summary.

just allow us to customize by obtaining upgrade plans obtained by opening boxes for rare tokens; these upgrades will have to be made as with tier up, by adding x x x and x materials ( it gives back MU ).
the upgrade can then be attached to a weapon armor plates finder extractor vehicle clothing ring ... depending on its type.
an upgrade will bring a bonus in damage, reload, range and efficiency for weapons.
protection for armor, increased durability, eco.

yes, we need to be able to customize and upgrade our equipment, improve efficiency and eco.

these improvements can be attached and detached freely, and sold too.


///////

another point is that of a loan or rental terminal; yes, a loan terminal too.
I'd like to lend a gun to a friend from time to time, but it's always dangerous, and neither of us is immune to an irl problem, with the risk of seeing a loaned item lost forever.
it can't be complicated, like with auctions, to have a terminal that would allow this!
I entrust my weapon to the terminal, I select the friend in question, he will be able to withdraw it, I will determine the duration and he will have to leave a quantity of ped equivalent to the maximum cost of repair; this sum will be returned to him in part or totality automatically; the lender will recover automatically, as with the auctions, his weapon and the tt in ped of the repairs.

It's unbelievable that we haven't yet developed the possibility of renting or lending out equipment in total security!

I think that is kind of the point. Lending items should be dangerous. MA should stay out of player created dynamics. (Sandbox right?)

The world is a risky, unsure, unsafe place that we all take chances in everyday.

Keep yourself covered by making sure they trade you something of equivalent or greater value you can hold as collateral.

 

[smoothee]

Why is there crying for losses sustained due to decisions made by the player?!

The decision is "Do I log in?"

Over long enough time, any activity in here currently is a big loss. I don't believe that there's any way that I can reliably find the markup to offset that loss. I could buy more ultra expensive gear but that's an even faster way to lose.

The 'rake' on this casino is just too high for the entertainment provided.

Please note the signup date you see in my profile. I've seen this company make self-destructive decisions for a very long time. They seem to have an extremely tough time thinking past the financial statement of the current year.

 

[James Jimbo Linehan]

We should try our best not to derail this very important topic. The Fact is MA broke the game. People are leaving in droves. Not because they want to play another game, they want to play THIS game. If people including myself could sell everything out real easy and be done with it from what direction MA has been going with making everything worthless so fast and killing all markup with their decisions and mostly bad balancing, I'd probably leave at this point. This coming from a die hard fan of this game.

Personally I'm at the point where deposits have been 0 and will be 0 and I'm not alone on that (not sure how they can keep lights on with deposits going lower and lower). Next step is firesale anything you can and leave someone else holding the remaining bag (many on this step). MA doesn't have long to smarten up and hire a balance manager before this game is toast. It's not too late and can be fixed IF they want to.

Again great ideas (RM + space mining etc) and great updates and some good content but terrible implementation with bad balancing and bugs,exploits. The whole game now to have any chance at possible profit is race to newest update take advantage of whatever bugs/exploits or bad balancing you can find and load up the auction before anyone else realizes.

This games lasted 20 years because it was knowledge, investment, skills game with an economy that depended on the other professions constantly and kept money moving person to person (not person to company only, like it is now). We got to get back to the roots of success.

If you add more of a resource you need a new way for someone to use the resource. If you add 100 million more UL items you need 100 million more players etc.

If you want to keep bots in game fine, find a way to burn millions of ped in mats per day.
If you want to add a new profession with same resources fine, add a new way to use up at LEAST the influx of new mats or cap it low/hr.

BALANCE.

 

[Azgarot]

The expectation is that those with the lowest skill will also have the lowest returns.
Is your expectation different from this? If so, how do you think it actually works?

If those new players are cycling 100ped a day and losing 4-6ped. I hardly call this a slaughter.

i.e. With an HK110 you will not be able to cycle more than 100ped a day shooting continuously for 10+ hours.

Do you call this a slaughter? 4-6ped a day loss? This is a joke right?

I don't think any serious debate can be held if we trivialize things and look at the raw PED amounts, be it loss or profit. I would never advise anyone to look at flat numbers when considering finances, be it in Entropia Universe or real life. One must look at percentages.

To answer your question, it's not a joke and yes, they are being slaughtered at that level of play with such losses.

Damn straight. The player has the greatest responsibility for all the losses that they incur.

You are really asking how you got here? So you take no responsibility at all for the losses you have incurred?

Really mindblowing. If you get an amazing drop...oh you won!!! If you have losses... It's a SCAM! It's MA's fault! They are incompetent
and complacent! What's the point no way to win! Malice!

You chose your gear, your mob, your bank roll etc... but most of all YOU CHOSE TO PLAY knowing the RISK.

Why is there crying for losses sustained due to decisions made by the player?!

If you did everything right...how could you have not seen the potential for the losses you have incurred?

Totally speechless.

In the recent days / weeks, we have been involved in some of the same threads on PCF and what I was able to conclude from your replies is that you have this habit, almost as if it's a need to oppose anything and everything everyone else are saying and you keep making these statements off of your high horse, often even twisting the words said by the other party.

First of all, to say that the optimal way to play is not to play at all is nonsense. I don't see how you'd think that this is constructive in any way, this is why I asked you on purpose to elaborate because I wasn't sure if I was understanding your point correctly.

Second, I am not asking how I got where I am, please take your time and re-read the OP, as well as further discussions, I was pointing out problems with the game. I hope that we can all agree that these are genuine issues, not because some AzGarot says so but because they really are, objectively speaking. Bots are a problem, balancing is a huge problem in our game, this is evident by just looking at the stats available to us as players.

Third, where was I ever crying? Just so we understand each other correctly, my returns are very good. For a player of my level with similar gear, there are opportunities in Entropia that practically guarantee profit. This is not the issue here, the issue is that the game is dying because the low and middle level players are getting destroyed by the lack of markup and oversupply caused by botting. They are the ones paying the price because botting is rampant in Entropia. The very high level players are playing a different game entirely.

Fourth, nobody does everything right so I sure as hell didn't do everything right but overall, I am not hemorrhaging PED, my avatar is profitable.

Fifth, actually, it's me who's speechless, mate. You have been advocating to delete everyone's Mayhem tokens without as much as giving people a chance to get some value out of them. What is the purpose of this anyway? What is going through your mind as you are advocating this? Just please, don't give me the same old "not everyone can be winners" because the way MindArk has been operating the Mayhem Token Trader, it made sense for people to work on accumulating their tokens over the course of multiple Mayhems. Had there been a statement in the past saying that the vendor will not be restocked, as was the case with the TWEN vendor, then I would wholeheartedly agree with you but this is a different scenario. We can't allow these people to be left holding the bag, there should be something for them to make their efforts and expenses worthwhile. If you read the OP, you already know that I even said that there should be no restocks in the future but it should be made clear in advance.

The bottom line is, you really should get off your high horse, take a look around and objectively judge the state the game is in today. I don't want Entropia to be changed in a way that benefits me, I would like Entropia to be improved in a way that will attract new players and in turn live on for many decades to come.

Again, same tactic, opposing someone for the sake of opposing them even if their suggestion is valid and could be useful to the playerbase:

I think that is kind of the point. Lending items should be dangerous. MA should stay out of player created dynamics. (Sandbox right?)

The world is a risky, unsure, unsafe place that we all take chances in everyday.

Keep yourself covered by making sure they trade you something of equivalent or greater value you can hold as collateral.

A system suggested by the other user could be beneficial, it could even be improved to allow people to rent their items through this system. Again, you are comparing this to the real world but in the real world, we have systems like this. Just recently, I made a very large loan to a business partner and friend of mine who had a large acquisition for his company. My attorney wrote up a contract, we took it to the notary and afterwards I transferred him the loan, yet I was protected in this process. Lending things of value doesn't have to be dangerous in the real world, as you stated above.

@Creo, I would like to kindly ask you not to derail this thread from the OP, you are going left and right with your statements and I would really like MindArk to actually get a chance to see what was said here for an odd chance they decide to act on any of these subjects. If you would like to have a discussion on a different topic, please open another thread and we can discuss that there. This thread is essentially not about returns and player losses, this thread is about the fundamental issues that are affecting Entropia. Again, please read the OP and you will see what I mean.

This games lasted 20 years because it was knowledge, investment, skills game with an economy that depended on the other professions constantly and kept money moving person to person (not person to company only, like it is now). We got to get back to the roots of success.

If you add more of a resource you need a new way for someone to use the resource. If you add 100 million more UL items you need 100 million more players etc.

If you want to keep bots in game fine, find a way to burn millions of ped in mats per day.
If you want to add a new profession with same resources fine, add a new way to use up at LEAST the influx of new mats or cap it low/hr.

BALANCE.

True words, James, thank you for that, mate. I couldn't agree more that Entropia needs a dedicated person in charge of balancing the game. By reading the different threads on PCF, I see that this is a sentiment shared between some of the strongest avatars in the game. I don't think that's a coincidence, what boggles my mind is how didn't MindArk already hire someone for this position. Part of me truly hopes that they will, sooner rather than later.

 

[Raixander Raix Leecan]

We should try our best not to derail this very important topic. The Fact is MA broke the game. People are leaving in droves. Not because they want to play another game, they want to play THIS game. If people including myself could sell everything out real easy and be done with it from what direction MA has been going with making everything worthless so fast and killing all markup with their decisions and mostly bad balancing, I'd probably leave at this point. This coming from a die hard fan of this game.

Personally I'm at the point where deposits have been 0 and will be 0 and I'm not alone on that (not sure how they can keep lights on with deposits going lower and lower). Next step is firesale anything you can and leave someone else holding the remaining bag (many on this step). MA doesn't have long to smarten up and hire a balance manager before this game is toast. It's not too late and can be fixed IF they want to.

Again great ideas (RM + space mining etc) and great updates and some good content but terrible implementation with bad balancing and bugs,exploits. The whole game now to have any chance at possible profit is race to newest update take advantage of whatever bugs/exploits or bad balancing you can find and load up the auction before anyone else realizes.

This games lasted 20 years because it was knowledge, investment, skills game with an economy that depended on the other professions constantly and kept money moving person to person (not person to company only, like it is now). We got to get back to the roots of success.

If you add more of a resource you need a new way for someone to use the resource. If you add 100 million more UL items you need 100 million more players etc.

If you want to keep bots in game fine, find a way to burn millions of ped in mats per day.
If you want to add a new profession with same resources fine, add a new way to use up at LEAST the influx of new mats or cap it low/hr.

BALANCE.

People are leaving in droves? Sry, what timeframe are we talking about here? After Covid when every game suffered player count loss? Or after space mining was implemented? Can you provide some data, it's a bit confusing.

And, MA adding more ways to get recources has no correlation to amount of mats moving around. Im pretty sure, as killing an asteroid is more time consuming than doing planetside mining or hunting, amount of resources is actually a bit less than before space mining. I have no data on that, tho, just guess. There's no big reason for MU drop for regular mats. Crafting moved from mining amps and armatrix to Sleipnirs, Pioneers and lasers. People still do planetside things also. If there is a MU drop on regular mats then it's mostly artificial. Different case about rare mats ofcourse. That's why i was suggesting to make pills craftable with rares and replace them from everywhere with L blueprints. Big market, lot to sink into.

Some players, not saying it's you, seem after 20 years of forum posts still have a idea that everyone should at least break even in this game. Players like to compare EU with a big C(we do not say that word). Not correct. What EU is, is a exact copy of a poker site. We all depo, 90% gets to play for that money and depo again. Rest 10%. the smartest of the player base, breaks even or makes profit.

Pokersite, however, has a basically neverchanging balance. I do agree with you that things here are out of balance. If top smartest players(not me) lose a chance to break even or make profit, the game dies. If MU is lost, game dies. Incoming resources heavily outweight market, game dies. Simple as that. Is the game dead now? Not by a mile. Things just need rethinking by MA.

 

[Raixander Raix Leecan]

One more thing. Reading posts here, time to time i come by to things like" We need a new resource sink, we need another gun line like armatrix " or similar. Everything new added that makes a player choose between old and new does not increase consumption. A new buff pill does not add to consumption. It just makes more choices. What is needed, is making a resource sink from something existing or add something completely new and at the same time hugely needed. And it's a bit easier to use old stuff than add new.

 

[Count0]

I never understood people upset due to low MU (original poster and others).
1. MU is a zero sum game (if you don't know what this is, educate yourself). If YOU (the one upset) want 200% for your stuff, someone has to pay that MU, it`s that simple. You can't say low MU is bad for EVERYONE, people buying your stuff are very happy to pay 110% instead of 200%.
You want to sell your stuff for 200% (and buyers to be happy), pay 101% when you need something (andsellers to be happy), and probably expect almost no one in game to go for that 200% MU items you`re selling? Well, it`s not possible.
2. In my opinion, the lower the MU for the vast majority of stackables in game, the better! Why? because low MU means more cycling, more money for MA, and a healthy company that makes money keep on running. If average MU is 102%, it depends ONLY on you to find ways to sell it for more, it depends on REAL LIFE skills to be profitable in a competitive environement.

 

[atomicstorm]

Side note:
In these last two days, since I created this thread, I had a lot of communication with different friends in EU and it is amazing how many people actually believe that botting in Entropia is a good thing. So many people believe that MindArk wouldn't be able to keep the game afloat without it that it's scary. What I find scary in this is the effect it has on the economy. We are going towards Unreal Engine 5. Unlike some people, I actually do believe that MindArk will deliver on that promise. But even when we do get Unreal Engine 5 and Entropia gets on the Epic Games (I think this was the plan), the bot problem will persist and I am not sure how many new players we can hope to bring to Entropia given the underlying issue.

You didn't talk to me - but I don't believe Mindark can keep the game afloat without botting. It's just simple math. That's how Mindark makes all its revenue. They will have to change their business/economic model. That requires competent people at the helm instead of no one at all or shifting that to the new tech buzzword AI. It doesn't mean it should exist. It means "mInDaRk sHoUlD aDaPt". I say that satirical because the onus has always been on us to adapt but Mindark has not taken that responsibility. They created this problem. They can end it with 2 changes. But their revenue will take an even further hit. It would be on the community to ensure that doesn't happen and I think we are beyond that point. At the same time, they have to make these changes because they're gonna be screwed if they don't - long term.

 

[Creo]

The decision is "Do I log in?"

Over long enough time, any activity in here currently is a big loss. I don't believe that there's any way that I can reliably find the markup to offset that loss. I could buy more ultra expensive gear but that's an even faster way to lose.

The 'rake' on this casino is just too high for the entertainment provided.

Please note the signup date you see in my profile. I've seen this company make self-destructive decisions for a very long time. They seem to have an extremely tough time thinking past the financial statement of the current year.

I don't think any serious debate can be held if we trivialize things and look at the raw PED amounts, be it loss or profit. I would never advise anyone to look at flat numbers when considering finances, be it in Entropia Universe or real life. One must look at percentages.

To answer your question, it's not a joke and yes, they are being slaughtered at that level of play with such losses.



In the recent days / weeks, we have been involved in some of the same threads on PCF and what I was able to conclude from your replies is that you have this habit, almost as if it's a need to oppose anything and everything everyone else are saying and you keep making these statements off of your high horse, often even twisting the words said by the other party.

First of all, to say that the optimal way to play is not to play at all is nonsense. I don't see how you'd think that this is constructive in any way, this is why I asked you on purpose to elaborate because I wasn't sure if I was understanding your point correctly.

Second, I am not asking how I got where I am, please take your time and re-read the OP, as well as further discussions, I was pointing out problems with the game. I hope that we can all agree that these are genuine issues, not because some AzGarot says so but because they really are, objectively speaking. Bots are a problem, balancing is a huge problem in our game, this is evident by just looking at the stats available to us as players.

Third, where was I ever crying? Just so we understand each other correctly, my returns are very good. For a player of my level with similar gear, there are opportunities in Entropia that practically guarantee profit. This is not the issue here, the issue is that the game is dying because the low and middle level players are getting destroyed by the lack of markup and oversupply caused by botting. They are the ones paying the price because botting is rampant in Entropia. The very high level players are playing a different game entirely.

Fourth, nobody does everything right so I sure as hell didn't do everything right but overall, I am not hemorrhaging PED, my avatar is profitable.

Fifth, actually, it's me who's speechless, mate. You have been advocating to delete everyone's Mayhem tokens without as much as giving people a chance to get some value out of them. What is the purpose of this anyway? What is going through your mind as you are advocating this? Just please, don't give me the same old "not everyone can be winners" because the way MindArk has been operating the Mayhem Token Trader, it made sense for people to work on accumulating their tokens over the course of multiple Mayhems. Had there been a statement in the past saying that the vendor will not be restocked, as was the case with the TWEN vendor, then I would wholeheartedly agree with you but this is a different scenario. We can't allow these people to be left holding the bag, there should be something for them to make their efforts and expenses worthwhile. If you read the OP, you already know that I even said that there should be no restocks in the future but it should be made clear in advance.

The bottom line is, you really should get off your high horse, take a look around and objectively judge the state the game is in today. I don't want Entropia to be changed in a way that benefits me, I would like Entropia to be improved in a way that will attract new players and in turn live on for many decades to come.

Again, same tactic, opposing someone for the sake of opposing them even if their suggestion is valid and could be useful to the playerbase:



A system suggested by the other user could be beneficial, it could even be improved to allow people to rent their items through this system. Again, you are comparing this to the real world but in the real world, we have systems like this. Just recently, I made a very large loan to a business partner and friend of mine who had a large acquisition for his company. My attorney wrote up a contract, we took it to the notary and afterwards I transferred him the loan, yet I was protected in this process. Lending things of value doesn't have to be dangerous in the real world, as you stated above.

@Creo, I would like to kindly ask you not to derail this thread from the OP, you are going left and right with your statements and I would really like MindArk to actually get a chance to see what was said here for an odd chance they decide to act on any of these subjects. If you would like to have a discussion on a different topic, please open another thread and we can discuss that there. This thread is essentially not about returns and player losses, this thread is about the fundamental issues that are affecting Entropia. Again, please read the OP and you will see what I mean.



True words, James, thank you for that, mate. I couldn't agree more that Entropia needs a dedicated person in charge of balancing the game. By reading the different threads on PCF, I see that this is a sentiment shared between some of the strongest avatars in the game. I don't think that's a coincidence, what boggles my mind is how didn't MindArk already hire someone for this position. Part of me truly hopes that they will, sooner rather than later.

When you can't attack the argument. Attack the person.

Also, the problem is people believing they are 'OWED' something.

This is a game. There are winners and losers. No player is 'OWED' anything.


This game is 'pay to win' not 'pay to guarantee a win'.

 

[Creo]

I don't think any serious debate can be held if we trivialize things and look at the raw PED amounts, be it loss or profit. I would never advise anyone to look at flat numbers when considering finances, be it in Entropia Universe or real life. One must look at percentages.

To answer your question, it's not a joke and yes, they are being slaughtered at that level of play with such losses.



In the recent days / weeks, we have been involved in some of the same threads on PCF and what I was able to conclude from your replies is that you have this habit, almost as if it's a need to oppose anything and everything everyone else are saying and you keep making these statements off of your high horse, often even twisting the words said by the other party.

First of all, to say that the optimal way to play is not to play at all is nonsense. I don't see how you'd think that this is constructive in any way, this is why I asked you on purpose to elaborate because I wasn't sure if I was understanding your point correctly.

Second, I am not asking how I got where I am, please take your time and re-read the OP, as well as further discussions, I was pointing out problems with the game. I hope that we can all agree that these are genuine issues, not because some AzGarot says so but because they really are, objectively speaking. Bots are a problem, balancing is a huge problem in our game, this is evident by just looking at the stats available to us as players.

Third, where was I ever crying? Just so we understand each other correctly, my returns are very good. For a player of my level with similar gear, there are opportunities in Entropia that practically guarantee profit. This is not the issue here, the issue is that the game is dying because the low and middle level players are getting destroyed by the lack of markup and oversupply caused by botting. They are the ones paying the price because botting is rampant in Entropia. The very high level players are playing a different game entirely.

Fourth, nobody does everything right so I sure as hell didn't do everything right but overall, I am not hemorrhaging PED, my avatar is profitable.

Fifth, actually, it's me who's speechless, mate. You have been advocating to delete everyone's Mayhem tokens without as much as giving people a chance to get some value out of them. What is the purpose of this anyway? What is going through your mind as you are advocating this? Just please, don't give me the same old "not everyone can be winners" because the way MindArk has been operating the Mayhem Token Trader, it made sense for people to work on accumulating their tokens over the course of multiple Mayhems. Had there been a statement in the past saying that the vendor will not be restocked, as was the case with the TWEN vendor, then I would wholeheartedly agree with you but this is a different scenario. We can't allow these people to be left holding the bag, there should be something for them to make their efforts and expenses worthwhile. If you read the OP, you already know that I even said that there should be no restocks in the future but it should be made clear in advance.

The bottom line is, you really should get off your high horse, take a look around and objectively judge the state the game is in today. I don't want Entropia to be changed in a way that benefits me, I would like Entropia to be improved in a way that will attract new players and in turn live on for many decades to come.

Again, same tactic, opposing someone for the sake of opposing them even if their suggestion is valid and could be useful to the playerbase:



A system suggested by the other user could be beneficial, it could even be improved to allow people to rent their items through this system. Again, you are comparing this to the real world but in the real world, we have systems like this. Just recently, I made a very large loan to a business partner and friend of mine who had a large acquisition for his company. My attorney wrote up a contract, we took it to the notary and afterwards I transferred him the loan, yet I was protected in this process. Lending things of value doesn't have to be dangerous in the real world, as you stated above.

@Creo, I would like to kindly ask you not to derail this thread from the OP, you are going left and right with your statements and I would really like MindArk to actually get a chance to see what was said here for an odd chance they decide to act on any of these subjects. If you would like to have a discussion on a different topic, please open another thread and we can discuss that there. This thread is essentially not about returns and player losses, this thread is about the fundamental issues that are affecting Entropia. Again, please read the OP and you will see what I mean.



True words, James, thank you for that, mate. I couldn't agree more that Entropia needs a dedicated person in charge of balancing the game. By reading the different threads on PCF, I see that this is a sentiment shared between some of the strongest avatars in the game. I don't think that's a coincidence, what boggles my mind is how didn't MindArk already hire someone for this position. Part of me truly hopes that they will, sooner rather than later.

Trivialize in raw ped amounts? Go test it for yourself then. Fact is that if new players are smart they have GOOD options to exist.

A 5-6 ped loss per day is a joke and can be overcame quite easily and reduced with smart trading.

You also, completely ignored my argument that new players have to have WORSE RETURNS as they are the least skilled.

Do you not believe this is the case? Do you not accept that it is this way?

Not playing IS an optimal strategy when you have no way of profiting and are not willing to RISK losing more ped.
The player has the ultimate choice of if they cycle ped or NOT. If you choose to do so then you accept the possible outcomes.

Players have the ultimate choice of what level of play they are going to pursue.

I never said anything about not recognizing the other issues in the game which have been highlighted especially botters, afkers and the like.
It is great that there is discussion over possibilities in the game I just very much disagree in pandering to players who have had huge losses
because they failed to or ignored reading the market/environment of the game.

If your hunt cannot support you anymore and your taking significant losses...logic says...STOP CYCLING or ADAPT your play to
what you can AFFORD to risk and possibly lose.

What an easy concept...do not spend...what you cannot afford to lose. Common Sense right?

I agree with largely all of your points in the OP.
The point I was trying to make is that players are NOT victims.
We chose to play. We have some responsibility to share in all of this.

Why does MindArk have to subsidize the cost of player decisions to lose ASS loads of Money on tokens when those
tokens have NO value, NO markup and NO promise by MindArk that everyone would have a chance to have them redeemed.

Why should the whole EU community suffer because of the risks taken by those who chose to grind Mayhem to hell
and back AFK, botting and otherwise?!

If you would have read other threads you would see that I called for making Tokens materials used for CRAFTING, having the ability to trade
for (L) weapons, having the ability to trade them for ped by giving them Markup.

So no... my first thought isn't just 'delete them' but it is also not 'GIVE THEM ALL A LOOT 2.0 UL WEAPONS' either.
(But this IS the expectation by token holders to compensate them for their time and investment as if it was guaranteed)

The truth is...Vendors need to be deleted. Mayhems need to be deleted. Tokens need to be removed from the game compensation or not.

Vendor restocks of UL items HURT THE GAME.

It is ironic that you tout support for 'New Players' when in your position you have the most to gain
from them financially. So you can pass off your losses and be made 'whole' again.

 

[Raixander Raix Leecan]

I never understood people upset due to low MU (original poster and others).
1. MU is a zero sum game (if you don't know what this is, educate yourself). If YOU (the one upset) want 200% for your stuff, someone has to pay that MU, it`s that simple. You can't say low MU is bad for EVERYONE, people buying your stuff are very happy to pay 110% instead of 200%.
You want to sell your stuff for 200% (and buyers to be happy), pay 101% when you need something (andsellers to be happy), and probably expect almost no one in game to go for that 200% MU items you`re selling? Well, it`s not possible.
2. In my opinion, the lower the MU for the vast majority of stackables in game, the better! Why? because low MU means more cycling, more money for MA, and a healthy company that makes money keep on running. If average MU is 102%, it depends ONLY on you to find ways to sell it for more, it depends on REAL LIFE skills to be profitable in a competitive environement.

More cycling comes from increased depos not from lower mu and more or less money changing hands ingame. And, no high mu, no high rewards- no ubers. EU would be gone years ago.

 

[James Jimbo Linehan]

I never understood people upset due to low MU (original poster and others).
1. MU is a zero sum game (if you don't know what this is, educate yourself). If YOU (the one upset) want 200% for your stuff, someone has to pay that MU, it`s that simple. You can't say low MU is bad for EVERYONE, people buying your stuff are very happy to pay 110% instead of 200%.
You want to sell your stuff for 200% (and buyers to be happy), pay 101% when you need something (andsellers to be happy), and probably expect almost no one in game to go for that 200% MU items you`re selling? Well, it`s not possible.
2. In my opinion, the lower the MU for the vast majority of stackables in game, the better! Why? because low MU means more cycling, more money for MA, and a healthy company that makes money keep on running. If average MU is 102%, it depends ONLY on you to find ways to sell it for more, it depends on REAL LIFE skills to be profitable in a competitive environement.

This game and economy is complex so we kind of skip over this part in the discussion. There is a psychological factor as well as a ped factor in this game/economy.

The problem is players new and old see 101% MU for everything when they know that they pay auction fees and they don't get back 100% of their cycle so they see no opportunity and want to quit or not even really start investing in their avatar if new. They see no point in paying 50k ped for an item that will make them more because MA is seen pumping out exponential higher amounts of more UL items/tokens making them have no chance of recouping enough regular MU on mats over the year to cover what they lost on the item devaluation alone (unless botting 24/7).

Back in the day people and myself had no problem spending 160% MU on a gun someone crafted knowing 10% of the loot we can sell back to the crafter for +110-120% plus a 1% chance of getting an item/chip/armor with nice MU or maybe mega rare loot worth 30k ped etc. And money kept changing hands and there were perpetual oppurtunities with crafting outside of just main events or new feature exploits/balancing problems so we knew there was always potential and it was fun even if you were down at the moment simply because you could see the opportunities everywhere. You knew it was 100% your fault and lack of skills or knowledge or gear in game if you lost. Back then people wouldn't even list items on auction for under 110% sometimes 105% depending on the item like eye oil and TT the rest. Now people fight to be the lowest with 100.48% etc. It's not good psychologically or for your wallet seeing numbers like that. Numbers like that will not attract players.

What botting did to hunting mats is what space mining is now doing to mining mats. Combine that with the fact MA increased supply big time while making less sinks for the mats. Then at same time crash the gear market with more and more ULs which then also kills crafting more because now no one needs anything limited at all. The only thing left in game for crafting was planet mining amps and with space mining there is no need for them. Don't even need to craft mining lasers for space because most of the people who bought limited amps are now just using the pretty strong MU free TT ones (because why not, can still get gems and redulite/igni whether the tailings come from lootable M-type or risk free lvl 1 C-type asteroids). The mining lasers that are taking the demand away from amps don't even use the resources that are now unlimited in amounts. Things have never been this bad as long as I've been playing (2009 off + on)

 

[Azgarot]

I never understood people upset due to low MU (original poster and others).
1. MU is a zero sum game (if you don't know what this is, educate yourself). If YOU (the one upset) want 200% for your stuff, someone has to pay that MU, it`s that simple. You can't say low MU is bad for EVERYONE, people buying your stuff are very happy to pay 110% instead of 200%.
You want to sell your stuff for 200% (and buyers to be happy), pay 101% when you need something (andsellers to be happy), and probably expect almost no one in game to go for that 200% MU items you`re selling? Well, it`s not possible.
2. In my opinion, the lower the MU for the vast majority of stackables in game, the better! Why? because low MU means more cycling, more money for MA, and a healthy company that makes money keep on running. If average MU is 102%, it depends ONLY on you to find ways to sell it for more, it depends on REAL LIFE skills to be profitable in a competitive environement.

I am not upset about the low average markup, I am upset because of the underlying reason markup is so low. I think we all understand that markup comes from other players, that's is no secret. Besides, low markup doesn't mean more cycling, if anything, it means less because there is less opportunities. At least for the majority of people, this is the case.

When you can't attack the argument. Attack the person.

Also, the problem is people believing they are 'OWED' something.

This is a game. There are winners and losers. No player is 'OWED' anything.


This game is 'pay to win' not 'pay to guarantee a win'.

I didn't mean to attack you, I merely said what seems to be the case judging by every single reply to every single thread I read from you. Now, please put this to rest, I didn't spend hours writing the OP so that I could have an offtopic conversation with you, Creo, with all due respect. Again, raw numbers mean nothing, percentages are everything. Here is an off the top of my head example: my electricity bill goes up by 5 USD during the summer when my expenditure is at its lowest point. I don't say "Ah, it's only five bucks, forget it. I say, God damn it, this is a 50% increase because my summer bills are 10 dollars each. This means then when the winter comes, this same 50% is gonna cost me an additional 150 dollars every month." And to answer that question that you asked the second time, of course a low level player is gonna have lower returns, this is by design but once again, this has nothing to do with the core point that I was trying to bring attention to in the OP...

Now, if you wish to have a debate on another subject, please open another thread, thank you.

You didn't talk to me - but I don't believe Mindark can keep the game afloat without botting. It's just simple math. That's how Mindark makes all its revenue. They will have to change their business/economic model. That requires competent people at the helm instead of no one at all or shifting that to the new tech buzzword AI. It doesn't mean it should exist. It means "mInDaRk sHoUlD aDaPt". I say that satirical because the onus has always been on us to adapt but Mindark has not taken that responsibility. They created this problem. They can end it with 2 changes. But their revenue will take an even further hit. It would be on the community to ensure that doesn't happen and I think we are beyond that point. At the same time, they have to make these changes because they're gonna be screwed if they don't - long term.

For real, fiva dolla, I didn't but I have to say, you have seen this a long time ago, man. It's a shame that nothing has changed since you first voiced your concerns. I wonder where EU would be today, had they acted sooner. Time will tell, I suppose. Truth be told, I am probably wasting my precious time with this thread but I didn't want to be one of those who complain, yet never put in any effort to voice their concerns and try to engage the community for a very slim chance that MindArk will actually do something for once.

 

[atomicstorm]

For real, fiva dolla, I didn't but I have to say, you have seen this a long time ago, man. It's a shame that nothing has changed since you first voiced your concerns. I wonder where EU would be today, had they acted sooner. Time will tell, I suppose. Truth be told, I am probably wasting my precious time with this thread but I didn't want to be one of those who complain, yet never put in any effort to voice their concerns and try to engage the community for a very slim chance that MindArk will actually do something for once.

There was a quote that got me hired once.

Question: I was asked how do you persuade people to get things done?

Answer: You try to make a compelling case based on available information. However, if they are being a wall (or stubborn), there's really only 3 things that can happen - either you knock down the wall, you burn out trying to knock it down, or you walk away. It all depends on if you think you can make a difference and if the energy is worth it.

If you aren't being listened to - then you can only say your peace and take the actions into your own hands.

 

[Creo]

I didn't mean to attack you, I merely said what seems to be the case judging by every single reply to every single thread I read from you. Now, please put this to rest, I didn't spend hours writing the OP so that I could have an offtopic conversation with you, Creo, with all due respect. Again, raw numbers mean nothing, percentages are everything. Here is an off the top of my head example: my electricity bill goes up by 5 USD during the summer when my expenditure is at its lowest point. I don't say "Ah, it's only five bucks, forget it. I say, God damn it, this is a 50% increase because my summer bills are 10 dollars each. This means then when the winter comes, this same 50% is gonna cost me an additional 150 dollars every month." And to answer that question that you asked the second time, of course a low level player is gonna have lower returns, this is by design but once again, this has nothing to do with the core point that I was trying to bring attention to in the OP...

Now, if you wish to have a debate on another subject, please open another thread, thank you.

In the next bill period plan try to not use so much electricity if you do not want to pay.

Lower your usage to meet what you are willing to spend.

Regardless, it is your fault you used so much electricity not the electric companies.

Like I said I support almost everything in the OP just believe that we as Players need to be responsible for our own choices in the game.

Decision: Players are responsible for their own actions and the results of those actions.

 

[James Jimbo Linehan]

Truth be told, I am probably wasting my precious time with this thread

MA does listen sometimes they recently fixed the backpack to what they said it's new intended buffs were after nerfing it from us making a thread on it. We have no choice but to voice what's really going on in the game and why #s are low and why people are selling out Or else they will end up listening to just bad ideas from forum trolls who don't even play or understand the game and think that's majority opinion.

However, if they are being a wall (or stubborn), there's really only 3 things that can happen - either you knock down the wall, you burn out trying to knock it down, or you walk away.

True true.. if I didn't care about this game as much as I do I woulda been gone after the first 2/3 major screw ups with balancing but I am definitely starting to get burnt out.. if they dont do something soon I'll probly just take a break this summer should focus on work anyways and getting married in June. Hopefully they balance properly by next winter and maybe you can come back too + the many others.

 

[Raixander Raix Leecan]

Two things stick out to me.

1. To continue as it is MA needs growing player base.
2. To continue as it is, with not growing player base, players need rebalanced game.

EU has never been balanced just because MA had no need for the game to be balanced. The word "balance" probably existed when the game was still on paper but was lost fast.Nothing complex also about EU economy. A really smart 10 year old with imaginary friend can come out with it. Rain the loot, some of it gets used, some gets tt-d. Played the game 3-4 years after it came out. Only difference back then was less items. Probably even less items per person, meaning better value. But no real balance back then eighter. Lots of stuff got tt-d back then as it does now.

To make it work MA needed just 2 things. Constantly growing player base and some "carrots". UL items, Mayhem tokens, shopkeepers, land areas and so on. People looted "carrots", new people needed them, bought them, everyone was happy. Reward existing players with high end items and let them sell it to the new little ubers.Worked like a charm all these years. Until now when suddenly there isnt any new players needing rainbows and unicorns. Ubers sitting on 20 UL items they need and selling 10 items they don't need, not many selling. More item trades than sales probably.

Are the top people in MA incompetent? Well, from one side, they have to eat the shit soup now that has been brewing last 20 years. That's not easy.
From other side, they seem to go with the same old flow. It would def be interesting to know which is more important- players they have now or new player wave that may not come for some time.

 

[Azgarot]

In the next bill period plan try to not use so much electricity if you do not want to pay.

Lower your usage to meet what you are willing to spend.

Regardless, it is your fault you used so much electricity not the electric companies.

Like I said I support almost everything in the OP just believe that we as Players need to be responsible for our own choices in the game.

Decision: Players are responsible for their own actions and the results of those actions.

Thank you for the advice... Albeit, it's not really useful as this was a hypothetical scenario and the sole purpose of it was to show that raw numbers are not the best way to look at economy related issues and that percentages are alpha and the omega.

There was a quote that got me hired once.

Question: I was asked how do you persuade people to get things done?

Answer: You try to make a compelling case based on available information. However, if they are being a wall (or stubborn), there's really only 3 things that can happen - either you knock down the wall, you burn out trying to knock it down, or you walk away. It all depends on if you think you can make a difference and if the energy is worth it.

If you aren't being listened to - then you can only say your peace and take the actions into your own hands.

Personally, I hope to see you back in the game some day, five dolla, you and a few other veterans. That will be a clear sign that things are starting to move in the right direction.

I must say that I appreciate the effort on MindArk's side with today's announcement about balancing. However, using AI for this task won't be without its set of challenges and I truly hope they can overcome them. Another problem is that we can't know for sure what "balancing" means to MindArk and whether we are talking about the same thing. Many of the game areas (certain blueprints, materials etc.) could use an overhaul and many new things can be introduced as part of the balancing process which could in turn boost the economy through the use of looted materials. For example, rare ores and especially gems being in Tailings is a big one right now, this shouldn't have been the case, especially not in such obscenely high amounts. Hopefully this gets addressed before we see CelestAI in action but if they are serious about it, I actually believe that down the line, things will improve. However, if balancing through AI means that this underlying system should be adjusting loot in real time for the players, it won't do anyone any good. Basically, this is how "balancing" can be interpreted but let's hope for the best. Let's hope that we're on the same page and that MindArk is aware that there's a problem with the economy. Time will tell.

 

[DRAGUNOV44]

I will ask you this i've seen many people post recently - They have hearts in the right place and there's a lot of good ideas. However how does that change things ? Before threads got locked claiming they are out of topic. Recent thread got locked after it raches 40+ pages in the course of few weeks. But how does that change it probably - MA will lock saying thank you for the sugestions we will cosnider it. Fact is it dosent change anything whats next ? Days where nobody log in or schdedule ingame protests ? Sad part is untill the game income gets hurt nobody is willing to change anything

 

[Azgarot]

After reading the recent announcement, that can be found HERE, I felt compelled to update the OP once again because I can see MindArk's struggle and the efforts they are putting into fixing the issues that were recognized by the community. Some of those issues were criticized at length in the OP and it's only fair to recognize improvements after criticizing them so harshly in the past. I truly hope that they will find a way to resolve the issue of existing Mayhem Tokens as best as possible but be that as it may, this is a change that I personally very much appreciate.

I only wish they would re-evaluate the presence and, at the very least, the quantity of gems in space mining. Imho, RDI is some of the best content in this game, don't make it redundant, expand on it.

 

[jetsina]

If you've only got one wish, then I find that remarkable.
Personally, if MA have identified that many items are now ready to be tiered, but people aren't doing it, then it could be because of the mus (as the tt itself is returned these days). It is possible that MA would like a higher volume of tiering to take place, which would also presumably boost the consumption of higher tier enhancers.
People will know that I'm quite likely to moan about the terrible balance we sometimes have, or that MA needlessly create, such as the mtokens and rare tokens compared to hand-in availabilities.
Yes, a sudden change can be quite a shock. I try to do things I like during periods when the results are good, but I haven't really mined for years, crafted individual stuff seriously for years, etc. etc.. Sometimes it's because I don't want to relearn new mappings or shift to a different part of the same basic field (crafting).
With new stuff (space mining) there is often a honeymoon period, but for me it lasted for about two weeks, then the loot supply went to very poor.
I think I'm generally quick to shut down my activity when I don't like the outcomes, while others continue for longer. How long until each new addition to the game dies off is a problem, I think, and MA are too slow to respond I think...

 

[SuperKanjo]

After reading the recent announcement, that can be found HERE, I felt compelled to update the OP once again because I can see MindArk's struggle and the efforts they are putting into fixing the issues that were recognized by the community. Some of those issues were criticized at length in the OP and it's only fair to recognize improvements after criticizing them so harshly in the past. I truly hope that they will find a way to resolve the issue of existing Mayhem Tokens as best as possible but be that as it may, this is a change that I personally very much appreciate.

I only wish they would re-evaluate the presence and, at the very least, the quantity of gems in space mining. Imho, RDI is some of the best content in this game, don't make it redundant, expand on it.

Please, it's Mindark here, them saying something isn't worth anything, have to see change first before believing.