Weapon calculator

[Gargamel]

I made a small tool for comparing weapons and estimating economies with current skills.

Main differences with wiki economy is that this tool shows minimum damage, your estimated damage and has an customizable miss % range.

tool is at: http://weapcalc.ogre-online.com/

Adding your own weapon selection and skill levels requires registering (which I tried to keep as simple and quick as possible)

I hope this tool helps. Feedback and bug reports are welcome.

 

[mrproper]

tool is at: http://weapcalc.ogre-online.com/

No comment as it is pretty good. Do a little graphic theme and you are all set. First post, fist hit, grats!

 

[Fanor]

Limited

Doesn't think the calculations are correct since limited weapons can't be repaired.. Should calculate the dmg/pec based on the % the weapons are averaged on auction or something..

 

[Nakia]

nice work

 

[kygon]

a very nice 1st post +rep for one of the most usfull 1st posts Ive seen

 

[helena]

very nive tool ty !

 

[Kerham]

am i the only one who thinks this is wrong?

when we shoot, are involved some skills. only MA can give an equation of which is the avg dmg at certains skills...

and unamped opalo, maxed out, with 30% misses .. avg dmg 3.8? lol

how he calculated? what equation he used?

 

[Gargamel]

am i the only one who thinks this is wrong?

when we shoot, are involved some skills. only MA can give an equation of which is the avg dmg at certains skills...

and unamped opalo, maxed out, with 30% misses .. avg dmg 3.8? lol

how he calculated? what equation he used?

My calculations may just as well be incorrect and there still may be some bugs in the system (just let me know what you find and I will try to fix them). The tool tries only to estimate average damage since I dont know the actual formulas.
But heres a little breakdown on what it does:

skills might affect something beyound these formulas, but I basically use hard numbers from the weapons info. hit ability and actual minimum damage shown on weapons.


avg dmg= (minimum damage+maximum damage)/ missavgvalue * shots per second
In this formula minimum damage is what is shown in the weapon.

missavgvalue used in above formula is calculated from miss% settings. Example: 50%=4, 10%=2.22 , 0%=2). That means that at 0% misses the value will be actual average, otherwise its bit watered down by the miss %.

miss% is looked from miss% settings by the hit ability. for example: 5.0 hit ability and settings of 50%-0% misses would give miss% =25% etc..

Unamped opalo maxed out with 30% misses shows 2.8 avg dmg for me, which seems correct (4+8)/2,8*,667=2,8 .
I'm curious where you saw the 3.8 value (there could be a bug).

Theoretical maximum for unamped opalo would be around 5.33 (with no misses and if it would always hit with maximum damage).

All feed back and improvement ideas are welcome. Thanks to Fanor for good idea on (L) weapons. I will try to implement that in the next upgrade.

 

[Nebu]

Nice site, I have seen the link on the other Forum over a week ago. Didnt notice it being posted here too, so I also wrote the link in another thread, slap me if you want
I havent noticed any mistakes in the damage calculations, the only thing I have concerns about is the miss probability on different Hit Abilities. Did you do some testing on those, or was it just guessed values?

 

[Gargamel]

I havent done actual testing on the miss% range. Thats why I made it user definable. Everyone can use the miss% range they feel is correct.

Default values: 50% at 0/10 and 10% at 10/10 are guessed, based on my experience in hunting (made it to proficient laser/blp sniper before quitting).
I also suspect that target affects miss % to some degree, but I had no data/proof to implement that in the calculator.

There is also a possibility that hit ability is somehow curved or that some hiddens affect it.

 

[buckaroobanzai]

I was fiddling around with the tool yesterday, and I was wondering why you decided to have the dam/pec/sec figure only as a reference figure for eco. I found that to be quite misleading, wouldn't it be more appropriate to quote dam/pec?

Take care,
BB

 

[Kerham]

i dont understand miss range.

and how must be completed this field?


Miss% 0/10:x 10/10:x NO MISSES

for tt weapons, ha and ca are 10/10, for rest is exactly same value for all lasers (2.5 in my case) and exactly same value for all blp (1.9)

so, for a given weapon, u have one hit ability. so, on solomate opalo, which is maxed out, what should i put at 0/10? i was at 0/10, not anymore what relevance has? also what should i put at 10/10?

meaning that i take it that "miss" means missed shots. i take it that with opalo, i have ~10% of all shots missed. where should i put that 10%?

also, is not taken in account the criticals

 

[Gargamel]

I was fiddling around with the tool yesterday, and I was wondering why you decided to have the dam/pec/sec figure only as a reference figure for eco. I found that to be quite misleading, wouldn't it be more appropriate to quote dam/pec?

I decided to add /s into it to get more indication of weapons speed into the number.
I'll add dam/pec eco value there too to make it more comparable.

 

[buckaroobanzai]

I decided to add /s into it to get more indication of weapons speed into the number.
I'll add dam/pec eco value there too to make it more comparable.

Thanks for the good job. I'd +rep u again if I had not already done it

Take care,
BB

 

[Gargamel]

and how must be completed this field?
Miss% 0/10:x 10/10:x NO MISSES
....
so, for a given weapon, u have one hit ability. so, on solomate opalo, which is maxed out, what should i put at 0/10? i was at 0/10, not anymore what relevance has? also what should i put at 10/10?

meaning that i take it that "miss" means missed shots. i take it that with opalo, i have ~10% of all shots missed. where should i put that 10%?

those fields configure the miss% range used in calculations. No misses link puts 0 into both values and eliminates any misses from calculations.

for max out opalo 0/10 miss% value doesnt have any effect since that opalo would use the 10/10 value for calculations. 10% misses would go to 10/10 part.
If you have other weapons, say at 2.5/10 ability, then 0/10 would come relevant for them.
for example if 0/10 would be 50% then 2.5 HA weapon would use miss% value of 40% for calcuations.

miss% values set the range of miss% starting from no ability to maximum ability.

I hope this helped,

for tt weapons, ha and ca are 10/10, for rest is exactly same value for all lasers (2.5 in my case) and exactly same value for all blp (1.9)

yes, it would be easier logical to enter them by weapon types instead entering hit abilitys per weapon since I think all non TT laser carbines have the same ha values for a player. Does anyone know if (L) weapons follow this pattern too?

also, is not taken in account the criticals

I've been planning to implement this in the future versions. Not yet sure how I'll do them. It'll be propably similar system to current miss% range.

 

[buckaroobanzai]

player. Does anyone know if (L) weapons follow this pattern too?

At least some (L) weapons have a skill bonus similar to TT items (e.g. Breer P1a if I remember correctly).

BB

 

[Kerham]

Korss L behaves exactly like opalo, i.e. maxed out etc.

Ok, I understood, but still...

If I am at 2.5 hit ability, i should put how was at 0/10? And how i woul suppose would be at 10/10? That seems... guessing

 

[KASSAD]

nice job
but something looks strange, I'll try to explain it in english ( )

I tried to compare 2 weapons & one was my good old opalo , where ofc I have 10/10

when I compare with a "normal" rifle, with a lower HA & CA, ofc again, the difference shown on the right in % is the same with or without skills

I guess we become more economical when we get skills, even if it's not a lot... don't u think so??


But, dude, I won't complain, u did a good job
and maybe I didn't understand correctly the stats, if so, forget my post...

 

[Gargamel]

I decided to add /s into it to get more indication of weapons speed into the number.
I'll add dam/pec eco value there too to make it more comparable.

Tried to add this field quickly and to bit of my suprice, when calculated from average damage dmg/pec values were very close to dmg/pec/sec values (only few fractions of the pec difference here and there).
so basically the dmg/pec/sec value can be treated as average dmg/pec indicator . I'll recheck this later incase I made some mistake. (lunchbreak at the moment)

 

[Gargamel]

If I am at 2.5 hit ability, i should put how was at 0/10? And how i woul suppose would be at 10/10? That seems... guessing

Its partly guessing but you can make an educated guess on how opalo behaves at 10/10. Since we dont know what all hidden skills might possibly do to misses I would go with the same 10/10 miss% value as in 10/10 opalo for all weapons.

Since this tool is more for comparing weapons than showing your true exact economy its basicly all the same what the miss% values are. It uses same miss% range for all weapons and puts weapons in the same line, trying to make them more comparable.
Economy values can be treated as rough estimates since there are propably many variables ingame which cant ever be put into these calculations.

 

[Gargamel]

I tried to compare 2 weapons & one was my good old opalo , where ofc I have 10/10

when I compare with a "normal" rifle, with a lower HA & CA, ofc again, the difference shown on the right in % is the same with or without skills

I guess we become more economical when we get skills, even if it's not a lot... don't u think so??

sounds like somekinda bug, but I wasnt able to reproduce it.
Private me with more details (which 2 weapons and what were your mindmg and hit abilities for them and which fields showed same % values)

 

[steffel]

i must say i like the tool. +rep

some adjusting i would recommend:

* dont seem the health regeneration of mobs is taken in account.
e.g: opalo is always the cheapest choice (cost to kill) compared to katsu honor, this is true no doubt on corn young but maybe false on a trox pro.
--> okay, might be hard to code but having the time to kill a mob, there could be a modifier for mob's hp according to the time used to kill it. like every 10 seconds needed to kill a mob their hp increase by 5% of basic hp?

* overkills are not taken in account.
e.g: opalo with 104 is cheaper than with 102 or so on a chirpy young. both use one shot to kill, but the 104combo costs more per click then 101combo.
--> okay, useless comment because after one played for at least one week you should have understood to finish with the cheapest (per click) choice and dont go for chirpy youngs with fat weapons

 

[Gargamel]

* dont seem the health regeneration of mobs is taken in account.

good idea, this might be pretty easy to implement. I'll look into it.

* overkills are not taken in account.

I dont think this modification would be too usefull overall since, as you said, most players know that its economical to finish with cheap weapons.
Also players use different weapons for finishing and might use finishing weapon for more than the 'last shot'.

 

[majorputty]

Good work mate
+ rep

 

[Gargamel]

Tool is updated. Some bugs squashed (and sorry for any inconvinience caused by broken creature cost function yesterday)

Creature kill cost calculations now take 5%/20seconds regeneration into account (hopefully correctly), updated weapons data, some new filtering options and other tweaks.

 

[mrproper]

Tool is updated. Some bugs squashed (and sorry for any inconvinience caused by broken creature cost function yesterday)

Creature kill cost calculations now take 5%/20seconds regeneration into account (hopefully correctly), updated weapons data, some new filtering options and other tweaks.

If you add that, how about the overkill? The last shot will averagely divide up to a subunit of the average damage. And that is lost, the cost is not fully rewarded so you can take the average damage, and divide the mob hp, after regen, and take out the part of the last shot that is wasted and complete the eco calculations.

Example: Shoot/slash a snable young, 19.5 damage, the snable has 20 HP, you then have to shoot again, do 19.5 damage again, but use only 0.5 damage to finish the mob, the 19 part is lost. Since it makes 48% something of the total cost to kill the mob, it will show a bad eco. And it's true, you can't expect a good eco when using a marber on snables.

 

[steffel]

If you add that, how about the overkill? ....

read 3 posts up yours, mister

 

[mrproper]

read 3 posts up yours, mister

Sorry, I tried to read all the posts but I missed that.

Overkill MUST be added. You have no ideea what an extra shot in 5 can do, that can alter around 10% of the eco, so instead of a max damage eco of 4, you have 3.6 wich is total rubbish. And maybe with another weapon, the mob gets more HP back, but the overkill is smaller and the eco is better than say 3.6 above mentioned value.

 

[Gargamel]

I've been thinking about how to implement overkill for some time but haven't had a good enough idea yet.

I wouldnt add overkill to actual ECO values since overkill depends on creatures HP (I think overkill with 2k health creature is pretty meaningless compared with 50hp creature). ECO is damage/second based while possible overkill value would have to be dmg/shot based (this would mean more calculations and complexity ).
Also creature might not be selected in the tool which would mean there is no 'target' HP available to calculations.

All experienced hunters know about overkill and tool does show total cost per shot (= maximum amount of overkill).

One possible idea to implement overkill would be adding a extra column into creature costs. for example:
creature hp=50, weapon X has avg.dmg/shot=20 and cost per shot=10.
Killing creature with weapon X would result in 2.5 shots on average which would leave 5pec overkill potential .

WEAPON Y with same creature but avg.dmg/shot=40 and cost per shot=20 would show overkill potential 15pec.

I'm not sure this value would help out in estimating overkill?

 

[Foreman]

Gratz ! for this interesting toll.

make new versions with more coll stuffs