Info: Weapon Review: Ashley & Perrin Series Mayhem BP-70, Perfected

Captain Jack

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Overview: The BP-70 Perfected is one of the most versatile weapons in the game, being scalable from low level mobs to the highest level mobs in the game, and with top-tier efficiency enables a hunter to grind almost any mob in the game with minimal risk on returns.


Versatility/DPS: With 78.7 max damage/shot unamped and unenhanced, this weapon is capable of grinding lower-mid level mobs with minimal overkill. Any mob which would be appropriately hunted with an LR-40 FEN Edition, Combat Mace 2, or Isis LR-48 would also be appropriate to hunt with this weapon since all of those weapons have similar max base damage/attack. On anything smaller than what would normally be hunted with the previously mentioned weapons, it is unlikely that a player who can afford this weapon system would be chasing markup on mobs smaller than that, and since overkill is compensated in TT return I would argue that this weapon is also appropriate for the smallest mobs for codex completion purposes. Yet it also functions very well for top-level mobs in the game, pushing out an impressive 262 DPS when fully amped/enhanced, appropriate ring/armor setup, and with very commonly available pills.



Efficiency: With a mere 1.5% shy of the Unique Sacrificial Dagger, the BP-70 Perfected is tied with the Unique Reaper's Blade for second highest efficiency of any weapon system ingame. Efficiency is arguably the most important factor the selection of a weapon system, as it directly affects your bottom line with or without markup. When I had the privilege of owning this weapon I received a 99.8% TT return over 500,000 PED tracked when I was in the high 50s in Looter professions. I was amazed. It basically gave me the ability to hunt anything for free, and any markup looted resulted in a profit.



Conclusion: The BP-70 Perfected ranks as #2 best weapon in the game in my book, directly behind the Unique Sacrificial Dagger as a very close second. It opens the door to every hunting opportunity in the game, and with more than one existing in the game, ownership of this incredible weapon system is actually attainable, though greatness comes at a cost.
 
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Just for comparison, there are two guns currently for sale.

A Perfected BP70 T3 (200k plus) and a MM t6 (50k)

150k price difference between the two guns.

Using the most compatible UL amps available, with 5 focus, 15% reload and 50 crit damage.

The Perfected BP70 is inferior in everything except efficiency.

Range - MM +19.2m / BP70 - 19.2m

DPS - MM (174.95) +18 / BP70 (156.95) - 18

Decay - MM (3.79) - 3.68 / BP70 (7.47) + 3.68

MM DPP (3.34) - 0.30 / BP70 (3.64) + 0.30

So the question is, does an extra 0.30 DPP represent good value at an extra 150k?

An extra 0.10 DPP = 50k ?
 
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Evey

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Wouldn't you trade 13 eff for 35 dps? (buffed to max ofc) Not to mention the dpp difference. They're both in my books below the LP100 Mod and there are also BC 110 and BC 80 in between, but nonetheless, a great tool


NameAmplifier nameDecayAmmoCostDmg/PECDamageMax.DamageEff.DamageMin.DamageRangeAttacksDmg/sec
A&P Series Mayhem BP-70, PerfectedMayhem B-Amplifier Alpha (L)2.369389441.7014.015196.75196.75167.4398.3830.398.8275.7084
A&P Series Mayhem BP-110, Improved (L)Mayhem B-Amplifier Beta (L)2.733425645.6894.61247.5247.5210.62123.7527.588.4310.3171
 

Jhereg

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@Teresa Contessa diVicenzo

I think you are mixing up DPP and Efficiency.

DPP = reduced cost per mob (and as a result volatility) and potentially better loot composition as stated by MA.

Efficiency directly impacts TT return -> Mod merc has 69.7% Eff, compared to bp70s 92.5%. Assuming a linear TT impact for the efficiency scale between 0-7%, this correlates to a difference of 1.6% improvement in TT return with the BP70.

Would you pay an extra 150k to save 1600 ped per 100k you cycle as an initial investment? All depends on how much you cycle I suppose :).

2k/day cycle -> ~700k per year or 11.2k ped saved per year.
10k/day cycle -> 3.5 million per year or 56k ped saved per year.

Just for comparison, there are two guns currently for sale.

A Perfected BP70 T3 (200k plus) and a MM t6 (50k)

150k price difference between the two guns.

Using the most compatible UL amps available, with 5 focus, 15% reload and 50 crit damage.

The Perfected BP70 is inferior in everything except efficiency.

Range - MM +19.2m / BP70 - 19.2m

DPS - MM (174.95) +18 / BP70 (156.95) - 18

Decay - MM (3.79) - 3.68 / BP70 (7.47) + 3.68

MM DPP (3.34) - 0.30 / BP70 (3.64) + 0.30

So the question is, does an extra 0.30 efficiency represent good value at an extra 150k?

An extra 0.10 efficiency = 50k ?
 

Jhereg

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Wouldn't you trade 13 eff for 35 dps? (buffed to max ofc) Not to mention the dpp difference. They're both in my books below the LP100 Mod and there are also BC 110 and BC 80 in between, but nonetheless, a great tool


NameAmplifier nameDecayAmmoCostDmg/PECDamageMax.DamageEff.DamageMin.DamageRangeAttacksDmg/sec
A&P Series Mayhem BP-70, PerfectedMayhem B-Amplifier Alpha (L)2.369389441.7014.015196.75196.75167.4398.3830.398.8275.7084
A&P Series Mayhem BP-110, Improved (L)Mayhem B-Amplifier Beta (L)2.733425645.6894.61247.5247.5210.62123.7527.588.4310.3171
Unfortunately, the BP70 Perf can't use full damage range of the Alpha Amp by quite a bit, so the DPP gets reduced by a lot when you look at them together...

I don't think there's a good amp to go with the bp70 perf (in terms of efficiency and dpp) ...maybe a dante if you really need the dps.

If it were me, I'd tier the bp70 to t10, and skip the amp altogether, or maybe use a dante...
 
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Evey

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Unfortunately, the BP70 Perf can't use full damage range of the Alpha Amp by quite a bit, so the DPP gets reduced by a lot when you look at them together...

I don't think there's a good amp to go with the bp70 perf (in terms of efficiency and dpp) ...maybe a dante if you really need the dps.

If it were me, I'd tier the bp70 to t10, and skip the amp altogether.
The DPP loss by overamping is minimal.

It's still ~10% dpp difference even w/o an amp - 3.9 vs 3.5 dpp.

As for playing without an amp, we are playing different games.

But I agree, MM is a good tool of the past. It has way less dpp and efficiency to be used in serious grinding, but it's a great option for a casual hunt style.
 
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ok, so I am a bit off track........

So the MM is better in 3 items, DPS, Range and Decay, and the BP70 is better in 2, DPP and Eff, and that is why there is 150k of difference!

I cant find anywhere where MA states its Linear, but lets assume on your figures it is.......

So you would need to cycle, 2k/day -> ~700k per year for 11.2k ped saved per year, for 13 years to recoup the extra investment, before you reap the benefit of a 1.6% extra return in the tt. Basically just paying the tt up front instead of spreading it over the 13 years?

Or you would need to cycle, 10k/day -> 3.5 million per year for 56k ped saved per year. for 3 years to recoup the extra investment, before you reap the benefit of a 1.6% extra return in the tt. Basically just paying the tt up front instead of spreading it over the 3 years?

And that's of course without tiering costs along the way included.

I think i am on track now, thank you........
 

True Juan

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I see people keep stating that both efficiency and looter gives 7% from 0 to 100.

That would mean new players would be around 87% return which is simply not true...
 

Jhereg

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The DPP loss by overamping is minimal.

It's still ~10% dpp difference even w/o an amp - 3.9 vs 3.5 dpp.

As for playing without an amp, we are playing different games.

But I agree, MM is a good tool of the past. It has way less dpp and efficiency to be used in serious grinding, but it's a great option for a casual hunt style.
I don't think we are inherently in disagreement or playing different games :) I agree with you dps is also important.

I think under different situations you need to optimize efficiency, dpp, or dps. Sometimes it is about a balance of the three, depending on the situation and your tolerance for loss and your game goals are.
 

Jhereg

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I see people keep stating that both efficiency and looter gives 7% from 0 to 100.

That would mean new players would be around 87% return which is simply not true...
Usually they start with a 55% to 60% efficiency weapon...so not sure why you would get 87%..
 

Captain Jack

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Wouldn't you trade 13 eff for 35 dps? (buffed to max ofc) Not to mention the dpp difference. They're both in my books below the LP100 Mod and there are also BC 110 and BC 80 in between, but nonetheless, a great tool


NameAmplifier nameDecayAmmoCostDmg/PECDamageMax.DamageEff.DamageMin.DamageRangeAttacksDmg/sec
A&P Series Mayhem BP-70, PerfectedMayhem B-Amplifier Alpha (L)2.369389441.7014.015196.75196.75167.4398.3830.398.8275.7084
A&P Series Mayhem BP-110, Improved (L)Mayhem B-Amplifier Beta (L)2.733425645.6894.61247.5247.5210.62123.7527.588.4310.3171
Personally I classify the LP-100 as in a different category than the BP-70. Definitely an incredible end-game weapon, but for now I prioritize efficiency > DPS to a large degree. This may change after I get some experience cycling with 2.0 weapons with DPS upwards of the LP-100.
 
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Just playing devils advocate.......

If the BP70 produces a linear 1.6% extra tt return, wouldn't that make the gun worth a few % more than the MM?
 

Captain Jack

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Usually they start with a 55% to 60% efficiency weapon...so not sure why you would get 87%..
Someone please volunteer to bankroll the test of a large sample size Swine Deluxe grind on a new avatar with daily chip-outs. Do it in the name of science!
 

Captain Jack

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Just playing devils advocate.......

If the BP70 produces a linear 1.6% extra tt return, wouldn't that make the gun worth a few % more than the MM?
I have not offered an opinion on this thread regarding the value of the weapon, as that would fit better in a "price-check" thread. But to answer your question briefly (and hope it does not open a can of worms), I would pay (and have) significantly more than a few % higher for a weapon that offers a consistently higher TT return. To me, the difference between 99.8% TT return and 98.2% TT return is the difference between consistently profiting off of shrapnel conversion (available on basically any mob) and having to be more careful with my mob selection, keeping in tune with the market swings etc. to ensure a consistently profitable month.

If the 1.6% TT return difference made only a few % difference in the value of the weapon, I would argue that either the Swine Deluxe is grossly underpriced, by a landslide.

...
Or you would need to cycle, 10k/day -> 3.5 million per year for 56k ped saved per year. for 3 years to recoup the extra investment, before you reap the benefit of a 1.6% extra return in the tt. Basically just paying the tt up front instead of spreading it over the 3 years?
...
Most Land Areas sell for a price-tag with a 3-5 year ROI. CLDs offer significantly less ROI, and yet are still incredibly popular.
 

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Someone please volunteer to bankroll the test of a large sample size Swine Deluxe grind on a new avatar with daily chip-outs. Do it in the name of science!
That will also not guve you the base return as the hunter will loose on tt cause of the misses :D
 

Captain Jack

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That will also not guve you the base return as the hunter will loose on tt cause of the misses :D
Which contributes to the bonus loot pool of players who are hunting more efficiently. The max TT return factors in bonus loot, so it would stand to reason that the losses incurred which contribute to the bonus loot pool should be factored into the "baseline loss" experiment.
 

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ok, so I am a bit off track........

So the MM is better in [...] Decay
This doesn't mean anything, decay is a part of the total cost but altogether it has lower dpp than the BP70 an pretty much lower than most if not all 2.0 weapons.
The price tag is however a very important aspect and you may be right, imo, that MM could be better considering the difference, but the price is set by the demand, not by logic :D Otherwise BP70 would be much cheaper than BP110 for example.
Dpp is a very important aspect, efficiency is top priority, but these two without DPS will not help a hunter progress much, merely will allow the hunter to look at a fancier % but in terms of opportunities, these will be limited.
 

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I have to add this: everyone's book looks different which is totally fine. We have different goals and different means to get there, different paces too. It's normal for some peopel to prefer imk2 vs anything else, or BP70 vs the rest of the weapons, but remember, it's very different for each of us so don't forget to take that into account when shopping for a weapon and never get your expectations too high because in this game that's the enemy no.1. Too high expectations is the reason people give up.
 
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girtsn

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i am willing to do a test with a doa foeripper or something crazy inefficient for a month, just need to find one
(in the name of science)

P.S. offer is off, found an efficient gun inbetween, sorry science :(
 
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Jhereg

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ok, so I am a bit off track........

So the MM is better in 3 items, DPS, Range and Decay, and the BP70 is better in 2, DPP and Eff, and that is why there is 150k of difference!

I cant find anywhere where MA states its Linear, but lets assume on your figures it is.......

So you would need to cycle, 2k/day -> ~700k per year for 11.2k ped saved per year, for 13 years to recoup the extra investment, before you reap the benefit of a 1.6% extra return in the tt. Basically just paying the tt up front instead of spreading it over the 13 years?

Or you would need to cycle, 10k/day -> 3.5 million per year for 56k ped saved per year. for 3 years to recoup the extra investment, before you reap the benefit of a 1.6% extra return in the tt. Basically just paying the tt up front instead of spreading it over the 3 years?

And that's of course without tiering costs along the way included.

I think i am on track now, thank you........
You are assuming the gun goes to zero value after three years, and that somehow you can't sell it...

If the gun holds its value 100% after one year, you would have netted an extra 56k you would not before...

Of course, there's risk to the purchase of the equipment, you can't neglect that, so expect some possible depreciation each year (but then again, those that purchased loot 2.0 weapons a year or more ago actually saw appreciation on their items...)

If you only cycle a small bit, MM is probably a great lower risk option.
 
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Jhereg

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I have to add this: everyone's book looks different which is totally fine. We have different goals and different means to get there, different paces too. It's normal for some peopel to prefer imk2 vs anything else, or BP70 vs the rest of the weapons, but remember, it's very different for each of us so don't forget to take that into account when shopping for a weapon and never get your expectations too high because in this game that's the enemy no.1. Too high expectations is the reason people give up.
100% agree with this. Do your own testing. And expect MA to change the status quo if it becomes too stagnant :)
 

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Nice review man. Its nicely written review and I can't find a single thing wrong with it tbh.

To add to the review, mainly about his 99.8% TT return on 500k cycle at 50 looter. Below is my return since I started tracking hunting with bp-70 perfected around august last year (over 1M+ peds tracked). I started using it below 50 looter now I'm almost lvl 62.
Here's a graph of my returns over this period until today.

Tracked through entropialoot.com tracker made by Atomicstorm.

I have honestly never experienced such consistent returns in my entire EU career. Around mid september/october I noticed the returns became significantly more consistent. I believe because the loot system finally started to catch up to my expected return due to higher efficiency.
December last year I didn't play much at all since I was sick. January and part of February been crazy loot for me and it looks like it may be a bit of downtrend from now on. I do expect it to land somewhere around 99.XX% TT return overall though (right now 101.40% TT return).

Hope this information is of help to anyone who is considering getting a high eff weapon in the future.
 
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JanOaki

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BP-70 is a very good weapon but it is not second best weapon in the game for grinding nor is it the most versatile. BC80 is same efficiency fully amped/enhanced because it can fully utilize mayhem amp.

1)Bp70 lacks range which makes it less versatile (have fun shooting flying mobs or chasing bosses with low range/mayhem defense..etc)
2)Mayhem cat 8 max dps is 105, BC80 base dps is 104.2,bp-70 is 99.7, so clearly not as versatile as it cant double up as an event weapon as well.
3)Bp-70 Uses more decay and less ammo burn..More ammo burn is better.

I would say its definitely within top 4 weapon in game however..
 
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binfordw

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BP-70 is a very good weapon but it is not second best weapon in the game for grinding nor is it the most versatile.
Items are always especially awesome, impossible to live without, when they are being sold.
 

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Items are always especially awesome, impossible to live without, when they are being sold.
It is an awesome gun no doubt...any one would be lucky if they could afford it. These weapons are literally game changing.
 

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I do expect it to land somewhere around 99.XX% TT return overall though (right now 101.40% TT return).
Nice figures there but your results can't be really take into consideration since you recently got 2 x 9k :D
Those are (I'm sure deserved) not regular loot. Those are after a very dry period or before one so w/o those probably you'd be around 97% which would make more sense given the effi and looter, for longer term.
Good numbers nonetheless and definitely a very good weapon!
 

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Nice review, man. Its a nicely written review, and I can't find a single thing wrong with it tbh.

The review was mainly about his 99.8% TT return on the 500k cycle at 50 looter. Below is my return since I started tracking hunting with bp-70 perfected around august last year (over 1M+ peds tracked). I started using it below 50 looter now I'm almost LVL 62.

I have honestly never experienced such consistent returns in my entire EU career. Around mid-September/October, I noticed the returns became significantly more consistent. I believe the loot system finally started to catch up to my expected return due to higher efficiency.

December last year, I didn't play much at all since I was sick. January and part of February been crazy loot for me, and it looks like it may be a bit of a downtrend from now on. I do expect it to land somewhere around 99.XX% TT returns overall, though (right now 101.40% TT return).

I hope this information is of help to anyone considering getting a high eff weapon in the future.
Thank you for this invaluable piece of information! Quick Maths (Big Shaq Reference)

1. 91% Average Base TT Returns
---
2. 92.5% Efficiency = 6.475% TT Contribution
3. 62 Animal Looter = 4.34% TT Contribution
4. Efficiency + Looter = 10.815% TT Contribution
---
5. Maximum TT Achievable = 101.815% Contribution
6. Actual TT Returned = 101.40% TT Contribution
7. TT Difference = 0.415% TT Contribution

Again, high efficiency is for those who want a head start, nothing more.
With enough time, Looter skills will outperform the capped efficiencies.
High-efficiency weapons reduce the sine waves and recover TT quicker.

Definitely, a great gun to skill with, and I would so love one to boot, lol.
 

Jhereg

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Thank you for this invaluable piece of information! Quick Maths (Big Shaq Reference)

1. 91% Average Base TT Returns
---
2. 92.5% Efficiency = 6.475% TT Contribution
3. 62 Animal Looter = 4.34% TT Contribution
4. Efficiency + Looter = 10.815% TT Contribution
---
5. Maximum TT Achievable = 101.815% Contribution
6. Actual TT Returned = 101.40% TT Contribution
7. TT Difference = 0.415% TT Contribution

Again, high efficiency is for those who want a head start, nothing more.
With enough time, Looter skills will outperform the capped efficiencies.
High-efficiency weapons reduce the sine waves and recover TT quicker.

Definitely, a great gun to skill with, and I would so love one to boot, lol.
Just going to say, you have no idea how currently looter skill level scales with tt return...unless you know something I don't :).

What do you think the tt return is of someone with 100 or 110 animal looter at this point? :)
 
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