What's the problem with re-selling?

[Vizir]

After a few days playing I still can't get my head around why people seem to hate re-selling so much.

Whats the big deal about it?

 

[jjmatrix]

One of the reasons is the fact that resellers are keeping prices higher than normal for everyone. Also, at higher levels, when large investments are available, they can (and do) manipulate prices for rare items.

 

[Tango]

Come back to this thread after a few years of playing,....Then you'll understand, but for now you are a noob as we all were at one time.

 

[sob]

Inflation.

 

[Witte]

Most people just hate manipulators, and in EU jargon reseller became a synonym for that.

 

[Ace Flyster]

There is a subtle difference here that people often forget to mention

There are those who buy and the resell instantly back on auction for a lot more, for a quick buck

There are those that buy all of the items to corner the market and the resell for quick profit

These are bad resellers

There are also GOOD resellers for example lebannor, who buys all ores from miners and resells to crafters. There are MANY people like this who have the contacts to be able to run a quick effiecent business and actually helps players a lot!

So not all resellers are bad!

Rgds

Ace

 

[Witte]

There is a subtle difference here that people often forget to mention

There are those who buy and the resell instantly back on auction for a lot more, for a quick buck

There are those that buy all of the items to corner the market and the resell for quick profit

These are bad resellers

There are also GOOD resellers for example lebannor, who buys all ores from miners and resells to crafters. There are MANY people like this who have the contacts to be able to run a quick effiecent business and actually helps players a lot!

So not all resellers are bad!

Rgds

Ace

An ethical question, what is worse: getting mad because you do not get the toy you want, or trying to make a buck off a video game.

For me, the first is worse, as he lets greed determine his behavior. The second just does what (almost) everyone does.

 

[Ace Flyster]

An ethical question, what is worse: getting mad because you do not get the toy you want, or trying to make a buck off a video game.

Fair point, the resellers as i quoted before are bad "in my opinion" and the good ones are "good in my opinion"

But unless people can come up with a counter argument to mine i will keep that opinion. Other than they are here to make money

Rgds

Ace

 

[Zilly]

I've seen a lot of hater/lover threads about resellers and I'll admit that for a while reselling was a part of my earnings in PE/EU. The auction used to be different from how it is now. You could sell items for only a 1ped placing fee no matter how high you'd sell it for. This resulted in many people selling almost everything on the auction. The thing was that in the old days there wasn't an ingame "Market Value" on items. There was a site/still is, PE-Auction where you could check the latest sales on the auction on that specific item, however the prices weren't always 100% correct and not everyone took the effort on checking the value of the items they wish to sell. In those days I saw a lot of crazy stuff. I saw an Eon Helm M go on the auction for TT+1k when it was priced at +8-9k. Ofc a reseller whom was just a second faster than me got that helm and sold it the same night for the real market value. I had several of those deals and they made it possible for me to keep playing the game on a decent level without having to deposit tons of RL money.

However I ALWAYS sold my items at the marketprice, sometimes the BO was a couple of peds higher then the real value but that's the point of the BO. I don't got actual numbers on how much money I made, don't think I ever made as much money as high-end resellers. I made enough to pay for a hunt every night considering that could cover my losses.

I never really considered myself a reseller, I always preferred the name "Trader" since that's what I'm good at. Making fast decissions, checking prices, looking for potential customers. It's a part of the RL world and a part of Entropia as well. If you can't handle that you got a serious problem cause it will probably never change.

However it's always easy to blame these so called resellers, but you can also blame the ones that pay the high prices and also create the "higher" market values. Resellers/Traders are a part of the ingame community that in a strange way keep Entropia Alive, ofc there are exceptions and some resellers are somehow extreme, I'll admit that there are some we'd be better of without but isn't that the case with a lot of stuff?

Anyway I hope my post made some of you thinking about this subject and my apoligies if I offended anyone.

Sincerely,

Zilly

 

[Corrie]

After a few days playing I still can't get my head around why people seem to hate re-selling so much.

Whats the big deal about it?

Consider this, a hunter needs a new weapon(insert profession and item as you wish its all the same) he goes to buy this weapon, but someone has bought it, this person has no intention to use it. Haha he says to the hunter, now you have to buy it from me for an extra 10ped, but thats 1k of ammo says the hunter, that could be the difference in having a successful or unsuccessful hunt. Tough i got it first even though i don't need it except to make money off people who want to skill, do you want or not says the scumbag reseller. Now repeat this everytime you need an item. Get it now Vizir?

 

[Matho]

Because they can make profit when everyone is losing around?

and yes, i dont like them too.

 

[Sweat]

Because they can make profit when everyone is losing around?

and yes, i dont like them too.

Without resellers, when you go on a small hunt, and come back with a small amount of oils and hides, nobody would buy it but the TT. Without them, big name crafters would have to spend a while buying small amounts on the street/ auction.

<edit> Was hoping people would have some sense to realize I'm not talking about your post...
I'll quote this then...

There is a subtle difference here that people often forget to mention

There are those who buy and the resell instantly back on auction for a lot more, for a quick buck

There are those that buy all of the items to corner the market and the resell for quick profit

These are bad resellers

There are also GOOD resellers for example lebannor, who buys all ores from miners and resells to crafters. There are MANY people like this who have the contacts to be able to run a quick effiecent business and actually helps players a lot!
Ace

Things may cost more, but that means, your hunts may end up profitable or not. When you loot some Shadow, and the markup is around 600 PED, you'll start feeling bad.

And I don't understand when you say:
BAD: Buying stuff off street, selling on auction
GOOD: Buying stuff off street, selling to other

The fact is....
Crafters buy off auction... did you know that?

And most people buying ores and enmatters are just gathering large amounts and putting on auction anyways.


Just my two pecs. (Let me check if I have any left...)

 

[Mandy]

There are also GOOD resellers for example lebannor, who buys all ores from miners and resells to crafters. There are MANY people like this who have the contacts to be able to run a quick effiecent business and actually helps players a lot!

To me that's trading or providing a service. He is therefore a trader or service provider, both of which are fine and serve a useful purpose.

However, reseller is basically a dirty word in EU, and I would therefore rethink what you call him.

 

[~CHOPPER~]

An ethical question, what is worse: getting mad because you do not get the toy you want, or trying to make a buck off a video game.

For me, the first is worse, as he lets greed determine his behavior. The second just does what (almost) everyone does.

I don't see any ethical issues with wanting to making a buck in EU?? after all MA does advertise the potential of making cash in the virtual world...it's a different issue if someone is manipulating the market or hording rare items to jack up prices.
It takes a lot of time and money to make peds in reselling and reselling is not without risks as well

 

[silentmado]

As a miner, some good traders make my life easier by buying my little amounts of ore that i can't put in auction. So i can go back faster for mining

 

[Matho]

post deleted, lot of misunderstanding

 

[Tree-doctor]

What zilly said on first page is... very true and a very smart way to run a living into PE. My english is too bad that i cant explain it better than he did in this post.

 

[Kiriku Surgun]

Trading and reselling are about similar or exact the same. It is good, they provide a service and they should make a profit out of that.

Basicly the only problem in trading/reselling is market manipulation
Happens also irl on a small and bigger scale, it is illegal though

It can cause great damage and unfair competition

 

[demonseedgfx]

No big deal. In Entropia some call it reselling in real life its called business. Its the same thing really. Some folks just dont like seeing the high prices on items they want, but I can bet they like the high prices on the items they sell when they craft, loot or mine them.

 

[mastermesh]

hmm..

This topic seems to come up about once every other month...

True "resellers" as you call them are not so good because they purposefully inflate market values.

Bargain hunters that just look around for cheap stuff to sell in there shops/shopkeepers/booths like I do are another sort of seller all together. We help make things cheaper, and our actions actually lower the market value on things... kind of shoot ourselves in the foot sometimes if we buy too cheaply actually since we cause market value to drop to a point where we can't make profit due to needing to pay for our own overhead (taxes, shopkeeper decay, maintanence fees, etc.).

All forms of reselling are not too easy... and take a lot of work to figure out what market trends are happening. Sometimes the risks are worth it, othertimes, things don't work out and we end up with no profit, a loss, or having to hang on to something for way longer than anticipated since market value dropped below the prices we paid.

The one true reseller is Mindark. They control the economy. In many ways, shops, booths, and shopkeeper owners have a major problem in that they are competing with the auction. It might be interesting if one of the new planet owners decided to keep auctions off of their planet... Then a true economy could develop. It'd be more like the real world - if you want a bargain you go looking for it.

 

[Auktuma]

But let me also react on your imaginations:
big crafters buying small amounts on street.....lol, I have seen Auktuma many times on street buying 10 zinc ingot from reseler who actually offered lowest price
From time to time Ive seen him also as he bought few peds of lyst even if he didnt need them, but price was low

Dear Matho, you don't need to spread rumours. I don't buy things what I don't need even if price is lowest (my friends could tell you that I've rejected many times to buy items at TT) and not the lowest price is meaning for me. Furthermore, I try to avoid contacts with resellers. Do not support them. I like just several fair traders. One of my principles: any work done, any service you ask from some one should be paid. By money or by service you could offer in return. Those who know me closer could tell that I never accept offers at TT value - always pay above.
I use ordering system and usualy my orders are highest, at times even higher than current markup value. Really I wish to pay MA - provider of the media we live and enjoy - and trust they will use that money to bring system to more entertaining. If reseller will get that money - I see no progress with that... I know well what work should be done to get ores and trying to do my best to support mining. I buy materials in auction from my friends even if they have not cheapest buyout. Sure just when I see that - have not much time for detailed browsing of auction. And sure if I have need for material.
Peace, Matho, I know I'm not hurry to bring info about me, so there are many rumours... My fault it is too with what you say

We could be angry for we have resellers, we could be not happy we have too many traders, but it's objective, nothing to do with it. People have no information about market values, about market tendencies, about demand, about who offers what and who needs what, people don't like to waste time on exchanging items/materials to money so people search for others who could offer that service. Some people ask high for their service (on purchase they ask higher discounts or on sell they offer prices close or even above market) and others ask lower or even happy to serve having no profit. Until some one taking their service they got life.
I should say that until we will have problems on distributing goods in EU - we will have resellers/traders. I wish MA could introduce some AI what could help with distribution and what could reduce community expenses for exchange service. Thanks for ordering system so much - that was so huge help and thanks so much for information on market activity and values on each item in game. I have no doubts they have many more options for future to improve our life.

/auk

 

[Auktuma]

After a few days playing I still can't get my head around why people seem to hate re-selling so much.

Whats the big deal about it?

The main thing is because it makes our life more expensive - we need to pay for additional service, trading service. Or because of resellers do trick market and so we could not get what we need so easy. Should pay them just for "please let us...".

 

[Ime]

Dear Matho, you don't need to spread rumours.

I think he was beeing sarcastic, but I may be wrong

 

[Mr Trayles]

One of the reasons is the fact that resellers are keeping prices higher than normal for everyone. Also, at higher levels, when large investments are available, they can (and do) manipulate prices for rare items.

The people who buy at the higher prices are the ones that raise the price. It always amazes me that people don't get this. It's called a free market and the price is set by both supply and demand. When demand is high, the price can go up. People want to believe that resellers are manipulating the market by reselling at a higher price when all they are really doing is recognizing that the market price is below demand.

Manipulation of the markets is different and should be discussed as such.

 

[Matho]

Dear Matho, you don't need to spread rumours. I don't buy things what I don't need even if p
/auk

That was sarcasm.
Dont get it wrong. I used your name only because your are one of best crafters ingame - to show that big name crafters, as was said in previous post, dont buy on street low amounts
Srry, for misunderstanding

 

[Rotrap]

no problem

Actually resellers are good for an economy. They help to stabilize prices. They buy when the price is going down, and help prevent the price from falling too much, and they sell when the price is higher, which help prevent the price from spiking as much. They act as levelers.

 

[DoubleWolf]

Actually resellers are good for an economy. They help to stabilize prices. They buy when the price is going down, and help prevent the price from falling too much, and they sell when the price is higher, which help prevent the price from spiking as much. They act as levelers.

And also consider the people that loot an item and put it on auction for only 1 day. Chances are, the end user wont even get a chance to see this listing, but you can be sure that the auction zombies will. So they'll bid on the item and then re-list it for 7 days with a fair buyout and make a few peds off it. The real service resellers provide is the ability to list an auction for a longer period of time. If everyone would list auctions at longer periods of time with fair buyouts, this wouldn't be an issue.

But then there are the people that list buyouts for far more than the market value. It's then up to the buyer to decide if they want to buy for that price. If everyone only bought for fair market value, people wouldn't list auctions with much higher buyouts. But since there is a sucker born everyday, there are people that will try to take advantage of that. I can't blame the reseller for that. It's the buyer's responsibility to know what they are buying. Again, if people only bought at market value, there would be no incentive to list items at higher prices...

 

[Auktuma]

That was sarcasm.

90% of readers don't know my way and won't get your "sarcasm". See what section the thread is posted on. n00bs Corner. I think it should tell you something. Think on who to you post your message and think about goals before posting. If that will be help or harm.
(PM sent)

 

[Sweat]

There are those who buy and the resell instantly back on auction for a lot more, for a quick buck

There are those that buy all of the items to corner the market and the resell for quick profit

These are bad resellers

There are also GOOD resellers for example lebannor, who buys all ores from miners and resells to crafters. There are MANY people like this who have the contacts to be able to run a quick effiecent business and actually helps players a lot!

This is what I was trying to quote, but think I quoted wrong.
And still, I thought that you could make the connection that maybe I had made an error, or that I was simply referring to a totally different post.

I'm saying that Auction zombies, as Auktuma calls them, are useful. Like another said before, if you list something at 100%, and there aren't resellers, chances are, you won't get the price you wanted.

lol Sweat, I really dont know where in one sentence that I wrote you was able to red all that you have reacted on

Wasn't talking about that one comment... look up please.

But let me also react on your imaginations:
big crafters buying small amounts on street.....lol, I have seen Auktuma many times on street buying 10 zinc ingot from reseler who actually offered lowest price
From time to time Ive seen him also as he bought few peds of lyst even if he didnt need them, but price was low

Well, saying I've seen this... I've seen that, not exactly the best way to be sarcastic.

Now let me jump over that Shadow story and lets go to : Crafters buy off auction... did you know that?
naaah, reallyyyy

Lets go little further:
And I don't understand when you say:
BAD: Buying stuff off street, selling on auction
GOOD: Buying stuff off street, selling to other
loool, let me remind u what I wrote:
Because they can make profit when everyone is losing around?
You was probably picking up characters and making your own sentences here, because I dont see I told something you have reacted on, again

Its better to not to put words you want to hear into others mouth.

And yet again, I don't really care about your comments..
I just wanted to point out that resellers have a purpose.
But I guess I accidentally forgot to quote somebody.

 

[Norbert]

Resellers.Traders i have no problem with they make a small % and keep ped flowing through the game, but price manipulators (some of which are old players) imo are scum.