Yog Pet Buff Issue

Mindark,

Maybe you need a refresher.



AND



Enforce the EULA or it is void because then it all is subjective.

Thanks for quoting that. It seems MA has forgotten about a paragraph on their on EULA too.

In my opinion these 12 players should be at the very least DISQUALIFIED. Ideally accounts suspended until such time that MA is done doing their investigation to see if they have abused the pet also outside the instance.

We are not as dumb as you seem to think MA. Anyone who hunts will certainly notice a 25% boost to reload, unless they are botting of course. Do you allow that btw?
Heck I even notice 10% with Hyperstim pill. 25% reload boost is a massive difference.

All who got this pet knew about the exploit because nobody in their right mind would pay 10k+ for a pet that gives % reload to mining excavating. You have trade logs and can also see who rented these yog pets to certain individuals.

Renting this pet and then participating in events and LG for example is clear proof that both the person who rented/borrowed it knew that it was bugged and decided to exploit it to a certain few. In my opinion these people who rented it is just as guilty as the ones who exploited it. So both should get punishment.

By not even giving them a disqualification or temporary ban are showing that you lack the courage to punish these players because it will mean loss of revenue.
There's at the very least not a proper excuse for not disqualifying them for this years event.

Just my two pecs.
 
Mindark,

Maybe you need a refresher.



AND



Enforce the EULA or it is void because then it all is subjective.

This is a very good point.

This part really upsets me.

[h=3]Yog Pet Buff Issue[/h]

Additionally, some participants have demanded a review of the results from previous Mayhem events where the unintended Yog pet buff may have provided an advantage, inadvertently or intentionally. We will be conducting this investigation over the next few weeks, with the intention of increasing the prize rewards for any participants who were pushed down in the final standings due to another higher-placing participant benefitting from the unintended pet buff.

Due to the unintended Yog pet buff being available for such an extended period of time, despite support cases that should have resulted in the issue being addressed, and considering that it is not possible to definitively conclude that use of the pet was in every case intended to exploit the buff to gain an advantage, MindArk has decided it would be unfair and impractical to punish participants who directly or indirectly benefited from the unintended buff, for example stripping prizes awarded in previous Mayhem events.

So let me get this straight, you're going to go back and find cases where people exploited this and "increasing the prize rewards for any participants who were pushed down in the final standings due to another higher-placing participant benefitting from the unintended pet buff." however, that individual will go unpunished? Even though you caught them. Is this really just because of the players who are exploiting the issue?

Let's also not forget that a vast majority of the "good" items from the vendor are already claimed.

I can understand letting it for for outside mayhem instances because of the duration of this bug, however lets be real here. Anyone that used that pet inside of a mayhem instance knew what they were doing. And before you pull the "I was just leveling my pet" bull**** card, please don't. We are not that stupid.

Man, I been disappointed in MA in the past, however this is on a different level. Disappointed does not even being to express how I feel about this decision.
 
I would understand if MA would have said we dont want to get wrong people banned and thats why we just punish yog horror user cause thats more than obvious and one more point why people are exploiter and abused it very well known. Who would turn on a mining buff in the hunting event? Or even have this pet outside? Like WTF Mindark please!

Everyone that is not an exploiter or abuser of this bug/exploit want a PUNISHMENT for those people.

[Removed]

PS: I rather have people punished at this point than any extra Rewards!!!!!


Please dont think we are stupid.

Kind regards
 
Last edited by a moderator:
This is a joke, plain and simple. If you guys dont take your own EULA seriously why the F should we? You wiped scores from the board, you know people are exploiting, and you dont do a dam thing about it. Who gives a shit about increased rewards, ooooh lets go buy the trash items available still.? oh boy. I mean I know your support is a joke mindark, but in this you have proven your EULA is a joke as well, as are the actions you guys deem punishable. How do you come to the conclusion DannyO should have gotten what he did but these useless idiots exploiting since how long now, just get away like nothing happened.Watch how many sell threads and withdraw requests come up in the coming months, get your check books ready MA.
 
Indeed if the Yog has already unlocked his buff, and someone uses it to hunt, he obviously does it to exploit the buff...

Or what other reason ? Cuteness ?.. :girl:
 
It's unfair for previous cheaters that have been banned for exploit known bugs like the unlimited lvl13, and dont ban this ones! This should be court matter!!!
 
Additionally, some participants have demanded a review of the results from previous Mayhem events where the unintended Yog pet buff may have provided an advantage, inadvertently or intentionally. We will be conducting this investigation over the next few weeks, with the intention of increasing the prize rewards for any participants who were pushed down in the final standings due to another higher-placing participant benefitting from the unintended pet buff.


Originally Posted Here

Cmon this is not really the case.
 
TL; DR - Mindark admits their support team is deficient.

Let's hope it gets addressed.

Agreed except I find it unnecessary to shoot down the completeness of this statement right away after all the complaining about lack of communications. This style is quite alright and let's hope it is kept up.

I also hope the review of the support department includes this forum, as it has been instrumental as a fallback tool when there was no other recourse. This often caused one to be at loggerheads with its administration which in turn only adds to the aggravation. Either support gets fixed for good now, or the defacto function of a public forum as backup channel is acknowledged in its rules.
 
MA, this public statement took you a lot more time than it would have took you to do things right, at this point. And you chose the worst course of action. Identify cheaters from the past and ...nothing.
MindArk has decided it would be unfair and impractical to punish participants who directly or indirectly benefited from the unintended buff, for example stripping prizes awarded in previous Mayhem events.
This must be the worst decision in the company's history.
Never been more disappointed.
 
Mindark,

Maybe you need a refresher.



AND



Enforce the EULA or it is void because then it all is subjective.

this is essentially what we have been asking for. follow your own rules.
 
It's unfair for previous cheaters that have been banned for exploit known bugs like the unlimited lvl13, and dont ban this ones! This should be court matter!!!

Why do you think they solve it this way as they do? If they can't prove intentionally exploit
then it is hard to get a judgement that says so.
Doesn't matter if it is obvious what has happened from moral, ethic, logic and whatever p.o.v,
as long as it can't be proved without doubt they can't get "right" judgement.
 
Weeeeeeeeeee Tokens drop!!!!

Mindark i at least want to see the full list of mayhem results in all cat with suspected exploiters removed and not just a shady mayhem token distribution with no explanation at all.
 
Also, Mindark,
To be fair with every players that lost the opportunity to pick up the item they wanted from the vendor becoz an exploiter got it first, you guyz HAVE to refill the mayhem trader with items and even introduce new ones.. its too long now we need some fresh stuff
 
Thanks MA for finally coming forward but you do really need to get a grip on your creation. The community is in uproar, the mayhem events are crucial for your lights to stay on. Keeping a level playing field is of upmost importance.

In short - the punishment should fit the crime,
You cant ban dannyo for gaining a few peds and skills then issue a public pardon for all these.

Sure it will upset a fair few people. Thats not the point though, the point is the other 99% who do really wish to play the game as intended.
 
So, MindArk has established a bar for enforcing punishments. This is their bar:

Please note that those removed scores do not necessarily constitute clear evidence of cheating or abuse on the part of the affected participants. For that reason, those participants were not disqualified from the event, as some participants have called for.

Clear evidence of cheating or abuse on the part of the participant.

If they can't meet that bar, they aren't going to enforce punishment. So comparing this to the Danny-O case, isn't quite the same. In the Danny-O case there was clear evidence of abuse. Open and closed case there.

I'm holding out hope that they dig into the suspected participants further and try their hardest to meet that burden. I hope they can find the clear evidence they need. Please look at chat logs, trade logs, patterns of abuse and lack of even using the pet for mining.

I think finding a balance between mercy and justice is best. I'd hope for even a 20-30% conviction rate with some digging, even just catching a handful of blatant exploiters and punishing them would be great. I realize they won't catch them all, but leaving every single one of them off the hook, without digging further into the past, seems to rob justice here. I hope a balance between mercy and justice is struck here.

Until then, I think just calling on them to punish everyone and anyone with a Yog pet spawned is a very dangerous road to go down for our community. Just wait until you're caught up in some sweep of false accusations and your account gets locked or your stats get reset. I don't want that for me, and I don't want that for others.
 
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Also, Mindark,
To be fair with every players that lost the opportunity to pick up the item they wanted from the vendor becoz an exploiter got it first, you guyz HAVE to refill the mayhem trader with items and even introduce new ones.. its too long now we need some fresh stuff


actually if someone got lowered because of exploit, and got P token as compensation, they should be able to say what item they want of the current items, if there are none left, providing they have the requirements.
 
Mindark

Is this really about a few tokens ?

How do you know you aren't giving tokens to those that cheated as well ?

Instead of trying to juggle rewards , hand out punishment to those that cheated.

Punishment does not have to equal a depositor leaving the game , but it should equal transparency.
 
Its just 12 players come on, the other 1 million players can't be mad about this.

signed financial & legal department in behalf of the not to be found GAMING DEVELOPER.
 
We will be conducting this investigation over the next few weeks, with the intention of increasing the prize rewards for any participants who were pushed down in the final standings due to another higher-placing participant benefitting from the unintended pet buff.

Imagine player X exploited on summer 2019, in the same category as player Y scored lower.
Imagine player Y exploited in halloween 2019 with borrowed Yog from player X, that also exploited and again ranked higher than Y.
Will player Y be compensated for both summer and halloween mayhems?:laugh::laugh::laugh:
 
Its just 12 players come on, the other 1 million players can't be mad about this.

signed financial & legal department in behalf of the not to be found GAMING DEVELOPER.

"You must spread more rep..."

I just had to read MA's statement twice to see if it made any more sense.... What the hell is this?

2 guys profit off developer items? barely disrupting anyones fun? 6 month ban and skill strip.

12 guys + family and acquaitances who have shared the pets (they are tradeable right? RIGHT?!) and instead of punishing perpetrators, why don't we reward the wronged people?

I am hopeful however that after investigating you do decide on how to handle this situation, I am seriously hoping so, otherwise this will be highly disapointing to say the least. But if you do decide to let it slide under the rug like everything is ok... Then I think you have more to lose than just a few players.


What kind of message is this? That cheating is ok, specialy if you do it - but if you don't its fine, we'll award you prizes anyway?

I am confused by all measures of the word.

Thing is, this is not just about mayhem... it's about a LOT of things, people need to keep in mind there's a whole lot more factors that are influenced by faster reload buffs EVERYWHERE in the game, specificaly skill markets for one. And I won't bother to list everything else that can be affected by this total lapse.

And what now? Slap on the wrist on the Support team? I guess they were too busy drinking coffees at the coffee shop, mingling about EU secrets casualy for nobody to hear, instead of reading our support tickets and forwarding them to the proper teams like they state SOMETIMES.


What is this?
 
"testing and development team"??? you mean the one intern you got last week?
 
OMG really?

You realize that everyone that has been exploiting this bug since halloween mayhem 18 is laughing right now? They got away with stealing ... They arn't named, they arn't shamed, they certainly arn't banned for 5 months and had some of their most valuable skills stripped away from them.

you can't show how harsh you'll be to one case of people cheating the system to gain advantages and then roll over and play dead to another case of people cheating for years to gain thousands of dollars worth of gear.

How do we ever expect to grow as a community with new blood of players when stuff like this keeps happening? This makes me sick.

Do you think with the way you're handling this is going to deter the next (possibly same) group of exploiters that find a bug to cheat and gain MASSIVE advantage with? Nah, they'll take the chance, knowing they'll probably keep the prizes and go about their lives laughing all the way to the bank.

Never been so disappointed reading a decision about cheating.

No one on accident spawns and activates a mining buff in an instance where you can't mine. How stupid do you really think your community is?

Be Better Mindark, Do Better.
 
Crying and bleeding...

Mental and emotional damage has been done.
 
OMG really?

You realize that everyone that has been exploiting this bug since halloween mayhem 18 is laughing right now? They got away with stealing ... They arn't named, they arn't shamed, they certainly arn't banned for 5 months and had some of their most valuable skills stripped away from them.

you can't show how harsh you'll be to one case of people cheating the system to gain advantages and then roll over and play dead to another case of people cheating for years to gain thousands of dollars worth of gear.

How do we ever expect to grow as a community with new blood of players when stuff like this keeps happening? This makes me sick.

Do you think with the way you're handling this is going to deter the next (possibly same) group of exploiters that find a bug to cheat and gain MASSIVE advantage with? Nah, they'll take the chance, knowing they'll probably keep the prizes and go about their lives laughing all the way to the bank.

Never been so disappointed reading a decision about cheating.

No one on accident spawns and activates a mining buff in an instance where you can't mine. How stupid do you really think your community is?

Be Better Mindark, Do Better.

What she said:wise:
 
OMG really?
This makes me sick.

Do you think with the way you're handling this is going to deter the next (possibly same) group of exploiters that find a bug to cheat and gain MASSIVE advantage with? Nah, they'll take the chance, knowing they'll probably keep the prizes and go about their lives laughing all the way to the bank.

Never been so disappointed reading a decision about cheating.

No one on accident spawns and activates a mining buff in an instance where you can't mine. How stupid do you really think your community is?

Be Better Mindark, Do Better.


so so true
 
as with all mindark shenanigans, this is a management issue

don't blame the underpaid and undertrained support staff. idc how small the company is, support cases should be triaged and pm or po should be prioritizing the defect backlog. it should not have fallen on one of the boots on the ground to escalate this.
 
TL; DR - Mindark admits their support team is deficient.

.


It's true but it doesn't seem like a good idea to have admitted it. Because the problem did not start with Support. That's impossible. It started in a sloppy development, continued with a Test Team that did not do their job well, testing, and only ended with Support. who did not understand the magnitude of the problem. :(
 
I`ve said it before, MA didn`t do anything and will not do anything.

They knew and allowed the exploiting because it was making money for them too (via rake).

Heck, some determined exploiters could even take MA to Court: "we (the players) reported the exploit, you (MA) allowed it for so long because it was making money for you too, now you ban us and want to confiscate our inventory??".
MA is now in a loose-loose situation because of their greed and their lack of professionalism (not considering ALL the implications of the exploiting).

This is why they can`t do anything, other then resetting some scoreboards...

My post from days ago (quoted above) is shorter (and more complete) than MA`s post...
Lack of professionalism - admitted
Greed, because exploiting made money for MA via rake - not admitted but obviously true
They won`t do anything against exploiters other then resetting some scoreboards - admitted...

And also as predicted in a previous post, MA knows for sure they will get away with this...
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...t-fraud-quot&p=3772159&highlight=#post3772159
 
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