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lost My Desert Stalker and Dante

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it's 2009...this is still happening?

never loan anything to anyone without collateral or better yet, don't loan anything at all.

I'm sorry for your loss, but this scam is as old as the game. Trust NOBODY you do not know very, very well!
 
First off, NOS, I hope you get your stuff back.

As for the debate on whether or not a crime has been committed:
Comparing virtual items in game to a car makes no sense at all. Seriously, cars are licensed and registered with a local government agency regardless of where you live in the world. Transferring the ownership requires signatures and paperwork, not just a verbal promise or a handshake.
I think a much more valid analogy would be neighbors borrowing a lawnmower, snow-blower, or other type of power-tool. In such a case, would you really ask the guy next door for a deposit on your mower? But you obviously expect him to return it, don't you? my-word-versus-your-word
Of course, you could always take it back in the real-world, but I'm sure lots of people have called the police in such a situation.

That was my :twocents:
 
JSeven said:
Sorry to hear about this problem. Shortly after logging in last night (around 04:00 MA time today) I literally ran into a female ava as I entered the center at Nea's. She opened a chat with me and you can see it in the pic below. Sorry, wasn't aware of this issue at that time. I didn't get a pic of the ava but after the ava left I thought it was a bit strange so I did do a screenie.

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

Good luck getting your items back safely.

(I did block out the ava name to be safe but can give it if requested.)
Click to expand...

I pretty much got exactly this PM myself last night. A downer to say the least as I always thought the ava was a nice person. I hate being such an awful judge of character sometimes.
 
Sorry for your loss, nice stuff.

I agree with everyone thats saying get the local police involved. Though you might had been a bit careless ppl dont deserve to get ripped off. True criminals will find them selves in prison, hopefully sooner than later, so maybe you can help this person find their path in life.

Though I hate to say it, MA's approach to some of this(scams etc) is probably the only thing they can do to keep themselves safe from litigation. You can have log after log after log and as soon as the term RPG comes up, now your playing in fantasy land and what you do is not real. :twocents:
 
it sucks, scamming nice people I don't really understand, some ppl are too greedy about money/ped.

I hope you will get back your stuff fast, tell me if you need some help, see you ingame mate !
 
Chrome said:
I also don't see how people can constitute this as theft. This was a voluntary TRADE, in which a DEAL was FINALIZED ingame by both parties involved.





I don't believe US law would necessarily apply in a world-wide "virtual world".

Also, how can you PROVE there was an expectation of getting it back?



Bottom line, never "lend" anything to anyone ingame for any reason... ever.
Click to expand...


How can he prove there was an expectation of getting it back? MAybe the lack of peds and / or items changing hands would help there? IF the only thing that changed hands in that deal were those items...what else could have happened? Don't say RL deals...if that had happened the other geezer would have been all over this thread with proof (easy to get IRL).
His absence and silence is like the dog that didn't bark in the night...pretty solid evidence of wrongdoing. If this thread was about me I'd be ALL over it with evidence that I did no wrong, or massive apologies if I'd had some other problem that caused a friend harm like this after doing a favour.

I read Lykke's library book analogy, and wondered why MA don't set up an item library, or allow others to do so (like maybe the banks?) ..where we could lend our stuff (instead of pawn) for a predetermined period, and if they were rented we got the fee less a % for the service? Banks are not doing too well it appears, this would be a boost wouldn't it?

Collateral would be required and a good system, but what a nice business that would be for everyone, and how much stuff wasting away in storage would that get back out ingame?

t
 
burnsey said:
I used to be a Valet, people would drive up to a restaurant and pay me 15 dollars cash to take their 60-100,000 cars from them. Is that a valid trade?
Click to expand...

Sorry the comparison is not valid. People pay for the valet service to park their cars, not to trade them. Besides, cars are still registered to a person, ownership can be proven, and taking a car that does not belong to you is theft. The car analogies don't work in EU...

Perhaps on the way to a parking garage, my cousin could shoot me in the kneecap and steal the new mercedes SL600 i was driving...
Click to expand...

...right ;)

Just because it's a virtual world with virtual items doesn't mean you throw your hands up in the air, it's real money and has real consequences.

Find the right people to help you out and don't give up.
Click to expand...

I agree you should not give up trying to get your items back. It would be interesting to see what MA and the police especially, have to say.

Cheers :beerchug:
 
Sorry to hear bout losing your stuff i hope you get it back soon, ill keep a look out for her and let ya know if i see her around.
 
Good luck getting your items back. But I seriously doubt that you'll ever see them back in your possession again since you traded him the items. That means that you both accepted and confirmed a trade towards another player, even tho he didn't pay you anything for the items.

This means that you actually gave away the items before realizing that the person was a thief, which means that the only thing the police will come up with, is the logs of you giving away the items for free, then wanting to have them back.

Even thou, I wish you the best of luck in getting your items back! Scams are truly a bitch.
 
just an update and a thanks out to all who have helped out the police cannot do anything, FBI is involved. but there is 3 guns invloved A strikehammer and a loudmouth and My desert Stalker. so if anyone is tring to sell you these 3 guns be aware they might not be who they say they are. Thanks for all the support and I do have the avatars IRL names and I have phone numbers. I thought I had all my bases covered. I also have IRL pics of both of these people. so it seemed ok. just a reminder to all, do not give out what you can't afford to lose. I told people that in game for years, too bad I did not listen and I guess I could afford to lose it. there was a urban stalker I was looking at... thanks again all
 
outch, it's getting more costly :/
 
Just a quick thought, are u sure the account hasnt been hyjacked by someone else??
 
Well i havent read all posts but do u know hes real name and where he lives?
If he lives close to Stockholm i promise u that i will visit him :)
 
Fight crime with crime?

This subject got me to log in for the 1st time in years. I know who she is and where she lives, plus her family. But NOS had to go and report it to the FBI. Now, even though I live close to her, I can't go and "pay her a visit". I now have to let the FBI take care of it.:rolleyes:

Scammers should be careful that no RL friends of the victim live close by before scamming them. And no, that was not a threat. Threatening people in RL is a crime.:bomb:

This "service" will get out of hand... MA should institute a loan service so something like my "paying a visit" will not happen in RL. Bad press could give them a bad rep. There must be a lawyer out there who can expound on this...
 
JackFree said:
Sorry the comparison is not valid. People pay for the valet service to park their cars, not to trade them. Besides, cars are still registered to a person, ownership can be proven, and taking a car that does not belong to you is theft. The car analogies don't work in EU...
Click to expand...

The car analogy may not work, but the lawnmower one sure does. I can imagine the court scene on that one "he borrowed my lawnmower and didn't return it", "I thought it was a gift!". I'm pretty sure the laws in most countries on earth recognize the difference between "you can borrow this" and "you can have this". You can even take engagement rings back if you don't get married since they are "conditional gifts". I think, if would ever go to court you'd have a good chance of winning (naturally it won't). The argument of "I thought it was a gift so I sold it even though the guy asked for it back" won't get far.
 
Mark MB Brainle said:
Fight crime with crime?

This subject got me to log in for the 1st time in years. I know who she is and where she lives, plus her family. But NOS had to go and report it to the FBI. Now, even though I live close to her, I can't go and "pay her a visit". I now have to let the FBI take care of it.:rolleyes:

Scammers should be careful that no RL friends of the victim live close by before scamming them. And no, that was not a threat. Threatening people in RL is a crime.:bomb:

This "service" will get out of hand... MA should institute a loan service so something like my "paying a visit" will not happen in RL. Bad press could give them a bad rep. There must be a lawyer out there who can expound on this...
Click to expand...

*Puts on western cowboy accent*

I don't like your tone, hombre.

I'm gonna pay ye a visit.
 
in my way to thing about that are few words :) f..k MA how they assure their clients :dunno: for me are complices with scammers until they find a way to finish with those simple proves and make some little changes in softwere to lock items.
it's not problem of FBI CIA Mosad or .... others to solve :( its a problem betwen MA and us :D
If that system permit such things are also responsable !!!! not problem about trade are final or EU is dinamic :scratch2: thats are simple words, until they win theirs incomes from us.

They appreciate reported bugs but forget essence :( We are clients !!!!
 
well the guy involved in this scam started a Play N Trade and 2 months ago sold it. I have to wonder why he is selling a store that is doing well?
 
It was realy bad idea to borrow such a gun.
You can''t borrow so big stuff to others unless you know them all time you play, maybe even you know him/her irl or she/he is very skilled and are a member of very respectfull and well known soc.
 
timmmers said:
How can he prove there was an expectation of getting it back? MAybe the lack of peds and / or items changing hands would help there? IF the only thing that changed hands in that deal were those items...what else could have happened? Don't say RL deals...if that had happened the other geezer would have been all over this thread with proof (easy to get IRL).
His absence and silence is like the dog that didn't bark in the night...pretty solid evidence of wrongdoing. If this thread was about me I'd be ALL over it with evidence that I did no wrong, or massive apologies if I'd had some other problem that caused a friend harm like this after doing a favour.

I read Lykke's library book analogy, and wondered why MA don't set up an item library, or allow others to do so (like maybe the banks?) ..where we could lend our stuff (instead of pawn) for a predetermined period, and if they were rented we got the fee less a % for the service? Banks are not doing too well it appears, this would be a boost wouldn't it?

Collateral would be required and a good system, but what a nice business that would be for everyone, and how much stuff wasting away in storage would that get back out ingame?

t
Click to expand...

Timmers you bring up a great point. If the Items where traded to someone with nothing in return then it is obviously a loan or its someone selling something thats being paid for outside of game. If its being paid for out of game does'nt that break rules? So should'nt MA reverse the trade on this just for that reason?
 
ChrisPope said:
in my way to thing about that are few words :) f..k MA how they assure their clients :dunno: for me are complices with scammers until they find a way to finish with those simple proves and make some little changes in softwere to lock items.
it's not problem of FBI CIA Mosad or .... others to solve :( its a problem betwen MA and us :D
If that system permit such things are also responsable !!!! not problem about trade are final or EU is dinamic :scratch2: thats are simple words, until they win theirs incomes from us.

They appreciate reported bugs but forget essence :( We are clients !!!!
Click to expand...

You are wrong about "f..k MA how they assure their clients".
MA is not responsable about peoples actions in game when they loan theyr stuff to other peoples without being sure that if they get them all back. Why peoples who never loan anything, never crying about how they been scammed... Because they are smart and they give security to them selfs by theyr own actions bifore do such a trade. No offence, just saying how it realy works and no one will dissagree with me here.
Chery Lady.
 
To the OP: I am sorry for your loss, and I wish you the best of luck getting these valuable items back.

To the people saying this is not a crime: Wrong! Atleast in America. A verbal agreement is considered binding in American courts. MA's "rules" on this would not matter so long as the 2 parties involved are both US citizens. The American law would supercede said "rules".

Furthermore, MA is officially a bank. Anything that occurs in Entropia Universe is a real and valid transaction and not a virtual transaction like a typical MMO.

Although local police would have no juristiction in this matter, the FBI does, and I am willing to bet that the OP will receive his items back.
 
this is s prime reason why they should have installed "the loan system" ages ago.

sorry you got screwed nos. why can we not speak of said avy's name? i think black naming a scammer is a good thing, is it not?
 
sloth said:
this is s prime reason why they should have installed "the loan system" ages ago.

sorry you got screwed nos. why can we not speak of said avy's name? i think black naming a scammer is a good thing, is it not?
Click to expand...

No, it is bad thing. There are made rules, and we can not broke them.
Posting others names in forums is against EULA
 
All we can do from this point is send support cases with Screenshots. and times and try to make sure dishonest people do not come out ahead. all of you can PM me if you have any questions for me I have lots of info to offer.
 
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JSeven said:
[br]Click to enlarge[/br]
Click to expand...

i got a similar pm last night but had no idea the gun had been stolen. i told them no thanks as i have no interest in owning a blp rifle, but anyhow NOS, hope this ends better for you than i expect its going to.

if they pm me again, i'll let em know what i think of it!
 
Ive heard FBI is involved now... thats great that NOS takes it up a level to get those 2 f**kers some real buissnes...
 
I like the idea of the FBI getting involved. I bet 2 or 3 visits from different police agencies will light a fire under MA to do something - loan system, item locks, whatever, support people who got scammed.

Their "hands off" attitude is wrong, They created the game, they created the rules, they created the opportunity. They should at least ask questions and read the logs. Most intelligent people could look at chat logs, ask some questions, look at screenies, and figure out who is scamming who. If they traded RL outside of the game, the person should be able to verify that to MA, if they can't, they are scamming.

For quite awhile, and I would again in the future, (at least with this avatar), I would give crafted stuff to a shop owner to sell "on consignment". But we both took screenies of every trade and chat window. We grew to trust each other, but still took screenies. If either of us stole or scammed, any reasonable person would be able to tell what happened. But if MA won't even look into it, what is the point of taking screenies of trades and chat? To come on the forum and complain? so - what are they saying? That the way to settle a dispute is thru the forum or RL friends paying RL "visits" to scammers?

That is why I think it is a good idea to involve the cops. They might not take an online "game" seriously at first, but once they realize real money is involved and real people are being robbed, they will learn to take it seriously. They didn't take "Identity theft" seriously at first, either. But they do now.
 
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