The motivation for change

[thoreau]

About nine months ago I wrote:

All interesting stuff. For me I worry about long term issues. For example, imagine planet X developing their own unique gaming environment and as a result they have their own unique player base.

Then Planet X petitions MA for some change in the underlying game mechanic that will affect all planets. Their presentation is good and the numbers are spot on - so MA makes the change.

How will Calypso players respond to that change?

There may come a time when MA will have to decide which planet to make happy.

And today Mindark wrote in regards to the mining changes:

Since we aim to expand the mining system with more items and categories along with our Planet Partners, the old system did not scale well and the complexity would be excessive.

My emphasis.

I have to ask, what was the motivation for changing the mining system? Was it initiated by one of the other planet partners. If so, is it fair that a system is changed on one planet because another planet envisions that system differently.

Would MA change mining on Calypso if Neverdie wanted buried treasures? (only an example)

 

[Ludvig|MindArk]

1) Treasure hunting is an Arkadia thing, as that is supposed to be a Treasure Hunt planet, right?
2) Since MA are the ones making the systems, perhaps this was done to make future development of new systems easier, and therefore all systems were included in the remake?

 

[thoreau]

1) Treasure hunting is an Arkadia thing, as that is supposed to be a Treasure Hunt planet, right?
2) Since MA are the ones making the systems, perhaps this was done to make future development of new systems easier, and therefore all systems were included in the remake?

So because Arkadia wanted treasures mining had to be changed across the universe?

I think this is actually an important issue as more planets come online.

 

[mastermesh]

sounds like a platform question to Ask Mindark.

 

[Ludvig|MindArk]

So because Arkadia wanted treasures mining had to be changed across the universe?

I think this is actually an important issue as more planets come online.

No, because new planets wants/may want new types of mining they had to make a mining system that was easy to expand so these new types of mining may be used.

 

[thoreau]

No, because new planets wants/may want new types of mining they had to make a mining system that was easy to expand so these new types of mining may be used.

So because another planet wants a different type of damage for mobs MA combines lasers, BLP, plasma, cannons into one weapon type?

 

[valentin]

No...When MA inplants a new system its only because of lot of new nerfs.
It has always been so.

 

[Ludvig|MindArk]

So because another planet wants a different type of damage for mobs MA combines lasers, BLP, plasma, cannons into one weapon type?

That is an entirely different thing, and has nothing to do with this.

 

[Moonbiter]

So because another planet wants a different type of damage for mobs MA combines lasers, BLP, plasma, cannons into one weapon type?

That's mute point. You need only 1 weapon to kill anything. You needed 2 sets of tools to be able to mine everything (ores and enmatters). With arkadia you would have needed 3 sets of tools.

 

[thoreau]

That's mute point. You need only 1 weapon to kill anything. You needed 2 sets of tools to be able to mine everything (ores and enmatters). With arkadia you would have needed 3 sets of tools.

You missed my point.

Imagine a PP wanted some mobs to be damaged by certain types of weapons. For example, imagine Planet X wanted bots to be immune to lasers but not BLP.

To hunt on that planet you would need to carry 2 types of weapons.

Would MA combine weapon types to a single type that uses different ammo?

 

[mobydick]

You missed my point.

Imagine a PP wanted some mobs to be damaged by certain types of weapons. For example, imagine Planet X wanted bots to be immune to lasers but not BLP.

To hunt on that planet you would need to carry 2 types of weapons.

Would MA combine weapon types to a single type that uses different ammo?

Well, think about Planet Michael. They want to have "dance attacks" which seems like it will be mindforce so we could very well see a re-design of all mindforce.

The Treasure hunting thing is interesting because it will cost more per "click" than mining. So, it's a sense of "higher stakes gambling" and it will be interesting to see if it works for them. Some people won't be able to afford treasure hunting.

 

[billairboy]

Well, think about Planet Michael. They want to have "dance attacks" which seems like it will be mindforce so we could very well see a re-design of all mindforce.

The Treasure hunting thing is interesting because it will cost more per "click" than mining. So, it's a sense of "higher stakes gambling" and it will be interesting to see if it works for them. Some people won't be able to afford treasure hunting.

I am curious about what "Treasure" are..... some kind of new items/resources or what?

 

[remontoire]

That's mute point. You need only 1 weapon to kill anything. You needed 2 sets of tools to be able to mine everything (ores and enmatters). With arkadia you would have needed 3 sets of tools.

Exactly. And quite possibly, 4, 5, 6, etc sets over time, if / when there are more types of things you can find underground.
Adding a new type of resource becomes a lot easier.

Now what I want to know is when we can do archeology on Calypso? But thats a different topic.

 

[Cani Ostro]

I think they took the opportunity to straighten out their misconception of UL vs. old L vs. new L finders.

And like always, I don't think it is anything that is working towards our pedflow, but theirs. Probably their numbers showed that certain finders produced too good results.

+they aim towards new customers, its easier to tell a newbie "y00 g0t onli 1 finder for a11 yer mining" than make em read and understand Alice guides for example

Since they need to fit planet content into their systems they probably adjust to what a planet partner in particular needs. So Arkadia introduced treasure hunting as 3rd type of mining profession and they jumped it to redesign the mining system in total.

I am no miner, but I would certainly have preferred a warning or heads up for such a major change. I just hope the miners do make the best of it.

 

[Legrian BB]

Wonder if you could use amps while treasure hunting...

 

[mobydick]

I am curious about what "Treasure" are..... some kind of new items/resources or what?

Yeah...just new kind of items which will form collections for quests, etc. with other items gained through hunting and crafting (see arkadia forum).

 

[Dblood1]

I think the main reason for the mining changes is based on 2 things:

1. dual mining (soon 3 with treasure) faster turnover = more deposits
2. make enmatter cheaper too mine and more supply = less markup = more deposits

 

[Ludvig|MindArk]

I am no miner, but I would certainly have preferred a warning or heads up for such a major change. I just hope the miners do make the best of it.

If they had told miners exactly what they were changing it would have the same effect as implementing the update... if they just said they would completely remake the mining system and didnt give many details, it could create panic and fierce speculation

 

[Mega]

I get the impression (maybe wrongly) they wanted to simplify it, possibly to make it easier for new players.

As with the mindforce revamp last year, this time it was minings turn.

Which makes me wonder if they are going to replace & rename all our weapons when its huntings turn.....

 

[SpikeBlack]

This change could have been made by slipping in new finders rather than changing all the existing ones. Atmost they needed to change the finders to use a generic bomb so that ore finders use 2 and enmatter use 1 rather than turning the finders themselves also into generic items.

This would have allowed miners to have enmatter and ore finders at different levels without having to continually switch options on them.

Lazy programming is all I can see and a lack of care for the rce.

 

[Divinity]

You missed my point.

Imagine a PP wanted some mobs to be damaged by certain types of weapons. For example, imagine Planet X wanted bots to be immune to lasers but not BLP.

To hunt on that planet you would need to carry 2 types of weapons.

Would MA combine weapon types to a single type that uses different ammo?

When i read the change in mining , i must say this was the first thought that came to my mind. In the near or distant future , i am pretty sure this can happen

 

[Naithen]

Any change made is made for one reason and thats to make it more expensive for you to participate.

 

[Robin]

No...When MA inplants a new system its only because of lot of new nerfs.
It has always been so.

agreed..makes more money for MA ..it's a business and that what businesses do

 

[Moonbiter]

Any change made is made for one reason and thats to make it more expensive for you to participate.

So what exactly are you doing here then for 5 years already? How exactly this update makes it more expensive to participate?

And just FYI, i'm miner, was on all time top5 on tracker for a year or more, and i personally thing that this update (along with some other changes recently, like real time coords) is best thing in years.

Just never fails, come any update, there will be a bunch of guys whining w/o any reason, w/o even reading the changelog just for the sake of it.

 

[aridash]

I have to ask, what was the motivation for changing the mining system?

ask? sounds like you've decided and attacking MA for making that decision (which you have projected onto them).

Imagine a PP wanted some mobs to be damaged by certain types of weapons. For example, imagine Planet X wanted bots to be immune to lasers but not BLP.

you mean like Ancient Greece on the NI planet? seems to have been dealt with. or a planet could have a robot mob attributes set to 1000 armour burn, 0 penetration or whatever.

given the way MA and the planets are working so far, i really doubt they are making universe wide changes on the behest of planets. mind you, i dont really know what needed to be "simplified" in mining. they might have taken on board a suggestion from a planet, if it serves a greater universe wide benefit. i dont mine enough to know if this does, but it does look detremental (loss of valuable items aside?)

Any change made is made for one reason and thats to make it more expensive for you to participate.

changes are often to remove exploits and cheats. it follows that exploiters and cheaters make the game more expensive for the rest of us to particpate.

 

[thoreau]

Just never fails, come any update, there will be a bunch of guys whining w/o any reason, w/o even reading the changelog just for the sake of it.

For the record I'm not whining. I'm interested in how the changes requested by one PP affects participants on another planet and what MA's thought process in implementing those changes.

More to the point, will MA ever seek input from the community or will they simply work behind the RCE curtain.

 

[mastermesh]

just wait til we all have to moonwalk to do any damage to any mobs on calypso.

 

[Tec]

So because another planet wants a different type of damage for mobs MA combines lasers, BLP, plasma, cannons into one weapon type?

I think the logical step would be to do away with ammo types and just have "energy"

 

[Joat]

Seems like they have been looking at my chat occasionly last years, since this new
system is something I think is way better. It might not be perfect (no hotkeys, yet,
to alternate between ore and enmatter), but way more simple.

My guess is that some people has to redo their mining theory (I'm not thinking of
you hrer, thoreau) since the dualbombing screw their theory up pretty good...
This new system do what I have tried to achieve asap when I droped bombs
and probes before this VU.

 

[Charlie Gloom]

Not needing two unl amps to have good economy, awesome move IMO