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FYI: The Definitive Character Luck study

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I dont use bigger weapons, as I cant afford their losses. Id play for an hour a week with my numbers! :ahh:

Even though my skills far outclass my equipment at this stage, I use a Loughlin Cutter 1 UNL, An amped Breer P2a, An Isis CB5 unamped, and Shogun. The Breer or the CB5 can be finishing weapons, depending on the sliver of health left.

With my dodge the Shogun only serves to replace a FAP by reducing damage done by mobs when/if they hit me.

At any rate, I also stick to Snables, Bibos, etc.
 
actually, argos are a good mob to hunt since they drop a good amount of iron and eye oil. plus most items are TT food so you get that ped back right away. you do however need to do longer runs on them to get the loot to balance out. as for yellows, they dont have any more than any other mob and probably less than the small mobs like exas/snables. and they give good skills too.

i think you should consider tracking your individual hunts. if you dont have excel then you can download open office, its free. there are several example spread sheets people have posted or if needs be i can send you a template of mine. sometimes you might have the feeling your doing poorly, but looking at the real numbers you see your not as bad as you thought. one issue i see with tracking cost with just ped card+inventory is that all the little costs that are not hunt related get mixed in. auction fees, tools, bp, clothes, armor application, etc, all that nickel and dime crap MA takes from you.

one thing you can change right now, is dont use your shogun on small mobs. for easy mobs use no armor or pixie. that shogun decay more with its added protection. at the very least you can convert pure amor decay into fap decay which gives you skills.


one more thing, when you cycle the looted ammo during your hunt you lose track of it. it should be counted as ammo AND loot in you hunt expense. the ammo in loot is a trick of MA's to get you to spend more right away. it seems we get about 10-15% ammo in a hunt, so if your cycling that back into the hunt thats 10% your not see at your ped card.
 
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Shapememory said:
actually, argos are a good mob to hunt since they drop a good amount of iron and eye oil. plus most items are TT food so you get that ped back right away. you do however need to do longer runs on them to get the loot to balance out. as for yellows, they dont have any more than any other mob and probably less than the small mobs like exas/snables. and they give good skills too.

i think you should consider tracking your individual hunts. if you dont have excel then you can download open office, its free. there are several example spread sheets people have posted or if needs be i can send you a template of mine. sometimes you might have the feeling your doing poorly, but looking at the real numbers you see your not as bad as you thought. one issue i see with tracking cost with just ped card+inventory is that all the little costs that are not hunt related get mixed in. auction fees, tools, bp, clothes, armor application, etc, all that nickel and dime crap MA takes from you.
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I dont use the auction house as I havnt the quantities of items yet I want to sell at, Ive had the same FAP for almost 3 weeks now (thats how little I use it), havnt had to fix my armor yet (its still green on every piece). So far the nickel and diming literally has been weapon related!

Ive even tried to be eco with my weapon choice, buying an UNL weapon in order to save on eventual auction markup fees, as Ive anticipated quite a few hunts with this particular piece of equipment. I was able to get it for a song, at +60PED, which overall isnt that much considering after less than 20 hunts the weapon has already paid for itself in markup %. I felt this was a better investment, given the weapon eco of 2.8 as opposed to the EnBlade-A at 2.7, and the extra 2 points of damage do seem to make combat a little quicker.

Ive got Excel. But what are you suggesting I track? That I tally up the value of each loot as it comes in, and compare it to my weapon decay? Thats quite a bit of recording for Combibo, dont you think?
 
Magyar Republic said:
Ive even tried to be eco with my weapon choice, buying an UNL weapon in order to save on eventual auction markup fees, as Ive anticipated quite a few hunts with this particular piece of equipment. I was able to get it for a song, at +60PED, which overall isnt that much considering after less than 20 hunts the weapon has already paid for itself in markup %. I felt this was a better investment, given the weapon eco of 2.8 as opposed to the EnBlade-A at 2.7, and the extra 2 points of damage do seem to make combat a little quicker.
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Eeek, what's your hit/damage on that weapon? Unlimited non-SIB weapons have far worse hit/damage than Limited SIB weapons unless your profession levels are very high.
 
Its UNL SIB.

My hit/damage is 10/10

I have another really nice UNL SIB sword if I can ever afford to start using it. Beautifully crafted Kilic Vass :)
 
just try tracking hunt expenses

say you want to do a 100 ped hunt. so ammo/sword decay is 100, then add armor, fap, amp decay,(this is total hunt decay) subtract that from your loot, and you get a net hunt +- number. divide your total loot by the hunt decay( first calculation) and you get a return %.

my sheet has following columns: notes, date, mob/location, ammo, weapon decay, amp decay, armor decay, fap decay, hunting loot, hunt decay, hunt delta, and hunt return %. for my decay columns i use a format where i just put in the begin and end numbers and the sheet calculate the delta for me.

i just track TT value, so to get total loot you throw everything at end of hunt in the TT(BUT DO NOT SELL) to get the total loot value. decay values you need to note the hunt begin and end value on whats decaying. it takes a little prep before and after a hunt, but then you know exactly whats going on and where your ped is going.

great thing about having a UL weapon is you can just charge it up for how you you want to hunt, it doesnt have to be 100% TT to use.
 
Yep. In all honesty this is nothing different than what Im doing now.

Many of these issues are not factors in my overall hunting experience, as I generally can go 4 weeks or more without having to repair my armor, and I dont have to FAP. High dodge comes in handy for low cost hunting. :)
 
I think your calculations must be way off.
With something like the Cutter 1 you would need around 200 hours to cycle though 15k, the other weapons you mentioned do not make cycling easier.
Maybe use the EU hunter tool to track your runs.

Also maybe take those 6k MU from the Kilik Vass and the remaining TT of at least 3k into your "where are my PEDs gone" calculation, do the same for the Cutter1.

With your levels it sounds absolutely fishy to have such an return, even with swords.
At higher level when one cycles more, it can happen that one has no global within 10k cycled, which is more likely to be a sign that one hunts prefectly eco and efficient. Below level 20 I would sent a support case.

edith: Also do not forget to have those 25% for the bank loans calculated into your equation and that the mobs you hunt do not need dodge but evade.
 
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WoenK said:
I think your calculations must be way off.
With something like the Cutter 1 you would need around 200 hours to cycle though 15k, the other weapons you mentioned do not make cycling easier.
Maybe use the EU hunter tool to track your runs.

Also maybe take those 6k MU from the Kilik Vass and the remaining TT of at least 3k into your "where are my PEDs gone" calculation, do the same for the Cutter1.

With your levels it sounds absolutely fishy to have such an return, even with swords.
At higher level when one cycles more, it can happen that one has no global within 10k cycled, which is more likely to be a sign that one hunts prefectly eco and efficient. Below level 20 I would sent a support case.

edith: Also do not forget to have those 25% for the bank loans calculated into your equation and that the mobs you hunt do not need dodge but evade.
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I said I cycled 15000 peds. Not that I spent 15000 peds. :) I have spent more. Youre assuming too much with a 6k markup on the Kilik. I assure you I did not pay 6k markup, or anywhere close to that! The Kilik is an investment in my character, one which I had hopes of using, but one where the purchase cost was low enough compared to long term trends I stood to make a profit off of selling, should the time come to do so. Of course with my performance using this blade would be beyond silly!

Regardless, there is a currency value correlation I had made in previous posts, and I apologize if my shorthand has not made the distinction clear between currency values and raw expenditures.

So you think I should submit a support case given my characters abysmal performance? I thought about that, but what would be my actual valid game mechanic concern? Seems to me theyre getting money, which is what the system is meant to do. I dont see why they'd be interested in helping me.

And what do you mean "bank loans"? That last paragraph makes no sense!

Oh sorry....evade/dodge. Bad terminology on my part. I have 2170 melee evade. My dodge is a whopping 8.
 
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Magyar Republic said:
I said I cycled 15000 peds. Not that I spent 15000 peds. :) I have spent more. Youre assuming too much with a 6k markup on the Kilik. I assure you I did not pay 6k markup, or anywhere close to that! The Kilik is an investment in my character, one which I had hopes of using, but one where the purchase cost was low enough compared to long term trends I stood to make a profit off of selling, should the time come to do so. Of course with my performance using this blade would be beyond silly!

Regardless, there is a currency value correlation I had made in previous posts, and I apologize if my shorthand has not made the distinction clear between currency values and raw expenditures.

So you think I should submit a support case given my characters abysmal performance? I thought about that, but what would be my actual valid game mechanic concern? Seems to me theyre getting money, which is what the system is meant to do. I dont see why they'd be interested in helping me.

And what do you mean "bank loans"? That last paragraph makes no sense!

Oh sorry....evade/dodge. Bad terminology on my part. I have 2170 melee evade. My dodge is a whopping 8.
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You said, you had quite some stuff at the bank about 2 pages earlier. I do not know of a bank that loans for free and they all have a maximum term of a month, meaning you must redeem the tiem and get a new loan. You pay the fees everytime you do that.

The system is not meant to be that expensive as you describe it.
If you lose around 10 PEDs per hour, that would be the average, which would be already way above the normal 6-7 PEDs per hour for your level.

With that evade, you must have chipped in. Return rate is also a bit skill related, there is a possibility that you might have screwed your avas yin-yang.
Also, how do you know your ava is destined to fight with swords ?! :D
I enjoy hunting and still, my ava is way better in crafting :D
 
I chipped in initially, but have since tapered off quite a bit. Evade was one of the skills I chipped in at, paying a monstrous 63 PED for 1.5k ish skill increase! I also chipped in Longsword and damage, but noticing decreasing returns on my level stopped and have since gained over 1k points in each on my own. I didnt chip at all for other skills, as they simply were not worth the cost. My chip in totals are less than 400 PED. Ive also viewed these as an investment, as I am projecting Longsword will be in higher demand once RockTropia and Next Island are released, which seem to explore the more traditional MMO fantasy mindset. Buy low, sell high. Use them while you have them, cheaply.

Bank is another poor term. Bank is synonymous with storage IMO, as the banks in this game are more like Pawn Shops, and Im not about to touch those!

I did start to think about avatar yin-yang, but to be frank if your skills define your luck, well, that seems a bit flawed, does it not? It stands to reason that an avatar over time will gain more in skills they use than in skills they do not, thus destroying the balance, and making avatars as they progress in life progressively more unlucky. It also in a way proves my theory, that luck is a static number assigned to your avatar, and is in no way "dynamic."
 
Magyar Republic said:
I chipped in initially, but have since tapered off quite a bit. Evade was one of the skills I chipped in at, paying a monstrous 63 PED for 1.5k ish skill increase! I also chipped in Longsword and damage, but noticing decreasing returns on my level stopped and have since gained over 1k points in each on my own. I didnt chip at all for other skills, as they simply were not worth the cost. My chip in totals are less than 400 PED. Ive also viewed these as an investment, as I am projecting Longsword will be in higher demand once RockTropia and Next Island are released, which seem to explore the more traditional MMO fantasy mindset. Buy low, sell high. Use them while you have them, cheaply.

Bank is another poor term. Bank is synonymous with storage IMO, as the banks in this game are more like Pawn Shops, and Im not about to touch those!

I did start to think about avatar yin-yang, but to be frank if your skills define your luck, well, that seems a bit flawed, does it not? It stands to reason that an avatar over time will gain more in skills they use than in skills they do not, thus destroying the balance, and making avatars as they progress in life progressively more unlucky.
Click to expand...

One thing that has been officially admitted is, that loot gets generated partly because of the skills of the looting ava, Anything else are rather unproved theories. From my own experience I had some real bad times after chipping in. There might be some balance in skills that should be preserved and it could be that due to your inbalance the system tries to work it out again and instead of loot you get more skills.
Also it might be, that avas that concentrated in one single profession might have longer bad periods in that profession but then hit a bigger one to even it out again. In short terms it could be that you could even out with a crafting or a mining run.
On an average of about 500k cycled you could get the 90% in one profession, but most rather try if they are lucky somewhere else.

Also unless you are using an finisher that fits exactly you might overkilling, which is again too much decay spent. Melee is not something I would recommend for starters and unless you have insiders information, it might not even be that suitable for Rocktropia and Next Island.
 
Magyar Republic said:
...With my dodge the Shogun only serves to replace a FAP by reducing damage done by mobs when/if they hit me.

At any rate, I also stick to Snables, Bibos, etc.
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dodge doesn't help against non ranged mobs, i think you might mean evade...?

and with only snabs, bibos, etc and shogun, there really should be no reason to waste fap decay at all anyhow (unless you are of the "decay contributes to loot" conspiracy crowd)
 
Magyar Republic said:
I chipped in initially, but have since tapered off quite a bit. Evade was one of the skills I chipped in at, paying a monstrous 63 PED for 1.5k ish skill increase!
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you may have a lot of evade, but what level Evader are you? it's about the profession level, not the # skills. Lots of things go into the proffession level
 
If you have your Kilic Vass maxed I would like to see you do a 1 or 2 week log on drones with it like i did with the bicak kek.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/hunting/176160-project-bicak-kek-vs-drones.html

Use at least 300ped of decay on the sword per day and track each of the things that I tracked. You could even use the Spreadsheet template that I started using towards the end of the log to make the tracking as near identical as you could.

The things tracked were, Blade decay, Armor/plate decay, fap decay, TT of loot, TT of Stones looted, and TT of stones looted X 125% (you can really get 130-135% for them)

Track these for each hunt and post them allowing people to analyze how you are doing. (maybe you need to tweak your armor or fap usage or something like that)

Record your skills before you start and after you finish the project.

I think you would be surprised at how well it turned out for you.


narfi

ps. If you trusted me enough I would be willing to match whatever you did with your sword afterwords for comparison.
 
Magyar Republic said:
Yep. In all honesty this is nothing different than what Im doing now.
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So then if you're already doing what Dante is talking about, you should be able to add up your total TT value spent and your total TT value received. Divide the total received by the total spent and you get your TT return rate.

If you indeed have bad luck, this is the number to look at.

I'm sitting at about 93% when you total everything I've done since mid-October. Narfi's project had him coming in at 90.21% when it was over. Those numbers are fairly par for the course. If you come in at something like 70% after say 5000 ped, I will tell you that you sir indeed have bad luck... though you seem more intent on trying to prove that you have bad luck instead of doing a well thought out experiment...
 
narfi said:
If you have your Kilic Vass maxed I would like to see you do a 1 or 2 week log on drones with it like i did with the bicak kek.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/hunting/176160-project-bicak-kek-vs-drones.html

Use at least 300ped of decay on the sword per day and track each of the things that I tracked. You could even use the Spreadsheet template that I started using towards the end of the log to make the tracking as near identical as you could.

The things tracked were, Blade decay, Armor/plate decay, fap decay, TT of loot, TT of Stones looted, and TT of stones looted X 125% (you can really get 130-135% for them)

Track these for each hunt and post them allowing people to analyze how you are doing. (maybe you need to tweak your armor or fap usage or something like that)

Record your skills before you start and after you finish the project.

I think you would be surprised at how well it turned out for you.


narfi

ps. If you trusted me enough I would be willing to match whatever you did with your sword afterwords for comparison.
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Im down to do this once my card evens out a bit, or I deposit again. I'll let you know.

On a positive I had a good run last night. Best run I have ever had ingame. Still 0 globals, but honestly these are combibos. :) Lots of skill gain, a decent amount of loot, and a single loot pull with over 1000 oil. I have never seen anything like the numbers I got last night before. Who knows what caused it, but the difference between last night and every other night is like night and day. I had to save up for a week before to get 2700 animal oil. I got twice that yesterday evening, plus a good assortment of other sellable loots. If this was how entropia had been playing for me even half the time prior, I would have had an overall PED loss still, but nothing to complain about!
 
Couple points:

1. I too was cursed. I didn't global in my first year, and I didn't hof until my 2nd year (although back then, the hof list only went to top 30.) Nowadays, I'm averaging about 2 hofs a day.

2. Chasing hofs is ridiculously easy actually. The way the loot system works is that you get ~90% back of what you spent, +/- 10%, on average. Every so often, this return is multiplied by X. X varies from 2 up to around 36,000. Therefore, the more you spend per kill/click/drop, the more often you will hof. The reason why people hof so often on oa 101's, proterons, levi, dasps, or CND mining is simply because they're spending 10-50 ped per try, and their loot multiplier is much smaller than what is needed to hof on an argonaut. This does not necessarily mean they profit, however.

3. So, there are two reasons (besides luck) why you are not globalling/hofing.: 1) you aren't spending enough per try, and 2) your play style is giving you fewer chances to do so. Last night, I was killing levi next to another player. I was killing 3X as many as they were in the same amount of time. I globalled twice and hof'd once. That wasn't because I was lucky, it was simply because I killed 10 and they killed 3.

Don't feel bad about your losses. I've had some spectacularly bad runs too, like 2k ped spent on cnd with a 25% return, or a 5% return on a 2000 ped crafting run.

If all you want to do is global, my advice is buy a simple 1 conductors bp, click full quantity until it's 20 qr, and then switch to full condition. I can almost guarantee you'll global within 200 ped.
 
u should find out what determines how lucky one can get , everyone knows that its not totally random as the game is man made.
 
"E" for Effort

I will actively be watching this thread. I have been playing since pre-gold and have had just shy of 20 globals/ HOFs since I started playing. I have deposited well over $1000.

Since VU 10 < I have not scored 1 global and have been losing peds like they were going extinct. I am quite pissed because I feel they changed (obviously) some variables in the game that threw off my mojo.

I guess the biggest mystery is why I continues to voluntary lose money LOL. The game is fun to play, but my patience grows thin.

Gentoo
 
Though I think it's interesting, isn't the design flawed? Globals/HoFs per hour is meaningless, as I think some people have hinted at. To truely control for all the variables involved, you need to have each player hunt one particular species (or a certain number of creatures) and graph their Hofs + Globals per Number of Creatures killed...

6 Globals per 1000 Daikiba Killed

That is the only way. Number of hours doesn't matter because someone may be killing Proterons while others hunt Chirpys. In addition all equipment needs to be identical and, as someone mentioned above, skill level too.

That would be a definitive study.

Sorry if this has been pointed out, skipped most of the thread :ahh:
 
I believe the most important variable to measures is this:

  1. return rate = ped from loot / (ped from all costs of decay and bullets and/or bombs used) x 100
  2. % profit per avatar at same time and cost of activities (it can be positive or negative)

But I believe other variables are important too, like this:

  1. minimun amount of bullets or bombs needed to reach average return rate
  2. minimum amount of bullets or bombs needed to reach first global (per mob)
  3. number of globals each "X" thousand of "Z" mob killed
 
Marcaine said:
Though I think it's interesting, isn't the design flawed? Globals/HoFs per hour is meaningless, as I think some people have hinted at.
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Imho, you don't need to check globals/hofs at all to calculate "luck." Simply get the average loot and then keep track of the ones where the multiplier is over say 20. For example, basic filters is 5 pec per click. Once in a while, you get a 5 pedder. That's a 100X multiplier, which would be a global on any monster with ~500 hps or more, and a hof on any monster with 1000 hps or more. While there may be individual variance, with enough people, it should be exactly equal.

Also, this study seems to ignore # of chances. Someone who does 100 bery per hour is far more likely to get a bigger multiplier than someone who only does 2 prots per 24 hours.
 
In contrast to some opinions, global/HOF per hour I believe is very meaningful. How many players have been concerned with noob ATH/HOF over the last few months? Players who play little time, and still get extreme results play a large part in measuring sheer luck as opposed to effort itself, as the observed trend in my own society is players who have a history of globals tend to continue to get globals. To give an example, I started playing at the same time roughly as another society mate - his rate of globals has been at least 2 per day since he started activities other than sweating. Whether mining, hunting, or even crafting he has consistently had good enough results that he has not had to fund his character at all. This luck continues into this week, where on Monday he scored a whopping 11 globals.

Other names in my society regularly global in similar suit, a player who gets 3 globals per week tends to continue this trend, and players who get 0 well... they continue, roughly, to get 0 and complain about it, celebrating small globals if and when they occur during the month.

The amount of globals one player accumulates have been enough to make me want to turn off society chat at large, simply to maintain my own morale.

While profit is another way to measure this, I am intentionally tracking the global/HOF trend of players as a rough starting point, and will continue to do so. Such a tactic eliminates economic hunting as a variable, and focuses in on a single, core value.

With that being said, no study is perfect. If someone wishes to track raw numbers as money gained vs spent, this data could also contribute to an overall number set, although economics can be planned and manipulated. "Gifting" or "Luck" if present, in theory cannot be.
 
Magyar Republic said:
While profit is another way to measure this, I am intentionally tracking the global/HOF trend of players as a rough starting point, and will continue to do so. Such a tactic eliminates economic hunting as a variable, and focuses in on a single, core value.
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That does not eliminate economic hunting as a variable. If we spend an hour hunting each and I kill 500 mobs and you kill 100, then I'm 5 times more likely to global/hof than you are. That's 400 more chances.

If you were to track global/hof per # of kills, that MIGHT be a little better. But even then if we weren't hunting the same creatures the numbers would be skewed.
 
Magyar Republic said:
I started playing at the same time roughly as another society mate - his rate of globals has been at least 2 per day since he started activities other than sweating. Whether mining, hunting, or even crafting he has consistently had good enough results that he has not had to fund his character at all. This luck continues into this week, where on Monday he scored a whopping 11 globals.

Other names in my society regularly global in similar suit, a player who gets 3 globals per week tends to continue this trend, and players who get 0 well... they continue, roughly, to get 0 and complain about it, celebrating small globals if and when they occur during the month.
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What did they global on? My guess is that it wasn't Exas and Snables. How much did they spend? What was their overall TT return? If you want to global, you need to spend money, and spend it on things that global. I'm a firm believer that each person's overall TT return rate is approximately the same. Those that disagree usually don't track their returns and expenses. Because I believe there is a "payback" mechanism in the game, people that are globaling are just getting back money that they have already spent. No one profits in TT value over time, and globals are NOT an indicator of profit.

While profit is another way to measure this, I am intentionally tracking the global/HOF trend of players as a rough starting point, and will continue to do so. Such a tactic eliminates economic hunting as a variable, and focuses in on a single, core value.
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The "core value" you need to be tracking (which I've tried to explain to you) is your TT return rate. It has absolutely nothing to do with profit or what you do with markups. It purely tracks what you spend in TT value versus what you get back in TT value. Globals/HoFs per hour means absolutely nothing without taking into account money spent, mobs hunted, weapons used, amount of bombs dropped, or widgets crafted (and whether or not it was on quantity or condition).

Because you're choosing to not track this information, your "definitive" study does not "define" anything at all. I was really looking forward to the results from this too. You seem like a pretty smart guy, so I figured this would be a good study to follow. Pity... :(
 
I had thought to type something here that really highlighted the derision I feel the previous post has at its core.

But I chose not to. Because its pointless to do so.

http://www.numeraire.com/download/WhatIsCircularReasoning.pdf
Basic Theme of Arguments.
http://www.ramdac.org/fallacies.php?fallacy=Red Herring
"It purely tracks what you spend in TT value versus what you get back in TT value."
http://www.ramdac.org/fallacies.php?fallacy=Appeal to Ridicule
"You seem like a pretty smart guy, so I figured this would be a good study to follow. Pity..."

Svenn said:
That does not eliminate economic hunting as a variable. If we spend an hour hunting each and I kill 500 mobs and you kill 100, then I'm 5 times more likely to global/hof than you are. That's 400 more chances.

If you were to track global/hof per # of kills, that MIGHT be a little better. But even then if we weren't hunting the same creatures the numbers would be skewed.
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For Svenn - I am. My hunters and I all hunt the same level of mobs, and use the same caliber of weapons. The central assumption here I think youre digging at is we dont know how long a player hunted vs actually sat there and chatted, so we cant accurately chart expenditures based on time online.

This is true. However Im operating on the assumption that players are online to play the game, and not online to chat. Chatting is much better done in IRC, or via instant messenger. These folks are aware of that. Besides, if we wanna talk we will just go to the bar and grab a few beers!

So Im assuming we are all online doing stuff central to the project, more or less. I think Im safe in this assumption. There's no need to document givens, IMO. Its just excess paperwork!
 
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Magyar Republic said:
In contrast to some opinions, global/HOF per hour I believe is very meaningful. How many players have been concerned with noob ATH/HOF over the last few months? Players who play little time, and still get extreme results play a large part in measuring sheer luck as opposed to effort itself, as the observed trend in my own society is players who have a history of globals tend to continue to get globals. To give an example, I started playing at the same time roughly as another society mate - his rate of globals has been at least 2 per day since he started activities other than sweating. Whether mining, hunting, or even crafting he has consistently had good enough results that he has not had to fund his character at all. This luck continues into this week, where on Monday he scored a whopping 11 globals.

Other names in my society regularly global in similar suit, a player who gets 3 globals per week tends to continue this trend, and players who get 0 well... they continue, roughly, to get 0 and complain about it, celebrating small globals if and when they occur during the month.

The amount of globals one player accumulates have been enough to make me want to turn off society chat at large, simply to maintain my own morale.

While profit is another way to measure this, I am intentionally tracking the global/HOF trend of players as a rough starting point, and will continue to do so. Such a tactic eliminates economic hunting as a variable, and focuses in on a single, core value.

With that being said, no study is perfect. If someone wishes to track raw numbers as money gained vs spent, this data could also contribute to an overall number set, although economics can be planned and manipulated. "Gifting" or "Luck" if present, in theory cannot be.
Click to expand...


If I could modeling the game, i would not draw on global or hof per hour. If not in a decent rate of return, that let recycle the money enough to have happy people in the game. I've gotten in the game over 400 global, and believe me mean nothing more than the amount of money that a player put in the game. Almost always the globals serve only to give back the bullets, but never returned the decay of the equipment (weapons, armor, plates, amplifiers, fap). The HOF will return the decay of the weapons and amplifier. And only the uberloots give you more money to continue playing the game. Thus the rate of return is the most important for the hunter.

I think that the globals are the awards on the work done. And believe me it is better that globals will be asigned according to the skills of the players. For a newbie should not be important obtain globals between his results, if not the rate of return obtained allow it to continue growing in the game, for some day be worthy of the awards of distinction as globals.

Surely one of the major flaws of the current game is to ignore the skill and knowledge of the players who already have some time playing the game. Every newbie should first pay the rent of floor on that is walking (like it is in the real life). So, i think is better that you follow-up rates of return obtained as main variable, and in second place then measures the globals/HOFs per hour earned by each of the avatars of your experiment. ;)
 
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Xavier_Jr said:
If I could modeling the game, i would not draw on global or hof per hour. If not in a decent rate of return, that let recycle the money enough to have happy people in the game. I've gotten in the game over 400 global, and believe me mean nothing more than the amount of money that a player put in the game. Almost always the globals serve only to give back the bullets, but never returned the decay of the equipment (weapons, armor, plates, amplifiers, fap). The HOF will return the decay of the weapons and amplifier. And only the uberloots give you more money to continue playing the game. Thus the rate of return is the most important for the hunter.

I think that the globals are the awards on the work done. And believe me it is better that globals will be asigned according to the skills of the players. For a newbie should not be important obtain globals between his results, if not the rate of return obtained allow it to continue growing in the game, for some day be worthy of the awards of distinction as globals.

Surely one of the major flaws of the current game is to ignore the skill and knowledge of the players who already have some time playing the game. Every newbie should first pay the rent of floor on that is walking (like it is in the real life). So, i think is better that you follow-up rates of return obtained as main variable, and in second place then measures the globals/HOFs per hour earned by each of the avatars of your experiment. ;)
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Hey Xavier,

Respectfully, I agree with the majority of what youre saying. However the rate of return players experience is a little bit of a red herring at this level of play. Unfortunately its a red herring that alot of folks seem to have bought into, as this games main focus is about rate of return vs expenditure.

The games focus however is not the focus of the study! So folks might be getting a little confused! :)
 
Magyar Republic said:
Hey Xavier,

Respectfully, I agree with the majority of what youre saying. However the rate of return players experience is a little bit of a red herring at this level of play. Unfortunately its a red herring that alot of folks seem to have bought into, as this games main focus is about rate of return vs expenditure.

The games focus however is not the focus of the study! So folks might be getting a little confused! :)
Click to expand...


I will wait the results of your study. And then comment again. If you show that one player gets the higher rate of return or more Hofs than the others, then you have proven that the avatars do not come with the same luck to the game. ;)
 
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