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Ridiculous weapon prices.

Evey said:
Oh don't worry about that a lot of people are listening ;)
And A LOT of them are switching to better habits and leaving the whiny circle
Click to expand...
and taking notes...and stocking bubblegum
 
Why are the same conversations happening between the same folks over and over again?

This is not the first thread on this same topic. Learn to read between the lines. There's massive nuggets of information being dropped each time someone with a higher level of understanding tries to subtly tell you something without blatantly giving away the secret to everyone.

If you treat Entropia like a game you'll get played.
If you treat Entropia like a business you'll get paid.
 
Deemer said:
You're obviously not listening well!
The more the upper limit increases, this affects many times the lower limit, and the difference is that the lower limit has much more losses.
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Dont get me wrong here, I don't want the market for these guns to grow so much, to where getting a decent UL gun down the line will mean, a down payment on a house (which some already are). I understand the point of the thread, and would like the market to stabilize. But also understand that, you have to buy what makes sense for you as a player. Whatever is more adequate for your situation. So me saying that I am listening, just means that, I'd rather have 10 people like Evey giving their own opinion, and from theirs be able to make my own, than people like him.. Just complaining and acting like a child because someone doesn't share their point of view of a topic.

The whole point of an argument, is to have different points of view, and be able to compare them, and the 3rd person be able to come to a conclusion.
 
Mr Odyseo said:
I am still listening. I find threads like this very interesting, and also helpful. For the players that can't really afford to use these expensive guns, or even use a higher budget, it serves as a way to know about the theory behind the game, and what to expect/do in the future. Evey keeps posting in threads, and they're usually full of information, whether true or not, still way better for arguments sake, than just a child crying and insulting for no reason.
Click to expand...

There absolutely was a reason, to start a discussion, which it did.
 
Mr Odyseo said:
Dont get me wrong here, I don't want the market for these guns to grow so much, to where getting a decent UL gun down the line will mean, a down payment on a house (which some already are). I understand the point of the thread, and would like the market to stabilize. But also understand that, you have to buy what makes sense for you as a player. Whatever is more adequate for your situation. So me saying that I am listening, just means that, I'd rather have 10 people like Evey giving their own opinion, and from theirs be able to make my own, than people like him.. Just complaining and acting like a child because someone doesn't share their point of view of a topic.

The whole point of an argument, is to have different points of view, and be able to compare them, and the 3rd person be able to come to a conclusion.
Click to expand...

Then I will tell you it in direct text so that you do not get lost between the lines.

The MA has not done anything in the last half year.
We know that they are working on a new interface, which is not so complicated to develop. The complexity of the interface is that it should be more intuitive for each user. Since we have official information from MA that they are working on a new interface, it means that they have previously made this architecture for the new interface. Of the good and bad experiences that these 60 programmers have in MindArk, only the Art part remains to be synchronized with a wider range of hardware requirements. That is, the company is not small, has experience and an action plan, but half a year has no results.

There is also no change in missions that are not difficult to repair.

Only from the above we can judge without speculation that they are not just developing an interface or a few bugs, but a completely new game architecture.

Without knowing what new MA is developing, many players insure themselves for new items and therefore sell them at the highest possible prices. Simple... half of them want to make a lot peds, to be ready for the new surprises in the game, the other half don't care about just want more and more peds and only fuck up the economy right now.

No matter what others say, I wouldn't risk buying a new weapon that may become obsolete in a week or a month, but that's my choose. What I don't like is the influence of all the greed, because it started to affect me directly. I am not interested in the profits of others, I am interested in their greed not to influence me.

Now start reading the topic from the beginning and... and based on that find out who is trying to help you by keeping you in the game and who is trying to take only your money.



As you try to find out more about the game, take a look at Captain Jack suggestions. They cover a very wide range in the game from which you can easily find out more even in aspects that do not affect you at the moment. JBK is the other one that shares specific details in more direct text. There are others, but at the moment these two are the most active, at least in the last half year since I have been following the forum.

In such topics you can find out who has what position in the game, but this may deceive you rather than help you.
 
I wuld reply to this topic some more but i am afraid that someone will ban me from using trade and calytrade Chat

Oh i forgot i am already banned but to bored to write something that makes sence

Just my two pecs
 
Deemer said:
"The person buying the overpriced asset later on, for a higher price, is deemed the greater fool."

Good find!
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unless prices just don't go down because MA won't release more loot 2.0 weapons.
 
This is a good thread, please continue
 
Rocket192 said:
unless prices just don't go down because MA won't release more loot 2.0 weapons.
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For me, this is not a reason or a reasonable argument to bet $20k- $50k which has a real cost of $25.

Evey mentioned that the new update may be in 1 year. And he's right. But 500k at the moment ... when the losses are the biggest, because MA needs money for these changes .... when the Loot is nerf to an illogical minimum .... these 500k even for 1 year are an illusion, I wouldn't even give 100k at the moment.

As far as I know you are looking for 2.0 ... I personally would wait. It may be in a year but it may be in 2 months.
 
Deemer said:
For me, this is not a reason or a reasonable argument to bet $20k- $50k which has a real cost of $25.

Evey mentioned that the new update may be in 1 year. And he's right. But 500k at the moment ... when the losses are the biggest, because MA needs money for these changes .... when the Loot is nerf to an illogical minimum .... these 500k even for 1 year are an illusion, I wouldn't even give 100k at the moment.

As far as I know you are looking for 2.0 ... I personally would wait. It may be in a year but it may be in 2 months.
Click to expand...
man i've been dealing in asset bubbles for over 25 years now. prices are whatever someone else is willing to pay for it. the only way prices go down is if MA triples the supply
 
Deemer said:
As far as I know you are looking for 2.0 ... I personally would wait. It may be in a year but it may be in 2 months.
Click to expand...
Imagine twen starting in a year and everyone (well, a lot of people) waiting in line to get a freshly looted weapon... think they'd get dirt cheap? :D

If people would sell to hunters instead of selling to resellers, prices would probably be half at most today. Thank them.... it's the 0 patience to sell your shit and then the 0 patience to buy the shit - creates a big void to fill by resellers that have both cash and time to wait for you to decide to stop drooling...
Buy from a hunter, sell to another hunter if you think the prices are too high :D
 
Evey said:
Imagine twen starting in a year and everyone (well, a lot of people) waiting in line to get a freshly looted weapon... think they'd get dirt cheap? :D

If people would sell to hunters instead of selling to resellers, prices would probably be half at most today. Thank them.... it's the 0 patience to sell your shit and then the 0 patience to buy the shit - creates a big void to fill by resellers that have both cash and time to wait for you to decide to stop drooling...
Buy from a hunter, sell to another hunter if you think the prices are too high :D
Click to expand...
WAIT FOR THE DROOL!!
 
Rocket192 said:
man i've been dealing in asset bubbles for over 25 years now. prices are whatever someone else is willing to pay for it. the only way prices go down is if MA triples the supply
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YES I agree with you, but I prefer to wait for the new version. Prices will not fall because there are too many resellers in the game, but it is much more likely that there will be new items that will make current prices meaningless.

New things in hunting / minig / craft ... space maybe .... none of this affects me indirectly, I personally hope there will be changes in the trade to stop all these manipulations and unnecessary hoarding. For me, this game is as good as it is, as long as there are no resellers.

There is a post by NEVERDIE, which unequivocally says that "everything will change in one fell swoop."


Evey said:
Imagine twen starting in a year and everyone (well, a lot of people) waiting in line to get a freshly looted weapon... think they'd get dirt cheap? :D

If people would sell to hunters instead of selling to resellers, prices would probably be half at most today. Thank them.... it's the 0 patience to sell your shit and then the 0 patience to buy the shit - creates a big void to fill by resellers that have both cash and time to wait for you to decide to stop drooling...
Buy from a hunter, sell to another hunter if you think the prices are too high :D
Click to expand...

Let these people start like everyone to pay fees, then we will open a new topic for them.
 
FEN weapons will never become what TEN are right now. FEN are too good, best eco, dpp best everything. Look at the IMK2, been top of the candy for 20 years and still there. Who thinks FEN prices will drop after new TWEN will be introduced (if will be introduced) its gonna get a smack. If the prices will drop they will go down like 20-30k max because ppl will still want them. 10-15 years ago when AoW, DK and warrants were rulling the game with the best toys and ppl were spending insane dollars to get them ppl often said that they are mad. Times changed and a MM was like 40k and imk2 t10 was 80k but suddenly they started to increase, quite good now, thats because 4/5 "players" are resellers and wanna taste the profit. If you buy a weapon for 10k you wanna sell it and add another k to profit and next one does the same and same until someone else is selling for lot less and then boom you lost.
 
I read a sentence: MA need moeny for development then moved the "loot percent slider " toward zero nome notches.....
that is pure paranoid reasoning.
then... "greater fool" theory, well its a market practitioner known issue since forever.. there is also another onr
"top picker and bottom picker often become cotton picker"...
all in all.. it is a game, should be played with amusement money
this thread has degenerated in
"i want a 2.0 weapon, it cost too much for my pocket so MA is a bad company and resellers are scammers and some "inner circle" elites destroy my ped"
we just miss illuminati, area51 and MIBs and its the usual conspiration theory bullshit

and @ Evey... a blade is as good as the man that wields it ... best tool is useless in the wrong hands

so i am happy that at least some of the good weapons are in teh correct hands
last post for me on this thread, it is not a discussion anymore, it is just a bad show
 
Rocket192 said:
underrated opinion here.



if the game continues to grow then asset prices within the game will also grow (scarcity)
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Its a logic error to do this assumption, and comparing it to for example scarcity of houses and land.

An asset like a house, indreases in value with normal inflation (in a healthy normal market over time)

The best locations will continue to stay "the best" and new homes will be built further and further away from the city and the "best locations"

In EU, new items come reguarly, with better and better stats, its like new homes would be build in better and more central locations all the time, if that were reality for homes the prices would not keep rising in the way they do. Same goes for items ingame, when enough better items come along, well...

I bet the people paying 500k for mod fap have some doubts today, unless they used it hardcore for service.
 
Orion said:
I am a middleclass player and i remember:

The last price inflation bubble of this size i saw in 2008.
But then, due to the housing and banking crisis some ppl needed to withdraw to pay their real life estate mortages.
Just a little more funds got withdrawn than deposited. That was enough to get the snowball rolling downhill.

The highest invested players started to liquidate the Loot1.0 moneyprinters at ridiculous prices (like 250k-400k for mod faps, imk2, etc.).

When the snowball reached even ground, the avalanche had swept everything down the hill by 60-80%, and also most of the middle class players, who in their mass paid MAs bills. This broke MA's neck more or less.


Today:
The pandemic with its lockdowns is coming to an end soon.
Some invested players will withdraw to buy a new car, go on holiday, spend their money outside again.
Now the Loot2.0 moneyprinter equivalents get liquidated.

Always keep in mind with your 500k purchase:
In the end according to the EULA (§7. Explicit consent to no right of withdrawal) MA owes us nothing, not even TT values.
And IF MindArk allows withdrawals, then according to EULA (§13. Limitation of Liability) MA owes us nothing that exceeds the total amount of PEDs that you have purchased during the six months period before your withdrawal.
So just in case you did well during the last six months and did not need to deposit much...

Enjoy the show.
:popcorn:


@Evey :
I do not need to like or consent with all MA decisions.
Under those given circumstances I enjoy the game and its RCE idea within the limits I consider to be reasonable for me.

Other people's limits may vary.

Players, stay reasonable.
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I do want to bring this post up because this does makes sense.
Many here on this thread weren't here when this happened. So they're clueless.
And I'm fairly sure this will happen again.
It's just normal.

When prices keep getting inflated, there will come a point that the bubble will burst.
And first to run to the exit wins. The rest all loses.

After 2008 most uber items never returned to their actual value again.
First there was a lack of faith (sky was falling the game would end)
And a little later those uber items where not so uber anymore because MA introduced new items.

So there are several very big risks in buying a 500k ped item.
Loot system changes. See what happened with items when loot 2.0 was introduced.
General economy. See what happened when the economy collapsed.
New items. See what happens if you uber rifle has became mediocre because more uber uber rifles will be introduced.

Folks like Evey preach that you will make your money back, guaranteed (when hunting the right mob etc etc). Might be true. not arguing that, but there is no guarantee at all the the market stays as it is and the systems stays as it is.

And i think you REALLY should take that into consideration as well before spending 500k ped on an item.
And if you really buy it to make money (why else whould you buy a 50k$ weapons in a computer game), really, aren't there tons of other better (and safer) ways to make money with that 50k$???

Note, this goes for people for whom 50k$ is a lot of money.
If 50k$ is pocket money for you, ignore all that is said here and just buy the damn rifle, and make 1 seller very happy!
 
wizz said:
Folks like Evey preach that you will make your money back, guaranteed (when hunting the right mob etc etc). Might be true. not arguing that, but there is no guarantee at all the the market stays as it is and the systems stays as it is.
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I doubt its guaranteed to make this kind of money back so I didn't said it....
First of all we don't know what the mayhems will look like what other opportunities will be there etc.
Let's make somethng clear 500k is too much. Stop saying that, no gun recently sold for 500k. So no, guns aren't that.
Half, yeah, sure, could be, even higher and there were recent sales in that area.

Probably very few would be ale to make that money back in a year or two, after which gun becomes for free and pure profit.

When you guys look at a gun purchases, there are two types of approaches:

1. some look at it as like an investment in some deed, like a useless but valuable token, that devaluates or gains value - don't do these kind of investments, prices go up and down a lot.
2. some look at it as a tool. too few look at it this way and this is the correct approach and it's a good type of investment if you put the gun to use, rent it, use it, generate markup with it. It's much more expensive to stick around in the game for a very long time and constantly use bad weapons because of the fear of devaluating of a potential good weapon... makign the leap makes much more sense as investment rather than proacting some funds that will bleed anyway

Again, as many have said, a price of a weapon is what someone is willing to pay. Ppl aren't paying 500k so that is not the price / value of good guns atm. There were recent sales around 250 - 300k and that range makes more sense. 500k doesn't. Stop using this number. Ofc, until next Bori shows up :D
 
Evey said:
I doubt its guaranteed to make this kind of money back so I didn't said it....
First of all we don't know what the mayhems will look like what other opportunities will be there etc.
Let's make somethng clear 500k is too much. Stop saying that, no gun recently sold for 500k. So no, guns aren't that.
Half, yeah, sure, could be, even higher and there were recent sales in that area.

Probably very few would be ale to make that money back in a year or two, after which gun becomes for free and pure profit.

When you guys look at a gun purchases, there are two types of approaches:

1. some look at it as like an investment in some deed, like a useless but valuable token, that devaluates or gains value - don't do these kind of investments, prices go up and down a lot.
2. some look at it as a tool. too few look at it this way and this is the correct approach and it's a good type of investment if you put the gun to use, rent it, use it, generate markup with it. It's much more expensive to stick around in the game for a very long time and constantly use bad weapons because of the fear of devaluating of a potential good weapon... makign the leap makes much more sense as investment rather than proacting some funds that will bleed anyway

Again, as many have said, a price of a weapon is what someone is willing to pay. Ppl aren't paying 500k so that is not the price / value of good guns atm. There were recent sales around 250 - 300k and that range makes more sense. 500k doesn't. Stop using this number. Ofc, until next Bori shows up :D
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Ok clear, let's skip the "guaranteed" part then.
As I wrote, I was not arguing about returns. And it was not the point ;)

I was just pointing to the situation that happened in 2008 that Orion described.
And the how prices evolved over the years.
The risks that it involves.

It's not just the "money printer" aspect you should look at, but also the system behind it. And that system is subject to changes.
That's all.
 
Evey said:
Imagine twen starting in a year and everyone (well, a lot of people) waiting in line to get a freshly looted weapon... think they'd get dirt cheap? :D
Click to expand...

In case the current trend of rising price's will keep going, all those new fresh weapons will be purchased up by resellers, no way they go any lower than the already existing weapons.
 
wizz said:
Ok clear, let's skip the "guaranteed" part then.
As I wrote, I was not arguing about returns. And it was not the point ;)

I was just pointing to the situation that happened in 2008 that Orion described.
And the how prices evolved over the years.
The risks that it involves.

It's not just the "money printer" aspect you should look at, but also the system behind it. And that system is subject to changes.
That's all.
Click to expand...
Yes. We understand each other and you isolated the two approaches I as talking about in my previous post.
If it's value in 3 or 5 years is very important to you as a buyer, do not buy stuff over 10-15k ped.

Because of the "money printer" aspect of some of the tools, the correct approach is to not care much about the value in 3-5 years. It's going to be different and you cannot control that in any way. What you have control over is the "money printing" part. Done correctly, renders the aspect of item value in 5 years, irrelevant. If you understand that and know you can do it, then and only then it's something you could do.

Yes, with a 15k gun you could make back its worth many times over in 2 years, but it would only be a fraction what a top gun can produce, the actual % of ROI is also irrelevant. Also, as I said few times before, it depends mainly on the user and not the tool. If the user is Orion, yeah, adj ml 35 is a perfect match. If the user is Ron Kovich (@Ron Kovich :😘), the tool should definately be a top 2.0 weapon. While Orion will wait to have his laugh, Ron Kovich could make a Tesla Model X in profit in next 5 years.... does it make sense to stay worried you loose 30k at this point?? Is this simple enough? Orion should not worry about the price of the items as long as he cannot grasp the possibilities, it will just be sometign forever out of his reach (not financially) but strategically. To you, hi

m and others, it's just pixels. To me, LP100 is a function, to me, it's LP-100();

These tools certainly are not for everyone, their price should not fit every pocket....



Hego Damask said:
In case the current trend of rising price's will keep going, all those new fresh weapons will be purchased up by resellers, no way they go any lower than the already existing weapons.
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I won't sell to a reseller, so not all of the mayhem weapons from the vendor will go to them :p
 
People asking 500k for a weapon doesn't mean that's the price... Like many people have said before it's all about supply and demand. Supply is low atm while demand is (very) high atm.

The 50 dps weapons; adj 41/maddox, L2, spirit etc. are pretty stable at 4-6k for the lower tiers. The upgrade from those weapons is where things become expensive.

We usually see this trend just before- and during migration, and the opposite post migration;
UL gear = up
CLD = down

With the whole covid shit and people generally having more money to spend, it's hard to say what's going to happen to prices after migration. But if we follow previous years logic that would mean people go on their back2work breaks and CLDs will go up again. Demand on gear is still much higher than normal so I expect gear won't go down much if anything at all, the resellers will quickly buy what comes up for sale to protect their other assets...

For the future of Entropia... I hope MA retains the "covid players" long enough (atleast untill unreal) which will give another boost to playerbase (and prices). Things are looking good for MA!
 
seffo said:
LOL I blame MindArk for allowing price manipulation to such a huge degree, and for limiting these high end items to so few that the traders can get away with this shit.
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See how scared they are, wondering what reason to come up with to justify these prices ... it's like buying $ 10,000 sandwiches. All these comments are to deceive the one who will seek information.

If it's on the internet, it means it's true!
 
seffo said:
and for limiting these high end items to so few that the traders can get away with this shit.
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Oh no, it's always the players. They don't give a fuck when gun is cheap, they only bitch when it's too expensive.

Took me 4 months to sell Lp70 FEN for 65k:

Selling: - ArMatrix LP 70 FEN Edition (tier 2)

I had several offers so far and I decided to set the following parameters for now. SB: +67k BO: +69k
www.planetcalypsoforum.com www.planetcalypsoforum.com

Took me 6 months to sell LP-100 Mod T6 for 100k

Selling: - A&P Series Mayhem LP-100 Modified

***sold***
www.planetcalypsoforum.com www.planetcalypsoforum.com

Took me 2 weeks to sell for below 100k BP-130 one year ago:

Selling: - [SOLD] Highest DPS weapon - Mayhem BP 130 (or LP-120, or BP-110 imp)

- SOLD - Hello, I decided to offer for sale*, once the summer mayhem prizes are awarded, a few options from the Mayhem Token Vendor, one of the 3 top DPS weapons: Mayhem BP-130, Mayhem LP-120, Mayhem BP-110, Improved. None of these 3 exist in game yet. According to entropiawiki, the highest...
www.planetcalypsoforum.com www.planetcalypsoforum.com
 
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