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Seriously?

Alukat123 said:
so many folks here, who don't get that it isn't about being ruined but that having those waves of getting one 75% return run after another not being fun but they're very demotivating....
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Great, so how much longer until you stop crafting if they are demotivating? cause apparently its not really enough to stop you from continuing, you just keep chugging along waiting for that ATH to bring you back to the magical 95% that apparently everyone gets. If it was actually demotivating, then you would stop.
If you are really getting 75% runs all the time, then you should be out of PED really quickly...in which case perhaps that is MA's plan all along?
 
Just a reminder, but there are 3 professions, not all of them will be in an optimal state all of the time.
 
I want all the honey but i dont want to pay for it! Screw you ma i should profit on every 10 ped run!!
 
forgo said:
Just a reminder, but there are 3 professions, not all of them will be in an optimal state all of the time.
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i don't expect all of them to be in an optimal state all of the time, but i expect them not to be terribly bad for a few days/weeks at the same time..
 
Alukat123 said:
i don't expect all of them to be in an optimal state all of the time, but i expect them not to be terribly bad for a few days/weeks at the same time..
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Ok so now we know.If you lose the game is not optimal.Should we stop?
Can you also determine temperature in my area next week based on your returns? I suppose you could.
 
forgo said:
Just a reminder, but there are 3 professions, not all of them will be in an optimal state all of the time.
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Lol why not? 3 is not much and in crafting it should be very easy - crafting at max quanity = very low volatility
 
Dollymaus said:
Lol why not? 3 is not much and in crafting it should be very easy - crafting at max quanity = very low volatility
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that's how it was before 2.0.
before 2.0: 1000 clicks , you could expect a times 10 and a times 40 multi, the majority of near successes were 90% return, most of the time resulting in 90+% return. After 2-4 months there were globals/hof to get close to 95% return.
Now: the times 40 multi has been removed and you can expect to get 1-2 times 10 multis, on top of that the majority of near successes are 25% or 50% return, which does now often result in bad return. Now it seems it takes over 6 months to get close to 95% return..

that simply isn't a volatility reduction, remember, reduced volatility is what they did want to achieve with 2.0.
 
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So... you mean, just this month you have these problem ?

For your info, you are not the only one and me had been having these kind of return since beginning of this year.
 
I think with Loot 2.0 everybody get a part of the cake, small low players and the middle and the big ones. I like Loot 2.0 :whistle:
 
approaching the 5k clicks mark, since bad return started... it's still bad return :(
 
How can I say it short , you mean the return is to bad. So you loos money? or at last loos them to fast?
I mean no one really go online and think they will make money? I never did.
If I did deposit and invest a Sh"#¤ of peds. Well I would hope to profit. But we talk about daily return here so thats out of the picture.

To use 1000ped and loos it all in 2 runn, is bad yes, But its only up to you and me to choose what we want to spend. No one force you to buy good items and hunt big. Buy a Jester D1 and 100Ped ammo and do a hunt. You still will have the same amount of gameplay as killing big stuff and use a good weapon. At last most of us pay for gameplay.

Stop crying. Imagen playing other MMO games. WOW = you pay what , 10-15USD to play 4 weeks.
Do this 5 years. What do you have left???

Play entropia and pay 10-15USD every month in 5 years. What value will you have left in here, compare to a other game where selling avatar or items is not allowed or items do not have real value. + in entropia you still have the tiny or small risk of hitting some extra value.

or am i wrong ?
 
Why so serious?
 
Alukat123 said:
that may be case, however, they should make the bad days less bad. That would be quite easy, just make the 25% near success 40% and the 50% into 75% or drastically lower their appearence... way higher base return and the bad days won't be that bad anymore...

i've looted quad-wing BP yesterday, normally i would be all excited about it, but i'm at -515,47 in TT-return, so even with the 350 PED from quad BP it's still loss thanks to 77,59% return.. nothing to be excited about...
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Do you remember all those Space Thruster BPs you sold me a while back? You said there's a possibility of a flag BP drop from clicking those... I didn't loot a Flag BP from those hundreds of Space Thruster clicks, instead I looted a couple of PRX limited BPs, which are not that great and hard to sell.

In the end the Space Thruster clicking turned up nothing good and I haven't bothered to keep track of the loss but I know it's big. Not to mention that it will likely take me a year or more to sell that many Space Thrusters...

I do agree that the volatility in the game is often just too much, I have seen some of the people in my soc or in my contacts 'take a break' and sell most of their stuff because they went from about +10k down to 0 in a short period, something is wrong with that, that is just too much money.

On the other hand I understand that if we want to have a chance at the big HoFs, then the bad returns must also exist, the balance must exist through a dichotomy of shit vs. uber returns. Make the shit returns less shitty, and the uber returns will be less uber. For those that are consistently unlucky, the answer is obvious, for those that are here to gamble and win it big, the answer is also very obvious.

Alukat, you seem to complain a lot about shit returns, but yet you keep taking risks like mining in Hell for example... So here's a question, what if tomorrow you were told you could fly to a new planet and hunt, mine and craft there as much as you wanted to and are guaranteed a steady 90% return on all your activities, never less, never more than 90%, because every click, every loot window always gives you exactly 90% of the money that went in.

Would you go?
 
Legends said:
I do agree that the volatility in the game is often just too much, I have seen some of the people in my soc or in my contacts 'take a break' and sell most of their stuff because they went from about +10k down to 0 in a short period, something is wrong with that, that is just too much money.
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glad we agree.

Legends said:
On the other hand I understand that if we want to have a chance at the big HoFs, then the bad returns must also exist, the balance must exist through a dichotomy of shit vs. uber returns.
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I have to disagree, make the shit returns less shitty and it will simply take longer to get the big HoF.
design-wise, there's no need to give crap return (80% or lower) to be able to build for big HoF.

You only need such shitty return if you want to make it so people can HoF big every week or month, that may be fine for those where it's playing out as intended, but it sucks for people who only get the crap return but no big hof.

example:
- expectation is to get a times 1000 every in average 80k clicks
- Player A gets his times 1000 every 80k clicks
- Player B gets no times 1000 for 390k clicks, then he gets 5 times 1000 within 10k clicks

Player A will say, the game's fine and it's working as intended and it's good.
Player B may quit after 250k clicks, because it's shit for way too long.


Legends said:
Alukat, you seem to complain a lot about shit returns, but yet you keep taking risks like mining in Hell for example... So here's a question, what if tomorrow you were told you could fly to a new planet and hunt, mine and craft there as much as you wanted to and are guaranteed a steady 90% return on all your activities, never less, never more than 90%, because every click, every loot window always gives you exactly 90% of the money that went in.

Would you go?
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make it 95%.

So if there's the choice between running 75-85% return for god knows how long with eventually never getting that uber hof to get to 95% and 95% return always, i'd certainly go for the 95% always one.

-------

since most people here appear to be hunter, let me ask you a question:
you go out on a 10k PED hunt, you loot several 105-140% MU items and at the end you loot an ESI worth 1.6k PED , you check your standing, you see you're still in loss by a few hundred PED because of shit return.
How do you feel & think about it?
 
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Alukat123 said:
So if there's the choice between running 75-85% return for god knows how long with eventually never getting that uber hof to get to 95% and 95% return always, i'd certainly go for the 95% always one
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But its 90%...


And most appear to be hunters because MA is removing virtual world and replacing with a boring solo instance mission based shooter.
 
Alukat123 said:
make it 95%.

So if there's the choice between running 75-85% return for god knows how long with eventually never getting that uber hof to get to 95% and 95% return always, i'd certainly go for the 95% always one.
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I think you're not really understanding what was proposed... If MA has set the Macro loot returns to 95%, the fixed return planet which I proposed could not have a fixed return of 95%, you would have to set it a bit lower. There's a trade-off involved here, you can't swap 95% average for 95% fixed. Getting fixed returns is a huge advantage for people that don't have a big ped card, it means they can usually play longer, they can plan their activities and know whether or not they will have enough money for the week or month, etc...

You could maybe make it 92% at most, not higher.

But anyways, I think you pretty much answered already, there's too much 'ifs' there and essentially you wouldn't go, the game would lose its thrill as far as you're concerned.

Case closed
 
Legends said:
I think you're not really understanding what was proposed... If MA has set the Macro loot returns to 95%, the fixed return planet which I proposed could not have a fixed return of 95%, you would have to set it a bit lower.
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If you set it a bit lower then the planet is going to be dead, because you're forced to always sell above MU, which nobody may buy then...

that's why it's a bad comparison, you loose there by default...
 
Alukat123 said:
If you set it a bit lower then the planet is going to be dead, because you're forced to always sell above MU, which nobody may buy then...

that's why it's a bad comparison, you loose there by default...
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That's right.

As a community, we lose by default, MA has set the Macro returns to less than 100%, what was it? 96-98%? So collectively we lose. Why do you think that is?

There has to be a revenue somehow for the administration and upkeep of the game, that 2-4% is part of it, it goes to MA (who still owns 50% of planet Calypso) and the Land Deed owners, the OLA owners, etc...

If, after trying my luck on some hunting or crafting, I suddenly found myself almost broke, I might be enticed to travel to an area that has a fixed return of 92%, cause that way I could keep playing for a while. I don't think it would be deserted. Maybe it should be higher, maybe 94%, but you couldn't make it 98%, cause then I think everyone would be there, considering the volatility of PED cards these days.
 
Legends said:
That's right.

As a community, we lose by default, MA has set the Macro returns to less than 100%, what was it? 96-98%? So collectively we lose. Why do you think that is?
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that's not the point, it's 90% return players never going to be able to break even with MU.

the 95% return players on volatile planet can sell for 105,3% average and they're in profit in the long run.
the 90% return players on no-volatility must sell for 111,11% average just to break even.

Do you really think the players on no-volatility planet will ever be able to break even? The 95% return planet players have just too much of an advantage...

Giving 2 bad options is just as bad as only having a single bad option...
 
But that's the point, you're not supposed to break even, you are paying a known percentage in exchange for your participation in the virtual universe of Entropia.

I understand that your effort is to at least break even, figure out a way to play endlessly without having to pay. That's a drain on the system. The administration and maintenance of the Entropia Universe is not free. If you don't contribute to it, then someone else is covering your share.

Put another way: if everyone succeeded in breaking even all the time, no one would ever need to deposit, MA would go broke and the game would shut down.

My point is, it's okay to pay a small fee in exchange for your participation in the virtual universe of Entropia.

On the fixed return planet, you know that you are paying a fee, and you know exactly how much that fee is to keep the game alive, therefore you can make a conscious decision whether you think it's worth paying that or not. In the rest of the universe, you often end up having to track all your activity, only to realize later, like in your original post, that your returns are way below what they should be...
 
Legends said:
But that's the point, you're not supposed to break even, you are paying a known percentage in exchange for your participation in the virtual universe of Entropia.
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With your suggestion the 95% return people can profit while the 90% return can pay for it.

Anyway, all of that is besides what this thread is about, it's not about MA getting a cut...
it's about return sometimes being as low as 75% and then not even a hof coming to put you to target 95% return, or even anywhere near it.
This is about volatility.

P.S.:
all that money MA is holding onto is generating them money outside of entropia, pretty sure they have that money in a bank account where it generates them money through interest.

And as i've said earlier in this thread, in the end all money is going to be in MAs pocket, even with 95% return.
 
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Alukat123 said:
With your suggestion the 95% return people can profit while the 90% return can pay for it.

Anyway, all of that is besides what this thread is about, it's not about MA getting a cut...
it's about return sometimes being as low as 75% and then not even a hof coming to put you to target 95% return, or even anywhere near it.
This is about volatility.

P.S.:
all that money MA is holding onto is generating them money outside of entropia, pretty sure they have that money in a bank account where it generates them money through interest.

And as i've said earlier in this thread, in the end all money is going to be in MAs pocket, even with 95% return.
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Since you are having problems understanding the word volatility

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volatility
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volatile_(computer_programming)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volatility_(finance)

And plsss stop crying now and MOVE ON
 
I am way too lazy to link up all the other threads about this but I will try to sum it up:
Volatility is nothing new, it s been here since before vu10
The people that profit in this game adapt and change when something isn t working anymore

Simply said, if you re getting bad returns, change mob, area, blueprint. You have no guarantee that your multiplier won t be given to the neighbour. There is no individual loot pool.
 
nutrageti said:
Simply said, if you re getting bad returns, change mob, area, blueprint.
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tried that already, didn't help, just had another 79,63% return run...
other than doing a handful of clicks on a way-too-big-for-my-bankroll craft, mob, amp i'm out of things to try...
 
after 3878 clicks* of roadie mk1 on full condition with 93,2% return**, i'm wondering, did they really turn quantity crafting into high risk crafting and condition crafting into low risk crafting?

*2,3k clicks before bad streak started, the other 1,6ishk today..
** only 4 times 2, 2 times 5, 3 times 10 and one times 15 multiplier
 
Alukat123 said:
tried that already, didn't help, just had another 79,63% return run...
other than doing a handful of clicks on a way-too-big-for-my-bankroll craft, mob, amp i'm out of things to try...
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Just like the Casino's there is only 1 winner here: MA (and close friends of them). The sooner you realize and accept this the better it is for your wallet.
 
SoReal said:
Why you do this ?
What are you expecting to get ?

:scratch2:
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pure desperation to get hofs, wouldn't do that under normal circumstances, but after that large amount of no 10+ multis on quantity, the bigger multis have to come at some point, and gladly they did:

last 600 clicks:
[Globals]: Son Alukat Goku has found a rare item (Adjusted Fi/Ra/Co Evil Blueprint (L)) with a value of 32 PEC! A record has been added to the Hall of Fame.
[Globals]: Son Alukat Goku manufactured an item (Roadie BLP Amp Mk I (L)) worth 755 PED! A record has been added to the Hall of Fame.
Globals]: Son Alukat Goku manufactured an item (Roadie BLP Amp Mk I (L)) worth 671 PED! A record has been added to the Hall of Fame.

so i'm left with 109,55% return after 4501 clicks on roadie on condition...
the return is only that roadie condition clicking, not overall crafting.
 
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