Suggestion: Pseudo-Unlimited Weapons

[Legends]

What I am talking about here is a Limited equivalent to current high-end Loot 2.0 weapons, like for example UL weapons usually with Augmented/Perfected in the name, with efficiencies which are in the high 80s, low 90s area.

I fully understand that the value of Unlimited 2.0 weapons is derived purely from this "potential" to earn the owner some profits. But I have a bit of an issue with the current paradigm whereby you have to go all in on hunting or don't bother with it at all. I mean, I'm not going to get a 2nd mortgage on my house to get myself a 2.0 weapon; if I did, I certainly would then feel I need to spend every waking moment grinding to make it earn me money. So it's either all or nothing; go all in on hunting and get a 2.0 weapon, or just stay out of it completely.

The LP-80 Perfected (L) is a prime example of this: who wins with this thing? Not the guy or girl who bought it of course, but the one who looted it and sold it for a massive markup. That's who the real winner is. And obviously, that's someone who owns several 2.0 weapons and who has gone all in on hunting. So the LP-80 Perfected (L), while it gives the illusion of making "good returns" within reach of the masses, is actually nothing but once you consider the markup you must pay upfront to acquire it in the first place.

So anyways, what about the guy and girl that is unable to go all in on hunting? Maybe it's not a matter of money, but a matter of time, maybe they can't justify spending that much on a 2.0 weapon because they know full well they won't have time to "monetize" it properly. Should those folks be relegated to forever shit returns?

I guess there is an option: rent one from one of the many flourishing "Rental Services" that currently exist in the game to take advantage of this gap in game-design. This doesn't benefit the community as a whole but only 1 or 2 people..

I have an idea which I think could work, without "destroying" what current 2.0 weapon owners enjoy: a weapon with 3 TT bars:

Actually, only 2 of these are really TT bars, the top one is what I would call a "Temperature" bar, when that bar hits 0, then the weapon cannot be used any further for the rest of the week until the bar resets.

--
EDIT: I think the Temperature bar is needed otherwise these weapons would be competing directly with the UL Loot 2.0 weapons since it would put anyone on the same level with them using these.

You put a limit in terms of time/week, now it becomes no longer viable for someone who wants to compete in an event or go all in on hunting long-term. The limit could be 20 or 30 hours per week, and different weapons could have different limits.
--

This weapon would still be a Limited weapon, but it has 2 TT bars (similar to how Quads do). Once the gun's TT reaches 0, it can be repaired, until the "Repair Pool" bar hits 0, then the gun is no longer repairable and no longer useable.

Some might look at this and say, well why have 2 TT bars, just make the gun have a massive initial TT so it will last a long time. The reason is simple, this type of item is meant to appeal to indivduals with limited bankroll and/or limited time to hunt. If you give the gun a massive TT, it would still be out of reach to many. The "Repair Pool" bar is NOT "money on the item" like TT is, it's how much more the item can be repaired, that is all. The PED used to repair the item comes from the players own PED card, and the bar reduces appropriately to reflect how much more it can be repaired before it is finished.

Making the item this way gives a pseudo-unlimited item, with a hard limit on how many hours/week it can be used and a limited life-cycle within the game (the weapon is eventually removed or render unusable).

For someone like me who might like to hunt maybe 15 hours per week, this would be perfect and could very well be worth the investment.

Do you think this is a good idea?

 

[Gopher]

Really good idea but I don't think the temp bar has/needs a place in this. Would just end up feeling like shit imo.

 

[jetsina]

Thumbsed up in other thread.
It's a bit like the skyripper vehicle that has a slow decay to main tt when it is used (=flown). Temp damage can be repped, but the background decay cannot.
I used to be against this, but now support the idea that this fun flyer should not last me forever if I don't engage in any fights (as other vehicles are).
jk: both the fight and flight response end in permadam

 

[Legends]

Really good idea but I don't think the temp bar has/needs a place in this. Would just end up feeling like shit imo.

I think the Temperature bar is needed otherwise these weapons competing too directly with UL Loot 2.0 weapons since it would put anyone on the same level with them using these.

You put a limit in terms of time/week, now it becomes no longer viable for someone who wants to compete in an event or go all in on hunting long-term. The limit could be 20 or 30 hours per week, and different weapons could have different limits.

This is more for casual hunters, who want to access "good returns" and are willing to pay a premium for that, but not willing to re-mortgage their house.

 

[dimod]

So you want 2.0 weapon for cheap price becoz you dont play as much ?

 

[Gopher]

I think the Temperature bar is needed otherwise these weapons compete directly with Loot 2.0 weapons since it would put anyone on the same level with them using these.

You put a limit in terms of time/week, now it becomes no longer viable for someone who wants to compete in an event or go all in on hunting long-term. The limit could be 30 or 40 hours per week, and different weapons could have different limits.

This is more for casual hunters, who want to access "good returns" and are willing to pay a premium for that, but not willing to re-mortgage their house.

If it was a high number like that, yeah it wouldnt really affect anything. Maybe even have it so the adjusted,imp,mod,etc.. modifiers increase the repair pool/temp bar maximum. What also could be really cool is if crafting skills also had a part in the repair pool/temp bar, so if you have really high skills, you can create weapons that are guaranteed to have 100% of the temp bar/repair pool and lesser skilled crafters would not be able to craft them with full bars. Example: weapon has a maximum of 1000 repair pool and blueprint maxes at lets say lvl 10. Anyone lvl 20+ would be able to craft it with 1000 repair pool everytime but someone with lvl 12 skill would only be able to get 750-800/1000 repair pool.

 

[Legends]

So you want 2.0 weapon for cheap price becoz you dont play as much ?

No.

First of all, this weapon is still LIMITED - so I'm not asking for a Loot 2.0 UL weapon for cheap.

Secondly, it's not my wish for these things to compete directly with Loot 2.0 weapons, I am simply looking for a solution for casual hunters that feel left out, with no other options... If you would like to offer some ideas or input in that regard, then great. But if all you have to say is "Re-mortgage your house if you wanna play, otherwise just don't play..." then I feel like you aren't really getting the point of this suggestion.

 

[castanhas]

the iten value depends on the use u give to it.
if u dony have playtime to justify owning unl, just dont.
Omho there are already way to many unl weapons.
just pick one that suits your gametime.

 

[Katie Chalmers]

Not exactly sure what niche this is filling. There are more weapon options than mortgage breaking 2.0 weapons, and Limited weapons. 25k can get you a BGH, you don't have to spend 100k+ on a BP-70 Perf.

If that's still too much, 1.0 Weapons are also still an option. Return difference between an average 1.0 setup and an average 2.0 setup is a little over 1%. For a casual hunter this doesn't equate to much.

 

[PreyNaika]

ok fck it i give up... thats a never ending story

 

[RT_Tony]

Do you think this is a good idea?

lol no

So anyways, what about the guy and girl that is unable to go all in on hunting?

they grab any (L) from auction and then they start shooting until they get tired of it or it breaks

if you cannot cover the small MU cost of using low MU (L) weapons, you`re hunting the wrong mob

For someone like me who might like to hunt maybe 15 hours per week, this would be perfect and could very well be worth the investment.

again, you should be using (L)

what the hell is with the shitty suggestions these days

 

[Gopher]

lol no

they grab any (L) from auction and then they start shooting until they get tired of it or it breaks

if you cannot cover the small MU cost of using low MU (L) weapons, you`re hunting the wrong mob


again, you should be using (L)

what the hell is with the shitty suggestions these days

I wouldnt say 150% MU minimum for even a low lvl 2.0 limited wep is small cost. Good luck gaining that back on even the best mobs in the game

 

[RT_Tony]

150% MU minimum for even a low lvl 2.0 limited wep

what?

auction is full of options well under that

 

[Gopher]

what?

auction is full of options well under that

Sorry, haven't looked at the MU in a fair bit on those, lowest im seeing for 2.0 limited is bp-110 for 136%, which is still a large amount of MU and your better off buying 1.0 limited weps since they are only like 110-115% for similar dps, eff wont make a difference when MU difference is that large. MA just needs to put more supply of limited 2.0 weps into the game so they are actually worth using without burning ped through MU.

 

[PreyNaika]

[Piron PBP-57 (L)] 103%
[Piron PLP-57 (L)] 103%
one (1) [Piron PBP-57 (L)] 103% on 153 tt is 4.59 ped

loot you can get using this weapon + using entropiawiki
[Output Amplifier Component] 0,40 tt 260 % = 1,04
[Tier 6 Component] 1 tt 630% = 6.30 ped

thats already 7.34 ped mu

loads in the auction

some people never left boreas after 20 years

edit* if people dont undertand this basic thing, then a high effi weapon wont safe you

 

[RT_Tony]

Sorry, haven't looked at the MU in a fair bit on those, lowest im seeing for 2.0 limited is bp-110 for 136%, which is still a large amount of MU and your better off buying 1.0 limited weps since they are only like 110-115% for similar dps, eff wont make a difference when MU difference is that large. MA just needs to put more supply of limited 2.0 weps into the game so they are actually worth using without burning ped through MU.

I wouldnt say 150% MU minimum for even a low lvl 2.0 limited wep is small cost.

how in the world is a bp-110 a low level weapon

 

[Gopher]

how in the world is a bp-110 a low level weapon

It isnt but it was the lowest MU % on auction rn for 2.0 limited weapon. I was looking at lr-20 mayhem adj limited about a week or so ago and they were going for around 150% which is where I got that number from.

 

[RT_Tony]

It isnt but it was the lowest MU % on auction rn for 2.0 limited weapon. I was looking at lr-20 mayhem adj limited a few days ago and they were going for around 150% which is where I got that number from.

wait what exactly do you think "2.0 limited weapon" mean?

 

[Gopher]

wait what exactly do you think "2.0 limited weapon" mean?

Stuff like the mayhem limited weps, RDI lp-80 etc... Armatrix was added after loot 2.0 but their stats are more similar to the loot 1.0 weapons compared to the newer weps. Armatrix lr-105 is 70% eff yet the lr-20 adj is 70%... (and thats one of the worst newer weps. BC-30 is 80.5% eff with .2 more dpp) Armatrix limited are semi-outdated compared to todays weps, looking at the TWEN weapon or mayhem weapon stats.

 

[RT_Tony]

Stuff like the mayhem limited weps, RDI lp-80 etc... Armatrix was added after loot 2.0 but their stats are more similar to the loot 1.0 weapons compared to the newer weps. Armatrix lr-105 is 70% eff yet the lr-20 adj is 70%... Armatrix limited are semi-outdated compared to today’s weps, looking at the TWEN weapon or mayhem weapon stats.

yikes

 

[Legends]

the iten value depends on the use u give to it.
if u dony have playtime to justify owning unl, just dont.
Omho there are already way to many unl weapons.
just pick one that suits your gametime.

Yes, the pace at which UL weapons have been introduced into the game has only been increasing over the last few years, so I agree that there are already too many unl weapons..

To be honest, the first time I thought of the double TT bar idea was as a an alternative to unl, because as we all know, once a player has an unlimited weapon, they are not really "buyers" anymore, so having all these UL weapons hurts the economy a bit. Sure they buy Enhancers, pills and tiering mats, but that's nothing compared to what goes into making limited weapons.

If MA continues to flood the game with Unl weapons, then there will be plenty for everyone and I have no idea why we need all these shops on every planet because they won't have anything to sell to anyone. I guess pretty soon they will all be pills and enhancer shops..

The advantage of the pseudo-unlimited is mainly that it doesn't last forever and keeps the economy circular. It may last 6 weeks or half a year, but eventually it breaks and then there is a need to get a new one.

Anyways, I'm sure this idea will never happen, but I am concerned about the health of the economy of the game.

And RT_tony, you don't have to be so rude. There are lots of people that are willing to rent items or shops, but MA said they are not going to make a secure rental system, so this idea is in lieu of that.

I'm not talking about 63-65% efficiency weapons, I'm talking about 80%+. MA is leaving cash on the table by allowing players like Xan and Messi to rent out their weapons, when they could just simply do a pseudo-unlimited 2.0 weapon like this and take back that market which shouldn't exist in the first place.

 

[RT_Tony]

And RT_tony, you don't have to be so rude.

I’m not rude, you asked if it was a good idea and it just isn’t. It solves no problem at all and is overly complicating something that really isn’t complicated.

It’s just not a good suggestion.

 

[MrMayhem]

I totally dont get it. Everyone want to win so badly, but willing to do so little for it. This has been bugging me since start of my career and can see it clearly in eu. In my opinion, grinding EU on highest levels simply isnt for everyone, same as someone talented for writing, but being loner shouldnt work with people at all for example. Simple as that, set your priorities, do things to your possibilities. All paths leads somewhere.

 

[Bones]

I like the mechanism you have created.
A (L) item with a certain amount of recharges.

 

[Legends]

I’m not rude, you asked if it was a good idea and it just isn’t. It solves no problem at all and is overly complicating something that really isn’t complicated.

It’s just not a good suggestion.

Ok thanks for your input.

Any idea/suggestion should always be evaluated based on how much benefit or positive impact it brings to the population as a whole, after all, without it's people (community), Entropia just doesn't exist.

One thing I would like to point out is that the current "Renting" of end-game gear in Entropia as it exists right now hurts almost everyone:

1. Fewer limited weapons need be crafted so it impacts Crafters negatively
1b. Fewer mats needed by crafters so Miners are affected
2. Fewer limited weapons need to be purchased so it impacts Shop owners
3. Fewer Loot 2.0 weapons need to be purchased if you can just rent it when you need it so it also impacts Professional Hunters who invested dearly to farm such weapons on profit on their sales

Let me tell you something, if a hunter can afford to just hang onto the Vendor pulls so they can rent them out to others, then they are WAY too wealthy, that's just plain as day to see.

People who would rather Rent an end-game weapon rather then Buy one is exactly who this type of pseudo-unlimited weapon is for. A weapon such as this is better for the community as a whole because it would benefit more people rather then just 1 Pro Hunter. As a way of example:

1. The weapon acquisition process would not require the huge upfront collateral that rental services demand (much safer transaction for the person "renting")

2. The person "renting" gets his money's worth no matter what because the life-cycle of the weapon is known and paid for (rather than per week or month), resulting in a fairer exchange since the buyer gets the number of hours he paid for whether it takes him/her 3 weeks or a year to "consume" it.

3. Input materials required for the creation of the weapon would potentially benefit Hunters, Miners and Crafters depending on how that weapon is brought into existence (whether looted mats, mined resources and crafted components/items are required).

4, Shop owners could have something new to sell.

So, as you can see, many stand to benefit. As it is now, only few individuals are benefiting from so-called "Rental Services" who take advantage of this gap in game design.

 

[MrMayhem]

Ok thanks for your input.

Any idea/suggestion should always be evaluated based on how much benefit or positive impact it brings to the population as a whole, after all, without it's people (community), Entropia just doesn't exist.

One thing I would like to point out is that the current "Renting" of end-game gear in Entropia as it exists right now hurts almost everyone:

1. Fewer limited weapons need be crafted so it impacts Crafters negatively
1b. Fewer mats needed by crafters so Miners are affected
2. Fewer limited weapons need to be purchased so it impacts Shop owners
3. Fewer Loot 2.0 weapons need to be purchased if you can just rent it when you need it so it also impacts Professional Hunters who invested dearly to farm such weapons on profit on their sales

Let me tell you something, if a hunter can afford to just hang onto the Vendor pulls so they can rent them out to others, then they are WAY too wealthy, that's just plain as day to see.

People who would rather Rent an end-game weapon rather then Buy one is exactly who this type of pseudo-unlimited weapon is for. A weapon such as this is better for the community as a whole because it would benefit more people rather then just 1 Pro Hunter. As a way of example:

1. The weapon acquisition process would not require the huge upfront collateral that rental services demand (much safer transaction for the person "renting")

2. The person "renting" gets his money's worth no matter what because the life-cycle of the weapon is known and paid for (rather than per week or month), resulting in a fairer exchange since the buyer gets the number of hours he paid for whether it takes him/her 3 weeks or a year to "consume" it.

3. Input materials required for the creation of the weapon would potentially benefit Hunters, Miners and Crafters depending on how that weapon is brought into existence (whether looted mats, mined resources and crafted components/items are required).

4, Shop owners could have something new to sell.

So, as you can see, many stand to benefit. As it is now, only few individuals are benefiting from so-called "Rental Services" who take advantage of this gap in game design.

We can simply go back to guns like mod korss was, with 5k ped tt was at time very useful gun and lasted for pretty long time. But it sure had good reason why it became obsolete and replaced by armatrixes. Armatrix lasts for idk 3-4 hours of shooting which is okay for casual player id say. Having a gun with lets say 5k tt and suddenly you have ton of people crying they are asked for way too much /again,lol/ Unfortunately you can´t make everyone like you or your ideas and you never achieve optimal state where everyone is happy. In this particular case i don´t think ingame mechanics is problem, but people are.

 

[DRAGUNOV44]

Make loot rare give people enough return to pay for ammo and repair they may not strike it rich but they won't go broke from just shooting it will take a while to reach the levels of other hunters and if don't want to grind you will have the option to inject implants for $ which means mindark will continue to make $ and new people will join and stick arround . Since most people hate grinding and being poor they will also invest money to buy swag with Unreal engine 5 thats the best option for mindark. They can also start selling cosmetic items and develop new ways for people to invest in the future of the game. Taxing everything the way they do it now has 2 negatives. The ammount of cash required per month to actually sustain yourself to just hunt or mine or cradt are anywhere between 100-1000$ that prevents a lot of people playing the game and second the way that the game does it means those people are going to loose the cash they put in just get upset and leave. It's the cycle of the last 20 year and the only thing that changes is the number of players which gets lower and lower.

 

[Art Jennifer]

Think there is something behind this idea. Obviously would need some tweaks, but more interesting than the current L.

Biggest challenge I see is how it would impact Crafting/Mining negatively. However sure this idea could be adapt to improve the economy

 

[minim]

Make loot rare give people enough return to pay for ammo and repair they may not strike it rich but they won't go broke from just shooting it will take a while to reach the levels of other hunters and if don't want to grind you will have the option to inject implants for $ which means mindark will continue to make $ and new people will join and stick arround . Since most people hate grinding and being poor they will also invest money to buy swag with Unreal engine 5 thats the best option for mindark. They can also start selling cosmetic items and develop new ways for people to invest in the future of the game. Taxing everything the way they do it now has 2 negatives.

You just described the game as it is today with this quote

 

[DRAGUNOV44]

Think there is something behind this idea. Obviously would need some tweaks, but more interesting than the current L.

Biggest challenge I see is how it would impact Crafting/Mining negatively. However sure this idea could be adapt to improve the economy

We can sugest all we like but question is if MA actually pays any atention to that. One of the reasons i repsect Legends is because he is trying to actually make changes that will benefit the playerbase if we could choose community leaders he would get my vote . But so far all the players sugested was ignored