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GeorgeSkywalker

GeorgeSkywalker

Mutated
Joined
May 20, 2007
Posts
11,627
Location
England
Society
Freelancer
Avatar Name
George Ace Skywalker
As some of you know I'm starting a new society (Ashla Marauders) and naturally interested in peoples views on what they think would make for a perfect society. Perfection is offcourse all relative but I believe in always striving to be that bit better...


So I'd be interested in your experiences in a society, things that may not have gone well and how it could have been handled better. Also good experiences, things that stand out to you and you thought eh that was excellent. Please Do NOT name people or societies, it's about drawing the learning from our experiences and improving ourselves not about getting into a dispute.



Also feel free to post a tip or tips on what you think would make a society better.






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Hmmmmmmm

Never really had any goals as a soc.

That would smack too much of some sort of organization.

Dunno if this is a good thing or not.
 
I find that hierarchy needs to be confinded to a minimum... unless you plan a military soc.

Personally I could never do it wouthout the help of other people. Firstly we were 3 leaders to set up the soc and we were lucky ennough to gain some very valuable and dedicated members.

In essence we only have 3 levels, new joiners, veterans, leaders where I see leaders more as an admin thing. Make sure the website and forum and promotions are done well.

Our soc is a bit special in that we don't force peopel to play gametime. Our concept is for bussy peopel IRL and I for myself don't have too much time playing.

I think the right mix is very important. One person that does not fit the soc will mess up the whole team spirit. Now that's a very difficult balance to find. But ultimately you have to be carefull recruiting and make tough decisions. A person either fits the soc or not.

The most important thing in a soc is mutual respect. The person in your soc is not an idiot that follows a leader. He is a player in this universe and wants to have fun with you. He might have different opinions, different culture, language... respect that and he will respect you.

And most important of all... don't take everything too seriously ;) Its a game... have fun !
 
safara said:
Hmmmmmmm

Never really had any goals as a soc.

That would smack too much of some sort of organization.

Dunno if this is a good thing or not.
Click to expand...


Yes two quite distinct approaches. Good and bad points with each approach.
However personally I believe each approach can be run really well or quite badly as well. Number of factors that can influence the outcome...

This isn't necessarily a thread about goals though. Just good and bad experiences in a society. Whatever a society is about we all have good and bad experiences...about learning from them.


For example I was in a society once where someone tried to scam me. I privately reported the incident to the society leader. Who arranged a meeting with myself and the person in question, only myself and the society leader turned up. That was really well handled in my opinion as society leader tried to hear both sides of the story before drawing any conclusions. It's very easy to fall into the trap of hearing only one side of an argument or story.
 
In my opinion, a good soc needs four or five people who are tragically sad and play about 10 hours a day, religiously. And who are also quite chatty.

Once you have that, especially if one of them is the leader, the rest of it all slots into place.

(Slightly tongue-in-cheek but you get the idea).

Edit - a good policy on when to kick inactives is also a good idea. As is a keen recruiter in the soc.
 
I suppose key points are :

1. The people. This is THE most important part of any soc - without the people it is nothing. The caliber of the people in the soc define it.

2. Dont grow too quickly. It has taken us approaching 4 years to get 20 or so regular players. The people in the soc are very close and dear to us, it takes time to get to know people.

3. Have fun. This is what this game is all about. If it aint fun, then you have an uphill struggle.
 
Don't let anyone blackmail you...

In a society, no one should attempt to blackmail others in the society... by that, I mean force others to do what the blackmailer wants the others to do or threaten them in some way, including but not limited to booting them out of the society... Yes, society goals are important... just don't let it go overboard. Also, if anyone wishes to create a society website, they should do so on their own time with their own money, not do it and later try to force others to pay up with any sort of blackmail like actions...
 
A society needs a goal, no matter what it is. If the society goal suits the members it will retain its members, if it doesnt they will leave and look else where.

My past, well do I really have to say what society gave me my path? If its a goal of winning land grabs or just being online every Friday night to drink some beers down while on TS - it really doesnt matter...... but its that goal that will make the differance on your members.

At least thats what I think.
 
Its always about who are you with.
But one dissapointing thing i have noticed over the years - its always have been better to be with skilled players or at least those that have been around for a very long (those that really have, not just who "claims"). It may depends from where you/others come IRL but still... I have seen so many newcomer/low skilled people who are annoying, stupid, teenagers who comes for the "profit" and after bashing everything etc. etc. I could go on and on... Of course i know you need a lot of patience and you need to work with them but everything has its limits and there are times when just patience doesn`t work and there is nothing much you can do about some.
P.S. don`t forget the scammers as well.

In contrast my experiences with the more advanced part of society (as an entropia community) in past years have been completly oposite to what i mentioned before (all the annoying, stupid and arrogant people i had contact in the past). Nothing personal against anyone just my vague thoughts about the people i have met in my journey on planet Calypso...
 
several years ago, my wife and i both where part of the same soc... one of which i was leader of at the time.

she got sick, was unable to play for a while, this effected my game time of course, and i started to scale back my involvement, and gave leadership to others.

however, after a few weeks, i returned to find out, i was pretty much banished and what friends i had had turned on me, apparently, a bunch of lies from others turned me into something i wasn't...

anywho... long story short... i still play, but have been playing a solo game for several years, i talk to basically no one when i play, and even when my wife got better, she moved to a different game, as the "soc" in itself burned her feelings for the game...

so i guess, all in all... its not so much the way your group is run, but the people inside that matter most of all.
 
AJack10600 said:
I think the right mix is very important. One person that does not fit the soc will mess up the whole team spirit. Now that's a very difficult balance to find. But ultimately you have to be carefull recruiting and make tough decisions. A person either fits the soc or not.

The most important thing in a soc is mutual respect. The person in your soc is not an idiot that follows a leader. He is a player in this universe and wants to have fun with you. He might have different opinions, different culture, language... respect that and he will respect you.
Click to expand...

2 of the most importent things to keep a soc runing smooth.

If there is a bad egg weather it be personality clashes, bullying, selfishness or any other reson be quik to act. Procastination or tryen to work your way threw it may only lead to unrest in the soc.:mad::mad:

Main thing to remember is whay everybody is sayen , its all about haven fun together.:yay::wtg::yay:
 
Society needs to have a minimum number of active members.
A set of ground rules and guidelines that is agreed upon either by the majority of members, or a core unit of the most experienced members.
Members should have similar skill levels and/or goals in EU.

An exception to this is a nub-acceptance society (large number of erratic-activity member, core unit of experienced, active, people)

As tekkie says, a goal is important. What is it you want your society to represent? wHy would people want to join you, above another society?

ALso remember while you are building a society, not everyone has to get along :) cK members certainly don't agree on a lot of issues but there is mutual respect among all members.
 
A Leader is only as Good as Their leadership

Personality should not come into this game, there's nothing personal about manipulating a bunch of pixels. Some people take the game so serious it begins to consume their life to the point of addiction.

A Soc leader needs to be ever mindful that conflict resolution requires a balance of openess and fairplay. Dictating is bullying and an act of selfishness. Being quick to act would mean opting to resolve disputes between parties before the gossip and inuendo begins to take effect. For this spells the moment when distrust starts to plague all concerned and that has brought down Empires.

If I were to take all the comments I see and hear to heart, I wouldnt bother getting out of bed in the morning.
 
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Oleg said:
I would reduce Spike's points to just this.

Nothing else is anywhere near as important as having good people.
Click to expand...

BUMP for your words i agree 100% and that soc i belong to now i can only say that i have got me a good home here in Planet Calypso.:yay: :yay: :yay:
 
"Rill" said:
...
Click to expand...


Could we please keep thread clear of personal issues. Thanks.

As I said in the first post:
"Please Do NOT name people or societies, it's about drawing the learning from our experiences and improving ourselves not about getting into a dispute."


If you read the rest of the thread, you'll notice people have had a good input by giving general information without getting into any disputes.







.
 
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Well with my experiance in a society is that everyone should help out each other just because you are the founder of that perticular society doesnt mean you have the right to rule the plce with an iron fist and if anyone disagrees with your decisions not kick them but respect constructive critsism.

With what i have been shown in the past with the society i have been in a soc isnt all about one person gettign the better of any other society or any other person. It is good to have goals for that society but if they goals start upsetting others in that group thenthen mabee you should raelly rethink on the direction that you are going in.

Never have a personal veneta against anyone who has a difference of opinions even if they have left soc and never ever have a public flogging with a ex member of a society.

What i have also learnt recenty is a society that is close and works well with each other makes the game a whole lot better. You can see your society liek an ingame family and you can make a lot of good friends there.


Good luck in your new soc george i wish you all the best

Desire xx
 
I believe and I think

someone mentioned " a bunch of pixels"

That the real personality comes through these pixels.

It is very difficult to really be able to guage the person on the other side of the screen.

However, you do get to "know" a person after 'typing' to them over a period of time.

I think this unexplainable rapport is the core of close nit smaller societies and even larger societies that break off into their own internal groups.

This does not happen overnight and a leader should be quick to spot troubles in the ranks and to solve these as soon as possible.

Jung
 
Sent a PM with a TLDR from my 5 years of leadership in WoW and hardcore raiding and how me as the leader and my officers and coleaders handled it =D
 
Every society is unique. It’s built by the members, for the members. We have to accept that each member is an individual with its own goals and expectations, both of EU and the society he/she belongs to. Anything that suffocates the individual progress, by different kind of rules and regulations, could make the member leave or feel uncomfortable.

When a person joins a society, the person automatically loose some of it’s freedom. But they loose it to gain something better. It might be status, friends, give each other information, develop personal bonds, help each other out in different ways etc. But the individual freedom is still there, no obligations that suffocate the progress who you are.

A society do need a hard core of members, who “been around” for a while. It gives stability. People who leave and join other societies – or chose to be freelancers - always make turmoil.

To handle internal dispute are very important. As a society leader, you have to focus on not to take any side, but instead try to be a negotiator. Make the members understand that the dispute doesn’t give the society, or them self, any credit. Try to dissolve the dispute without any of the members leave society. It’s so easy just to click in the society terminal, and then leave, and think that the problem is solved.

As a leader of a society, you have to be very humble and human. No dictatorship! You have to get the members trust that you do things for the common good, and for the whole society. You are their servant, not the opposite. Let the members express they vies on important matters. Do no decide things, until all members had a chance to express them self.

It’s difficult to give an example where I could have handled the situation better. I’m always sad when members of the society leave. I wish I could be more convincing for them to stay. On the other hand, it’s natural the people leave or quit for personal reasons. I also think that I spend too little time on line.

My best experience has to be that I try to listen to he members. I honest try to develop the society into what the members want it to be. To give and take, to evaluate each member’s opinion, and even so, each member who doesn’t have an opinion, to try to make decisions that every one can accept.
 
i guess despite the RCE model still people join EU for fun. After a day at work, family problems, screaming gf, hot weather, cold weather, driving car for hours, boss that crash your balls etcetc many people just need to log in and kill some. OFC for few it s important for fun have a end point like gain money, fame etcetc


all this to suggest you some: don t stress your soc mates, leave them free to enjoy the game like they wish. No one love to obey in a game too.

imo
 
My first long time society is mostly defunct, most of the members have moved on but still come around to chat once in a while.

The one thing that seemed to cause the most controversy in that society and was the society fund. The fund was build up from a tax on the globals each member had. From that fund was purchased some nice weapons and tools that members could check out and use.

It was nice to have those things available, but as with all things with money as people would leave they would sometimes feel that part of that fund belonged to them.

As the society got down to only a few members some felt the items should be sold and proceeds split. I left before anything happened with that, but now that the last few members are selling out I am sure some wonder about it. It seems a few will benefit from the few thousands peds that were in the fund. Not a big amount, but still some ped that we all chipped in.

I have seen otehr threads here of societies torn apart over society funds and I would suggest that no society do something like this unless they know each other very well and each member has a way to get their portion back out of the fund if they choose to leave.
 
Immortal said:
....ALso remember while you are building a society, not everyone has to get along :) cK members certainly don't agree on a lot of issues but there is mutual respect among all members.
Click to expand...

desire said:
Well with my experiance in a society is that everyone should help out each other just because you are the founder of that perticular society doesnt mean you have the right to rule........Never have a personal veneta against anyone who has a difference of opinions even if they have left soc and never ever have a public flogging with a ex member of a society....
Click to expand...

Caliber said:
Every society is unique. It’s built by the members, for the members. We have to accept that each member is an individual with its own goals and expectations, both of EU and the society he/she belongs to. Anything that suffocates the individual progress, by different kind of rules and regulations, could make the member leave or feel uncomfortable..........To handle internal dispute are very important. As a society leader, you have to focus on not to take any side, but instead try to be a negotiator. ..........As a leader of a society, you have to be very humble and human. No dictatorship! .....To give and take, to evaluate each member’s opinion, and even so, each member who doesn’t have an opinion, to try to make decisions that every one can accept.
Click to expand...

Johned said:
.....The one thing that seemed to cause the most controversy in that society and was the society fund............As the society got down to only a few members some felt the items should be sold and proceeds split......I have seen otehr threads here of societies torn apart over society funds and I would suggest that no society do something like this unless they know each other very well and each member has a way to get their portion back out of the fund if they choose to leave.
Click to expand...

Very relevant and a solid foundation of comments that will stick when I choose to become a member of another Society. Especially if your new to the game and discovered your first choice may not have been the right one.

EDIT: Had formed association with some members of a Soc prior to becoming a freelancer and now joined with them and looking forward to enjoying happier times ahead. It seems mutual respect for all is a big part of their outlook and works well as far as I can gather.
 
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One advice:
Size does NOT matter.

I have had experience with societies in EU, but also in other games. I have been leader of societies of 200 members, and of 10 members.

200 members turns out to be a lot like work. With such a size, there is ALWAYS gonna be some people who are fighting out some sort of vendetta: not fun. With a smaller group, you are more likely to get along.

I have been with NBS when I started, great bunch, helped me a lot, but sadly... timezone problem. I then moved to the SPU, a soc where everybody has turned to mining, while I am a hunter. A society where we often disagree on stuff, but we still manage to get along just fine :)

So yeah, people people people. Attract the right people, and the soc will flourish.

But more important: if it is the soc you founded, you should make sure you attract the people which are right for you. After all, what good is a 25 man society, if you don't like these people at all?
 
Yes the people are most important!

Johned made a very good point with the fund, as long as there is no contract system in EU to do stuff like that, it will only be calling for trouble.

What I can add is that as society leader you can be as silly as you want but you have to know when to stop being silly.
Always take your people serious if they come for advice or help and never make rushed decisions.
If you have doubts you should have some trusted people you can share your thoughts with.
Make sure that in regards to society matters you never involve an outsider, with the exception of situations that require a mediator cause emotions in the society prevent any sort of solution.

And besides all of that and utmost important are: the people :)
 
One thing to be mindful of is that when you start a Society (as I have done a few times now) you have your own intentions. It is very important that as people begin to join, and you form a core, that these intentions are reviewed and the Society is developed with the member in mind rather than the leader.

The society I am currently in which is called Pay It Forward was renamed after it gained a core membership. It started off as 'my' society and became 'our' society.

I hope this is helpful.

One last thing - in my opinion it is wise to avoid a skill related hierarchy unless you are aiming to be a top 50 skilled society.
 
my experience of the socs i've joined have all been the same..

hardly anyone online and when they are we don't do anything together, partly becuase of the rich poor devide where i am too poor to go team hunt with them coz they are like mega rich and outskill me by miles.. most socs i've tried have been into the sociable thing where i am not very sociable coz i'm too depressed about my hunting loots to be happy jolly joy joy , LOL

I have been harrased by some friends to join a particular soc but i won't join coz i will become competative due to rank status and such.. not sure i fit in with the soc life atall really.. remaining freelance now i think till maybe i meet a group of brits that i could realisticly meet in real life and form a true society bond and get pissed up with them on a friday night lol ! :p
 
GeorgeSkywalker said:
I believe in always striving to be that bit better...
Click to expand...

That's cool! That is what life should be about.
Good luck with your soc and may the force be with you all and of course some good looking hofs & aths, too! ;)
 
Well my experience during the past two months has been interesting. I once was a member of a soc, which trained newbs, due to rl had to take a 1 year break from entropia. When I came back their soc had changed dramatically, I then after two weeks left again. permanently, tried a couple of other socs, wasn't fitting the bill..

After a few weeks as a freelancer I decided I needed a family of my own. After some a few people had laughed a bit about me having a society, not realizing the friendships I had developed with some pretty cool people in EU, it only gave me more determination to make a soc of my own.

I first modeled my soc after CK Coat Killers, lol, thinking oh yeah.. gonna have an uber pk soc.. oh yeah.. uber uber uber.. omg uber... pfft lol.. dunno was just in my head.. I was pissed and wanted to spread a little death in pvp.. hence our soc name for those of you that know us :)

Anyways, not that I am an uber, lets be honest there are those that feel they are and then those really are.. we all know who I am talking about. I calmed down a bit.. got a few more solid recruits and the soc started to take its own unique shape.

My plans to create an uber PK PWNGE soc... ( looking back couple months now.. lol.. hahaha bwahaha @ myself ) has resulted in something better, more mature and alot less rage driven than what was fueled by my perception of my viewing me as a lesser player.

So now my soc is .. laid back, no rules, some jokes and fun. We have about 10 solid players, 25 total, some have come, gone, or are in limbo... we still keep it a tight knit group... but the value of it is much more than what I was looking for...


So now that I have spent all this time selfishly spamming you with my EU life story :)... I got one piece of advice...

" whatever your soc becomes.. just let it be, don't fight it.. cause what it is.. is what it is... That needs to be ok, you will be happier that way. "
 
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The game itself is only so much fun on its own... And the people you know inside PE/EU are what add the finishing touch to any experience once you log off for the night. I can log in, put on some basic armor and eco hunt while having a blast because the soc chat is lively and active. Just the same- I could log in and kill some nice team mobs and have a good time.

I was in socs that had 29 rules to each level, and 5 sister socs that have 29 more rules each and multiply that by blah, blah, blah. It just wasnt fun after a while for me. Its all about finding the right people that share the core motivations- to have a good time, to respect each other, to drink Beer, etc... Only then can the members that hardcore skill do so happily, and the eco hunters can eco hunt happily, and the miners/crafters/chatters can well, you know.




My thoughts exactly echo Spike's- people first and grow slow
 
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