Suggestion: Space war

[Deemer]

A proposal to encourage piracy in space in order to have better gameplay there. Just an idea for a space war. I will save the many factors that are currently in the game ... such as the large space on each planet where is a non lootable zone.

At the moment, the battle is unequal, because most people leave the game to defend their goods. From this place, which is intended for looting other players, it is meaningless. Either remove it or develop it.

What I suggest is to be like looted PVP.
- Use shots to enter the space.
- to remove the instance in Mother Ships. That is, if someone logoff the game to be in the same place, not where the Mother Ship is.
- to limit the loot of players (for example, up to 5% depending on the quantity, the higher carrying loot, a low percent. And / or a 50/50 chance for this looting).


If there is a reasonable limit to all of this, I think human greed will overwhelm and more people will group up for Space PVP groups.
In order to protect its passengers well, a Mother Ship will need a larger crew, but this also means a larger prey for a group of space pirates.

At the moment, if there is a group of space pirates firing on a point of the Mother Ship, even the most protected ship at the moment will be in question to survive. But due to unequal, such team attacks are not even considered by players.

There was a topic about reviving space, that's а way.
Too much halos in game, let we reveal some devils.

 

[Deleted member 58836]

Hey!

I like the direction you're heading

Can you elaborate more on your points?

Use shots to enter the space.

What do you mean by this?

to remove the instance in Mother Ships. That is, if someone logoff the game to be in the same place, not where the Mother Ship is.

I'm on board a Mothership/Privateer and am at Calypso Space Station.
I logoff.
The ship warps to Next Island.
I logon.
My avatar appears helpless in space and I die @ Calypso Space Station and revive there as I was left behind when the ship took off.

I'm on board a Mothership/Privateer and am in the middle of a Lootable-PVP battle.
I logoff.
The ship dies.
I logon.
My avatar appears helpless in space @ the location the ship died. I die and get looted by the attackers.
However, I can be patient and outwait the PVPers.
I then logon.
My avatar appears helpless in space @ the location the ship died. I die and revive @ the nearest Space Station.
No loot lost.
I am safe but stranded in deep space with whatever loot I may have had on me.

to limit the loot of players (for example, up to 5% depending on the quantity, the higher carrying loot, a low percent. And / or a 50/50 chance for this looting).

If I were to kill someone in PVP and they had 100ped TT in loot. I would get 5ped TT of that?
or
50% chance that I loot 5% of the loot AND 50% chance that I loot 100%?

Cheers,
The Great Adventurer

 

[John B Knight]

- to remove the instance in Mother Ships. That is, if someone logoff the game to be in the same place, not where the Mother Ship is.

There is many suggestions already made out there how to fix the loggout stackable transport (declaring goods and packing in space containers, relocating goods if logged out to last planet, etc ) which dont lead to scattering a ships crew over the entire universe should disconnects occure during flight.
And no we dont want all people within a mothership on the space server putting them on a different server was one of the best things mindark ever did without it no pirate could attack a mothership and no big ship could attack anothert big ship without massive lag and disconnect - having them on different servers keeps space battles smooth when they happen.

What we primarily need is ammo cost in space to be reduced to 1-5% in pvp, spent ammo in space fights going to the winner and partially lootable fuel tanks (so pirates become valid targets).
And maybe a oil rig/ship yard/space la out there to fight over - so people dont sit around in the void all day and get bored.

 

[Sirhc]

Lootable PVP zones should be zones in space like they are on Calypso. Right now they are barriers to a vibrant space experience. Make the lootable space PVP zones worth the risk either through specific mobs and or loot. People will venture into them if they perceive the reward being worth the risk.

I like the percentage loot factor idea in lootable PVP zones. I think this would increase traffic to some extent. I do however think lootable zones in space or planetside will continue to suffer because of exploits and its hard enough to keep an avatar afloat in the current EU economy without having to worry about being looted by an exploiter.

Honestly they need to revamp space in a a lot of ways I am just not sure if they have the developers to do it plus there is some really stiff competition out there that have pseudo RCE elements.

Just a few of my thoughts (from easiest to implement to hardest):

1. Delineate the space maps and update the notifications in regards to safe space, PVP, and lootable PVP
2. Bring back actual dogfighting aspects to space. (no auto target and no auto action in regards to combat)
3. Implement asteroid mining in space with ships dedicated to that profession.
4. Create LA like areas in space and have space grab events to control certain zones for a set amount of time with tax system
5. Implement player owned and modified space stations to some degree. Different stations have attributes in other words some are used to manufacture ships, some process raw materials, some repair ships, others create fuel or food etc.
6. Create vibrant NPC patrols that attack pirates and keep the peace. Being a pirate shouldn't be an easy life and having safe ports to doc will give people the option to weight the risks of that lifestyle. Let's say your reputation is low on Calypso it would be difficult to enter that zone near stations because of the AI CAP
7. Since we currently have the Spring Offensive on Calypso that should be something happening in space. Increase the robot ship library and presence in space and have a major fleet move through the planet zones in an attempt to wipe out the stations and ships. A pirates rep could increase by participating in repelling the robot fleet. I keep thinking of the game X4 Foundations in this instance where I have Xenon (AI) incursions into multiple sectors at the moment and how am I going to deal with it while working with friendly aliens (AI) since that game is a sandbox game and no other online players.
8. Increase the player ship library and means to upgrading and acquiring ships. Also implement HOTAS control for space combat.

Let space grow organically and the space battles will occur. Everything is limited in scope at the moment so their is no incentive to form large bands of pirates and large bands of those willing to repel them.

I do think giant space battles would be awesome and bring back some nostalgia of land grabs of old but as space stands now it just doesn't seem feasible and the risk VS reward is skewed.

 

[Granny Rowan]

A proposal to encourage piracy in space in order to have better gameplay there.
At the moment, the battle is unequal, because most people leave the game to defend their goods. From this place, which is intended for looting other players, it is meaningless. Either remove it or develop it.

I agree that at present any battle between pirates and others is unequal but not for the reason given. Log off is the most commonly cited reason for pirates failing to thrive and being unable to loot bigger ships.
In reality the majority of people shot by pirates are in quads or sleipnirs, and they cannot log off, and still be flown to destination. If they log off or DC all the pirate has to do is sit and wait for them to log in.

It is also a myth that all passengers log off during warps, in fact the vast majority don’t, may even produce repair tools and ready to help repair if needed. I am not saying they never log off, just it is a lot rarer than people like to think, and pirates like to claim.
When attacking a privateer or MS whether or not it has passengers, whether or not some may have logged the odds are actually in the pirates favour as regards loot.
Warp ships may have passengers or over-confident crew carrying loot, so if the pirates succeed in the battle their chances of loot are moderately good. But pirates know they are in space to fight, they are very unlikely to carry loot, so warp ship gunnery crew spend to defend, knowing that even if they kill a pirate, their hope of loot is tiny. It will usually only happen if pirate is shot, before they offload any loot already taken from previous battles.
The pilot and repair crew defending the ship would in any case get no loot from the dead attacker.

What I suggest is to be like looted PVP.
- Use shots to enter the space.

Adding to the costs that everyone already seems to feel is too high. Remember the cost for the passenger will be not only their own shot, but presumably the increased overheads for the ships crew may lead to ticket price rises if the attacks became very regular

- to remove the instance in Mother Ships. That is, if someone logoff the game to be in the same place, not where the Mother Ship is.

Not sure how MA could do this as the ship is an instance primarily so it and its contents (Passengers/crew/and their inventories) can be moved as a single entity both sub warp and during warp
I also have concerns about issues caused by unintentional log off.. internet loss, power loss, domestic emergency

As space is currently organised ships warp from non-lootable PVP to non-lootable PVP when travelling between planets. However, the warp itself passes through lootable and the ship can be warp mined.
So if the contents of the entity were only moved once the ship exits warp, then any that log off would indeed still be at their start point and not have travelled at all. Which means they were not put at risk, without the means to help defend ship.
Those on the ship and logged in would arrive at end point of warp, be that pirate warp mine, or destination. If they then log off to avoid being looted, they have to risk logging back in to a patient pirate camping the spot.

- to limit the loot of players (for example, up to 5% depending on the quantity, the higher carrying loot, a low percent. And / or a 50/50 chance for this looting).

If there is a reasonable limit to all of this, I think human greed will overwhelm and more people will group up for Space PVP groups.

Limiting both percentage that can be looted from each victim, and then perhaps initiating a timer, so that same victim cannot be looted twice within x minutes, could indeed make it more interesting and has been suggested to MA multiple times

In order to protect its passengers well, a Mother Ship will need a larger crew, but this also means a larger prey for a group of space pirates.

At the moment, if there is a group of space pirates firing on a point of the Mother Ship, even the most protected ship at the moment will be in question to survive. But due to unequal, such team attacks are not even considered by players.

Yes pirates or attackers of a privateer or mothership with reasonably good SI would need to team, just as hunters may need to team to take down large mobs. This has always been true, and there have been may occasions in the past where this has happened.

That ship owners need to pay out to upgrade their SI, their armament, their skills and to carry more crew has always been the best hope of defence of passengers, and has worked remarkably well over the years.

The lack of pirate cohesion and teaming is nothing to do with the ships or log off, it is lack of those easy victims leaving the SS, that reduced their funding and made many leave in a sulk, and others without the steady income from killing Sleipnirs, can no longer easily afford the large scale team attacks

 

[SoberPhil]

Lootable PVP zones should be zones in space like they are on Calypso. Right now they are barriers to a vibrant space experience. Make the lootable space PVP zones worth the risk either through specific mobs and or loot. People will venture into them if they perceive the reward being worth the risk.

This is what we need, not more space parasites that are officially allowed to commit theft and rob you at gunpoint. I'm baffled by the fact that this is still allowed to go on, theft is a crime anywhere in the world, but not this universe. Forcing PvP upon every player who wants to travel though space is a weird and deterring move, the reduction of lootable zones in space was a step in the right direction, all we need now is to bring the planets closer together with no lootable zones between them. Most players don't like piracy, nor do they like being looted. Make lootable PvP in space similar to how it is planetside, whoever wants to go there can go, some incentive should be added as well, maybe increase the reward for the relatively new space event thing and make that zone lootable.

 

[SuperKanjo]

I agree with Granny Rowan, the majority of the travelers don't log off in my experience. I do believe MA should do something about this, give the mothership owners a reason to up their SI.

I also do believe that the risk taken should be equal, a pirate should only be able to loot the amount he is risking aswell. So if he is flying with empty inventory he can't loot anything either. If he has 100 ped stackables, he can loot up to 100 ped etc. Makes the risk equal.

 

[San]

This keeps coming up like a bad penny. I quit if I have to risk losing stuff for no other reason than my internet connection dropping out for a minute. Not a big hole in the company's bank but I wonder how many others will say this isn't the game they signed up for. In the end you guys can loot each other until the cows come home.

 

[Granny Rowan]

It also occurs to me the reason may have dragged their feet on seeking a solution is the unintended log offs.
If the game crashes and someone then lost ped to pirates because 'deemed too be on board' yet in no position to help defend, it has the potential for MA being accused of complicity in theft.
Since it would be impossible to prove if game crashing was fault of MA, your internet provider or lack of RAM, etc the arguments would go on and on, Simply not good for business. They need to think outside the box.

 

[SoberPhil]

Complicity in theft is when you own a platform that allows one costumer to steal from another without the latter's concent. So that's already a thing.

Truth is, there's only one logical explanation for space piracy still existing in thing game. Piracy helps maintain a certain level of demand for warps through fear. That's it. There's no other reason for it still being allowed. Everybody hates it, many paying customers have quit over it, other planets are lacking development and turnover because of it.