Question: Effectivness of sweating

[Shaedlaer]

I wanted to ask if anyone has ever made attempt to calculate sweat per hour:
- without using any help
- using fap
- using focus chip
- using fap & focus chip

I'm interested what way to achieve best effectivness of sweat/hour or cash/hour. If possible, I'd also want to know what are costs of such equipements, and how fast do they pay back? What fap would be best for sweating? Or maybe if there are some steps like first one fap would be better, then, when one could afford another it could be better than that etc.

I know I'm asking much questions and about much data, but maybe someone already did such research? In fact I'm pretty sure I've seen such calculations some long long time ago, but can't find them now anywhere.

P.S. Is armour for sweating really such a bad deal? No matter what armour? Even if it's settler armour or the other tt one (don't remember the name atm) with plates (I've read it's most eco for low lvl mobs like daikiba or exo).

Thanks in advance.

 

[Thaddeuss]

ill start off by saying that sweating with armor on is a bad idea, you will end up spending more in decay on the armor then u would make in sweat, compared to sweating naked.

when i go out sweating havent done it in a while now but i seem to remember getting something like 200 300 sweat an hour if ur consistent. maybe a 100 if ur taking it kinda easy and lolly gaging.

U get more skill with wearing the armor sweating but ur profit per hour will certainly go down.

 

[xInFernaLx]

Focus chips certainly gives you more sweat per hour, but it costs some pecs as well.. The best thing is to get someone to give you focus charges, and if you have that, I would recommend a fap

 

[Redfrog]

I haven't done any scientifc calculations on it but my personal feeling is that the most effective way is to buy a tt fap from selling your first load of sweat and then max it while sweating. Assuming you plan on hunting or mining that is
The Evade, Combat Reflexes and Anatomy skills thus gained give you a boost when you pick up your first gun and shoot your first mob.

 

[Alice]

get some buddies, with focus chip and fap
and share hits #D

i might explain that a bit more

say 4 ppl, each one has a m2100 tt gun
one has healing tool, one focus
at least one something to kill the mob

you sweat, when team member falls below 30%, one with more HP shoots at the mob til he has its attention and is hit

instead of 88 HP you have like 320 then the mob gotta chew on

the 1-4 pec shooting on the mob can be forgotten, since else you had to fap yourself up, and ~10 heal for 0.9 pec adds up as well
likely cheaper with shooting version

if you have someone with focus chip as well with you, all will be fun

go for stuff like berys then

happy

 

[kosmos]

get some buddies, with focus chip and fap
and share hits #D

i might explain that a bit more

say 4 ppl, each one has a m2100 tt gun
one has healing tool, one focus
at least one something to kill the mob

you sweat, when team member falls below 30%, one with more HP shoots at the mob til he has its attention and is hit

instead of 88 HP you have like 320 then the mob gotta chew on

the 1-4 pec shooting on the mob can be forgotten, since else you had to fap yourself up, and ~10 heal for 0.9 pec adds up as well
likely cheaper with shooting version

if you have someone with focus chip as well with you, all will be fun

go for stuff like berys then

happy

everything alice said. i used to do this with friends. in 2.5 to 3 hours i could get 1k easily.

you could always goto neas and hope for a organized crowd that sweats one mob.. having a hunter killing dry mobs helps alot there too. i have gotten 300 to 600 there an hour depending on how dedicated i was.

good luck on figuring out the best method. i kinda feel alice's suggestion is going to be the most consistent.

 

[Shaedlaer]

FAP research

Thanks everone for answers.
I know it's best to hunt in groups, but I wanted to see what's best to get to sweat better even if there's no medic or focuser around.

In fact I've made today a test run of sweating with and without FAP.
From what I've noted, during 1h sweating:
- Without FAP, I have gathered 295 sweat (dieing like 4 or 5 times).
- With TT FAP, I have gathered 358 sweat (dieing 1 time, when I didn't manage to escape 3 mobs at a time).

The difference is 63 bottles, which means 31,5 to 34,65 PECs difference (depending on price we sell sweat at - currently 0.5-0.55).

FAP's decay was 0,46 PEC.

I was healing myself only when my health run below 25% or when I died. I healed up to 66 - 75% of full health (so the rest may regenerate itself for free while I sweat).

While sweating, and a mob is attacking me, I slowly walk backwards, so that the mob hits me less (it just walks slowly following me).

I was sweating at combibos young (and some old) to the north-west from Port Atlantis.

Also, I had Evade at 32 when starting hour without FAP, and when ending the hour with FAP, I had Evade at 34.

As for now, I've earned 14,5-11,35 PEC less with fap than without it (counting the decay in).

I'll investigate it more, because with only 1 hour sweating in each setup, the randomness factors may be doing their tricks to me. But as for now sweating without fapping is more proffitable. Also my FAP isn't maxed yet, so I need more uses per same health as one with maxed FAP.

Question:
- Do I use right healing strategy? Or should I not fap myself until I die, then fap to full, and go back sweating? Or any other way than I do it?

Notes:
- Not dieing so often is certainly more fun, and not having for health to regen/ not sweating with empty health bar is way better, and less boring.
- In my calculation, I didn't add profit from the skilling of medical skills, that could be sold some day => money value.
- I was sweating when there were some other sweaters (3-6) and hunters (1-2) were around, which may affect results (less hits taken), but also is most normal enviroment for sweating newbie as sweating alone is way harder and less effective.

P.S. I wonder if it's better to make new thread for the research on this, or keep it in this thread?

 

[Borr]

There is another solo-sweating strategy that will cost no decay. You will get hit sometimes, but not too much...

Here's what to do:

Find a slow mob that has short range and enough sweat.
Focus (from a distance)
Start to sweat
Run away when you get attacked
Sweat cycle succeeds or fails
Keep running until you have enough time to focus
Start sweating again and repeat until dry.

When dry, keep running until the mob is off your radar.
Find the mob back and repeat


You will get hit after focussing and before getting far enough out of range, but this approach works.

 

[Redfrog]

While sweating, and a mob is attacking me, I slowly walk backwards, so that the mob hits me less (it just walks slowly following me).

This will probably gain you more sweat but you won't skill up Evade, etc as quickly since these come from being attacked. Just a point to bear in mind

 

[Alice]

While sweating, and a mob is attacking me, I slowly walk backwards, so that the mob hits me less (it just walks slowly following me).

This will probably gain you more sweat but you won't skill up Evade, etc as quickly since these come from being attacked. Just a point to bear in mind

actually, i doubt that helps
mob attack range is 1-5 meters for melee ones

i doubt pretty much that you make 1m walking backwards before the mob follows if its already in range

 

[Redfrog]

actually, i doubt that helps
mob attack range is 1-5 meters for melee ones

I'm not so sure, it certainly seems that the mob can either attack or move but not both. It definitely seems to launch less attacks per minute when you do this and obviously hit less often too. It even works (though not as effectively) on fast moving mobs like big Argos.

 

[Alice]

I'm not so sure, it certainly seems that the mob can either attack or move but not both. It definitely seems to launch less attacks per minute when you do this and obviously hit less often too. It even works (though not as effectively) on fast moving mobs like big Argos.

funny, but never tested that really, especially not for sweating

on the other hand, if you sweat you could run during the beam too, to get even less hits, ofc less evade then too

 

[Shaedlaer]

I've done it many times at least on combibos (young-old) it works perfectly, as they move slowly. As Redfrog said, it seems, that they can't attack and move simultaneously, so when I walk backwards (or backwards + to either side, or turning lightly with mouselook), they land 1 hit on me when I start walking, and then just follow me without attacking. Compared to running it has some adventages as well as disadventages.
- running certainly you take less or almost no hits if you run far enough
- you can outrun faster mobs
- however you gain less evade
- you sweat slower if you want to get less hits (need to run longer)
- you waste time on turning (so it isn't as much distance gained as it seems)
- other people sweating this mob get angry at you when you run, but walking, especially in right direction doesn't stop them from sweating, fapping you or shooting the mob, as you and the mob don't go as fast as when running - which I find the most important.

I think it's a good method as you get ~half less hits (almost no hits at time when beaming), and you gain evade while concentrating, so it's like in the middle between standing still, and running during beaming.

I myself start doing the walking trick only when I have 1/3 or less hp left, and almost always when I'm solo sweating at the location, as there is no one at whom the mob might switch.

btw. Young Combibos never hit me when I walk, except the hit when I start walking, however Mature and Older (i.e a bit faster) ones do land hit from time to time. It also doesn't work that good with fast mobs that run, then hit, run, hit and so on... However they attack less often then too.

This trick also works when hunting with any ranged weapon, however if the mob (for example Young Combibo) walks so slow that you don't get hit at all, there will be message that it is in state when you can't hit or sweat it from time to time (as if it was blocked by something from hitting you). If you stop to let it hit you it'll be back to normal, and you can walk backwards, firing at it again. The message never appeared to me when sweating tho, only when shooting and walking backwards.

Edit:

I have finished second round of testing. As before 1h witout FAP, then 1h with FAP.
Without: 356 sweat, died 7 times. There were lots of people and 3-4 hunters first half an hour, so it was quite easy to sweat, however later I was alone there - thus those deaths.
Evade: 34-36
Profit: 178 PEC
With: 322 sweat, died 2 times from critical hit. For first half hour I was still virtually alone there, later some more sweaters came, no hunters.
Evade: 36-38, First Aid 2-4 (earlier fap run it was 0-2)
FAP decay: 30PEC
Profit: 131 PEC

It's 47 PEC less with FAP.
I was fapping less now - only when almost dieing or after death, and only to a bit over half hp.

Maybe it was just the circumstances I was sweating in, and not maxed FAP, but still it's less than when sweating without it.

I'll keep updating as I test it farther, to see if the fap-sweating in fact is more efficient, and if yes, than how long does it take to return cash spent on repairs and on buying fap (I know we can tt it back, however I am thinking about returning cash to current capital we could spend on trading, crafting, hunting or whatever instead of buying fap .

Notes:
- Aim of this research is to know if it's more efficient to fap when sweating, or not.
- I know that fapping gives skills, however I don't know if it wouldn't be cheaper => more efficient to sweat first, and then skill fap when we have more cash.
- It probably won't help me much (unless I keep sweating for eternity, which may be the case as I don't want to deposit), but it might be helpful to other newcomers.
- Later on, when I earn enough PEDs to buy implant, chip and implanter, I'll also test how efficient is selffocusing (I believe it's much more efficient with it, as I see how many times I loose focus), and how fast do the costs pay back with it.
Question:
- Maybe fapping is more efficient than non-fapping only in conjunction with focusing (as focusing goes inefficient when you die a lot)?

 

[Shaedlaer]

Third testing round.
First, a very important thing, not only for sweaters. I've been reading "Guide to Proper Health Management" written by JohnCapital, later tested it myself. One of big pros of walking backwards/sidewards is that while doing it you can heal fully. Instead of standing and taking hits while trying to heal faster than the mob hits, or running away and loosing the mob before healing, one may just walk backwards (or in any other direction) when healing - thus getting less or no hits while healing. This improves sweating with fap (and probably hunting too if you need to heal during hunt) a lot.

Now to the test results.
1h without fap: 238 sweat; evade at 38-41.
Profit: 119 PEC (@0.5)
1h with fap: 371 sweat; evade at 41-43; first aid at 4-5; fap decay: 14 PEC.
Profit: 185,5-14=171,5 PEC (@0.5)

Difference: 171,5-119=52,5 PEC/h
Finally it is more sweat than without fap. Perhaps it is tactics thing too, but circumstances (number of other people sweating etc.) were similar this time. I also think this walking back while healing thing helps a lot, because I don't have to run or die (as I can't heal faster than the mob hits, and that for sure wouldn't be eco).

Also I think when I finish those all tests (fap vs no fap, focus chip vs no focus chip, maybe armour vs no armour to see how much does it waste?), I'll make some report and maybe a guide from its results. For me, this research helps a lot, so maybe it'll help others too.

 

[Borr]

Remember that sweating (getting hit) also gives you FAP skills, just very slowly

Fapping at no skill will be less efficient then when you pick that up later. So you may want to repeat your test after you have maxed the Vivo T1.


Regarding the running vs. walking backwards:
You will get hit less and get less evade skills that way. But the point of this technique is to stay alive longer and get more time to focus. If you time it correctly you can finish the focus cycle before the mob gets in range. You are right in saying that this does not work well while group sweating. In that case you can run the mob around the people that are not getting attacked. You will never get enough distance from the mob to do a full focus though.

Regarding the turning:
Practice a bit and turn with your mouse. It will be near instant and not cost time. Also you don't need to turn before you start focusing, but you do need to deselect the mob before focusing, then turn and select it before starting to sweat.


BTW: There are slower and more suitable mobs then bibo's

 

[Drave Robber]

i've always felt that being hit in movement has a way higher probability to give skill increases than being hit while standing, although i'm too lazy to conduct any tests.

i don't sweat much anymore, but i suppose walking backwards certainly reduces frequency of being hit, and may even yield more skills at the end of the day.

 

[SparkyJordan]

There is another solo-sweating strategy that will cost no decay. You will get hit sometimes, but not too much...

Here's what to do:

Find a slow mob that has short range and enough sweat.
Focus (from a distance)
Start to sweat
Run away when you get attacked
Sweat cycle succeeds or fails
Keep running until you have enough time to focus
Start sweating again and repeat until dry.

When dry, keep running until the mob is off your radar.
Find the mob back and repeat

You will get hit after focussing and before getting far enough out of range, but this approach works.

I use this technique myself, but only when I seem to be dying more frequently than I can tolerate, and only in places where there are few players and the mobs are spaced far apart. In someplace like Swamp Camp this technique will only get everyone around you annoyed. The more mobs you disturb with your running around, the more of them will be plaguing all the other sweaters. Plus it makes it hard for people to help you.

 

[Shaedlaer]

In fact I thought about this hit and run tactics, however I'm now focused on making cash => earning fastest as possible on sweating. I find it much easier and cheaper to make more sweat per hour in places where other people are sweating, so I can't use this tactic a) without making them all angry, b) without making noobs run around with mobs. Besides that, although I'm not sure how long does one have to run so that the mob doesn't hit him while focusing before pull, however I think it's longer than pulling time, while when walking backwards only during pull time, than focusing, and pulling again walking backwards and so on, I only get one (young) or two (from higher maturities) hits when focusing, and as for my current evade at mobs I'm sweating, they rarely hit. If I had focus chip it wouldn't be even problem anymore. So, as running might be good when solo sweating, I can't use it because I'm not solo
However the tip with replenishing sweat when mob is off everyones radar is a good one to know

I've also made next round of testing today.
1h without fap: 391 sweat; evade 43-45.
Profit: 195,5 PEC
1h with fap: 370 sweat; evade 45-47; first aid 5-6; fap decay 16PEC.
Profit: 169 PEC

Still it's more without fap.

Fapping at no skill will be less efficient then when you pick that up later. So you may want to repeat your test after you have maxed the Vivo T1.

I know it's less efficient now, however I want to check how much cash does one loose until it is maxed, and how long does it take then to make for it with profit it gives after being maxed. I'm just curious... Also if it takes too much time/PEDs, maybe it would be better earn more cash without fapping, earn some more on trading, and just after making cash buy fap? I want to check which way is more eco, so I have to monitor it all way up the skills until maxed. I just hope the research will show clearly that buying fap as advised is right/wrong. I won't profit much on it, but maybe it'll help others? And it might just feed some numbers-hungry brains as mine

P.S. This might have been last testing round for next few weeks as I have some important exams in 2 weeks, so I won't be able to play much or at all. Also I don't know if my internet connection where I live during academic year will let me test it all as much as I want to. I hope it will, because I really would like to finish this research

 

[Piehkter9]

.....

I've also made next round of testing today.
1h without fap: 391 sweat; evade 43-45.
Profit: 195,5 PEC
1h with fap: 370 sweat; evade 45-47; first aid 5-6; fap decay 16PEC.
Profit: 169 PEC

Still it's more without fap.
......

hi
nice analysis on cause/effect of FAP on sweating productivity...
btw, i don't think sweating is the way to go to make money....
here's why - doing about 400 sweat/Hr gives you approx 2PED/Hr or USD 0,2/Hr
thats just insanely low - you can click on ads on the internet and make USD 0,02 per click, with each click lasting 30 seconds- so thats USD1,2/Hr
your earning productivity is 600% higher
hope it helps
gl to you

 

[davidgr1200]

The cheapest way to sweat is by sweating chirpies & Fugarbabas - they never attack! (But you will only get one chance to sweat each one) If you can find an area with several of them you can go from one to another gathering sweat (one attempt each). You will gradually move them around but you should be able to keep going for a while.

 

[derek666]

This is a great test with much helpful info...

I mostly like to sweat exo's and daibas because they are easy to kill when they do attack and sometimes have good stuff on them...but to sweat without fighting seems dangerous...

Thanks for the info!