MA's manipulation of market value - overview and discussion

mastermesh is still right at the moment. It's becoming very common to see rocktropia and next island items around Calypso. Maybe when they have more players it will be less of a problem, but at the moment 1 more item on any planet equals a reduction in value for any other similar item within entropia unless they're travel limited items (which most aren't afaik).

lol and whats with all the items from calypso ? u know we use on RT more calypso items :scratch2:

and dont forget maybe some will items be impossible to use on calypso , realy u panic to much and probaly even scare more new customers

write to support if u think u know how to make it better ? but always panic helps none , or your here fpr forum-dollar?
 
lol and whats with all the items from calypso ? u know we use on RT more calypso items :scratch2:

and dont forget maybe some will items be impossible to use on calypso , realy u panic to much and probaly even scare more new customers

write to support if u think u know how to make it better ? but always panic helps none , or your here fpr forum-dollar?

Then it works in turn and devalues rocktropia items from the start.

Just because they use calypso items doesn't mean that Rocktropia items don't exist. If they introduce another version of a EMT EK-2600K which is slightly better and there's at least 100 or more of that item then don't you think the original version of the item will be devalued as it is moved down the list of desirable items?
 
Then it works in turn and devalues rocktropia items from the start.

Just because they use calypso items doesn't mean that Rocktropia items don't exist. If they introduce another version of a EMT EK-2600K which is slightly better and there's at least 100 or more of that item then don't you think the original version of the item will be devalued as it is moved down the list of desirable items?

prices always change and honestly i beleave MA dont care about MU . MU is what players are willing to pay , MA earns only some if we sell these in auc from fee :wise:
 
lol and whats with all the items from calypso ? u know we use on RT more calypso items :scratch2:

and dont forget maybe some will items be impossible to use on calypso , realy u panic to much and probaly even scare more new customers

write to support if u think u know how to make it better ? but always panic helps none , or your here fpr forum-dollar?

If panic makes n00bs realize what a crappy situation the market is in so that they don't freely blow their cash, the panic is doing it's job and getting the message across.

Until MA and the Planet Partners fix all the bullshit that's been going on for over a year, with all the broken systems, nonfuntional estates and items, etc. no new folks should be putting money in and all those that already got cash in should not put more in.

We are paying them a paycheck. If the source of that funding goes away til they actually get off their butts and make this non-tested buggy virtual reality platform in to "the safest virtual world utilizing a real cash economy" that they promise that it already is, then would be the time to remove the panic and start inviting people to come in and spend freely.

http://www.entropiaplatform.com/entropia-platform/security/
MindArk aims to provide the safest online entertainment environment available. Safety and security is highly prioritized and MindArk has implemented functions on several levels to ensure this. Both Planet Partners and the participants on the planets should always feel safe in their endeavors in Entropia Universe.

As things are right now there is not one single thing in game that makes this place anything anyone should consider "feel safe" about.
 
I skimmed a good chunk of this thread after the first page but.

Every comment i saw that said the EU economy doesnt work like the real world economy is flat out wrong. Examples to follow....

  1. Folks don't make guns in RL to "practice" making them
  2. companies dont lose ALL the manufacturing materials 1/3 of the time they try to make something
  3. innovation and improvement makes the manufacturing process cheaper... not to mention the ability to "copycat" similar items.
  4. Noone will pay 10$ for a gallon of milk hoping there's 500 inside:)
  5. Deer have deer hide, deer guts, and meat when you kill them, every single time:)
  6. if a company doesn't find oil in an area, they don't drill again in 4 hours
 
If panic makes n00bs realize what a crappy situation the market is in so that they don't freely blow their cash, the panic is doing it's job and getting the message across.

Until MA and the Planet Partners fix all the bullshit that's been going on for over a year, with all the broken systems, nonfuntional estates and items, etc. no new folks should be putting money in and all those that already got cash in should not put more in.

We are paying them a paycheck. If the source of that funding goes away til they actually get off their butts and make this non-tested buggy virtual reality platform in to "the safest virtual world utilizing a real cash economy" that they promise that it already is, then would be the time to remove the panic and start inviting people to come in and spend freely.

http://www.entropiaplatform.com/entropia-platform/security/

As things are right now there is not one single thing in game that makes this place anything anyone should consider "feel safe" about.

ok u know what , all stop depsiting ! that will help to build presure ! complain about all and warn any not to play this game ! thats right ... or does it only damage the games rep ? anyway complain party for all ! :tongue2: and just to know , how many of your over 7k posts are complaining xD ?
 
ok u know what , all stop depsiting ! that will help to build presure ! complain about all and warn any not to play this game ! thats right ... or does it only damage the games rep ? anyway complain party for all ! :tongue2: and just to know , how many of your over 7k posts are complaining xD ?

We don't need to warn others away, we just stop inviting them. Infact the last time I invited someone to come and play Entropia was almost 2 years ago. What reputation does this game have to lose anyway?

Also, most of the "complainers" still have hope. There is a reason people even bother to stick around pointing out what is wrong and what can be improved. We want MA and this game to do well because it's such a brilliant concept. But although complainers mean well they are pushed aside and trolled by kiss asses. It's a shame MindArk don't tend to listen, their paycheques would likely be a lot larger if they put in the effort.
 
MA dont care about MU, TT is the only thing that mean something for them. We the players set the MU, and we base them on stuff that we have no controll over... that part is very funny :D

If you cant lose some k's in markup on one item, dont buy it then.
 
MA dont care about MU, TT is the only thing that mean something for them. We the players set the MU, and we base them on stuff that we have no controll over... that part is very funny :D

If you cant lose some k's in markup on one item, dont buy it then.

This whole MA not caring about markup is an illusion. They have an entire balancing team for it. Higher markup means that MA get a larger auction fee each time a sale is made. If they didn't care about markup then why not put those hundreds and possibly thousands of empty estates on auction with a 0ped starting bid? Because they know it would devalue them thats why, and they themselves wouldn't make much money from it.
When they sold Crystal Palace don't you think they cared about the +3.3million ped markup? Ofcourse they did, it was the only reason they sold it even though it was never privately owned before which meant due to another decision from a mindark employee they manipulated a virtual item that you could argue was public property since it wasn't originally created to be privately owned. Without market value MindArk wouldn't make a living, if Land Areas sold for under $100USD each then they probably wouldn't even bother creating any more of them. Instead they pay almost a years wages for some of their employees or a nice little bonus when they add new ones.

If they wanted to they could sell off all of eudoria as a land area. If that had no markup then obviously they wouldn't bother.
 
Ive known a time where everything was overpriced and now its at a reasonable price. I can understand MA toying with its own system. (L) stuff saved this game believe it or not. But the market is indeed broken with daily mu's reference.
 
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  1. Folks don't make guns in RL to "practice" making them
  2. companies dont lose ALL the manufacturing materials 1/3 of the time they try to make something
  3. innovation and improvement makes the manufacturing process cheaper... not to mention the ability to "copycat" similar items.
  4. Noone will pay 10$ for a gallon of milk hoping there's 500 inside:)
  5. Deer have deer hide, deer guts, and meat when you kill them, every single time:)
  6. if a company doesn't find oil in an area, they don't drill again in 4 hours



Well said..:smoke:
 
  1. Folks don't make guns in RL to "practice" making them
  2. companies dont lose ALL the manufacturing materials 1/3 of the time they try to make something
  3. innovation and improvement makes the manufacturing process cheaper... not to mention the ability to "copycat" similar items.
  4. Noone will pay 10$ for a gallon of milk hoping there's 500 inside:)
  5. Deer have deer hide, deer guts, and meat when you kill them, every single time:)
  6. if a company doesn't find oil in an area, they don't drill again in 4 hours

1) I'm sure most gun manufacturers do R&D, and production tests. You think they just miraculously get it right the first time?
2) There are inefficiencies in all means of production.
3) So does raising the QR of a BP
4) I'm sure they would if they could
5) Not if you nuke it
6) I'll agree with that.

My point is not to debate, but to point out that it's a mug's game to run EU/RL analogies too far. In EU many things are completely unrealistic, while other things have artificial factors that help simulate RL conditions in ways that are unrealistic. But the economy works on supply and demand. MA never said what the MU on Choppers should be. MA has no control over what MU is set at. They do have overall control of the potential availability of items, but we all act as free agents within EU and they cannot control that, only influence it. This is quite like real life, where MA represents "outside forces and events" that influence the economy, but it is we as players who determine how to react to those forces.

:beerchug:

Miles
 
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My point is not to debate, but to point out that it's a mug's game to run EU/RL analogies too far. In EU many things are completely unrealistic, while other things have artificial factors that help simulate RL conditions in ways that are unrealistic. But the economy works on supply and demand. MA never said what the MU on Choppers should be. MA has no control over what MU is set at. They do have overall control of the potential availability of items, but we all act as free agents with EU and they cannot control that, only influence it. This is quite like real life, where MA represents "outside forces and events" that influence the economy, but it is we as players who determine how to react to those forces.

:beerchug:

Miles

So now you're agreeing with the OP?
 
So now you're agreeing with the OP?

Im sure he dont fully agree with you.. no one does..

if you would have said what miles just said even I would agree with you.. but you didnt
 
Im sure he dont fully agree with you.. no one does..

if you would have said what miles just said even I would agree with you.. but you didnt

I'd like to correct you there, quite a few people agree, why would I be receiving so many reps on that post otherwise?
 
I'd like to correct you there, quite a few people agree, why would I be receiving so many reps on that post otherwise?

I dont even remember what this thread was about.. but it was probably something really stupid. otherwise I wouldnt have spent the time reading it.. I give up.. you win.. your the planet calypso forum master..
 
I dont even remember what this thread was about.. but it was probably something really stupid. otherwise I wouldnt have spent the time reading it.. I give up.. you win.. your the planet calypso forum master..

I asked for a constructive conversation, not a sarcasm war.
Please stop being rediculous. Slating a thread when you even admit you can't remember what it's about is just plain silly. Troll much?
 
I asked for a constructive conversation, not a sarcasm war.
Please stop being rediculous. Slating a thread when you even admit you can't remember what it's about is just plain silly. Troll much?

I always troll retarded threads.. threads that is a waste of everyones time.. and yeah.. Im always hoping for a flame war..
 
I always troll retarded threads.. threads that is a waste of everyones time.. and yeah.. Im always hoping for a flame war..

Well you seem to have plenty of time to waste if you spend it making retarded comments in threads you personally find retarded. You have nothing better to do with your life? Fail.
 
Mindark does care about markup, but one thing i find funny is no one complained when vehicle bps weren't looting and they enjoyed pie in the sky prices on different things. Funny to see a whine thread now there is more bps in the supply chain influencing the price downward.

@ the opening poster I am going to tell you a secret, well not much of a secret if you pay attention. Mindark has done this to many things in the past and does it daily/weekly if you really pay attention.

kosmos
 
Well nothing against supply and demand really but I get your point. I personally dont like it when we are such a small playerbase that the demand is so small compared to supply.

When we are talking MA controlled supply I think that if they wanna change it, they should do it gradually and not crash it like they did with the scanners.
 
Well you seem to have plenty of time to waste if you spend it making retarded comments in threads you personally find retarded. You have nothing better to do with your life? Fail.

lol nice try.. you dont have to worry about me and what I do with my life..
now back to this whining thread of yours.. you bought a helicopter for this and that much peds and later the price of helicopters went down in price.. and then you make a whining thread on the forum about it.. like so many other ppl who seems to have a really hard time learning about the game.. what should I do about it? protest against MA for deciding that ppl needed more helicopters or flame this retarded thread?

as I said in my first post.. helicopters is so new that the price has not stabilized yet.. they might become like lvl 1 tp chips next week.. no one knows. the crafters and buyers decides the price of choppers.. not MA..

if you couldnt afford to buy the thing you should have waited.. its a limited item so you should be able to figure out that more BPs will be dropping.. and if your even smarter you also know that the new BPs will drop in waves.. and ye.. thats when you should buy one because thats when items usually goes down in price..

its not like the ppl at MA is trying to piss you off or anything.. they just felt it was time for more BPs..

"kosmos
Mindark does care about markup, but one thing i find funny is no one complained when vehicle bps weren't looting and they enjoyed pie in the sky prices on different things. Funny to see a whine thread now there is more bps in the supply chain influencing the price downward."

this is so true.. the work at MA cant be easy.. 10% whine about that theres not enough stuff and 10% whine about it beeing too much stuff.. while the majority dont care about any of you.. and sadly stop reading this forum.. wich was a good sorce for info before.
 
lol nice try.. you dont have to worry about me and what I do with my life..
now back to this whining thread of yours.. you bought a helicopter for this and that much peds and later the price of helicopters went down in price.. and then you make a whining thread on the forum about it.. like so many other ppl who seems to have a really hard time learning about the game.. what should I do about it? protest against MA for deciding that ppl needed more helicopters or flame this retarded thread?

as I said in my first post.. helicopters is so new that the price has not stabilized yet.. they might become like lvl 1 tp chips next week.. no one knows. the crafters and buyers decides the price of choppers.. not MA..

if you couldnt afford to buy the thing you should have waited.. its a limited item so you should be able to figure out that more BPs will be dropping.. and if your even smarter you also know that the new BPs will drop in waves.. and ye.. thats when you should buy one because thats when items usually goes down in price..

its not like the ppl at MA is trying to piss you off or anything.. they just felt it was time for more BPs..

"kosmos
Mindark does care about markup, but one thing i find funny is no one complained when vehicle bps weren't looting and they enjoyed pie in the sky prices on different things. Funny to see a whine thread now there is more bps in the supply chain influencing the price downward."

this is so true.. the work at MA cant be easy.. 10% whine about that theres not enough stuff and 10% whine about it beeing too much stuff.. while the majority dont care about any of you.. and sadly stop reading this forum.. wich was a good sorce for info before.

Sorry mate, but yet again you're wrong.

This thread is highlighting the power MindArk have over the ingame economy. The economy ingame is NOT driven by competing companies, but by decisions from individuals.

I don't think people complain when there is too little of an item, infact i've NEVER seen a complaint over there being too few of an item. There are wishful thinkers who want one, but they don't go around saying "oh there aren't enough mod faps in this game".

Another point is MA can put more items into the economy but they can't take them out unless like in the past they offer compensation. This can ONLY drive the market downwards, for everything.

Yet another point is MindArk advertise that people should be confident in investing their money into the game. Why should ANYONE be confident in investing money into something that could fall by 70% in value because some derp at head office hit a button on their keyboards.

Unsustainable. (L) Items are there so they're cycled through and so theoretically people wouldn't be able to keep them forever. This means that the items wouldn't be hogged by the first few who got them and their sales being rare. The only way to get around this would be for more to be looted. This was unnecessary for vehicles that hadn't yet been spent.
 
Fashion - an ipod will remain the same price when sold by Apple until a new one is released the next year, and they will stop selling the old one then.

You lost me completely with this. Electronics are incredibly unstable and drop quickly in price before the new ones come out. You can almost always buy the last model cheaply even after the new one comes out. What world do you live in that has constant pricing for electronics?
 
I've come to learn that the difference between items in the real world and ingame is that in the real world the price of an item will always be based around the cost to produce it (includes costs of wages and running a company etc). The value of an item in Entropia Universe is based totally on demand and supply, and nothing to do with cost to manufacture at all. And this is what is wrong with the economy ingame.


I don't really agree with anything much you've written in this thread, but let's go back to your original assumptions.

The crux of the problem seems to be that you are comparing a 'item' in EU to a 'manufactured item' in RL; but the price behaviour of the former is actually much closer to a 'share' in RL. This is the comparison that you should be making - think of the Auction House as a stock exchange.

Stock exchanges are governed by supply and demand, exuberance, false markets, tulip mania, panic etc., etc. (no way are they efficient!). Values can plunge in a day - ask recent investors on the LSE about Rok or Connaught or HMV. Individual institutions can manipulate prices, or cause temporary price shocks, very easily where the share has a small market base.

Or if you prefer - foreign exchange markets see deliberate intervention by national banks to force price changes. See MA like a national bank.
 
Sorry mate, but yet again you're wrong.

This thread is highlighting the power MindArk have over the ingame economy. The economy ingame is NOT driven by competing companies, but by decisions from individuals.

I don't think people complain when there is too little of an item, infact i've NEVER seen a complaint over there being too few of an item. There are wishful thinkers who want one, but they don't go around saying "oh there aren't enough mod faps in this game".

Another point is MA can put more items into the economy but they can't take them out unless like in the past they offer compensation. This can ONLY drive the market downwards, for everything.

Yet another point is MindArk advertise that people should be confident in investing their money into the game. Why should ANYONE be confident in investing money into something that could fall by 70% in value because some derp at head office hit a button on their keyboards.

Unsustainable. (L) Items are there so they're cycled through and so theoretically people wouldn't be able to keep them forever. This means that the items wouldn't be hogged by the first few who got them and their sales being rare. The only way to get around this would be for more to be looted. This was unnecessary for vehicles that hadn't yet been spent.

yes.. MA owns all the stuff in here.. get used to it. investing in limited helicopters when they are brand new is retarded.. I would not even think about doing it.. not until the market is stabil anyway. buying one because you want one is another thing.

yes they have control over almost everything in EU.. and its not strange at all.. they are god.. they decide when and where and what dropps.. but they dont decide the MU of items.. the traders does :)

I have answered your question many times now.. and it is starting to get boring.. and face it.. only you failed here.. you are the one that bought a chopper and lost money :laugh:
 
if they were realy worth 2000 ped or more the price would have stayed there

the price drop because no one wanted to buy them at 2000 peds

for me i wouldnt pay 2000 ped for a choper than it will be gone later on they were made for PVP decay
do you think MA make more money poeple selling at 2000 or 500 peds there more poeple are going to used them at lower value and going to mount gun on them

the only complaint are the poeple that baught them at high price and the poeple that taught they strike it rich whit the bp

the way i see it here

poeple only want a limited supply send a message to ma to only make 20 of them the stop making them
 
yes they have control over almost everything in EU.. and its not strange at all.. they are god.. they decide when and where and what dropps.. but they dont decide the MU of items.. the traders does :)

And MA started the crash. One and only. It is human nature to panick and sell up stock if a situation changes for the worse. But this change in the amount of items was a decision by a human being in an office. In my opinion it's just wrong. There shouldn't be anybody playing god with real money, the role of politicians irl and national banks are to keep the economy stable and their money at a high value. The only ones that don't do this are the corrupt ones who don't care about their people. If you would like to compare this way then there is your answer - MA is a corrupt (virtual) government. Take Zimbabwe as an example, corruption in their leadership caused their currency to become worth less than 50 pence for 10 billion zimbabwean dollars.

Now to everybody who is saying "the trader decides the price" and let me make this point very clear.

A baker in Zimbabwe has the ability to sell his bread at any price he wants to. But he has to keep up with the economy so if he wants to make 20p for a loaf he would sell at 4 billion zimbabwean dollars. If the currency is worth less then he HAS to sell for more if he wants to make enough money to buy grain to make another loaf. Now this would be slightly different in EU since its items not currency but the concept is the same. To keep up with the market crafters have to bring their price down as amounts go up to keep a balance.
If suddenly thousands of choppers flooded into the market, there is suddenly more of this item 'currency' which devalues it all. Once again, in the Zimbabwe situation i'd be able to get more money for fewer items, in EU it's more items for fewer money but it works the same.
Because there are more it means it is harder for crafters to sell them. This is what makes the price drop by a hundred or so peds each time a new auction is made. Crafters could still sell at the higher price but they wouldn't make the sales and only because of the increased numbers introduced by MA. MA know the market prices, they know what will happen to prices depending on how they run things. It is 100% the fault of MindArk for this price drop.

If you're suggesting that crafters could have created an agreement not to sell lower than a certain price then this is actually illegal so no the crafters have no power over competition.

--------

Oh and just to add on:

When there is going to be a change in real life it is announced often months and sometimes years before it happens. This gives people time to make the sales they need and is fair for everyone. The situation with MindArk is that these things happen instantly with no warning whatsoever.

The real life situation here means people can plan, people who want to wait the extra months get the lower price and people who want them now have the opportunity to still pay more. The price decreases at a slower rate and people will know in advance. The prices won't crash at speed in this situation because the current owners in majority aren't the crafters competing with eachother and are current owners who would want their money back or to keep their vehicle during the no-drop month.

if they were realy worth 2000 ped or more the price would have stayed there

the price drop because no one wanted to buy them at 2000 peds

for me i wouldnt pay 2000 ped for a choper than it will be gone later on they were made for PVP decay
do you think MA make more money poeple selling at 2000 or 500 peds there more poeple are going to used them at lower value and going to mount gun on them

the only complaint are the poeple that baught them at high price and the poeple that taught they strike it rich whit the bp

the way i see it here

poeple only want a limited supply send a message to ma to only make 20 of them the stop making them

This is completely wrong. I barely saw any gungnirs on auction for more than a day at a time before the massive influx. They sold easily, it's just people like you who wouldn't buy at that price and so assume others wouldn't.


>>>> Money DOESN'T grown on trees. And it also DOESN'T in Entropia.
If things appeared out of thin air in the real world then NOTHING would have a value.
These items literally appeared out of thin air and only retain some value because they aren't in unlimited quantities.
 
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And MA started the crash. One and only. It is human nature to panick and sell up stock if a situation changes for the worse. But this change in the amount of items was a decision by a human being in an office. In my opinion it's just wrong. There shouldn't be anybody playing god with real money, the role of politicians irl and national banks are to keep the economy stable and their money at a high value. The only ones that don't do this are the corrupt ones who don't care about their people. If you would like to compare this way then there is your answer - MA is a corrupt (virtual) government. Take Zimbabwe as an example, corruption in their leadership caused their currency to become worth less than 50 pence for 10 billion zimbabwean dollars.

Now to everybody who is saying "the trader decides the price" and let me make this point very clear.

A baker in Zimbabwe has the ability to sell his bread at any price he wants to. But he has to keep up with the economy so if he wants to make 20p for a loaf he would sell at 4 billion zimbabwean dollars. If the currency is worth less then he HAS to sell for more if he wants to make enough money to buy grain to make another loaf. Now this would be slightly different in EU since it's items not currency but the concept is the same.
If suddenly thousands of choppers flooded into the market, there is suddenly more of this item 'currency' which devalues it all. Once again, in the Zimbabwe situation i'd be able to get more money for fewer items, in EU it's more items for fewer money but it works the same.
Because there are more it means it is harder for crafters to sell them. This is what makes the price drop by a hundred or so peds each time a new auction is made. Crafters could still sell at the higher price but they wouldn't make the sales and only because of the increased numbers introduced by MA. MA know the market prices, they know what will happen to prices depending on how they run things. It is 100% the fault of MindArk for this price drop.

If you're suggesting that crafters could have created an agreement not to sell lower than a certain price then this is actually illegal so no the crafters have no power over competition.

--------

Oh and just to add on:

When there is going to be a change in real life it is annonced often months and sometimes years before it happens. This gives people time to make the sales they need and is fair for everyone. The situation with MindArk is that these things happen instantly with no warning whatsoever.

The real life situation here means people can plan, people who want to wait the extra months get the lower price and people who want them now have the opportunity to still pay more. The price decreases at a slower rate and people will know in advance. The prices won't crash at speed in this situation because the current owners in majority aren't the crafters competing with eachother and are current owners who would want their money back or to keep their vehicle during the no-drop month.



This is completely wrong. I barely saw any gungnirs on auction for more than a day at a time before the massive influx. They sold easily, it's just people like you who wouldn't buy at that price and so assume others wouldn't.

if the crafters actually sold the choppers for 2k peds the price would not go down.. was the same with some crafted faps a few years ago.. how can this be MAs fault? just because MA makes it possible to do it doesnt mean that the crafters has to do it.. if someone need cash and sells one for lower should not ruin the whole economy around the item.. but ppl seem to panic and sell out everything they have as soon they see someone doing it..

take akoz and his 2 dante BPs.. what do you think will happen when another BP dropps? I believe that akoz will buy that BP to keep his monopoly.. why not do that with the chopper BPs? because it aint worth it.. because ppl know that the bubble will pop around choppers any day now.. and this might have been it.. as I have said.. MA want everyone to own vehicles.. same with tp chips.. so for investment it is a high risk trading with vehicles.. atleast now when the price is slowly setteling.. would be better to invest in them in a year or two when we know more.. the ones who is buying now and have bought before either want to be one of the first to own one.. or take the high risk investment..

this apply to almost every new item.. and I think it is a good thing.. because it sets a MU on the item for the others who dont want to play around with our money in that way.. MA didnt tell how many BPs would drop.. so it was a very high risk imo to buy one for the crasy prices that have been going on latley. playing around with any crafted item is a high risk imo.. because I and many more ppl know that crafters usually can sell their crafted stuff cheaper to get back their money faster.. or that more BPs can start dropping any minute... and with that follows a wave of panic from ppl who dont understand that if the items they own will rise in value again if the items is actually worth it.. if its just a hyped price (like the choppers) then its another thing.. if you dont like the rules then why play?
 
take akoz and his 2 dante BPs.. what do you think will happen when another BP dropps? I believe that akoz will buy that BP to keep his monopoly.. why not do that with the chopper BPs? because it aint worth it.. because ppl know that the bubble will pop around choppers any day now.. and this might have been it.. as I have said.. MA want everyone to own vehicles.. same with tp chips.. so for investment it is a high risk trading with vehicles.. atleast now when the price is slowly setteling.. would be better to invest in them in a year or two when we know more.. the ones who is buying now and have bought before either want to be one of the first to own one.. or take the high risk investment..

Or maybe it's because they don't actually get sold at all and the crafters prefer to keep them.
 
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