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Major tier upgrade process

cuilwenevey said:
My Opalo reads "Tier 1 ----- 120", my firend's reads "Tier 1 ---- 85" there is no discernible logic or reasonable explanation why theirs would read differently than mine even though they are the same gun purchased from the same TT in Nea's.
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they are not the same gun anymore. all weapons are different, even when their "names" are the same. your opalo goes from tier 0 to tier 1 faster than your friends.

cuilwenevey said:
So, why set up a system that makes no sense. I have a friend who spend over 170PEDs on repairs on a Katsuichi Determination and has yet to reach Tier .01, I on the other hand only spent around 70PEDs in repairs (on same sword)and have already reached 01.
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because your kat most probably has a higher value for tier 1 increase rate.


cuilwenevey said:
Our skill levels are almost exactly the same so it should not be such a large difference in advancement in tiers on the same weapon. This goes with out saying for the Korss 400(l)'s we both own. He has put more ammo through it, had more decay as a result and he has not even reached tier .6 and as for me, I have already reached .08 with less than half of the ammo usage.
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skill do not play a role in tier advancement, as far as we know.

wrt your korss, you both own different korss. yours, most probably, has a higher tier 1 increase rate.

cuilwenevey said:
The suggestion to MA is that "Tier" leveling up an item (no matter what it is) should be consistent throughout the game.. If it would take (for exsample - so many number of Criticals to reach a tier or let us all say skill lines in that area - rifle skills, longblade, handgun and for armor so many hit damage it takes) but it should be the same throughout the game. The numbers do not make sense Why would my opalo read different than the person next to me. Opalo's are all the same. They use the same amount of ammo and they Max out at the same - so why should the Tier numbers be different for everyone who owns one?
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they have designed the system like that, and they have made each item unique to give more diversity. why is that bad? they system is different than before, not necessarily worse.


cuilwenevey said:
AGAIN MA has no explanation for this.
(...)
MA is going to have to do something about it if enough of us want explanations.
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they released the system with not enough info, agreed. but there has been many threads both from MA giving additional info, and from players doing some research, and the system is better known now.
 
So what is being said is that if I buy 100 opalo's from the TT, each one will have it's own built in "genetic defect" allowing there to be diversity so each item will have it's own little quirk that works out to different efficiency, hit rate, damage infliction rate, upgrade-ability and so on and so on... also if I and a friend go in and create our first avi, using the basic settings and just accepting the basic mold settings, both deposit $100, and both run together hunting same mobs with same weapon, same ammo, that one of us is predetermined by our avi's and equipment's digital genetic makeup to skill up slowly, spend a fortune and never expect to have any chance to get any globals or Lootius forbid, any HOF's. So by that logic, only those that have "made it" will be successful at most turns while the majority are paying for their success.
 
LCD_ON_LSD said:
So what is being said is that if I buy 100 opalo's from the TT, each one will have it's own built in "genetic defect" allowing there to be diversity so each item will have it's own little quirk that works out to different efficiency, hit rate, damage infliction rate, upgrade-ability and so on and so on... also if I and a friend go in and create our first avi, using the basic settings and just accepting the basic mold settings, both deposit $100, and both run together hunting same mobs with same weapon, same ammo, that one of us is predetermined by our avi's and equipment's digital genetic makeup to skill up slowly, spend a fortune and never expect to have any chance to get any globals or Lootius forbid, any HOF's. So by that logic, only those that have "made it" will be successful at most turns while the majority are paying for their success.
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no what he said was that every weapon or tierable item is different to all others in respect to the tiering system. Everything else about the items stats are identical.

The other stuff you mentioned was already in game before the tiering system was added ;)

btw a friend just pointed this thread out to me

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/upgrades/173850-enhancers-lootable-pvp.html

it seems our nice new enhancers are lootable in pvp
 
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SpikeBlack said:
no what he said was that every weapon or tierable item is different to all others in respect to the tiering system. Everything else about the items stats are identical.

The other stuff you mentioned was already in game before the tiering system was added ;)

btw a friend just pointed this thread out to me

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/upgrades/173850-enhancers-lootable-pvp.html

it seems our nice new enhancers are lootable in pvp
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:D and another MA joke involving the tier system.. but hey, they are stackables, so.. what a mountain of horse sh*t.
 
OK i may have not made myself really clear..
I know what MA has stated.
•Weapons, Armors, Mining Tools and Fast Aid Packs have a new property called Tier
•Tier increases independently for each item when it is used
•Tier Increase Rate (TIR) indicates how fast Tier increases and is different for each item (shown in Items Info)
•Limited items increase Tier faster than unlimited items
•Major Tiers (1.0, 2.0, 3.0 etc) unlocks Sockets, i.e. an item with Tier 4.0 has four unlocked Sockets
•Limited items are automatically Upgraded when they get to a new major Tier (Tier 1.0, 2.0, 3.0 etc)
•Unlimited items must be Upgraded through a manual process when they are about to reach a new major Tier (Tier 0.9, 1.9, 2.9 etc)
•Upgrading an Unlimited item requires ingredients; if it succeeds, it takes the item to the new major Tier (Tier 1.0, 2.0, 3.0 etc)
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But again there is no explanations to how someone no matter who they are in game noob to uber. that tells me what makes a item tier up..

example i go hunt im lvl 30+in an area a friend is lvl 25+ we have opalo. but as we look at the lines damages/crits and skill lines but then we see that he get .1 then .2 and im still at .0 then after about an hour or so he hits 0.6 and i then have .8. what indicates the increase. what indications is there .. then after we both reach tier 1. - i look back at the log and see what indicaters are there ( i count the shoots - i count the criticals and i even count perticular skill lines. ) nothing in there tells me how we tier up. So can someone explain this to me.. what makes my iteam tier up - there must be some indication.. and MA can not explain it to me..

In all aspects of the game there must be some indication - we know that it takes so many lines to lvl up in any profession.. So there must be some indication to What makes an item reach each Tier.
for days i have counted Lines but nothings is consistent.
And if anyone can tell me that "Its takes so many Damage points or so many what evers, to reach a Tier", than let me now what it is and i will test it out.
 
cuilwenevey said:
OK i may have not made myself really clear..
I know what MA has stated.


But again there is no explanations to how someone no matter who they are in game noob to uber. that tells me what makes a item tier up..

example i go hunt im lvl 30+in an area a friend is lvl 25+ we have opalo. but as we look at the lines damages/crits and skill lines but then we see that he get .1 then .2 and im still at .0 then after about an hour or so he hits 0.6 and i then have .8. what indicates the increase. what indications is there .. then after we both reach tier 1. - i look back at the log and see what indicaters are there ( i count the shoots - i count the criticals and i even count perticular skill lines. ) nothing in there tells me how we tier up. So can someone explain this to me.. what makes my iteam tier up - there must be some indication.. and MA can not explain it to me..

In all aspects of the game there must be some indication - we know that it takes so many lines to lvl up in any profession.. So there must be some indication to What makes an item reach each Tier.
for days i have counted Lines but nothings is consistent.
And if anyone can tell me that "Its takes so many Damage points or so many what evers, to reach a Tier", than let me now what it is and i will test it out.
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No one knows except MA/FPC. I'll give you my guess though.

It looks to me each use of an item has a chanse to nicrease it 0.1 tires. The chanse is greater the greater the tire increase rate of the item is.

That's a simple system and it would explain why it's so hard to find a pattern, there simply isn't one :)
 
I wonder though why every item tiers up at a different rate, and why these number stay visible even after you have reached the next tier. The information then become totally redundant.
 
Change this item stealing system please!
 
Witte said:
I wonder though why every item tiers up at a different rate, and why these number stay visible even after you have reached the next tier. The information then become totally redundant.
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Unless, those values also have an influence on the duration of the enhancers themselves. Guess we'll have to find out.

In the meantime, I'd also like to add the following:

It seems to be general assumption that Higher Tier values correspond to faster Tier 'upgrading'. Based on experience, this seems to be valid only when we're comparing the same Tier level.

Example:
I have a fap with Tier I value of 65 and Tier II value of 151.
Getting it increased from 1.0 to 1.9 took way way much more time (I'd say 10 times longer) than what it took me to increase Tier from 0 to 0.9.
 
cuilwenevey said:
OK i may have not made myself really clear..
I know what MA has stated.


But again there is no explanations to how someone no matter who they are in game noob to uber. that tells me what makes a item tier up..

example i go hunt im lvl 30+in an area a friend is lvl 25+ we have opalo. but as we look at the lines damages/crits and skill lines but then we see that he get .1 then .2 and im still at .0 then after about an hour or so he hits 0.6 and i then have .8. what indicates the increase. what indications is there .. then after we both reach tier 1. - i look back at the log and see what indicaters are there ( i count the shoots - i count the criticals and i even count perticular skill lines. ) nothing in there tells me how we tier up. So can someone explain this to me.. what makes my iteam tier up - there must be some indication.. and MA can not explain it to me..

In all aspects of the game there must be some indication - we know that it takes so many lines to lvl up in any profession.. So there must be some indication to What makes an item reach each Tier.
for days i have counted Lines but nothings is consistent.
And if anyone can tell me that "Its takes so many Damage points or so many what evers, to reach a Tier", than let me now what it is and i will test it out.
Click to expand...

There is some random chance on each use for the item to gain .1 tiers. The chances are improved with higher tier increase rates of the item, but since there is such a small chance with each use, there is considerable variation in how fast the item will gain tiers.

The skill system also gives random chances to gain a (somewhat) random amount of skill in a random choice of skills within the profession you are doing. It's not correct to say "we know how many green skill messages you need to level up in a profession" since the size of those messages has a random element.
 
Many players will lose 1k+ USD items...Please MA !!! Stop it!!!
 
Well now that tiers have been around for a while... I still hold that they are a waste of ped and an unneeded risk! N8
 
HuntingN8 said:
Well now that tiers have been around for a while... I still hold that they are a waste of ped and an unneeded risk! N8
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i think that we are not even past 1% of the tier system introduction phase. time will tell, but it could very well be that in a few months, lower level enhancers will be a commodity, with prices below 110%, and you will not conceive going out for a hunt without your stack of enhancers, just as we do today with amps.
 
jdegre said:
i think that we are not even past 1% of the tier system introduction phase. time will tell, but it could very well be that in a few months, lower level enhancers will be a commodity, with prices below 110%, and you will not conceive going out for a hunt without your stack of enhancers, just as we do today with amps.
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That is a possibility. I guess only time will tell. But even if they are down to 110% it is still a major risk to tier up some of the items. N8
 
Noobs?

So if a noob asks for advice, I tell 'em to keep recycling Opalos through the TT until they get one with a high TIR? :ahh:
Bet MA's servers would love me for that! Quick, add another box of hamsters!
No, I do NOT recommend you tell noobs this, but I also wonder if anyone involved in the development thought about it. :D

Really though, the fact that the TIR may be wildly different for the SAME item with the exact same name (item label), means that the wonderful "market value" of an item is pretty much useless.

Think about BP's. A given BP with a QR of 0.1 might be worth a ped, the same BP with a QR of 1.0 might be worth 100 ped. Market value of BP's is pretty much useless.

Now, consider that MA/FPC is doing something like that for the most used items, with the added bonus that no-one knows for sure just how the TIR of an item will affect the time it takes to 'tier-up' an item.

While I can't really blame "them" for trying to suck more money out of the userbase, this does seem like a pretty badly implemented way of attempting to do that.

Sometimes it seems like new features are implemented just to make sure there's something new we have to misunderstand.
 
HuntingN8 said:
That is a possibility. I guess only time will tell. But even if they are down to 110% it is still a major risk to tier up some of the items. N8
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I see the advantage of enhancers more on (L) which are risk free to upgrade. Especially for highTT Adj / Imp / Mod (L) Gear. But time will tell us
 
tier = tax

I admit I don't fully understand the new tier system. Tier on an L item sounds to me like I could go buy an old junker of a car and the more I drive it the better it gets until it is so good it doesn't work anymore.
Going to CryEngine was a very expensive mistake, but you don't need to ripe off your regular players to make up for it, dump this tier system.
 
thought you might to hear what I think of tiers :-

1. "teiring up" unlimited stuff only makes any sense on high level gear other wise its better to buy better gear as "tiering up" (then you have to add enhancers) .
example why "tier up" a punisher mk1 when the punisher mk2 cost much less than tiering a mk1 (for that matter why teir up a punisher mk2 when the justify mk1 cost`s less than teiring and so on )

2. what use is an "ecconomy enhancer" ? adding decay to save decay + markup give me a break ?

3. I would not use any of the enhancers even at TT price until MA state exactly how long they will last .

4. the good thing is we can sell the "teir" and "enhancer" materials !
 
Bobbins said:
thought you might to hear what I think of tiers :-

1. "teiring up" unlimited stuff only makes any sense on high level gear other wise its better to buy better gear as "tiering up" (then you have to add enhancers) .
example why "tier up" a punisher mk1 when the punisher mk2 cost much less than tiering a mk1 (for that matter why teir up a punisher mk2 when the justify mk1 cost`s less than teiring and so on )

2. what use is an "ecconomy enhancer" ? adding decay to save decay + markup give me a break ?

3. I would not use any of the enhancers even at TT price until MA state exactly how long they will last .

4. the good thing is we can sell the "teir" and "enhancer" materials !
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very well put!!!
 
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