Menu
What's New
By:
Filters

Question: What do you think of current state of the game?

What do you think of current state of the game?

  • We don´t need no changes. People don´t know how to extract MU. There is plenty!

    Votes: 20 35.7%

  • There is hardly any MU avail to justify my time in game. Fix the game please.

    Votes: 36 64.3%
  • Total voters
    56
So for those who think MU isn't the issue, mostly they misunderstand where MU comes from. MU is a quantitative proxy for the qualitative amount of fun and excitement players are having with the game, relative to the opportunities available.

I did not realize that until I really stopped and thought the system through.
 
In the longer run, mu is a willingness to pay above tt for something, but probably in the knowledge that they won't be getting 100tt back from the activities carried out.
Mu is thus in addition to paying the platform a few %, but is considered worthwhile because mus are often generated too, such as through crafting sales or the looting of better quality loot with a setup that includes (L) stuff over not using (L) stuff.
Additionally, there are some fun/convenience elements as mentioned that can also result in players willing to fork out some mu.

The bottom line is whether there is enough size to the economy and balance of activities for players to find each other with their 'products'. The platform will always have its costs which must be paid for by the players, who will experience varying costs associated with their skill levels, activities and knowledge.
One of the problems of growth is that for players as avatars it is always at the newbie end with varying amounts of spending allowing a certain amount of time saving to get to whatever level, but these days, a low spend of 10-20 dollars a month will get an avatar almost nowhere compared to others. If the game is fun, but not too much fun at low levels, the incentive is there to move up. It took me ages of sweating, then swunting to get to a point where I was happy even on argos near Twin Peaks, at a time when sweating had a price decent enough for me to spend the mu gains on slowly improving my skills and hp. I was thus free-to-play but ofc subsidised by others and slow to progress.

With hindsight I should have depoed and moved up faster, but I don't know if it is still the same for newer players today. Obviously, lots of players deposit, so presumably they balance things their way too, with payments to MA but a satisfying gameplay and progress.
I think UE is a great chance for a new surge of players, with lots hopefully staying, but in what new fields of gameplay will the gameplay be level enough for newcomers to compete against seasoned players enough to stay with it? We shall see....
 
Gopher said:
Only way the MU goes back up for a lot of stuff for long periods of time is if MA makes new craftable 2.0 limited weapons/tools better than any UL equivalent
Click to expand...
UL gear was a mistake. But there's no way to reverse this now without killing all player trust in MA.
If they do this, they need to bring in 1000s of new players to compensate for all the UL owners quitting the game at the same time.
If UE5 is successful enough, they can think about slowly moving away from UL and creating a sustainable (L) economy.
 
Oh yeah lets remove ul then we can complain about to high mu on limited 😂☝
 
The current state of the game offers very little value for a very large upfront fee. That value only goes up so far, while the fee goes up to infinity.

I have come to peace with the fact that I might simply not be "made" to make it in this game, and my money is far better off spent in literally any other similar game than EU. I have uninstalled the game about 3 weeks or a month ago and will probably not be coming back.

That being said, I am still excited to see what Unreal will bring for Entropia, I sincerely hope it is going to be an "Entropia 2.0" with completely overhauled systems.
 
ZPF said:
UL gear was a mistake. But there's no way to reverse this now without killing all player trust in MA.
If they do this, they need to bring in 1000s of new players to compensate for all the UL owners quitting the game at the same time.
If UE5 is successful enough, they can think about slowly moving away from UL and creating a sustainable (L) economy.
Click to expand...
I believe this is a correct assessment of the situation.

If UL exists at all, it should have lesser efficiency. Often, but not always, this is the case. I think having a higher eff on armatrix was an attempt to address this somewhat. But there's still plenty of L craftable gear in the game that has eff on par with stock standard UL. I have proposed possible changes to how UL gear works that would put crafters back in the loop.
 
jwestonmoss said:
I believe this is a correct assessment of the situation.

If UL exists at all, it should have lesser efficiency. Often, but not always, this is the case. I think having a higher eff on armatrix was an attempt to address this somewhat. But there's still plenty of L craftable gear in the game that has eff on par with stock standard UL. I have proposed possible changes to how UL gear works that would put crafters back in the loop.
Click to expand...
No matter what "fix" MA will make to improve the state of it all they NEED to include all professions to make a sustainable economy that can work on its own.
 
jwestonmoss said:
I believe this is a correct assessment of the situation.

If UL exists at all, it should have lesser efficiency. Often, but not always, this is the case. I think having a higher eff on armatrix was an attempt to address this somewhat. But there's still plenty of L craftable gear in the game that has eff on par with stock standard UL. I have proposed possible changes to how UL gear works that would put crafters back in the loop.
Click to expand...

The armatrix stuff gave me hope, but at some point it seems they changed their mind and it started raining powerful UL gear again.

Mining has these same issues. UL finders and amps were a completely unnecessary mistake. And don't even get me started on UL excavators. The (L) crafted excavators are complete garbage compared to them.
 
(L) Chips make bullet 100.20% (no craft just drop)
(L) armatrix make bullet cost 101%

if you compare using a 72% armatrix setup with a 72% of a MM and a H204,
the upfront payment of 100k ped makes it 100.000 /0.01 =10.000.000 ped to shoot before recouping the UL upfront payment

please all ppl that is lamenting about the presence of UL state how much you shot per month
because i think many participants talk the talk but dont walk the walk.....
 
Last edited:
Msturlese said:
(L) Chips make bullet 100.20% (no craft just drop)
(L) armatrix make bullet cost 101%

if you compare using a 72% armatrix setup with a 72% of a MM and a H204,
the upfront payment of 1''k ped makes it 100.000 /0.01 =10.000.000 ped to shoot before recouping the UL upfront payment

please all ppl that is lamenting about the presence of UL state how much you shot per month
because i think many participants talk the talk but dont walk the walk.....
Click to expand...
and many are walking.. away!! Because their competition, unL gear efficience 90%+ make bullet cost 100% 24/7.
unL upfront payment is no more than investment that you recoupe later when you sell it. get of that boat you are special cause you drop a lot of money in a gun...

Example: Buys a gun 10k. use it for a year. sells for 12k... yells in forum he made an upfront payment on a gun... so what markup did you pay in that year??

Yeah... but we are the woke that want fairness and equality for all... In fact you being one of the guys who came up with the nanos change idea (along with me and a few other fellas). It is odd that as soon as it seems another change might affect you, you switch sides and completely forget about the shit you used to agree with. But everyone got their own agendas. Some are just less egocentric I guess...

In this system even a monkey would pick unL if you gave him a electric shock everytime he needs to deposit. No wonder all monkeys are playing unL and that the economy does not move forward.
 
Last edited:
People cycle 1000 ped a month and complain about ul prices ul armor and ul what ever 😂

I Brake 3 armatrix a day if i go limited
38,75 ped per weapon
116,25 for the day
42.431,25 for the year
Not counting the tt return

No wonder your "economy" sucks even if you pay only half that Bill.


People who drop that money on a gun or armor or what ever, are special because they understood how importent it is
 
In my humble opinion, issue isn't limited/unlimted/fat wallet/ thin wallet etc etc.......

Problem is demand in game never really recovered from EP4, recycling "crap" for nanocubes I guess partly helps but is trying to shut door after horse has bolted.
Amp crafter gamblers moved to EP4 20 ped per click, the huge fall in demand for mined resources hit hard and we are where we are. First thing new players used to craft were seen in hof board along with random stuff , now is list of EP/shrapnel spam.

I guess answer would be put nanocubes in robot loot or where-ever, so EP demand had to be fullfilled..... I think though devs are now addicted also to income stream from those EP clickers.
There is mark up still ingame, but demand drives mark up, EP moved from no Mu input to hoovering up stuff hardly used now. Is a sticking plaster solution to in game economic demand issue that devs created themselves.

You can see this in game these days, mark ups so bad even trader spammers can't be assed to buy most stuff as mark ups so low no longer worth bothering.
 
Last edited:
Msturlese said:
(L) Chips make bullet 100.20% (no craft just drop)
(L) armatrix make bullet cost 101%

if you compare using a 72% armatrix setup with a 72% of a MM and a H204,
the upfront payment of 1''k ped makes it 100.000 /0.01 =10.000.000 ped to shoot before recouping the UL upfront payment

please all ppl that is lamenting about the presence of UL state how much you shot per month
because i think many participants talk the talk but dont walk the walk.....
Click to expand...

it's just that UL gear essentially is simply choosing to not participate in the demand side of the economy.

the nanocubes at least set a floor on the mu of any cube-able item.

i understand the POV of people who own UL items. if i had an item that cost me as much PED as a late model used car, I'd want to protect my investment too.

but it can't be denied that it has an impact on the game economy.
 
Dibbler said:
In my humble opinion, issue isn't limited/unlimted/fat wallet/ thin wallet etc etc.......

Problem is demand in game never really recovered from EP4, recycling "crap" for nanocubes I guess partly helps but is trying to shut door after horse has bolted.
Amp crafter gamblers moved to EP4 20 ped per click, the huge fall in demand for mined resources hit hard and we are where we are. First thing new players used to craft were seen in hof board along with random stuff , now is list of EP/shrapnel spam.

I guess answer would be put nanocubes in robot loot or where-ever, so EP demand had to be fullfilled..... I think though devs are now addicted also to income stream from those EP clickers.
There is mark up still ingame, but demand drives mark up, EP moved from no Mu input to hoovering up stuff hardly used now. Is a sticking plaster solution to in game economic demand issue that devs created themselves.

You can see this in game these days, mark ups so bad even trader spammers can't be assed to buy most stuff as mark ups so low no longer worth bothering.
Click to expand...
from a supply/demand POV the only thing EP crafting + nanocube changes did is establish an absolute minimum MU on items between 101% and 102%

if there are other MU opportunities where it makes sense ped-wise to cycle, people cycle. EP is 101% in and something like 95-97% (depending on whether you sell the EP or recycle) out after losses on maxed bp's.
 
jwestonmoss said:
from a supply/demand POV the only thing EP crafting + nanocube changes did is establish an absolute minimum MU on items between 101% and 102%

if there are other MU opportunities where it makes sense ped-wise to cycle, people cycle. EP is 101% in and something like 95-97% (depending on whether you sell the EP or recycle) out after losses on maxed bp's.
Click to expand...

And we (MA & players) will have to adress the same problem nanos in tt created, for unL sooner or later. Thats preety much it.

If only MA would address our concerns and provide us with clear updates and a road plan none of this would be needed...

Nanos change proves the point that there is energy/MU to be farmed from turnover. But asked EP crafters to pay up the difference to keep gambling as they were completely unattached to the economy as was. They played at 20ped a click for the whole lootpool at 0% MU invested creating MU in the process while killing metal res price.

As Dibbler pointed. The mess and unconnect that EP created.

The "El Plan" focuses on making something like a closed economy like mining/crafting had before EP, but for the whole game. Working with the mess we have in hands so fair MU is created from every ped cycled.

Since, when asked about EP/nanos in tt problem, MA representative answered "we have no clue how to solve that" I took it on my mind to think about it and try to figure out a solution.

As a test MA could: Plug EP as a repair coin for unL. Together with the demand for EPs for recycle bps.
2 customers for one good should pump the price of running unL up enough that armatrix starts making sense in 1st phase.

Not a fix but a patch yeah :p

Is it asking to much this time to the users who have unL gear far better in efficiency than the best L gear out there, that repair goes through at least 1 run of crafting? Just to get them in the same game as L users and as EP crafters now since nanos change?

After all even if base price for unL repair was 115%. Those guys should still be printing money over competition.

Do you see that this game is far easy to explain to the returning or new user that is not only a gambler? And with that MU on unL repair, if those metrics run closer L becomes an option to many that have only a 55%efficiency gun. Triggering demand for those guns and resources needed for them.

unL will not lose value because of this. Or should not at least. The propertys that make unL have a hefty price tag are still untouched. It is replicable infinite times still. It is a solution far better than Naika proposes of removing unL altogether xD

On the other hand it is getting harder and harder to justify the hefty price tag on the weapon if the market it is supposed to explore does not have any markup.

Considering the results of the poll and interest so far in the thread I will go ahead and post "El plan" as soon as I put it to paper in a way that makes sense to most.

It is the least I can do after the starting this debate. It is a mere suggestion and a vision of how I see things. Does not necessarily mean Im right you are wrong.

It does represent my viewpoint from the macroscopic analyse of Entropia economy aligned to a poker mindset of evaluating the EV´s of a game. In that frame work I see a lot of potential for Entropia., even for the masses, if the economy is well set up and balanced.
 
Msturlese said:
please all ppl that is lamenting about the presence of UL state how much you shot per month
because i think many participants talk the talk but dont walk the walk.....
Click to expand...
good call...!
 
Ivo Jahrumble said:
Yeah... but we are the woke that want fairness and equality for all... In fact you being one of the guys who came up with the nanos change idea (along with me and a few other fellas). It is odd that as soon as it seems another change might affect you, you switch sides and completely forget about the shit you used to agree with. But everyone got their own agendas. Some are just less egocentric I guess...
Click to expand...
i am on the side of the LOGIC... nano was breaking the GIZMO cycle i dont care of EP4, the items from EP4 can be farmed in RDI.

this does not mean that i support all weird claims,
if i agree with you on one thing it does not mean that i agree with you on everything, sorry for this :)

Problem of game is JUST HIGH ACTIVITY TAX. if monster would return 99.5% instead of 98% all would be perfect.

and yes there is WOKE. but to be up to times with US weirdness we can also claim to make all armors gender neutral,
(are already one-size -fit-all so are not fatshaming)
 
as a side note i will post personals so can be moderated in case.
i used imp105 (small amp ad ep41 military that personally upgraded until level 78), return was 97.4% tt as i cared to test (with looter under 40ish)
i used almost all items i dropped, decayed all chips and weapons (apart the azuro, rubio, mawlood class ones because time is limited).
clicked all BP i clicked since qr1 to qr100 and actually i own a 2870 and H204 BUT still i decay all weapons i drop, still i buy limited chips to skill and still i buy knifes to skill melee (and also crafted swords).
i have 25.870 USD in deposits, my avatar ar 14 august was worth 33.733 usd so yes i am over deposits and i use (L) items with no fear.
i cycle about 150.000 to 300.000 per month depending on the working hours so i am a SMALL PLAYER.
i got mates that shot 1.300.000 ped per month, have outgrown my skills and i am happy for them.
really i dont care at all of other people results, returns or whatever, to me EU is a living economic simulator that satisfies my statistic curiosity aswell as my gaming being it easy (FFFF) to manage.

simple as this... Nanoblade burns 400 enhacners per day, so it is 190% OR 400*0.8 *1.9 = 600 PED LOSS and returns 98% as per other players, so in a month a nanoblade user suffers 18.000 ped of broken enhacners plus another 20.000 tt loss and it is 38.000 ped loss. his extracted MU most of the time is same garbage as mine, because there is a cap on heart oil and spleen went to nano mu.

many of posters cycle 10.000/20.000 ped per month and DREAM that an UL BP70 means return over ammo.. SORRY they return 98% too and loose money too.
if you see MANY hunting log the losses are severe. as one moves over level 20 monster the REAL swings kick in. small critters are to let you play.
cyclers kill flesh rippers and sand vortex to reduce risk in non-event moments because of low HP.
if you play with daspeltors, or eomon or LT the swings can be insane.

who shots 10k per month has no idea of what EU is and i was lucky to be explained some, and to live some (my top month was 600.000 ped cycled in crafting).

EP4 clicking is 18.000 ped per HOUR
Nanoblade is over 3000 ped per hour
MM, lp70, bp70 class are 1800 ped per hour
a 400 ped per hour "average joe" cycle is nothing compared to this.

hence again how many ped you cycle guys?
because if i see a "i shot 500k last month and i still think that armatrix gaming out of special situation is ok" i call the BS man
 
Simple way to solve the EP/nanocube issue would be to return maybe 10% less shrapnel and replace with nanocubes, and let supply/demand set price for EP clickers. Every other blueprint has to consider input mark ups, why not EP?
I know EP clickers (me included on lower ones) loved cheap nanocubes from tt or through tt recycle, but i would much rather have to farm them myself or pay mark up if fixes economy overall.

Posters in thread trying to link to UL/limited, turnover per day etc are strawman arguments imo, economic and mu issues started with EP4. Mark up is powered by demand ingame, since EP4 most crafter turnover click EP4 as mu in is next to nothing, result was other bp's clicked much less as next to no chance to hit HOF board as no way to compete in turnover or mu in for all other bp's.

Is so obvious is a huge imbalance, look at hof list daily over last x years.
 
Last edited:
jwestonmoss said:
it's just that UL gear essentially is simply choosing to not participate in the demand side of the economy.

the nanocubes at least set a floor on the mu of any cube-able item.

i understand the POV of people who own UL items. if i had an item that cost me as much PED as a late model used car, I'd want to protect my investment too.

but it can't be denied that it has an impact on the game economy.
Click to expand...


You simply have no idea what you talk about
 
19.146 ped thats the amount of peds you pay in marktup if you want to tier a mod blade from 0 to 4 now add up the costs of damage enhancers because someone who got a tiered weapon also uses damage enhancers

How much do you as Single Player contribute to the economy with your limited armatrix ?

If you think logical you figure out real quick that unlimited items are needet,
The game is fine , the mu potential is fine too , whats not fine are those Kind of players who talk Nonsens all day, rather then asking for a game fix to make it easyer for you , go visit a math class and fix your math skills or what ever

Even if mindark choose to give everyone avarge 200% returns , people will complain, because other people got the "better items" or other people do 201%
 
Last edited:
Msturlese said:
who shots 10k per month has no idea of what EU is and i was lucky to be explained some, and to live some (my top month was 600.000 ped cycled in crafting).

EP4 clicking is 18.000 ped per HOUR
Nanoblade is over 3000 ped per hour
MM, lp70, bp70 class are 1800 ped per hour
a 400 ped per hour "average joe" cycle is nothing compared to this.

hence again how many ped you cycle guys?
because if i see a "i shot 500k last month and i still think that armatrix gaming out of special situation is ok" i call the BS man
Click to expand...

A couple of years imp fapping some of the high turnover guys opened my eyes but was pre loot 2.0. I saw and helped some glorious moments with those guys along with some eye watering losses.
Above my EU pay grade but had a lot of good times healing them. :)
 
There are so many opportunities to offset the TT-loss in this game if you do enough research and have enough patience. This goes for all levels of players - no matter skills or possibility to buy gear / BPs.
 
PreyNaika said:
You simply have no idea what you talk about
Click to expand...
ok then, correct me

you are presenting as fact that UL are needed in order for ubers to cycle. that's simply not true. what is true is that people have invested hundreds, thousands, sometimes tens of thousands of dollars in markup (not TT) into UL items and have a vested interest in protecting that. as i said, i fully understand that.

but there is a way to bring uber-UL-owners back into the economy without cutting their legs out from under them. in what way can be convince all players - because they voluntarily want to - cycle more ped through the economy, through and from the hands of other players? that's what i'm interested in.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top