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Loot related to the cost of the kill - Eco goess out of the window!

AxeMurderer

AxeMurderer

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Wand AxeMurderer Silva
What I mean is what if the loot is related to the total cost of the kill. If your decay and ammo spent is bigger the loot goess bigger too.
So the beggest noob can take the most un-eco gun, go there overkilling and the loot he gets will rise to compansate for that. If this is the case it takes out the fun of choosing your weapon carefully. Also it means that all expensive uber eco weapons are overpriced and dont cost more than TT+2.

EDIT: I didn't use the word "Theory", but the post is moved to "Loot Theories" and I'll get some "love" for sure.

I personaly don't believe it, but just something to think while hunt.
 
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I totally disagree. You have probably never used eco gun :wise:
 
So basically playing like a dumb@$$ will net more loot than not playing like a dumb@$$. I am sorry, I don't buy it.
 
As said just above me....

Try it for yourself and see the returns, it really, really helps by using eco weapons....
 
I dont think so either, if you hunt eco then you will get ~90% return but if you hunt Uneco you will have a 200ped run like one of the badest runs u ever done..

Had a cpl of testruns with uneco guns and eco guns and i lost 60%~ on the runs with un eco guns...

BUT you allways pay your hof or so..
consider HOF as a bonus tbh :)
 
It wont work if you try to loot stuffs with MU at a regular base.
Maybe it works for a short periode of time if you just had deposite and MA want to give you some sugar
and fool you by rigging the loot.
 
Loot is more likely related to the HP taken from the Mob : Original HP + a portion (still to be determined) of its regen' HP.
Profiting with eco setup has been proven for years by not depositing people.

A very simple test: kill one thousand Snabby Male young (HP: 30) with a tiered 10 CB28 + Dante...
 
I was asking becouse I was doing 50 PED hunt on zombies with opalo and got 70% return
next day I do 50 PED hunt on zombies on the same spot with Kinetic Attack Chip I (L) and my decay is huge but my loot got up to 96% not counting the chip decay.
Well with your replies I see that it is just coincidence that my loot got bigger after I hade more decay on the chips.
 
Truth is no one knows. You are in the wrong place to ask that question. Who will tell you "it is like this" or "it is like that" is full of shit.

In my opinion, eco of an item is not as relevant as other aspects related to that specific item and a specific avatar and place where you plan to use the toy.


And at that person who said
R4tt3xx said:
So basically playing like a dumb@$$ will net more loot than not playing like a dumb@$$. I am sorry, I don't buy it.
Click to expand...
Well.. playing like a dumb@$$ payed off way too many times to be so convinced you can ignore the option. People did some strange tests with opalo and E-amp15 and results were... interesting.
 
AxeMurderer said:
What I mean is what if the loot is related to the total cost of the kill. If your decay and ammo spent is bigger the loot goess bigger too.
So the beggest noob can take the most un-eco gun, go there overkilling and the loot he gets will rise to compansate for that. If this is the case it takes out the fun of choosing your weapon carefully. Also it means that all expensive uber eco weapons are overpriced and dont cost more than TT+2.
Click to expand...

I think the market being the way it is for such a long time goes some way to show your theory to be incorrect.

I've been doing some tests recently (not public data yet) using different weapons on large molisks and my average loot has stayed the same, only my costs have fluctuated.

I don't have enough data to conclusively say "You're wrong" yet, but I certainly see evidence pointing that way.
 
I get the same % returns with regular (L) guns and with unl./(L) MF chips, while the MF chips are less eco.

However, if I try hunting with an unl. gun (not enough skills for those) or with any type of melee (L or unl) I get horrible % returns :dunno:



Therefore my new theory is that the avatar is upon creation assigned a few weapon types that will give good loot and a few that will give bad loot later on ;)
 
AxeMurderer said:
What I mean is what if the loot is related to the total cost of the kill. If your decay and ammo spent is bigger the loot goess bigger too.
Click to expand...
You might get more loot, but you'll also get it at a higher cost, i.e. higher loot does not necessarily mean higher % return.
 
Lorfat said:
You might get more loot, but you'll also get it at a higher cost, i.e. higher loot does not necessarily mean higher % return.
Click to expand...

but it may mean that MA try to make loot better for dumb* and worse for the smart players with eco guns.
I'm sure they are trying to make the game foolprove - it's imposible to loose your vehicle no mather how dumb you are, it's hard to drop item on the ground no matter what, it's hard to get looted in PVP4 unless you are not realy asking for it...
There is possibility that they wana make you get decent loot no mather how dumb you play. (Don't loose too much money [at least not much more than the eco player])
 
i just love those " i cycled 50 ped now i know how the system works " threads.

loot is related to hp killed ( may also be other factors , but this one is the biggest factor )

kill the hp as cheap as possible and you will see close to 90-95% tt return after big enough cycle.

cheers

ermik
 
instead of a 50 ped run, try a 5k run using the same method and see if your returns stay at 96%. ;)
 
Didn't Douglas Adams say something like "If anyone ever works out how the loot system works, the entire (Entropia) Universe will instantly rearrange itself into something Else"

Or something like that...
 
AxeMurderer said:
I was asking becouse I was doing 50 PED hunt on zombies with opalo and got 70% return
next day I do 50 PED hunt on zombies on the same spot with Kinetic Attack Chip I (L) and my decay is huge but my loot got up to 96% not counting the chip decay.
Well with your replies I see that it is just coincidence that my loot got bigger after I hade more decay on the chips.
Click to expand...

70% from 50 ped is 35 ped, 96% from 50 ped is 48 ped. so With both runs you still have 83% return. So you had a not so good run and after that a good run which evened things out a bit.

Its the same as killing 1 mob that costs 5 ped to kill and after that yelling that MA is robbing you since you only get 20% returns all the time (the killed mob had 1 ped loot).
 
i don't believe in loot

using hl8 and 104 and imo that is eco but i still can't get 90% return
 
BlackHawk said:
Truth is no one knows. You are in the wrong place to ask that question. Who will tell you "it is like this" or "it is like that" is full of shit.

In my opinion, eco of an item is not as relevant as other aspects related to that specific item and a specific avatar and place where you plan to use the toy.

Well.. playing like a dumb@$$ payed off way too many times to be so convinced you can ignore the option. People did some strange tests with opalo and E-amp15 and results were... interesting.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with BlackHawk. Eco is a factor to consider in your hunting but it is not quite as important as some people think it is. The main point of eco for me is to stay well within the limits of reasonable eco to avoid too high variations in loot for me to cope with. However that does NOT mean that I think I would get worse loot return over 250k turnover if I used a crappy eco weapon.
 
Buy a swine for hunting and test for urself. You'll see u make a way steadier loss even lol. Eco is ur own influence on the costs.
 
So we should give a day-old newbie this weapon and watch him/her get an ATH? Yeah, I'm not so sure.

Or better yet, they can craft OA-109s on full condition with a 0.0 QR BP! :D
 
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Luckycharm said:
Buy a swine for hunting and test for urself. You'll see u make a way steadier loss even lol. Eco is ur own influence on the costs.
Click to expand...

And if anybody wants to say that they can't afford the swine, as an alternative, please take Mann MPH DLxE and do the test with it instead. Using X40/XR50/CCC/A101/Eamp 11 amplifiers, you can somewhat tune the dps level .. not so much the eco.
 
hihi @ initial post :laugh:

True, spending more will increase your loot and give sometimes even impressions of getting more globals and better loot.That is all very well ... until you see the average % return.

Then you suddenly realize there is something like "eco".

Atami

PS :

The good thing is the system is about "relative" compared to others. So the more players play uneco, the more eco players will benefit. With that in mind I ask everyone to play as uneco as possible ;)
 
i dont go in for deep data analysis, but when i cast my eye casually over several years returns using DOA Loudmouth, Adj 97, Apis and CB19, i see little difference in the returns back. the defense costs make more of a difference, and thats usually down to mob choice. strip out those costs and theres a few % difference over time, to be expected but i think its less than the nominal difference in eco. certainly, i saw little difference switching from DOA LM to apis.
 
Both times that I used a Cause amp on an Isis CB5 (L) that was tier 10 and full of damage enhancers I got a global on a mob that you usually never global on. Daikiba Mature 58 peds and Merp Young 75 peds (Though tracker didn't track it).

Both times I did this for about 30 minutes and the Merp Young happened about 5 minutes after changing to Beast amp.
(Killed another 15k Merps for Iron Mission and not a single global....though I did it hunting mostlyl eco)

btw you get better average damage using Cause over Beast on CB5.:scratch2: Not sure why since both are way over the limit of increase that they can do.:laugh:
 
Talania said:
Both times that I used a Cause amp on an Isis CB5 (L) that was tier 10 and full of damage enhancers I got a global on a mob that you usually never global on. Daikiba Mature 58 peds and Merp Young 75 peds (Though tracker didn't track it).

Both times I did this for about 30 minutes and the Merp Young happened about 5 minutes after changing to Beast amp.
(Killed another 15k Merps for Iron Mission and not a single global....though I did it hunting mostlyl eco)

btw you get better average damage using Cause over Beast on CB5.:scratch2: Not sure why since both are way over the limit of increase that they can do.:laugh:
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I do have something to add here. One of the guys in my soc is ~level 20 in both hit and damage, uses UL non SIB guns, uses no amp and usually gets at least one global every day (at one time he was getting 3 or 4) on small mobs. By small, I mean bigger Corns, Bery etc...this is the one thing that makes me kind of think maybe returns are based on tt in regardless of eco.

But I tried it myself and it didn't work for me.
 
RobBuona said:
uses UL non SIB guns, uses no amp and usually gets at least one global every day (at one time he was getting 3 or 4) on small mobs.
Click to expand...

Global count is not an indication of % returns.

One person is not enough to make reliable statistics.
 
Nighthawk said:
Global count is not an indication of % returns.

One person is not enough to make reliable statistics.
Click to expand...
I'm aware it's not, but it does indicate that TT out is greater for him on these mobs than it is for me. Also he claims to be making profit depsite selling everything to the trade terminal...

The OP is wondering if TT out is influenced by TT in. The uber-eco players will tell you that TT in does not influence TT out in any way. And I also know one person is not enough to make reliable statistics, but I just find it odd that he can keep this up for months.

But as I've said, I tried it myself and it didn't work for me.
 
RobBuona said:
I'm aware it's not, but it does indicate that TT out is greater for him on these mobs than it is for me. Also he claims to be making profit depsite selling everything to the trade terminal...

The OP is wondering if TT out is influenced by TT in. The uber-eco players will tell you that TT in does not influence TT out in any way. And I also know one person is not enough to make reliable statistics, but I just find it odd that he can keep this up for months.

But as I've said, I tried it myself and it didn't work for me.
Click to expand...

One person is certainly not enough to make reliable statistics when that person is clearly a habitual liar.
 
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