***WoF 2010 Suggestions and Stuff***

Coop_

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It isn't a competition as Nation Vs Nation as advertised this way more like Nation Vs Allies.

It's more like Nation + Allies -v- Nation + Allies, kinda like any war worth calling a "world" war.

Support teams can be policed up, maby not during the event but when screen shots are produced the team names can be checked against registered support members. Force Support teams to make team of 12 before starting another support team this will ensure all members names are visible on that support team. If their is a short team there should only be 1 short team if a member leaves the team keep his name listed the team is now 11. If the Country has 36 support members then they should only have globals posted from WoF Support team 1 to 3, any other name or number won't count.

A member registered on a support team can only change teams once and only if the team they started with is still in the event.

You'd have so many fewer participants with rules like this. Many support players can't be there at the beginning or end of the match, or just want to hunt with their socmates for whoever's team, etc.

If the goal really is to prove which country is the "best" maybe your rules would be a good idea. But if the goal is to encourage as many people to participate as possible and get as much hunting in together as they can, just pretty much leave it as is.
 

Rayne Jade

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...Maby 11 on a team and one judge to ensure all members of the support have been registered on the forums. Or 1 judge to just meet the support teams at a meeting spot and account for the teams...

That would work.... however (comma... pause for effect....) that would require a LOT more judges. More often than not, it was:

Hurrikane
Chopper
Jamira
Spike
Lee
Mack
Me

Oleg and Jimmy B helped out when they could. Team Australia started having their own rep join us toward the end of the tournament (a great idea IMO).

Have you judged a WoF match?
 

Jamhot

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I love WoF! bit random I know, but hey *shrugs :)

Jamhot
 

Oleg

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Instead of recruting 20 other countries to help win in the end.

It's not 20 countries though is it, it's not even 20 people in most cases I've seen.
 

MilkeN

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It's more like Nation + Allies -v- Nation + Allies, kinda like any war worth calling a "world" war.

WRONG!

There is a few teams that have someting called PRIDE and DONT USE EVERY METHOD TO WIN!!! And then there is the teams that do creat allies, becouse there dont belive in there own team...

FFS... aint we old enuff to set rules that we cant police ?

From ToU

"1. Age Requirements

If You are under the age of 18 please note -

To qualify as an Entropia Universe Participant, You must be at least 18 years old. If You are not 18 years old but You are at least 13 years old, You may still apply for an Entropia Universe Account, but only with approval of Your parent or guardian."
 

Wildman Alpha

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That would work.... however (comma... pause for effect....) that would require a LOT more judges. More often than not, it was:

Hurrikane
Chopper
Jamira
Spike
Lee
Mack
Me

Oleg and Jimmy B helped out when they could. Team Australia started having their own rep join us toward the end of the tournament (a great idea IMO).

Have you judged a WoF match?

I guess you missed this post! I will repost it for ya ;) It doesn't require a judge just checking names after the fact!

Support teams can be policed up, maby not during the event but when screen shots are produced the team names can be checked against registered support members. Force Support teams to make team of 12 before starting another support team this will ensure all members names are visible on that support team. If their is a short team there should only be 1 short team if a member leaves the team keep his name listed the team is now 11. If the Country has 36 support members then they should only have globals posted from WoF Support team 1 to 3, any other name or number won't count.

A member registered on a support team can only change teams once and only if the team they started with is still in the event.
 

Wildman Alpha

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It's not 20 countries though is it, it's not even 20 people in most cases I've seen.

It was towards the end, players were trying to even recruit player for WoF in my SOC forums to support teams the last 2-3 weeks of the event. Those number were blown just to show a point, not sure if you were at the final on CND but there were or at least it seemed there were a lot more on the teams than we all started with.

As another stated above it is Pride to win just using what you started the season with. I took great pride in being invited to main team USA and took it as an honor to be selected. What happend on USA support after the 2nd week I don't know but I figure they recruited as well. I see that as wrong. If you have say in RL a Bowling team of 4 you don't show up with 8 to finish the season.
 

Rayne Jade

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I guess you missed this post! I will repost it for ya ;)

I did... sorry 'bout that. So many threads to delete... :laugh:

It doesn't require a judge just checking names after the fact!

Support teams can be policed up, maby not during the event but when screen shots are produced the team names can be checked against registered support members. Force Support teams to make team of 12 before starting another support team this will ensure all members names are visible on that support team. If their is a short team there should only be 1 short team if a member leaves the team keep his name listed the team is now 11. If the Country has 36 support members then they should only have globals posted from WoF Support team 1 to 3, any other name or number won't count.

A member registered on a support team can only change teams once and only if the team they started with is still in the event.

An interesting proposal... and it has been mentioned before (by the organizers and others). Easier said than done, I assure you. We just got to the point that we can verify scores and get them posted in 24-48 hours so I don't see getting all the screenshots posted and verified happening prior to even the next match, much less the next day. The 24-48 hour turnaround time is mainly due to selfless service from the few Judges we do have. There were many complaints in 2008 that the scores took too long to get posted, and we got a lot of compliments in 2009 for the speed of the scores getting posted. I would hate to take a step backwards...

The principle behind support teams has always been that anyone willing to name their team correctly will score for the team they are hunting for. The main team might not even know who is on team "WoF England Support 69 up yours", but if it is the right mob in the right slot, it counts. I know Hurrikane will pop in soon to clarify this, but I don't see this changing anytime soon. If all the screens for a hunt were posted in the following 24 hours, this might work... but to be honest... after Judging for 16 hours (yes... 16 hours) the last thing I want to do is go blind looking at screenshots and comparing them to a list from the support teams.
 

Oleg

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It was towards the end, players were trying to even recruit player for WoF in my SOC forums to support teams the last 2-3 weeks of the event.

Did they succeed?

Those number were blown just to show a point, not sure if you were at the final on CND but there were or at least it seemed there were a lot more on the teams than we all started with.

Yes, I was there, and yes the teams were bigger than they were in the earlier rounds. Because a) it was the final and b) almost everyone was in the same dome instead of being scattered around the planet as they were in the previous rounds.
 

Wildman Alpha

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I can agree with you there as well RJ, but the judges don't have to screen every screen pic. It won't be hard to tell if someone is cheating. Remember the pics are out there for everyone to see and not much is missed in EF. Other players will look and call the foul for the judges if they suspect a problem. They can name their team anything they want but only the teams of 12 registered prior to the match will be counted (only 1 short team).
 

Wildman Alpha

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Did they succeed?

Yes, I was there, and yes the teams were bigger than they were in the earlier rounds. Because a) it was the final and b) almost everyone was in the same dome instead of being scattered around the planet as they were in the previous rounds.

USA lost so my point of view will be tainted ;)

We knew who was on what teams by the mass green dots migrations and SOCs in the green dots. Also players hunting on other teams were supporting another team from the start of the season. Play numbers all ya want the fact remains and anyone with a brain knows there were plenty of new players on every team in the finals. This taints the result of what should have been the outcome from the start. I am not saying USA should have won at all, my point is we don't know who should have won with the teams tainted with players from other teams.
 

Kamarkos Danix

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I have a suggestion to the group phase draw.

How about if it was done as it's done in the Champions League !(i'm talking of football/soccer) With pots, and groups with a team from pot 1, then other from pot 2, then other from pot 3 and another from pot 4. the best teams were in a pot, the next one in another, etc...

This would made groups balanced, Every group would always have a top team and a weak team.

Here's a fake draw using the pot system, based on the top 24 teams from the stage 1

Pot 1
England
Usa
Sweden
Portugal
Canada
Australia
Pot 2
Romania
Norway
Netherlands
France
Wales
Finland
Pot 3
Czech Republic
Scotland
Greece
Slovenia
Eudoria
Italy
Pot 4
Ireland
Poland
Amethera
Estonia
Denmark
China

(you may notice that the teams are in order of classification, this is from Stage 1 Warsheet, i couldnt find the Stage 2 moblist)

Group A

USA
Netherlands
Scotland
Estonia

Group B

England
Norway
Slovenia
Ireland

Group C

Sweden
Wales
Italy
Amethera

Group D

Australia
France
Greece
Denmark

Group E

Canada
Romania
Eudoria
Poland

Group F

Portugal
Finland
Czech Republic
China

Randomness provided by random.org

This is balanced for me, because every group has a strong team, no multiple strongies in a group.
This is used in RL and it may work well here
 

Rayne Jade

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Here is how it looked at the end of the Qualifying Rounds (Stage 2 complete):

wof_stage_2_scores.jpg


Is that what you were looking for..?
 

Dark Cat

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Kamarkos, your suggestion is pretty much exaclty how it actually was drawn last year. Only one seeded team per group etc.
You need to explain how this is different from what is currently done, because so far the only difference I see is you chose different teams as opposed to the actual positions that Rayne posted above.

More details needed....
 

Oleg

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I have a suggestion to the group phase draw.

The reason they do that in the Champions League is purely to protect the big teams.

If Real Madrid, Barcelona, AC Milan and Manchester United all got drawn together in the first group stage, there would be fewer big teams in the later stages and UEFA would be terrified of a dent in the billions of dollars received from TV money, sponsorship, merchandising etc. Since they and the clubs are obsessed with raking in as much cash as possible, they make sure that doesn't happen.

It's a biased and unfair system which results in the smaller teams get screwed.

Which is exactly why I suggested the exact opposite earlier in the thread :)
 

Dark Cat

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It's a biased and unfair system which results in the smaller teams get screwed.

I disagree actually. I think that with the top teams being spread out then everyone has a chance at getting 2nd place in the group as there is only one big team to deal with. If you draw 2 in your group, then you have no chance and are screwed from the very start.
You could argue that you might end up with no big teams in your group, but this based entirely on luck either way. At least with them spread out everyone has a fighting chance to make it past round 3.
 

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:scratch2:
I thought we're over this "cheating" BS; was Star (and the Alliance) a cheater?

If you hunted for multiple teams you cheated. By Alliance are you refering to LG or WoF?

As I stated above I think USA Support had many players as well that wasn't with us through out the season. So if they came just to help USA at the end and played for other teams through the season then YES "Star" as well as myself since we were on the same main team are guilty as well.

If team integrity isn't included on WoF this coming year I just can't join it as I don't see a point. It is advertised as team vs team/ Country vs Country support the team you started for don't team hop to influence the outcomes. I can't be a part of an event that will start as a team and finish with a blend of teams as one. Keep some integrity to the teams I will police up the support teams myself if need be based on similar rules I posted above you have a judge that just volunteered. Team integrity is my only request for a change other than that awesome event if loots suck hey that is EU can't complain there we all know loots suck prior to joining the event. Seems 90% are complaining about loots in many other threads keep it in the other threads not in a WoF thread. Either your in or your out of WoF loots shouldn't be a factor in determining if you play or not. Your in WoF for the pride of playing for your country/named team!!! For me when we blend teams towards the end that pride is gone so what is left? Why bother to play if it will just be like that is my point?
 
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Oleg

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I disagree actually. I think that with the top teams being spread out then everyone has a chance at getting 2nd place in the group as there is only one big team to deal with. If you draw 2 in your group, then you have no chance and are screwed from the very start.
You could argue that you might end up with no big teams in your group, but this based entirely on luck either way. At least with them spread out everyone has a fighting chance to make it past round 3.

When I was talking about small teams getting screwed, I meant in the football :)

Also I realise now that my previous suggestion was to do with the second group stage, while you and Damarkos are talking about the first one. I think the first group draw works well as it is.
 

Coop_

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Nope, if you hunted for multiple teams, you multiplied your fun. Nothing in the rules against it :)

Yep! In fact the SCAR awards strongly encouraged ppl to hunt for other teams, since you could go for the SCAR w/o hurting your own team's score.

I can see your point about "team integrity" would be needed if we really were out to see "who is the best." But that doesn't seem to me the spirit of WoF, which is why everyone is encouraged to participate as much as they like in support.
 

Wildman Alpha

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unfortunately this is why I cant take part this year in any major capacity,especially as many of these extra team members were bought and paid for essentially buying the competition.Dissapointing but thats the direction it has taken.

This is the type of +rep quotes I have been recieving for my team integrity post. I feel the same way if teams can't be a team instead of a mob of hunters I won't be taking part either. I have offered in previous post to help clean it up.
 

MilkeN

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Nope, if you hunted for multiple teams, you multiplied your fun. Nothing in the rules against it :)

And what will happen the day the big players dont whant to attend just becouse off that ?
For many off the most skilled people in here there is a competion to be just the best skilled...

What will happen the day when them had enuff, 12 main team members and just 5 off them have Medium HP, is that something to look forward to ?
 

Wildman Alpha

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And what will happen the day the big players dont whant to attend just becouse off that ?
For many off the most skilled people in here there is a competion to be just the best skilled...

What will happen the day when them had enuff, 12 main team members and just 5 off them have Medium HP, is that something to look forward to ?

MilkeN gets my point exactly, I take pride in trying to be the best I can and I am sure many others do as well. I don't consider myself uber as I wasn't 1st choice for main team but the better players dropped out and I was in. But that same pride that drives the top players to be top players brings them to feel the same about a team/country name they are fighting for. And to have that pride ruined because a bunch of mercenaries jump on the other team just isn't right. Rules need to be changed...
 

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I agree that it would be better if only people actually from that country were allowed to fight for it, and there wasn't any back-and-forth between teams - however - there is just no way to police or enforce that unless MindArk makes some major changes just for the WoF, and I don't see that happening.

There is no point calling for rules to be changed, because even if Hurri brought that in as a rule, how could he stop people from doing it? Put a judge in every team that every country has? Last year there were barely enough to cover each country alone...

There's not really any point in argueing about something that cannot be fixed or changed, the arguements are moot if the desired outcome cannot be achieved.
 

MilkeN

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I agree that it would be better if only people actually from that country were allowed to fight for it, and there wasn't any back-and-forth between teams - however - there is just no way to police or enforce that unless MindArk makes some major changes just for the WoF, and I don't see that happening.

Why cant we make rules that we cant police ? I think we have a very high avg. age on the players in there. We are not 14 or... ?
Cant see who everyone looks over that fact, we are old enuff to own 100k+ items, but not old enuff to follow simpel rules ?
So please STFU whit all this "we cant police BS", we are old enuff to follow rules!

There is no point calling for rules to be changed, because even if Hurri brought that in as a rule, how could he stop people from doing it? Put a judge in every team that every country has? Last year there were barely enough to cover each country alone...

Read post before...

There's not really any point in argueing about something that cannot be fixed or changed, the arguements are moot if the desired outcome cannot be achieved.

Read post before, before... thanks
 

safara

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What will happen the day when them had enuff, 12 main team members and just 5 off them have Medium HP, is that something to look forward to ?

I would actually applaud that day, as it would show that tactics can beat the uber chaps with all the uber toys.

I am really not bothered with teams support team tactics - as long as they are within the rules.

I play this game for fun, and the friendship to be gained by meeting and fighting with and against other players from around world is the real prize as far as I am concerned.
 

Dark Cat

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Look, I'm just repeating exactly what the organisers said the last time this was brought up. It cannot be tracked. This topic has been talked about many times, and it always comes down to that same fact.

No need to get moody.
 

Wildman Alpha

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Support teams can be policed up, maybe not during the event but when screen shots are produced the team names can be checked against registered support members. Suggested rule changes as follows;

Stage 1-3 Rules;
Simple and sweet to begin with to give players freedom to choose the right team. This will also give them a chance to hunt for as many teams as they choose as well as choose one that has a chance in the finals.

1. Players can move about and support whatever main team they choose until the conclusion of stage 3.
2. At the conclusion of stage 3 they must register in forums as a support member of the team they chose this must be completed prior to the start of stage 4.

3. team names can be made anything they want as long as it fits the WoF format and clearly states what country/team your supporting.


Stage 4-6 Rules;
If everyone cooperates this also will be simple and screen shots will be critical to include names of the team members.

1. Support team captain will post in forum all registered support players consolidated into one post (completed prior to the start of stage 4).

2. If support member isn't registered on a support team by the start of Stage 4 all screen shots and points that the individual support team the member hunted with will not be counted.

3. Support teams will make a team of 12 before starting another support team this will help ensure all members names are visible on that support team and cut down on the number of Pics that will need screened by judges(they don't have to hunt as a team of 12, just be listed on the same team).

4. If there is a short team (meaning the numbers on support team are not multiples of 12) there should only be 1 short team. Unless there is a case such as a 37 member support team one team will have to be 11 and the other team 2 or a balance of 6 and 7 on each team.

5. If a member leaves the hunt early keep his name listed the team is now 11 on that team to continue the match. If a player shows up late they can join the team that had a player drop or join the team that was short from the start.

6. Support names can be anything with-in the WoF format.

This format will make the support teams captain position a more valuable one as he will have to lead and coordinate all of this for his support teams. Some notable reasons why a format like this will work;
This gives players a chance to test multiple teams prior to choosing one to support.
Judging doesn't come into play until there are 12 teams left to cut down on the number of screen pics to decipher.
Team integrity will be maintained for the final 12 teams.
If 24 teams were registered that leaves 12 teams worth of players that the remaining 12 teams can recruit. This will help keep up the number of support players throughout the event.

Just a little suggestion food for thought,, any input to it :scratch2:
 
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