Question: Shrapnel: Why not refiner?

JohnCapital

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Why didn't they have shrapnel require using a refiner, and adjust the ratio so that the slightly-better-than TT refiner(s) came to a 100:101 ratio after the refiner decay? Obviously the most eco refiners would give more ammo/shrapnel, after factoring decay, and the TT refiners, less than 101% results.

This would have spurred renewed interest in better refiners, encouraging more crafting of them, and more mining of the materials used.

But then I thought about the tiering process, and wondered why it wasn't designed to go through the refiner system either.

Sure in this case, since there's a skill/profession issue that was involved, I can see bypassing the refiner that time, but...

I guess my main point is...

Why is the refiner system being bypassed in new systems that clearly seem made for it?

Of course refiners(L) would be introduced, thus encouraging a more long-term cycling on many levels, mining, crafting, and usage.

Or, are you just slowly removing/reducing the refining process from the system?

And for those who can't read, allow me to quote the part I'm sure many will miss:
came to a 100:101 ratio after the refiner decay?
 

Haruto Rat

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My guess is that all this is at least partly aimed at retention of new arrivals (giving them five more minutes of shooting), and those aren't likely to have a refiner yet.
 

Sissi

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came to a 100:101 ratio after the refiner decay?

where did you get this?

ps. sad that you are not moderator any longer
 

SpikeBlack

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The 1% benefit would out weighed by the decay of the refiner especially at low quantities resulting in no one bothering.

It also depends on the refiner used as well so people look for the most eco method and getting more than 100-101 ratio.

Also many hunters don't carry refiners with them on a hunt. And when you're starting you're not going to waste ped on an item you don't use, plus we don't really need yet more items as that's what led to the creation of the shrapnel in the first place because they kept adding more and more resources to create more and more items.
 
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Makitoki

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there are many new players in this game who probably for many months to come wont even realize that they are able to turn shrap into ammo, i THINK the majority of new players just want to try shit out shoot crap and tt then repeat. while many of us been at this for ages are able to utilize MOST of the Features in this game it is probably easier for all the new players to adapt with as little effort as possible for player retention. and yes using a refiner is an issue for many new players and this is probably one of the many reasons we see new avatar selling stones or animal hide on auction because they arent ever made aware that stones CAN be refined in a refiner. while many of the items we use now may be second nature to us it is definitely not second nature to all the new players MA is attempting to attract and retain.
 

Oleg

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Due to the low TT of ammo the refiner costs would be way too large. I realise you want to balance it so that this cost is effectively negated, but perhaps you don't realise the scale of it.

Refining 100 PED of ammo would cost 310 PED in refiner decay using the TT model.

It would be a pointless inconvenience at best.
 

JohnCapital

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Due to the low TT of ammo the refiner costs would be way too large. I realise you want to balance it so that this cost is effectively negated, but perhaps you don't realise the scale of it.

Refining 100 PED of ammo would cost 310 PED in refiner decay using the TT model.

It would be a pointless inconvenience at best.

It's possible I don't. I've always been a bit vague on the refiner decay. I do understand it's based on qty, and it's a static amount. But yeah, never been good at figuring out how much the decay is before hand.

So yeah, it's possible that refining a few 100k would cost too much decay. Sad to consider. Oh well.
 

sawachika

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It's possible I don't. I've always been a bit vague on the refiner decay. I do understand it's based on qty, and it's a static amount. But yeah, never been good at figuring out how much the decay is before hand.

So yeah, it's possible that refining a few 100k would cost too much decay. Sad to consider. Oh well.

Well...can't help but noticed your comment.

Perhaps you can consider reading this

http://buladifu.blogspot.com/2014/09/entropia-universe-part-eight.html

I tried to explain the refining costs part a bit in that post. (Towards the bottom end of it.)
 
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