How to convince players to come back to EU?

Geralt

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That's easy, take me as an example

Yesterday after 3 months break I decided to give EU a go and did some mining. As I checked mining has went through some rough ups and downs recently (redulite hoarding) so I decided to do a quick reconnaissance before starting any serious activity. Bought 100 bombs, chose my four favourite ore spots, 25 bombs each. Set up as usual but without amps.

Result:

Hit rate: 12%
Cost: 101 PED
TT return: 23,6 PED


Yes, I know. Only 100 bombs. That's "just" ten bucks. Ten bucks that can actually buy me a month of subscription of other MMO or just a pack of beers. Yes I know "I need to drop 2k or 3k bombs daily blah blah spending 3-4 hours on it for a week to get anywhere around 93% blah blah". I'm not new in this. But you know what? I need entertainment, not a dreadful hardcore grind party. I just wanted to jump in, have fun for an hour or two and go back to my life...

Soooo no Henrik, thanks for now. I'm still not convinced.

Uhh... :laugh:
 
Your HR and return seems impossible even on only 100 drops - unless you were indoor mining, in which case lol.
 
For real?

Give players chance to profit .... since 26.08.19 something happens with minning multi is gone
tt is gone , all areas average markup drop to equal around 108-112%
everything is set to make impossible to profit on minning
/beginrant
* since that date my average return come from 95-98% that normal to my level and gameplay
to tt 90% util 12.12.19 in this day+- my tt become 75-85% come new year 2020 i expect better or at last 90% back its not happen , every my attempt in this year end with tt 50-75% i not casual miner , i not newcomer you can take my words and keep minning and think everything is fine
but its not
** remind new minning area in cyrene? in first hours is great , amazing , after 6h they nerf mineral comp in realtime , and six hour later they add waves and more 6 ? they nerf mineral composition again , now this area is waved with shit mineral composition and you think is good? whats point exploration when you find something good mindark going equal(nerf) to all others area in game to make impossible to profit? its not fun. and lost soul of this game

/endrant

If mindark dont give true economy , or chance to player profit
Entropia itself is outdated game , with shallow gameplay that not worth my time and money
(I wish know i wrong here , i see several peoples love eu but only know eu)
You can spend way less in any other game in market(buying game or pay sub) and get much more fun and money back in gray market(that if you want) , people going say here you can take you money back direct from mindark and legal , true but its only fraction you spend and hard to sell(and chipout) and moths and moths to mindark deposit you money(someone say 90 day?) in others game you can easly go gray market and get money in 24h or less after sell
 
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Your HR and return seems impossible even on only 100 drops - unless you were indoor mining, in which case lol.

I know it sounds crazy, in my time since 2008 with some breaks (I actually once took 3 years break :cool:) I have never experienced such crazy low returns. I mined on Caly around Ashi outside and inside PVP, on two LA's I liked in the past and in my one secret spot :rolleyes:

But this i like big wtf. :scratch2:

I had once 34 consecutive NRF's on Next Island but it has ended then with nice 74 ped global and 24% hit rate, total of 200 bombs. I know mining can be volatile but 12% HR is just a bad joke.

It should not be possible to get as crazy low returns because it just feels more like a rip-off, evil MA laughter in my face. I dont care about 10 bucks. It's just not entertaining anymore. It's just pure pain in the a$$.
 
Hunting just as volatile. It is quite pathetic.

In attempt to flatten things and give better returns for people, they made it worse and potentially implemented a pyramid scheme (looter skills) in the process. Pay to win with gear was not good but at least players had something to strive for.

Instead, people are full of anxiety to play and that is not a recipe for success.
 
I know it sounds crazy, in my time since 2008 with some breaks (I actually once took 3 years break :cool:) I have never experienced such crazy low returns. I mined on Caly around Ashi outside and inside PVP, on two LA's I liked in the past and in my one secret spot :rolleyes:


Yea if that was your return on an unamped outdoor run, then I agree it's totally fucking whack.
 
Answer: You don't.
 
Go tt finder. $1 runs can last a long time.
 
That's easy, take me as an example

Yesterday after 3 months break I decided to give EU a go and did some mining. As I checked mining has went through some rough ups and downs recently (redulite hoarding) so I decided to do a quick reconnaissance before starting any serious activity. Bought 100 bombs, chose my four favourite ore spots, 25 bombs each. Set up as usual but without amps.

Result:

Hit rate: 12%
Cost: 101 PED
TT return: 23,6 PED


Yes, I know. Only 100 bombs. That's "just" ten bucks. Ten bucks that can actually buy me a month of subscription of other MMO or just a pack of beers. Yes I know "I need to drop 2k or 3k bombs daily blah blah spending 3-4 hours on it for a week to get anywhere around 93% blah blah". I'm not new in this. But you know what? I need entertainment, not a dreadful hardcore grind party. I just wanted to jump in, have fun for an hour or two and go back to my life...

Soooo no Henrik, thanks for now. I'm still not convinced.

Uhh... :laugh:

Generally if your hit rate is that low, you should be going to another area to test that out well before you get to 100 drops. There's an off chance you were mining less than 15 minutes after another miner in that area, which would reduce your hit rate. Some areas are also just filled with miners like Ashi, the only place I could get near a 12% hit rate nowadays. Your results are definitely outside the norm, but as moery said, you'd want to use a smaller finder if you wanted to stretch out $10.
 


Mining returns last 6 months.
Blue - normal claims.
Red - multis.
Each bar 4-5k bombs. (last 1100 bombs)
 
u all doing it wrong ! go mine non stop oil rig like all russians do, and u will have profit ! :) lots of mu ores there tridenite, vesperdite, pyrite, megan
 
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u all doing it wrong ! go mine non stop oil rig like all russians do, and u will have profit ! :) lots of mu ores there tridenite, vesperdite, pyrite, megan

Exactly. but what people want is short time good return like this i guess :D
 
Been coming back for a period time to time for years, but its just too expensive... $100 for just a couple of days of normal play (dont question my skill or knowledge. Look at when I joined this forum) is just to much. There are other games that gives so much more for less - and thats my main point. Only reason I return occasionally is because I'm curious on the game (especially prices on the gear I own) and its nostalgic for me.

Get the return more stable - even if you're just messing about. Short wins keeps me more motivated than "if I just keep grinding this mob for one more week, I'll hit a big one and break even".
 
I think one of the core problems is that the loot algorithm is one-size-fits-all. It's near impossible to adequately tune such a design to satisfy the variety of players. Too volatile and the more casual players suffer (and leave), but too flat and the grinders get bored (and leave).

IMO what MA should do is create an adaptive algorithm that learns players habits and adjusts their volatility based on a prediction of how much PED they will input during any given session.

I think this could be easily achieved with a pretty simple linear regression algorithm and trivial model with only a handful of features - timestamp, day of week, day of year, time spent, PED input, would probably be all you need to learn a reasonably accurate prediction. Probably have to add some polynomials to help with bias but I don't think the hypothesis would be very complex all and could get a low enough margin of error for this problem.

Anyway this would help a lot with perception I think. Players who only have time to log for short periods and blow off some steam won't be punished with 30% returns anymore and long-term grinders could achieve higher volatility for more excitement and potentially more interesting loots.
 
I think one of the core problems is that the loot algorithm is one-size-fits-all. It's near impossible to adequately tune such a design to satisfy the variety of players. Too volatile and the more casual players suffer (and leave), but too flat and the grinders get bored (and leave).

IMO what MA should do is create an adaptive algorithm that learns players habits and adjusts their volatility based on a prediction of how much PED they will input during any given session.

I think this could be easily achieved with a pretty simple linear regression algorithm and trivial model with only a handful of features - timestamp, day of week, day of year, time spent, PED input, would probably be all you need to learn a reasonably accurate prediction. Probably have to add some polynomials to help with bias but I don't think the hypothesis would be very complex all and could get a low enough margin of error for this problem.

Anyway this would help a lot with perception I think. Players who only have time to log for short periods and blow off some steam won't be punished with 30% returns anymore and long-term grinders could achieve higher volatility for more excitement and potentially more interesting loots.

All MA needs to do is add 0.00 TT items to the loot pool. It wouldn't cost them anything and would add variety and excitement to hunting.
 
All MA needs to do is add 0.00 TT items to the loot pool. It wouldn't cost them anything and would add variety and excitement to hunting.

And what item should that be? It need to have a use (therwise why be excited) but it shouldn't have a negative impact on the economy (crafters and by that also hunters and miners).
 
There is already ul items that drop ,low tt mu that can be hunted for, bxes and tokens during events etc, more items isnt the answer, idk what people mean when they say more exciting loot. Loot tables are pretty solid imo. Flat loot can be pretty boring, did go over 100k cycle with a single 500x multi no esi or anything, tt return was still stable so idc too much but it was boring and thats a pretty large sample, for me not even two weeks of play but for casual player that sample could stretch months.

They need to create more demand for what people are looting already, crafting event is good start I think they start to focus on the right areas. Players come and go in eu, ive noticed a lot of players i havent seen in ages return again recently and though markup is lower than in the past its not like everything is tt food and stuff doesnt drop like always just gotta adjust and adapt. Little off topic but the op is pretty garbage so shrug
 
I'll read this thread later when bored. Here's my two pecs on its stated objective though:

(PEC 1): Normalize the loot randomizer a little bit. The occasional massive $$$ win only goes so far for encouraging active play, we also need reasonable normal returns so we play longer so we deposit more to fund said play. Below 80% on a given run is a fairly persuasive deal breaker.

(PEC 2): Don't just give us a level to pull, give us something to do. The people who design missions and ambience on the various planets are good at this, let them loose. Immersion counts for a lot.
 
Your HR and return seems impossible even on only 100 drops - unless you were indoor mining, in which case lol.

12% HR indoor would be over 100 PED of ressources, but he got only 23,6 ped, so definately outdoor ;)
 
(PEC 1): Normalize the loot randomizer a little bit. The occasional massive $$$ win only goes so far for encouraging active play, we also need reasonable normal returns so we play longer so we deposit more to fund said play. Below 80% on a given run is a fairly persuasive deal breaker.

Even 80% for weeks or even years is a deal breaker... 90% would be somewhat acceptable.
 
The problem with this game is the greedy players. 22K PED for a small shop with a 40 item point display at Port Atlantis Mall. Had a player quote me a couple weeks ago 25K PED for a booth at Cape Corinth. As long as players continue to pay exorbitant prices for basic items, there is no room for growth.
 
All MA needs to do is add 0.00 TT items to the loot pool. It wouldn't cost them anything and would add variety and excitement to hunting.
but we already have los particulos que no va
 
And what item should that be? It need to have a use (therwise why be excited) but it shouldn't have a negative impact on the economy (crafters and by that also hunters and miners).
Sweat :sweat::acid:
 
Everyone already knows

Every gamer knows that this game is a $ sink and less than 1% chance of ever making profit again. The only new money coming in is from unwary new players who make depos until they figure out the truth. The whales of yesterday have mostly withdrawn all and floating on deed income to play. I personally have not deposited since loot 2.0 and not spent 1 ped in game since the tiering bug. My deeds and shares continue to provide me with a growing ped card with no spending in game. The smaller and free players are ones paying all the ped in decay and lack of efficient items. The UL high efficient items and keeping the rich in ped, and keeps the poor in paying for it. One can look at the limit of withdrawl options and see the bigger picture, to keep money long as they can to gather interest of the $$ they hold. There is no way to get old players back with the state of the game like this, no loot dynamics, its all shrapnel in loot.
 
IMO what MA should do is create an adaptive algorithm that learns players habits and adjusts their volatility based on a prediction of how much PED they will input during any given session.

Their already is such a thing based on activity and ped cycled. I have been hit hard on some sessions and kinda come to the understanding its based on location, timeing, activity, have you hit hof recently. Your competing against other players in a global system with very small random windows where the system pays out.

As what other people said about mining well il give you a hint theirs caps in place at least on the rarer materials. That is why its pretty pointless using big amps to find high mu resources unless you know someone in the last 24 hours used a ton of it. Again its about timing, location, has it been mined recently before the reseed for hit rate.

Out all honesty though i had some terrible hit rates mining but also bumper payouts so id really go with location and timing for mining tbh.
 
Their already is such a thing based on activity and ped cycled. I have been hit hard on some sessions and kinda come to the understanding its based on location, timeing, activity, have you hit hof recently. Your competing against other players in a global system with very small random windows where the system pays out.

As what other people said about mining well il give you a hint theirs caps in place at least on the rarer materials. That is why its pretty pointless using big amps to find high mu resources unless you know someone in the last 24 hours used a ton of it. Again its about timing, location, has it been mined recently before the reseed for hit rate.

Out all honesty though i had some terrible hit rates mining but also bumper payouts so id really go with location and timing for mining tbh.

and here's the loot myths. I've tested everything you've stated and it's just false.
it's still 00,xx% Chance to get XXXX Multiplier. Just random.
 
That's easy, take me as an example

Yesterday after 3 months break I decided to give EU a go and did some mining. As I checked mining has went through some rough ups and downs recently (redulite hoarding) so I decided to do a quick reconnaissance before starting any serious activity. Bought 100 bombs, chose my four favourite ore spots, 25 bombs each. Set up as usual but without amps.

Result:

Hit rate: 12%
Cost: 101 PED
TT return: 23,6 PED


Yes, I know. Only 100 bombs. That's "just" ten bucks. Ten bucks that can actually buy me a month of subscription of other MMO or just a pack of beers. Yes I know "I need to drop 2k or 3k bombs daily blah blah spending 3-4 hours on it for a week to get anywhere around 93% blah blah". I'm not new in this. But you know what? I need entertainment, not a dreadful hardcore grind party. I just wanted to jump in, have fun for an hour or two and go back to my life...

Soooo no Henrik, thanks for now. I'm still not convinced.

Uhh... :laugh:

I'm a miner as well and with 72 prospecting. I'm in the same boat as this guy but I deposit much more than him and get the same results back. Why can't we who have been supporting this game for so long get better results? I feel for you and don't blame you for not wanting to come back.
 
decided to do a quick crafting run..
414 Clicks - 107,64 in - 79,42 out - 73,78% TT-return

MA, that's not how you attract players =)
 
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