Entropia Universe and Vista

[golddude]

IS THIS THREAD STILL GOING????

 

[cibean]

Can MA please give us a deadline or at least a timeframe that it will take to make EU compatible with windows vista? A lot of people who have bought new PCs especially laptops are stuck with vista. It'll be nice of EU to introduce vista support asap

 

[SeamusO]

MA is still in denial .. ..


Everything works OK for me in spite of the X.

 

[aridash]

MA is still in denial .. ..
Everything works OK for me in spite of the X.

support doesnt mean it wont work, it means if theres a problem its up to you to resolve it, they wont address the issue. Win2K isnt supported but works fine (and i mean that in both contexts, in regards to EU and in its own right).

 

[SeamusO]

Vista might be some of the reason behind the engine switch. Even if the old engine works in vista, that doesn't mean it's compatible. The crytek engine is vista compatible and once it's launched, hopefully there will be support for vista.

As I see it, MA isn't going to have many options in a couple of months when XP is no longer available for anyone to buy.

 

[WoenK]

Can MA please give us a deadline or at least a timeframe that it will take to make EU compatible with windows vista? A lot of people who have bought new PCs especially laptops are stuck with vista. It'll be nice of EU to introduce vista support asap

Not giving "support" does not mean, that it will not run.
They simply will not help you if you have trouble with EU and Vista.
It runs as "stable" as with XP.

And if you really want to hace that green mark, that it is supported, simply switch XP compability on

 

[NightwolfAA2k5]

Funny thing is, you don't need a crash hot system to run the cryengine, If you think you do - you're wrong. I was able to run Crysis fine @ 1024x768x32 at a respectable speed on the following rig with no problems:

Processor:
Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.00GHz (2 CPUs)
Memory:
2046MB DDR2 SDRAM
Video Card:
RADEON X1600 Series
Operating System:
Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2

All your 8800 and 9600's are a waste of your hard earned.

- Nightwolf

 

[SeamusO]

Some of what may be getting missed is that there are different levels of computer users. I live at one end with my bookshelves full of assorted 50 pound unix manuals .. .. boxes of misc parts that I've accumulated through the years, etc. If something goes wrong, hardware or software, I can usually resolve it myself.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have someone that uses a computer, but if they run into difficulty, they use support services.

If I go out and buy a new system (or the parts to build it), I actively make a choice as to what I want it to run (currently, vista64, ubuntu hardy64, xp pro in a virtual machine that I can access from either OS).

On the other end of the spectrum, someone walks into the local "Computers R Us" store, picks up that new HP, Dell, Emachine, whatever, they just got vista. Now this person also happens to play EU, has invested time & money and suddeny there is a vista related issue and they are unable to turn to the content creator for help (not discounting the forums here, but at most all we can usually do is offer suggestions that may or may not pertain).

It's really no different than playing in Wine or Cedega .. you might get it to work, but don't go crying to MA when it breaks on a VU (or your avatar turns grey). The problem with vista is that as things break now, people are going to start crying to MA more and more.

 

[Nirfu]

MA is still in denial .. ..


Everything works OK for me in spite of the X.

You can set in the shortcut that it should run in an emulated XP environment, no improvment or change for you, but the red will turn green.

 

[Tseng]

Vista might be some of the reason behind the engine switch. Even if the old engine works in vista, that doesn't mean it's compatible. The crytek engine is vista compatible and once it's launched, hopefully there will be support for vista.

That actually doesn't mean, that the game will be compatible
If they keep the rest of EUs design as it is (saving log files in the same folder as the game itself or saving the cached Images from the ads/displays in EUs folder), it still won't be Vista compatible. This is actually one of the most problems that is caused by EU on Vista (if EU is installed in it's default directory in C:\Program Files\Entropia Universe) and basicly force you to execute it with administrative privilegue token. Just let's hope that they finally learned how to program windows software after 7 years.

And you are right about Vista, not the OS that is the problem, it's, I say it again, drivers from 3rd part.
Since the companies doesn't like Vista we will soon se the new OS from Microsoft, Windows 7.

Problem is just: Drivers and software that don't run under Vista, won't do under Windows 7 neither. Not to write software against Vista (well, stricty it was possible to write the software which is Vista compatible since Win2k, if everyone would have implenented the Windows Security model correctly) is absolutly the wrong way to deal with the situation and will just lead to much bigger problems, when Windows 7 drops the Virtualization support.

Reminder: Virtualization is that thing in Vista, that allows some software which doesn't stricktly follows the windows security guidelines still to run and give the bad/lazy developers a deadline to finally adapt this system. So without the virtualization, we'll see 60-70% of all XP/Win2k based software (who dont followed this guidelines) simply stop to work (or requiring Admin rights to run).

 

[trance]

PLZ no vista for ever! i like my xp

 

[WoenK]

PLZ no vista for ever! i like my xp

Have you tried it ?!
For more than two months ?!
Believe me, you would never miss XP again.

 

[SeamusO]

Problem is just: Drivers and software that don't run under Vista, won't do under Windows 7 neither.

Windows 7 will be its own little monster .. http://www.electronista.com/articles/08/04/04/windows.7.emu.layer/

Microsoft's next version of Windows will represent a large enough break from the codebase of Vista that the company will have to implement a backwards compatibility layer similar to earlier versions of Mac OS X, according to reports from a user familiar with the early versions of the new software. As many of the application programming interfaces will be fundamentally incompatible with the earlier OS, Microsoft will reportedly no longer support programs from earlier Windows versions; as a result, the company will need to introduce a distinct compatibility layer to support earlier programs.

PLZ no vista for ever! i like my xp

Vista got a really bad rap from the beginning for one simple reason .. after extensive delays in release, people started pushing vista development to the back burner. Most of the "bad" vista experiences that you hear about are not the OS failing. Most of the problems revolve around bad drivers or incompatible software. When I was originally playing with the RC versions in 2006, all of the problems I had were directly related to buggy drivers (sata raid controller drivers and sound drivers). Fast forward to now, and I've bluescreened once, but that was directly related to a memory tweak I was trying in my bios.

As it were about me and Vista, I planned on a system with 4GB+ memory, so a 32bit OS was out of the question, had I stayed below the 4GB limit, I would have installed XP Pro. I felt less confident about a 64bit version of XP (tried it a few years ago and wasn't impressed) than I did a 64bit vista .. plus the price was right .. $100(US) for home premium 64 OEM.

As for XP, I still have my previous system with EU installed (XP Pro, opteron 170, 1GB, 6600GT).

Plus, I run virtualbox with an XP virtual machine. It's accessible from both Vista and Ubuntu (hardy64) ... here's a screenie from hardy ..

 

[ALEXANDER]

How can i capture ss in EU using vista ? SnagIt,autoscreen for EU , and even the old printscreen button does not work

 

[Bartoke]

How can i capture ss in EU using vista ? SnagIt,autoscreen for EU , and even the old printscreen button does not work

FRAPS works 99% of time here with vista, 1% off the time it just don't work wich is quite odd but a reboot should help on that

 

[Nazbrat]

Funny thing is, you don't need a crash hot system to run the cryengine, If you think you do - you're wrong. I was able to run Crysis fine @ 1024x768x32 at a respectable speed on the following rig with no problems:

Processor:
Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.00GHz (2 CPUs)
Memory:
2046MB DDR2 SDRAM
Video Card:
RADEON X1600 Series
Operating System:
Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2

All your 8800 and 9600's are a waste of your hard earned.

- Nightwolf

First off Very Nice Rig there Bud.

But how many People do you think that Frequent these forums let alone EU have that kind of Rig? or Know where to get such equipment? Let alone know how to install a Memory stick into their computer? if not a Cpu from a Memory stick?

Of Course a 3 Ghz Dual (2) Processor Machine will Kick Massive ass with Crysis i'd expect nothing less. (Which is what you described) if you meant Dual Core then that is a Different system.

 

[Tseng]

How can i capture ss in EU using vista ? SnagIt,autoscreen for EU , and even the old printscreen button does not work

That can have many causes.

Starting with that your screenshot software is not Vista compatible to the fact that EU isn't.

One possible (and most probable) cause for this could be this:
You installed your Entropia Universe installation in C:\Program Files\Entropia Universe and are forced to run the game/updater with Administrative token, while your Tool you use for taking screenshot runs with normal user token.

This is one of the new features. Software running with low Integrity Level (IL) can't write in memory space of an application with high IL. Applications started with the normal user token, have the IL level "normal" (or 3) while applications started with administrative token have IL "high" (or 4, System being 5 and TrustedInstaller being 6).

For a screenshot Tool to work, it needs to install a global hook in every running process, to intercept/capture the keypress events. In order do to install this global hook, it's necessary to patch the memory of the process. This way, screenshot software which is running with fewer/normal IL can't install that hook in system processes (or ones started wiith admin token).

This btw, is the same method like the one keyloggers use, to log passwords and a keylogger with normal user token won't be able to login passwords from higher leveld processes (additonal security).

So there are basicly two soltuions:
1) Run your screenshot tool with administration token by selechting "run as administrator" properities. This is a ugly solution, cause if its started automaticly with windows you need to confirm every time that you want to grant it admin rights. You could also add it to the Scheduler and let it automaticly start (instead of autostart/registry "run") and run it with elevated privilegues.
Still not best solution imho, cause you shouldn't run applications with admin rights if it's not absolutly necessary

2) Uninstall your Entropia Universe game and install it in another folder on another partition (i.e. D:\Games\Entropia Universe). This way, you can start Entropia Universe without needing an administrative account and the screenshot software would be able to install it's global hook.

3) get another screenshot tool. Most screenshot tools work by installing a global hook, which will allow you to set the custom capture key (and not be limited to Print Screen key) and will only make the screenshot when you press that key. Other screenshot software works, by monitoring the clipboard content. If it changes (after you press PrintScreen) it grabs it's contents and save it. This may be annoying at times, when you don't want to take a screenshot but put the content of the screen into clipboard (i.e. if you want to paste it in Photoshop for editing but the screenshot creates you a jpeg file you dont really want)

 

[WoenK]

How can i capture ss in EU using vista ? SnagIt,autoscreen for EU , and even the old printscreen button does not work

Autoscreen works on Vista, it just does not take the Screenshots automatically.
Pressing the print-screen button does however make a picture.
If it does not, it could be due to the acess rights (as mentioned above).

I think even the "old" printscreen should work, if you press "paste" in your image app.

 

[ALEXANDER]

Autoscreen works on Vista, it just does not take the Screenshots automatically.
Pressing the print-screen button does however make a picture.
If it does not, it could be due to the acess rights (as mentioned above).

I think even the "old" printscreen should work, if you press "paste" in your image app.

nope.. the only one that works is FRAPS

 

[Tseng]

nope.. the only one that works is FRAPS

Fraps hooks/uses DirectX to take the Screenshot/Movies, which is a different technique than most other screenshot tools do. Not sure, but i think the limitation of this is, that you can't take screenshots of desktop/windows applications with FRAPS and are only limited to DirectX based games.

 

[SpikeBlack]

But how many People do you think that Frequent these forums let alone EU have that kind of Rig? or Know where to get such equipment? Let alone know how to install a Memory stick into their computer? if not a Cpu from a Memory stick?

Well I'm running an E6850 3.0Ghz Core2Duo with 2Gb ram, an ATI HD2900, with two 500Gb raid 1 arrays all topped off with a 24inch SyncMaster widescreen full HD monitor 1920x1200. And yes EU still lags occasionally.

Before the big graphics change, it was capable of recording a 1hr movie of a beacon mission in 1440x900 (16:10) movie using fraps with little or no lag.

 

[WoenK]

nope.. the only one that works is FRAPS

Weird...
I really wonder how I am able to make screenshots using Autoscreen then

Must be magic

Enough kidding...
It works, been using it for 6 weeks now.Also works fine in fullscreen.
Only thing that does not work is NRF.
SkillScanner only works in windowed mode.