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Petition: Fix Wave-Based Loot

Rocket192

Rocket192

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Sean Rocket Connors
Fort said:
Make Entropia Great Again!
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So I decided to try some marcimex for the first time yesterday to confirm some data given to me by another player who had spent significant time on them. Big mistake.

I'll just start with some major points as we all know that item drops are wave-based and it ruins the game for many.


1) wave-based loot encourages botting, Alts, and other ToU violations.. if MA won't ban abusers then take the abusers' source of income away.

2)the wave based system is easily exploitable and results in markup crashes from over-farming from said abusers.

3) the abusers are not at fault for exploiting a flawed system to gain advantage and a RCE game... this is just the way it is and everyone has a right to gain an edge. However, gaining that edge typically involves ToU violations. MA provides a gateway for those ToU violations.

4) exploiting wave loots leads to lower turnover. This harms both MA revenue and CLD revenue. -Aio


I don't really care what replaces the system, but it needs to be less exploitable.
You can add further suggestions, comments, etc. and I'll update this post to contain them.
 
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i've always had issues with wave loot, playing a large amount of my time on cyrene is very noticeable, but better than it use to be. but i'm not sure what effect removing the waves would make.

it could make loot very common or extremely rare if the drop rate is slight % off or there is a sudden increase or decrease in hunting a mob.

a better system is needed and maybe it should be tested on a mob or planet first
 
The Jetman said:
i've always had issues with wave loot, playing a large amount of my time on cyrene is very noticeable, but better than it use to be. but i'm not sure what effect removing the waves would make.

it could make loot very common or extremely rare if the drop rate is slight % off or there is a sudden increase or decrease in hunting a mob.

a better system is needed and maybe it should be tested on a mob or planet first
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Agreed. MA is more than capable of using RNG to make rare loot less consistent and predictable without flooding markets. The wave-based system is grossly outdated
 
I do not support wave hunting system.
Hire someone competent and change this.
 
There is a significant issue with wave items, for two main reasons - it is completely exploitable by those who know the wave timings (promoting both botting and a reduction in overall turnover) and for those who do not know the timings, they get relatively less than the other hunters as they hunt during both hot and cold periods.

Now, the issue of chance based dropping is oversupply of materials - as TT value of materials does not matter due to the cost to play charged by MA, it is essential that markup is maintained.

So, before petitioning to remove waves, MA must first come up with an alternative. As much as I hate waves, it is not constructive to say "anything else is better" because there are many alternatives which are far, far worse.
 
I believe loot waves exist for a reason even though they suck and get exploited.
Entropia is a skill game, not gambling, good observation and techniques allow you to pull more markup hence improving your returns through skilled actions.
 
I noticed wave based loot for the first time recently while doing the puny iron mission. I was hunting for about 1 hour a day, on some days I would loot 5-7 L items (the amps and the little L guns) in the space of about 10 minutes, on other days I could go the entire hour without getting a single L item. I am about 7000 kills into the chain and have experienced this wave nature on 3 or 4 occasions now.

The system definitely seems unbalanced, if not unfair, in many ways.

Please sign me up,

Sir Matt Copping
 
I agree wholeheartedly.

The BEST way to get rid of this is to COME FORWARD WITH THE INFORMATION.
That will force MA to do something about this.

I personally dont have any timing information other that one event-wave on Cyrene (a long time ago) had about 45 min between each drop with a +/- 5 min random. (This is all from memory and might be off)
 
This ruined the game for me. I'm not sure they can get away from such a loot system. Loot waves ultimately says to me that loot can be earned during times there is consumption and by the time us folks log in, it's already been farmed out.
 
atomicstorm said:
This ruined the game for me. I'm not sure they can get away from such a loot system. Loot waves ultimately says to me that loot can be earned during times there is consumption and by the time us folks log in, it's already been farmed out.
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Well, two different things happening there.

Loot waves are the timings of the drops. The consumption issue is due to the item caps, made clear first by the amp upgrades and subsequently by the robot upgrades / fap upgrades.

The loot waves are a fundamental logic flaw in that they are predictable and therefore biased.

Item caps have a fundamental logic flaw in that the base item (say, EP41) should have a linked cap to the upgraded version (in this case, Adj EP41). There does need to be item caps (otherwise eventually, everyone would have the same gear) but the way to raise them is simply get more people playing. So the item cap issue is low down on my list of problems (fix the others first, larger player base, larger dynamic item caps, less noticeable).
 
atomicstorm said:
This ruined the game for me. I'm not sure they can get away from such a loot system.
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I think they could probably get away from it by tweaking the black box randomiser.
We basically need the loot pool to update more often, which means more server interactivity, yes, but could bring down the next potential drop time dramatically.

As I don't like the way the system works, I try not to pay really high attention to it (to my disadvantage), but it can't be in MA's interest to have people go afk whenever they catch wind of a drop, because they know the next drop CANNOT come for a certain period.

The flipside is that if a rare drop CAN come twice in quick succession, then the AVERAGE wait for the next drop after that will increase (if you count the two quick events as being like one event). What I mean is the lengths of time people can hunt continuously with ZERO drops of the desired loot from the lootpool will increase in practise, even if the actual 'average' stays the same after the changes.

However, I believe this is the way MA must change things.
It is possible, however, that MA uses some kind of algorithm similar to the printing of scratchcards, where the highest concentration of winning cards in a batch may be limited. Unfortunately, it is difficult to have an open discussion about the inner workings, I accept that....
 
Rocket192 said:
So I decided to try some marcimex for the first time yesterday. Big mistake.
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Marcimex might be on my list, care to explain why it was a big mistake besides loot wave ?


I do not support wave hunting system.
 
Droops said:
Marcimex might be on my list, care to explain why it was a big mistake besides loot wave ?


I do not support wave hunting system.
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go down there and wait for an hour.. want a tip? record your gameplay :laugh:

Without accusing avatars of botting, which can be hard to confirm at times.. it's something to see the cave go from 1-2 players to 8-10 when the shroom waves start.

i'd prefer not to turn this into a botting debate thread though... we've had enough of those.
 
Sign me up as well. sir lance lancelot

It's sad that a few bad apples makes the whole orchard bad though cause many people track everything they do in order to find these waves just to make a decent return without huge investments and don't abuse the system. Now all that work will go for not if they fix it. All goes back to not having enough MU spread out though. Still amazes me that the have pretty much eliminated weapons II bp book by stopping the drops of basic scanners and all the other generic components. They need to re-balance that book and the weapons within it. And that is only one example I'm sure others can point to other things as well.
 
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signed Randy Hypnotyk Bafia
 
Loot is ok for me but I can see how Loot Waves are bad for the game, especially when others are botting. Put me on the list in support of change here please.
 
might have been a little vague, but yeah i'd like my name adding ;)
 
Sign me up.

Really stupid that items are on a timer. It really discourages ped cycling, which imo is not in MAs best interests. Im tired of people coming into my hole to steal my shroomies. But marcimex have the same issue as caperon and eomon. I also have issues with what 5$ mentioned about the rare items MA inserts into loot that always seems to drop all at once to the same person or group. Perhaps in an effort for more fairness, a hidden temp cap system MA can construct that once a player loots an item of higher rarity and value that person is barred from getting another for a few hours. That and spread out the drops through out an event.
 
Usually I don't join petitions
But when I do I'll sign the loot wave ones! :cool:

Yeah, sign me up!
 
You guys think only the wave system is at play?

I'm OK with botters not being banned. Since they keep feeding MA, and don't really take from the players.
I'm NOT OK with wave hunting botters being allowed to exist.
I'm NOT OK with market manipulators, should be punished.
I'm NOT OK with the stupid monopoly that due to not only this wave system but the limit system allows. There's a CAP for every item in the game. When that limit is reached, it will not drop until it has been consumed or until they raise the cap. Rich players can hoard items with higher MU and reach that cap, then sell when the price inevitably goes higher.

Just make it so grinding (the main core of this game) actually matters.
Just increase the freaking limit of stackables at least. Pyrite is a fine example of monopoly at play.
Even so removing the loot wave system is better than nothing I suppose.

So hereby Sub-Zero The Killer signs this petition.
 
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Sign me up, Id love a more modern and "dynamic" lootsystem. Change is good :)
 
Well the joke on us is that it really isn't dynamic loot. Just mindark can do dynamic things.

But I'm against playing now because everyone should have a fair shake regardless of time zones, etc. I shouldn't have to play 24/7 or have a crystal ball. And since I've seen how arkadia loot works first hand, I've seen enough about the loot system as a whole.
 
Make Entropia Great Again!

Signed, Fort
 
Add my name to the list, so I can get more than lyst!
 
Sub-Zero said:
I'm OK with botters not being banned. Since they keep feeding MA, and don't really take from the players.
I'm NOT OK with wave hunting botters being allowed to exist.


Just make it so grinding (the main core of this game) actually matters.
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This is the problem in itself

MA has an interest to increase decay and turnover as much as possible... Botters are great at increasing turnover, when actually decaying constantly. That's why MA will not ban botters......

So... change loot waves = less botting.... or at least less "loot-wave botting" which is the core of the issue here..

I don't think anyone cares that botters exist if they're shooting 24/7... they become a problem when their used to exploit a poorly-designed loot distribution algorithm
 
Sign me..

Fox FM superb
 
Sign me up for this....Most of the time the loot wave happens when i'm not online...so I get to be one of those ones that just gets bad loot for an hour before having to log off....doesn't stop me from playing...just means I have to stand around sweating for skills more each month (when my monthly deposit has been used up).
 
I sign too. I don't like this system too. Loot waves help no one at the end, if ppl lost the fun to play and depo about this issue. May this is the problem, why i lost so fast, i just don't hit the waves.

An other idea could be, that we make the waves publique in chats, all around, if they happen, so everyone have the same chance. But are ppl ready to do so? I mean this ppl knowing, when the WAVEs happen. Are they ready to share this infos, to make the game better, or force MA to make a better system?
 
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