The efficiency of scopes/lasers, Feb 2010

aboo

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A test in response to this post,

2010-03-08 14:16 Entropia Universe Support:


Hi,
Thank you for your inquiry. The laser and scope does not affect the stats of the weapon because it only affects the effective range of the weapon.
Kind regards,
Entropia Universe Support
From this thread https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/weapons/182134-enhancers-change-stats-why-dont-lasers-scopes-3.html#post2339964

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Weapon and Skills for All the Runs

Weapon Used: MK5 Mentor Edition + A106 (fully repaired)
Laser Sniper Hit Level: 60.2
Laser Dmg Level: 74.5
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Test 1 - Old Client (crits not shown, missed data lines bug)

Without Attachment - First Run

Attachments: None
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1495
Total Misses: 220
Expected Hit Rate: 87.2%

Actual Hit Rate: 87.17%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

(screenshot shows the program results)

Without Attachment - Second Run

Attachments: None
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1505
Total Misses: 210
Expected Hit Rate: 87.2%

Actual Hit Rate: 87.7%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

(screenshot shows the program results)

With Attachment - First Run

Attachments: Hunnir + Hunnir + Jzar (fully repaired)
Skill Mod: 58%
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1502
Total Misses: 226
Expected Hit Rate: 91.37%

Actual Hit Rate: 86.9%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

(screenshot shows the program results)

With Attachment - Second Run (to verify 1st run)

Attachments: Hunnir + Hunnir + Jzar (fully repaired)
Skill Mod: 58%
Hunting Style: 1st person and manual aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1501
Total Misses: 250
Expected Hit Rate: 91.37%

Actual Hit Rate: 85.7%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

(screenshot shows the program results)

With Attachment - Third Run

Attachments: Hunnir + Hunnir + Jzar (fully repaired)
Skill Mod: 58%
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1503
Total Misses: 227
Expected Hit Rate: 91.37%

Actual Hit Rate: 86.8%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Test 2 - New Client (shows crits, missed lines fixed)

Without Attachment - First Run

Attachments: None
Hunting Style: 1st person and manual aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Formidon

Total Hits: 1488
Total Misses: 233
Total Critical Hits: 24
Expected Hit Rate: 87.2%

Actual Hit Rate: 86.4%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

With Attachment - First Run

Attachments: Hunnir + Hunnir + Jzar (fully repaired)
Hunting Style: 1st person and manual aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Formidon

Total Hits: 1517
Total Misses: 239
Total Critical Hits: 43
Expected Hit Rate: 91.37%

Actual Hit Rate: 86.38%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Conclusion

The support reply appears correct, scopes and sights do not help hit rate. A new release from MA states it does not effect range either.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/mindark-news/188881-what-does-scopes-laser-sights-really-do.html

Update: Test 1 was done with the old client, which did not record critical hits, and missed some data lines apparantly.

The data from Test 2 (fixed client) indicates no improvement in hit rate when scopes and sights are attached. Therefore it supports the findings of Test 1 in this respect.

Note: Client did not reset critical hits for the 2nd run in Test 2 when scope/sights were added. It carried on counting from 24. Therefore the screenshot with 43 critical hits is not significant. The real number was 19.
 
Last edited:

DoctorH

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Well, that's damn interesting.
 

Johned

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Wow that is very interesting. Did you only do the one run without attachments? Were they fully repaired? I once read if scopes and lasers were at a low level of repair it would make the hit rate less.

If they were fully repair then :eyecrazy: at wasted ped in miss rate over the years.
 

mjukis

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Did you fully repair the attachments before the test?
 

aboo

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Did you only do the one run without attachments?
Yes, only one, i didnt have time tonight for another. But as it proved to be exactly the hit rate I should get for my skills, i didnt feel the need to try again tonight.
 

XxSmityxX

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so what your getting at is that we should all sell our laser sights and scopes because all they do is cost us decay ?
 

jjmatrix

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So "Skill Mod" = Range?
:scratch2:

Also, maybe be the decay from the scope+laser is adding to the loot?
 

aboo

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so what your getting at is that we should all sell our laser sights and scopes because all they do is cost us decay ?
They may help a tango user in pvp4, and for long range ml35 etc to take more health from a mob.

But they do not appear to be a good choice for handguns, doa etc.

I'll be selling mine ;), as long as the tests prove the same tomorrow.
 

Superhal

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Can you check crit hit rate? That seems to be the big improvement I'm noticing after upgrading my scope/sights.
 

Moonbiter

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Can you check crit hit rate? That seems to be the big improvement I'm noticing after upgrading my scope/sights.
That would affect avg dmg and as you can see from screenshots, it does not.
 

Johned

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Accoding to this it may not be tracking any crits that are dealt ...

Just saw this new feature in the suite. Very nice... though I'm not realy happy with my current Hit Rate... not sure I like knowing that I'm missing over 10% of my shots.

It currently does not appear that the tracker accounts for Critical Hits... is this something you will implement?
 

Moonbiter

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Accoding to this it may not be tracking any crits that are dealt ...
Yeah, just noticed this myself after posting. So effect on critical hits is still unclear.
 

Legion

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soo uuum you say lasers and scopes increase the range of the gun? never seen that in any shape or form.
 

Killahbee

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Awesome information fish!
Can't wait to see some more test results.
Perhaps there are others who can do some testruns?

a big +rep is on its way :)
 

~CHOPPER~

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soo uuum you say lasers and scopes increase the range of the gun? never seen that in any shape or form.
Maybe the old pre-vu10 tests are no longer valid??:scratch2:
 

PW3CKA

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Hmm.. im confused..

I swear HA goes pretty up with scopes and lasers on ML-35 , also the crit rate..

I have no data for it, just my common sense.. As when i had ml-35 i hunted a lot without scope and lasers before i bought them, and i must say that the difference was quite big and clearly noticable lol.. Also the range was not improved at all, and it was already in VU10

It might be something with your skills because i was around level 50 blp/sniper hit when i used the ML..


Anyway if it comes true.. Bastards changed it and we should complain somehow.. Everybody knows Lasers and Scopes were quite properly tested in vu 9 and they were INCREASING your HA, except on maxed SIB guns where they decreased it..
 

Wed

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so what your getting at is that we should all sell our laser sights and scopes because all they do is cost us decay ?
Seems im ahead of my time, as i sold mine long time ago. No reason to add extra decay with scopes and sights :cool:
 

aboo

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soo uuum you say lasers and scopes increase the range of the gun? never seen that in any shape or form.
A support case reply from MA/FPC stated it only helped range. Personally, I have never noticed it either.

As when i had ml-35 i hunted a lot without scope and lasers before i bought them, and i must say that the difference was quite big and clearly noticable lol..
Maybe the mind can play tricks on us. When I applied sights to my gun for this test, I thought, there is some improvement here, then i looked at the computer program and there wasnt.

Plus, I wanted there to be an improvement, because my gun would be more eco. That may effect how we perceive things.
 
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Legion

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A support case reply from MA/FPC stated it only helped range. Personally, I have never noticed it either.



Maybe the mind can play tricks on us. When I applied sights to my gun for this test, I thought, there is some improvement here, then i looked at the computer program and there wasnt.

Plus, I wanted there to be an improvement, because my gun would be more eco. That may effect how we perceive things.
well putting a scope and laser sure as hell dont improve my range :p But then again we know how confused support can be.
 

Hijacker27

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Now we have to test whether scopes and lasers actually affect range :)
 

Yquem

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When you hunt with a ml-35 how do we know if that mob close to radar boarder is within the range of the ML-35? Maybe if it is outside the range you can hit it if you use scope and lasers?

A new test is on the way .....

Good test btw
 

Nihilist

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i think "effective" is the key word in that support reply.

effective range and range might be two different things.

hah
 

Futurama

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Nothing new really for me, but well its still a good thing that someone did a proper test for people to see that scopes and lasers doesn`t really do anything (ofc unless someone can somehow prove something about the range).
 

aboo

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Test Results: Second Day

Weapon and Skills for All the Runs

Weapon Used: MK5 Mentor Edition + A106 (fully repaired)
Laser Sniper Hit Level: 60.2
Laser Dmg Level: 74.5

Without Attachment - Second Run

Attachments: None
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1505
Total Misses: 210
Expected Hit Rate: 87.2%

Actual Hit Rate: 87.7%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

(screenshot shows the program results)

With Attachment - Third Run

Attachments: Hunnir + Hunnir + Jzar (fully repaired)
Skill Mod: 58%
Hunting Style: 3rd person and auto aim
Software Used: Entropia Tracker Suite
Hunted Creature: Droka at hades crater

Total Hits: 1503
Total Misses: 227
Expected Hit Rate: 91.37%

Actual Hit Rate: 86.8%

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

Conclusion

Still no hit rate improvement with a 58% skill mod. If anything they slightly decrease hit rate :)
 

Cron

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If they do improve range it ought to be easily tested. Take someone to a pvp area and use sights and scope and move to maximum distance. Remove the gear and see if it still hits.

I suppose if range is in any way dynamic, that might not work too well though :laugh:
 

Lorfat

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So the question remains open, why does it not display changed Range?
Maybe that is only displayed when (after inserting the scopes/lasers) your skills enable you to surpass the weapon's standard range limit (i.e. the range limit of the weapon without scopes/lasers attached).

Here's an example of range improvement shown in the weapon's stats:
 
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All I know is with the scopes and lasers I can tag mobs with just an ear sticking over a hill. Without em at same range initial shot misses are far more.

Track the difference on the "Tag" shot only and see what effect it has.
 

mjukis

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Maybe that is only displayed when (after inserting the scopes/lasers) your skills enable you to surpass the weapon's standard range limit (i.e. the range limit of the weapon without scopes/lasers attached).
Since the enhancer update it's no longer possible to overmax range with lvl 100+ hit prof. And the extra range was there regardless if you had scopes and lasers or not.
 
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