Question: Unreal Engine 5 Vulkan

[Angel O2 Mercer]

Question for the dev team: Have you considered using Vulkan for the new game engine?

Pros:

• Massive performance advantage (when I say massive, I mean it)
• More modern rendering pipeline
• Native Linux support
• It seems UE5 already supports it
• Free marketing since not many games are using it yet

Cons:

• Newish tech, maybe there's some problem I'm not aware of.
• Vulkan is a lower level API
• Probably harder to find talent experienced in Vulkan than in OpenGL or DirectX

Notice though that 2 out of the 3 cons I've put are really a non-issue since UE5 encapsulates the API so you dont need to worry about it.


I ask this question because there's many people worried about the new system requirements and we have huge performance issues with the current engine. I'm not advocating for one or the other, I'm just curious if you have atleast considered it.

Thank you.

@Ludvig|MindArk

 

[M Rufen Power]

I may take a prolonged hiatus if the new requirements stop me from logging into the game.

 

[jetsina]

If the new requirements stop me from playing, then obviously something will have to happen to reenable me. The question is what?
Can you tell us more about what Vulkan is - and why it brings advantages over a straight UE5?

Why would performance be improved and would it also affect minimum requirements? Is Linux support going to be likely anyway when the move to EU5 happens, or would the probability be much improved via whatever this Vulkan thing is?

 

[Angela Draniie Cloud]

Cause they have a deal with Epic Games who paid them some good ass money to use Unreal Engine 5 lmao

 

[Angel O2 Mercer]

Cause they have a deal with Epic Games who paid them some good ass money to use Unreal Engine 5 lmao

Vulkan is just a graphics API like DirectX or OpenGL, it's not a different game engine (or a game engine at all).

Unreal Engine 5 supports Vulkan, your answer makes no sense to me sorry.

 

[Angel O2 Mercer]

If the new requirements stop me from playing, then obviously something will have to happen to reenable me. The question is what?
Can you tell us more about what Vulkan is - and why it brings advantages over a straight UE5?

Why would performance be improved and would it also affect minimum requirements? Is Linux support going to be likely anyway when the move to EU5 happens, or would the probability be much improved via whatever this Vulkan thing is?

Sure, it has many performance advantages and would mean lower system requirements for sure. Do a quick youtube search for performance comparisons if you want, I think there's some games which came with both DirectX and Vulkan implementations (RDR2 and Saints Row I think?).

Linux/Mac support comes native with Vulkan since it's an open source API, unlike DirectX which is from microsoft.

If Entropia Universe is the car and Unreal Engine 5 is the engine (of course), then Vulkan would be like using high performance engine parts instead of regular ones.

I'm just asking, I think UE5 will work well regardless.

 

[jetsina]

Thanks. So, still trying to understand somewhat, but hopefully, like in "I, Robot", I'm asking the right questions.
I gather you have to write your own code differently depending on what API is going to 'communicate' with the graphics engine? Does that mean that you need to get yourself Vulkan-capable programmers anyway for a properly fast Linux version, but then you wouldn't need ones who know about DirectX, as UE5 under Windows understands Vulkan too anyway somehow?
What's the 'lower level' bit? Is it anything to do with the instruction set capabilities, thus potentially missing out on anything?
Do different APIs for the same communication have different RAM requirements, or is that more an engine specs thing?
Is that where different Linuxes have an advantage too, by being able to choose more what to load actively into RAM in comparison to Windows?

No expectation of answers, but nice if they come when peeps have time. I'll try and find a few comparison vids, as suggested. Thanks!

 

[DrGirlfriend]

Cause they have a deal with Epic Games who paid them some good ass money to use Unreal Engine 5 lmao

Quite the opposite ma paid a snit load to use ue5, unreal doesn’t give a hoot about MA

 

[Msturlese]

In my humble gamer opinion, graphic interface has nothing to do with game mechanics

wow, siablo immortal, lost ark games have similar graphics as Entropia already, they got 100x (or 10.000x ) player base because drop over unit so progress is easy

 

[Nick Seventia]

Vulkan is just a graphics API like DirectX or OpenGL, it's not a different game engine (or a game engine at all).

Unreal Engine 5 supports Vulkan, your answer makes no sense to me sorry.

I'm not really sure what you are referring to with the post as a whole, UE5 supports BOTH DX12 and Vulkan and does not require any change in code at all to run either, optimisation for Vulkan/DX12&OpenGL is done as just that, Optimisation.

As it currently works with pretty much all current games the graphics API can be swapped at any time in the game menu (If you have a Vulkan card it's usually set by default to this encoding and vice versa for DX12.
And at this point most of the actual optimisation of games for AMD (Vulkan) cards and DX12/OpenGL (Nvidia) are released as graphics drivers for the cards themselves.

So as long as you run the most recent drivers the game would run optimally.


And as for anyone that is worried about being able to run the game, you don't need to be.
UE5 runs miles ahead of the for the lack of a better word 'ABSOLUTE ATROCITY' of Cry2 Engine.
To put it into perspective.

My setup:

RTX 3070 (8Gb)
Ryzen 7 3700X (8 Core / 3.6Ghz)
32Gb Ram


This setup has issues running Entropia above 100 Fps, I can run any of the most recent titles at usually over 150+ Fps at 1440p and maxed out graphics.
This is mostly due to the shaders/lighting in the game being extremely poorly optimised and most people can turn of Shaders and shadows and gain huge amounts of performance.

TL;DR:

UE5 will make your game run much better in general, there might be some really old cards that won't run UE5 at all, but as long as your card isn't 12+ years old I cannot imagine anyone having any issues.




Bonus fact about UE5 optimisation:

Unreal 5 uses a newly created asset-loading which reduces the amount of polygons used for objects that are at a certain distance away so that the system does not undergo such heavy load when you are out in open world areas, this system is automated and built in to the engine itself and will greatly benefit Entropia for example as trees, mountains, grass and other objects and terrain will de-load themselves as they are no longer in plain view or far enough away from the player.

 

[Angel O2 Mercer]

I'm asking if they have considered it, if we'll be able to use it as an option, if it will be enabled by default or if this has been discarded completely.

Vulkan is not an AMD vs. Nvidia choice, both support it.

 

[Mika]

Quite the opposite ma paid a snit load to use ue5, unreal doesn’t give a hoot about MA

not true as developers who wish to use ue5 get deals in form of contractors from Epic Games.

i think what draniie might mistake with it is the deals epic games give inhelping starting crestors with the programs they have going with both funding, aid in development, and free publishing etc as well as really great deals when it comes to selling their stuff. Epic games pour hundreds of millions out of pocket for that. But that does not reach established developers who will only get development aid with the transition to the engine etc.

as for performance im not sure why people worry. Like sev touched on. Its a damn beast of an engine. And the game were it is currentøy live were it was ue4 and went to ue5 it saw a performance increase across a vast majority of systems.

And a general message for most.

if you have a system and hardware that is 10 years old. Ill do the douchebag thing and say what everyone wants to but no one seems to want to say. Get a new fucking system, stop wasting your money on entropia and prioritize for one damn fucking second lol. GPU and hardware prices have been stable again for nearly a year now.. which is a shit excuse if your system is so fuck damn dated that the recent times wouldnt have mattered anyways… how you play eu currently is a miracle as cryengine is so bad it cant get worse. No matter the new engine youll have to play on hyper safe potato mode regardless, but ue5 will be a increase in performance unless your crepid system is so old it should be in national history museum anyways and just isnt compatible with anything nor was compatible with anything for the past 6 years.

yes there are engines that still would work on ancient hardware but for christ sake, but if you cannpt afford upgrades for your pc, maybe, just MAYBE not throw the money you have at entropia as a first priority when you know you need things like hardware upgrades.

Tldr ue5 runs better than cryengine on setups that are not older than time. And like real life has shown us were ue5 was inplemented instead of ue4, it saw a good perofmance INCREASE for older systems.

 

[Angela Draniie Cloud]

if you have a system and hardware that is 10 years old. Ill do the douchebag thing and say what everyone wants to but no one seems to want to say. Get a new fucking system, stop wasting your money on entropia and prioritize for one damn fucking second lol.

Buy new shit you cheap old sons of bitches XD

 

[DrGirlfriend]

It’s

I'm not really sure what you are referring to with the post as a whole, UE5 supports BOTH DX12 and Vulkan and does not require any change in code at all to run either, optimisation for Vulkan/DX12&OpenGL is done as just that, Optimisation.

As it currently works with pretty much all current games the graphics API can be swapped at any time in the game menu (If you have a Vulkan card it's usually set by default to this encoding and vice versa for DX12.
And at this point most of the actual optimisation of games for AMD (Vulkan) cards and DX12/OpenGL (Nvidia) are released as graphics drivers for the cards themselves.

So as long as you run the most recent drivers the game would run optimally.


And as for anyone that is worried about being able to run the game, you don't need to be.
UE5 runs miles ahead of the for the lack of a better word 'ABSOLUTE ATROCITY' of Cry2 Engine.
To put it into perspective.

My setup:

RTX 3070 (8Gb)
Ryzen 7 3700X (8 Core / 3.6Ghz)
32Gb Ram


This setup has issues running Entropia above 100 Fps, I can run any of the most recent titles at usually over 150+ Fps at 1440p and maxed out graphics.
This is mostly due to the shaders/lighting in the game being extremely poorly optimised and most people can turn of Shaders and shadows and gain huge amounts of performance.

TL;DR:

UE5 will make your game run much better in general, there might be some really old cards that won't run UE5 at all, but as long as your card isn't 12+ years old I cannot imagine anyone having any issues.




Bonus fact about UE5 optimisation:

Unreal 5 uses a newly created asset-loading which reduces the amount of polygons used for objects that are at a certain distance away so that the system does not undergo such heavy load when you are out in open world areas, this system is automated and built in to the engine itself and will greatly benefit Entropia for example as trees, mountains, grass and other objects and terrain will de-load themselves as they are no longer in plain view or far enough away from the player.

not true as developers who wish to use ue5 get deals in form of contractors from Epic Games.

i think what draniie might mistake with it is the deals epic games give inhelping starting crestors with the programs they have going with both funding, aid in development, and free publishing etc as well as really great deals when it comes to selling their stuff. Epic games pour hundreds of millions out of pocket for that. But that does not reach established developers who will only get development aid with the transition to the engine etc.

as for performance im not sure why people worry. Like sev touched on. Its a damn beast of an engine. And the game were it is currentøy live were it was ue4 and went to ue5 it saw a performance increase across a vast majority of systems.

And a general message for most.

if you have a system and hardware that is 10 years old. Ill do the douchebag thing and say what everyone wants to but no one seems to want to say. Get a new fucking system, stop wasting your money on entropia and prioritize for one damn fucking second lol. GPU and hardware prices have been stable again for nearly a year now.. which is a shit excuse if your system is so fuck damn dated that the recent times wouldnt have mattered anyways… how you play eu currently is a miracle as cryengine is so bad it cant get worse. No matter the new engine youll have to play on hyper safe potato mode regardless, but ue5 will be a increase in performance unless your crepid system is so old it should be in national history museum anyways and just isnt compatible with anything nor was compatible with anything for the past 6 years.

yes there are engines that still would work on ancient hardware but for christ sake, but if you cannpt afford upgrades for your pc, maybe, just MAYBE not throw the money you have at entropia as a first priority when you know you need things like hardware upgrades.

Tldr ue5 runs better than cryengine on setups that are not older than time. And like real life has shown us were ue5 was inplemented instead of ue4, it saw a good perofmance INCREASE for older systems.

Unreal only does deal like that with small indie studios.

I would bet my left tit that unreal has paid zero dollars or benefits to MA and MA is in fact paying a lot for this engine

 

[Mika]

It’s


Unreal only does deal like that with small indie studios.

I would bet my left tit that unreal has paid zero dollars or benefits to MA and MA is in fact paying a lot for this engine

Unreal Engine is free. So MA did not pay a single dime for it*

*Companies using Unreal Engine 5 that earn over a set amount, iirc its a flat 1 million USD annual i think, will have to pay a royalty fee.


This means, anyone can download it, use it, work with it, play around using it, and as long as you dont make more than the gridded amount set you wont have to pay epic games a single dime for using it still That includes companies of any size, but most companies who make bigger games or MMO's quickly do make more money and as such will have to pay royalty Which is also not that much all things considered when you compare it to other engines that actually do cost a metric load of millions to just use, let alone the consultant hours and other costs tied to them

 

[DrGirlfriend]

You also assume MA is not paying unreal massive amount for support? They are for sure hiring in help from the unreal tram to learn the engine

Also ma brings in more than 1m a year and this is paying those fees as your quote states.
Their net profit does not matter UE only cares about gross

 

[M Rufen Power]

Buy new shit you cheap old sons of bitches XD

I just bought myself a subscription with GeForce Now, but that's for Steam games. If EU needs more hardware to play, it'll have to be Shadow at £30 P/M.

 

[DrGirlfriend]

This game will run smoother than cry engine when it has EU5. No one will need new hardware, in fact you may be able to use your previous generation of hardware if you really want to. UE5 is amazingly efficient.

Think of it this way, Cryengine is toy snowball gun efficiency and UE5 is impk2 efficiency.

 

[jetsina]

EU could in some ways be seen as a sandpit for making (or not making) informed choices, but also a sandpit for misinformation, half-truths, self-deception and simply being wrong sometimes.
The ability to actually discover the truth yourself has declined in EU as areas have been made restricted, skill requirements have increased and various additions have been made too rare for self-discovery (unless lucky). We can't be experts everywhere, even when generally pretty competent.

No one will need new hardware

I guess my question is thus: does anybody run any UE5 environments on Win10 with just 4GB RAM and onboard (shared-mem) graphics? That's not an ancient setup, it's just a low-end laptop setup for non-intensive stuff. It normally uses just 10-25 Watts - and runs EU. There may be people out there who are off-grid (but with Internet), or who often move around.
It may be icing on the cake to also find out comparisons of APIs at this low end, or people who use Linux and UE5 - and Vulkan.
I watched one vid with a higher level comparison (where one rides a horse a lot and tries to redeme oneself), and the RAM use was higher for Vulkan, but setups, threads, cores etc. make things harder and harder to compare I guess.
Thanks

 

[DrGirlfriend]

EU could in some ways be seen as a sandpit for making (or not making) informed choices, but also a sandpit for misinformation, half-truths, self-deception and simply being wrong sometimes.
The ability to actually discover the truth yourself has declined in EU as areas have been made restricted, skill requirements have increased and various additions have been made too rare for self-discovery (unless lucky). We can't be experts everywhere, even when generally pretty competent.

I guess my question is thus: does anybody run any UE5 environments on Win10 with just 4GB RAM and onboard (shared-mem) graphics? That's not an ancient setup, it's just a low-end laptop setup for non-intensive stuff. It normally uses just 10-25 Watts - and runs EU. There may be people out there who are off-grid (but with Internet), or who often move around.
It may be icing on the cake to also find out comparisons of APIs at this low end, or people who use Linux and UE5 - and Vulkan.
I watched one vid with a higher level comparison (where one rides a horse a lot and tries to redeme oneself), and the RAM use was higher for Vulkan, but setups, threads, cores etc. make things harder and harder to compare I guess.
Thanks

Yes just download a (non entropia) ue5 demo yourself and run it you’ll see it works amazingly well

keep in mind every demo you see is usually at max graphics thus using more resources than if it was set at a lower setting, but lower settings don’t get eyeballs in engine demonstration