FYI: Stop Hunting with Air ships please.

HinDragoz

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Sry, I didn't read the whole thread.

I don't own any vehicle but please can someone clarify in a simple statement the following:

I understand that using VTOL to avoid aggro when mob is closing in is considered cheating. (But that could be easily solved by a disallowing of entering a VTOL when under aggro.)

But for the rest:
-MA creating vehicles for Land, air and water.
-After that MA creates weapon attachments for the vehicles. (I guess you also need skills to use those.)
-So now you cannot use the vehicles with weapon attachments to hunt? :scratch:

Isn't that the same as saying that using tiered weapons with enhancers to hunt because they do more dmg is cheating?

You cannot damage mobs with vehicle weapons
 

Majstorex

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Sry, I didn't read the whole thread.

I don't own any vehicle but please can someone clarify in a simple statement the following:

I understand that using VTOL to avoid aggro when mob is closing in is considered cheating. (But that could be easily solved by a disallowing of entering a VTOL when under aggro.)

But for the rest:
-MA creating vehicles for Land, air and water.
-After that MA creates weapon attachments for the vehicles. (I guess you also need skills to use those.)
-So now you cannot use the vehicles with weapon attachments to hunt? :scratch:

Isn't that the same as saying that using tiered weapons with enhancers to hunt because they do more dmg is cheating?

what exactly you have problems understanding?
MA creating weapons for vehicles and making them usable only in PvP, is that the problem?

Comparing tierd weapons, using enhancers so they cause more dmg is just plain dumb since you get extra decay not NO decay like when hunting with VTOL vehicles.

Seriusly, exploiting such features, which have been marked as an exploit by MA, not publicly but in a support case posted on forum, is enough for me to not do it.
I do understand the temptation of some to exploit it, wanting to kill a mob over your lvl, trying to loot big, but in the end i rather have my account clean than to be banned and called un exploiter.
 

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You cannot damage mobs with vehicle weapons

I did not know, (You see I never owned a vehicle :) ) and that's lame that you cannot use it for hunting.
Even fewer reasons to buy one, They cost a lot of money, they are limited, you cannot hunt in them and you don't get skills ? using them. And my TP brings me everywhere I want + gaining skills.
Then yes the only good thing is avoiding MOB aggro :silly2: (And LG for a LA you can keep a couple of weeks)

Ow and I must admit, some look cool. ;)
 

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you dont seem to hunt much. Otherwise you wouldev known that if you walk backwards while shooting a mob, it mostlikely become unreachable.

If you are referring to hunting lately, no I haven't much in past year (as long as you've been playing), so in that you would be correct.

So you are saying MA screwed it up even more?

Please do educate me, I always love learning the nuances of EU from newborne experts. People that have no clue where PE has come from so hard to see direction it's headed.



Seriusly, exploiting such features, which have been marked as an exploit by MA, not publicly but in a support case posted on forum, is enough for me to not do it.


And if a person doesn't come to forum they are shit out of luck and can be banned. That is the fricking problem!
 

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Really pathetic responses here. So you all really think when MA introducted vtols that they meant to make skills and gear irrelevant, and wanted noobs like you to suddenly be able to hunt warlocks, osseocollum, etc. with zero armor/fap costs? Really?

It's an exploit and you all know it. People have been banned for using the exploit. Documented and public. You are all just trying to make excuses so you can exploit, period.

Really pathetic is the way MA didn't prevent it and most important didn't fix it after so many months

So if it is so broken why is it the same after all this months ?

About "official reports" ?

You really want me to believe that if you send a well cooked support case about something they won't say it is a exploit and that you shouldn't do it since you admit that it is wrong

Actually sometimes it is hard to explain what is wrong to them in the first place, so if you say it is incorrect and there is valid logic behind won't support agree with you even if they don't know nothing about it

Meaning unless they give something different the only official report that I got so far was that VTOL don't aggro mobs



I agree that using it to hunt certain mobs doesn't seem to encourage what I would like this virtual universe to be
(I would love to see organized team hunts with over 60 people on the Warlocks)

So I don't do it
Hope that bad karma will hit those who do it with bad intents
 

mastermesh

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Since the whole 'universe' is going to be pvp based on the space announcement, I wonder if that means we'll be able to shoot vehicles anywhere?!? ;)
 

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I am going to just state this when i mine with a Vtol.... My gas bill for a day of mining is usually around 15-20ped oil if not more.. my last run took nearly 100ped of oil.... now do you think a exploiter will spend that much oil hunting a day?
 

Majstorex

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If you are referring to hunting lately, no I haven't much in past year (as long as you've been playing), so in that you would be correct.

So you are saying MA screwed it up even more?

Please do educate me, I always love learning the nuances of EU from newborne experts. People that have no clue where PE has come from so hard to see direction it's headed.

No not at all, infact, they have improved the unreachble status quite well imo.
So couse i wasnt here in the past, you believe i cant observe things and interpret them in the right way?


And if a person doesn't come to forum they are shit out of luck and can be banned. That is the fricking problem!

Ofc this is not professional behavior from MA, but why you seem so shocked about it, being here for years and all that.....
 

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Didn't read everything. Just a reply to OP:

Wrong approach. More people should start hunting with VTOLs. The more one exploit is used, the more it is reported - the faster it gets fixed. That's how MA works..
 

mastermesh

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You cannot damage mobs with vehicle weapons
Wonder if that will apply to space too since there's supposed to be mobs in space?
 

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Just For everyones information I caught Eric the Geek Using the vtol hunting on malc..... So sad that a uber hunter is using this exploit.
 
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No not at all, infact, they have improved the unreachble status quite well imo.
So couse i wasnt here in the past, you believe i cant observe things and interpret them in the right way?

Lol. It is my opinion that ANY time unreachable happens due to backing up is unacceptable. When it first Started happening, I had it only occured with drones. I sent a support case cause I couldn't understand how on flat ground with no obstacles would trigger the trapped response. Id have to wait to be hit before id be able to hit them again. Now it happens with several more mobs. So id consider it less than fixed
 

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some thoughts

Ok, many hot discussions here, some interesting, some superfluous...
Although I do not represent MA in any way, I think I have a pretty clear understanding of the several parameters in this situation. Therefore I want to clarify a thing or two for everyone who does not understand, and for every other one who tries to find excuses to continue his/her actions.

History Lesson:
--- Phase 1---
No vehicles, walking backwards is a normal hunting strategy, to lower your decay, or walk towards the next mob. Note, 'lower' decay, not 'annihilate' it.

---Phase 2---
Wheel-based vehicles were introduced, when you jump into these, your vehicle will be damaged, some mobs are faster then your vehicle and will attack you.

---Phase 3---
Flying vehicles were introduced, when you jump into these, your vehicle will be damaged, untill you reach a certain height.

Problem 1
People start using vehicles for the normal ping-pong teamhunts. By doing this, if fast enough, they avoid all decay.
Problem 2
When people fly low over spawns of mobs, they gather a huge mobtrain that causes problems to others.

---Phase 4---
MA solves Problem2 by making mobs no longer agro towards vtols
Problem 1: People keep using their ping-pong teamhunt techiques vtol's included

Definition of the exploit:
Hunting with the following technique: damaging a mob from long distance, jumping into the undamageable vtol when the mob get near you, following by relocating yourself, or the mob (by a teammate), restart damaging the mob, and repeat this technique untill the mob is down.

Why is this an exploit?
- because MA says so by not denying what their support department has said. For serious issues, the support department asks MA first what to answer.
- because support says so
- because people who got locked for it say so
- because if you are honest within yourself, you know so.
- because this is not fair-play, it is sneeky and lame
- because the only reason that mobs don't agro on vtols, is because MA got complaints about ppl using vtols and mobtraining them. Hence non-agro Vtols were not made to hop in/out/in/out while killing 1 mob.


What is allowed?
- walking/running backwards and shooting a mob;
- driving away from mobs in vehicles that can take damage;
- jump into vtol to escape from a mobtrain or huuuge newspawn amount of mobs;
- shoot mob, die, return by vtol, continue hunting;
- jumping into your vtol, flying as high as u can, jumping out and dying.

Sollution:
- MA makes all mobs high-regain, very fast running. Is that what you want to achieve?

If someone hops in the vtol, zooms away, relands, and shoots the enemy again, that's something else. Hell, that's smart playing.
Sure, and photocopying and printing money is pretty smart as well, but sneeky and not honest.
(this has nothing to do with the issue whether the governments handle their money fair or not)


Mining with them is as bad, freakin miners driving or flying in dropping bombs agroing mobs they cant normally mine in on the hunter then flying or driving off, then when you park all the agroed mobs on there cliams they report you :).
I have to agree on this. MA, put in a 60second mining delay after jumping out of a vtol :)


BUT if MA gives you opportunity to do it then why not?
Sure I have the gear and opportunity to print money, let's do it :) (nota: fictional statement)


MA did not intent to give people this opportunity.
They changed VTOL behaviour because ppl would fly across LA's creating huge herds of mobs.
So they quickly changed VTOL's so that they wouldn't agro mobs anymore.
exactly


amazing how heavily discussed this is, dont we have bigger issues in this universe to solve first?
MA has bigger things to do right now as well...but they may come back with a vengance :d
and why is it so damn bad to hunt with a vtol escape trick, you still need all the ammo you need to kill that mob,
Ammo is only 1 part of what you need to kill a mob. you also need gear and skills. Theoretically with this technique you could kill a warlock with (several decayed) opallo. Does that sound fair to you?
and even more because its health does recover while you escape.
this technique is only used on low-regain high-hp, high-dmg mobs, so your arguement doesn't hold its ground


Really pathetic responses here. So you all really think when MA introducted vtols that they meant to make skills and gear irrelevant, and wanted noobs like you to suddenly be able to hunt warlocks, osseocollum, etc. with zero armor/fap costs? Really?
It's an exploit and you all know it. People have been banned for using the exploit. Documented and public. You are all just trying to make excuses so you can exploit, period.
amen...


Whats the point, MA do nothing.
Its really wierd, in any other MMORPG that doesnt even involve real money you get banned for life, and in many cases character erased if cought cheating or using exploit, and here you get a little lock on your avatar and then its all good and forgotten.
Is there really a mmorpg that acts that fast, without a monthly fee to be paid?


If you have played for more than a year and don't understand why it's a problem if people of any skill level can kill any mob in the game without any armour or fap decay, you are an idiot.
a bit harsh, but true


Stop Making Excuses lol

I am not speaking for all, neither do I wish to generalise but:
Several greedy idiots try to squeeze out every pec they can by finding excuses for exploits, and hence not feeling guilty for their actions. On the other hand, their greed is what attracted them to EU and made the playerbase grow. When they find out that Ma is no charity organisation either, they get frustrated and try to get revenge. After a while they usually find out that MA is better and smarter at making money, then they are themselves.
 
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Oleg

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Problem 2
When people fly low over spawns of mobs, they gather a huge mobtrain that causes problems to others.

---Phase 4---
MA solves Problem2 by making mobs no longer agro towards vtols

I agree with most of your post but this part is rewriting history.

Mobs have never aggroed on flying vehicles, and it was never possble to use them to make a mob train. They worked as they do now when they were introduced.
 

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History Lesson:
--- Phase 1---
No vehicles, walking backwards is a normal hunting strategy, to lower your decay, or walk towards the next mob. Note, 'lower' decay, not 'annihilate' it.

---Phase 2---
Wheel-based vehicles were introduced, when you jump into these, your vehicle will be damaged, some mobs are faster then your vehicle and will attack you.

---Phase 3---
Flying vehicles were introduced, when you jump into these, your vehicle will be damaged, untill you reach a certain height.

Problem 1
People start using vehicles for the normal ping-pong teamhunts. By doing this, if fast enough, they avoid all decay.

You completely neglected the fact that ping pong hunting wascommon practice and eliminated all decay way before vehicles. Also neglected the fact that grenade launchers were introduced way earlier than vehicles and that they also allow you to completely negate armor/fap decay on some mobs. Neglected the fact that TP chips have been around forever, and have always allowed the practice of hit-&-run hunting much like entering a vehicle and speeding away before starting shooting away (albeit in a more costly and tedious way). And finally neglected the fact that you can do hit-&-run tactics with nearly all vehicles, it only takes a bit more driving away until you're in a safe distance to disembark and start shooting than with a VTOL due to their non-aggro feature.

I agree with some of what you wrote, but I just think this needed mention to help make it clear to the paranoid people that think hit-&-run hunting makes skills useless. It shows hit and running has always been around and that skills have never been endangered of becoming useless.
 
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Just For everyones information I caught Eric the Geek Using the vtol hunting on malc..... So sad that a uber hunter is using this exploit.

just go check the warlockspawn at the crater,i wont put his name here,ill just say hes russian,most wil know then anyway,he used it on several occasions different days even after i told him it was looked upon as exploiting

it pisses me off that we in team if we take on warlock 9/10 we all die several times and take decay and use mindessence ,and 1 exploiter can kill wl 9/10 easily hopping in and out of his vtol when the wl reaches him without decay

he just steals loot from all of us
its about time ma made an official statement about this in the clientloader...either that or state that it aint an exploit so we all can use it so the playingfield is leveled again

or just destroy the vtols(and i own an vtol myself)
 

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Well to respond to the mining aspect i think they should Make the entering a VTOL locked while your in 'action' such as dropping a bomb so you would have to wait the full 8 second before entering again. i think that's fair but i don't agree with a 60 sec entering time frame. And I am not Out in the game to Go catch people using this hunting exploit but if i see you doing it ...... well guess what will happen ...... yap you will be reported and MA will have a history on your avatar. SO understand this If you report these people The more they understand and IF they WANT to risk there account they understand what they are getting into.
anyways
my 2 pec.
 

JD RACING

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I suppose you have never heard the two words: "common sense"? Or you just like to troll on the internet a lot?

it would be common sense if there wa a problem whit vtol hunting it would have been fix by now how long vtol have been out now over a year and still not fix

it maybe like the person that reported the mining bug whit amp also and let the bug there so poeple can use it

if there a bug take the vtol out of the game still it fix other wise use it the way you want

it like leaving the kee for the bank machine hinden a certain place you know poeple know it there stealing money but you leave it there for more poeple to steal more
 

JD RACING

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I am going to just state this when i mine with a Vtol.... My gas bill for a day of mining is usually around 15-20ped oil if not more.. my last run took nearly 100ped of oil.... now do you think a exploiter will spend that much oil hunting a day?

for me i think you just as bad as a person using it for hunting you say you dont agro mob on other people

like i said in other post i was on la40 hunting atrox it was not u but another person using vtol for mining he was getting out droping the bomb then jumping back in

were do you think the mob ran for after he got back in me i paid for the decay the miner paid fuck all the only thing he paid in decay if he found something other wise driving or runing or walking he would have got alot more decay

the way a see it ma is too laysy to fix the problem instead of reporting other not saying it a bad thing

make a list for people to sign that they want this fix complain to them day in day out to fix this problem how many report did you send whit out naming name that you what this fix <<<<< this is to all that complain about votol hunting>>>> make something to sing a complaint i will be the first to put my name on it also

dont blame the poeple blame the company that let it go for this long
 

minim

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Well to respond to the mining aspect i think they should Make the entering a VTOL locked while your in 'action' such as dropping a bomb so you would have to wait the full 8 second before entering again. i think that's fair but i don't agree with a 60 sec entering time frame. And I am not Out in the game to Go catch people using this hunting exploit but if i see you doing it ...... well guess what will happen ...... yap you will be reported and MA will have a history on your avatar. SO understand this If you report these people The more they understand and IF they WANT to risk there account they understand what they are getting into.
anyways
my 2 pec.

If I see you NEAR a vtol dropping bombs I will use fraps and report you to. Your doing as much exploiting as anyone hunting with vtol (those I don't bother reporting cuz it really isn't that big of a deal..) but you annoy me when you go this hard out against those exploiting when hunting when you do the same thing yourself in mining and don't seem to care. Just look some posts above and you will see old-time players agreed with me on this one ^^
 

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What did i start. Oh ya I started this SO people Stopped hunting with VTOL's and PLAY the GAME how it is suppose to be played.
A. INVEST in your avatar.
B. Hire a Fapper
C. Hunt your LEVEL


You mine with your VTOL could be considered as an exploit:
Saying : "Hunt mobs only with in your level and don't use VTOL"
is just the same in my book as:
"Mine only in the areas you can mine, if the mobs are to dense or tough in a certain area for you, don't mine there!"

Both are just the same exploit actually. In both cases you gain advantage over other ppl not using a VTOL for hunting or mining.
It's the same if you hunt mobs you couldn't handle/make it easier or you mine in places you couldn't reach/make it easier to reach using VTOL.


I have something in analogy of your statement:
A. INVEST in your avatar.
B. Hire a hunter to protect you while mining. (This a done in the past)
C. Mine your LEVEL

Don't use double standards because it fits you since you are a miner and someone else is a hunter.
 

Majstorex

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Lol. It is my opinion that ANY time unreachable happens due to backing up is unacceptable. When it first Started happening, I had it only occured with drones. I sent a support case cause I couldn't understand how on flat ground with no obstacles would trigger the trapped response. Id have to wait to be hit before id be able to hit them again. Now it happens with several more mobs. So id consider it less than fixed

when mob becomes unrechable due to a obsticle in the way, it does not need to hit you to become shootable again since they go around most of the stuff thts in theirs way, this part was improoved well imo
 

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just so you know DRDOOM the first thing i did in game was Become a hunter so i could remove mobs out of my way. I can kill mobs if need i am a pretty decent hunter.....
I just don't see how you think i am going above and beyond anyone in this game with A VTOL Since the Vtol's price is cheap enough for any level player to buy......... anyways.

I have mined in areas that people can't normally survive and i don't go in areas that i can't survive in..... i guess If anyone wants to continue to hunt with a VTOL you are doing So at your own risk of being caught and reported.


Also i don't see how in any WAY a vtol gives me in any advantage to mining...... i still can lose ped just as fast as i normally do. or gain..... which ever my avatar 'wave' feels like being on.
Atleast i am not Taking down mobs like some people are.
 

minim

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just so you know DRDOOM the first thing i did in game was Become a hunter so i could remove mobs out of my way. I can kill mobs if need i am a pretty decent hunter.....
I just don't see how you think i am going above and beyond anyone in this game with A VTOL Since the Vtol's price is cheap enough for any level player to buy......... anyways.

I have mined in areas that people can't normally survive and i don't go in areas that i can't survive in..... i guess If anyone wants to continue to hunt with a VTOL you are doing So at your own risk of being caught and reported.

So just because you can kill them it's OK? You are avoiding decay or in general costs that would add up in the loot pool for hunters with avoiding random kills while mining and that is my point. You do this and complain about others exploiting and don't seem to get that there is something similar in both cases ^^
 

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Well i guess You can do as you please.
It was just a simple Request not to use vtol to hunt A. jump in Vtol fly to hard mob, Shoot mob, mob gets close, jump in Vtol Fly back whatever distance, Continue to shoot mob, etc...... I am not doing this nor do i ever want to do this. I don't respect this method of hunting.
I know alot of miners in game that use a VTOL. it helps in alot of aspects, but it is not cheating in any sense.
anyways

I will just wish everyone luck and hopfully people will come to a realization in this and it will be cured.

PEACE and GOOD luck!!!
 

DRDoom

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just so you know DRDOOM the first thing i did in game was Become a hunter so i could remove mobs out of my way. I can kill mobs if need i am a pretty decent hunter.....
I just don't see how you think i am going above and beyond anyone in this game with A VTOL Since the Vtol's price is cheap enough for any level player to buy......... anyways.

I have mined in areas that people can't normally survive and i don't go in areas that i can't survive in..... i guess If anyone wants to continue to hunt with a VTOL you are doing So at your own risk of being caught and reported.


Also i don't see how in any WAY a vtol gives me in any advantage to mining...... i still can lose ped just as fast as i normally do. or gain..... which ever my avatar 'wave' feels like being on.
Atleast i am not Taking down mobs like some people are.

I'm not saying that hunting with a VTOl is OK not do I say it's cheating. I'm just saying that miners using it for their advantage as well just as a hunter does.

For a hunter there is no guaranteed profit for killing a mob with VTOL hunting either. It would still cost just as much ammo to kill the mob. And he has no armor decay, but he does spends peds on using the VTOL as well.


Let me rephrase it and please answer honestly: Lets say you are out hunting and you find a claim next to a spider stalker which you probably cannot kill. are you going to aggro it and let the spider kill you, run/TP/Fly back let him aggo you again,.. and do this untill the spider is far enough from the claim to extract it?
OR are you going to aggro it, jump in you VTOL, fly a bit further, agro it again etc... so you cannot get killed and then fly with VTOL towards the claim.

I know if I was out mining and had a VTOL I would choose the second option, It would save me time armor & Fap Decay.
 
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minim

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Well i guess You can do as you please.
It was just a simple Request not to use vtol to hunt A. jump in Vtol fly to hard mob, Shoot mob, mob gets close, jump in Vtol Fly back whatever distance, Continue to shoot mob, etc...... I am not doing this nor do i ever want to do this. I don't respect this method of hunting.
I know alot of miners in game that use a VTOL. it helps in alot of aspects, but it is not cheating in any sense.
anyways

I will just wish everyone luck and hopfully people will come to a realization in this and it will be cured.

PEACE and GOOD luck!!!

And I agreed to that Strash. I have invested much money in tools that make me hunt bigger mobs without much armor decay (and of course without VTOL) so I, or ppl with more tools/skills than me should really be creating these threads rather than a miner doing VTOL runs himself but do we? ^^

The argument that you know a lot of miners that use VTOL doesn't really help much. I could say I know a lot of hunters using VTOL to but it doesn't make it more right to use the VTOL in that way, or am I wrong?.

Consider that ppl might look at your VTOL exploiting as you look at the hunters exploiting before you go out in the community and scream about it. I am one of those.
 

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So just because you can kill them it's OK? You are avoiding decay or in general costs that would add up in the loot pool for hunters with avoiding random kills while mining and that is my point. You do this and complain about others exploiting and don't seem to get that there is something similar in both cases ^^

Lootpool is a myth anyway :p
 

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I'm not saying that hunting with a VTOl is OK not do I say it's cheating. I'm just saying that miners using it for their advantage as well just as a hunter does.

For a hunter there is no guaranteed profit for killing a mob with VTOL hunting either. It would still cost just as much ammo to kill the mob. And he has no armor decay, but he does spends peds on using the VTOL as well.


Let me rephrase it and please answer honestly: Lets say you are out hunting and you find a claim next to a spider stalker which you probably cannot kill. are you going to aggro it and let the spider kill you, run/TP/Fly back let him aggo you again,.. and do this untill the spider is far enough from the claim to extract it?
OR are you going to aggro it, jump in you VTOL, fly a bit further, agro it again etc... so you cannot get killed and then fly with VTOL towards the claim.

I know if I was out mining and had a VTOL I would choose the second option, It would save me time armor & Fap Decay.

I would use the "summon claim" option, but that's just me.

About the whole VTOL argument ... it feels kinda lame to hunt that way, doesn't it? But what do I know? I don't own a single vehicle, haven't played much for about a year now and I've always used the head-on-attack option. I'm a melee hunter after all. No hit and run tactics for me. No hit and hide tactics for me. No ping pong in team tactics for me. Just me, my sword, my mob and my armour and fap.

:cool::wise::cool:
 

~CHOPPER~

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I know if I was out mining and had a VTOL I would choose the second option, It would save me time armor & Fap Decay.

Most people probably would do the same.

Seems like the same issue as hunting with a VTOL.
 
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