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Stop UL Drops in Hunting

JohnCapital

JohnCapital

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In connection with my request for future events, I say the same here.

Every UL drop during hunting is a slap and attack on the mining/crafting players.

Instead of dropping ISoCool Gun Mk.III, I say drop a control ingredient that goes to (L) BPs.

You can make the control ingredient drop 3X as much as the rare item itself (assuming 3.33% Avg Chance of Success, adjust as needed)

Make sure the (L) BPs are easy to loot during crafting. If there's too many, no matter, since you still need the control ingredient.

When enough successful clicks of an UL item are done (according to your rules for player base size vs drop rate) then simply remove those control ingredients from loot table until it's time to introduce them again.

Now, assuming the other ingredients of those bps are ingots, enmatter, components, oils, hides, boards, etc. you make more business for miners/crafters and even other hunters while still allowing those UL items to reach the market.
 
i asked for this like over a year ago and was flamed to death about it. and MA didn't listen to me now my gear is worth less and less every month which sucks, but its not like i have any intention of selling it anytime soon anyways so i give up.
 
That's exactly what they did with Marcimex Slime and Adj/Imp/Mod Evil.

Did it help?
 
What about us hunters that are still out there looking for a nice unl drop? I've been playing a long time, skilled to commando naturally, and I'm still waiting to see something like that in my loot window too.
 
sidxx said:
i asked for this like over a year ago and was flamed to death about it.
Click to expand...
I know, I've brought this up before too and same thing. But wanted to bring it up again.

Oleg said:
That's exactly what they did with Marcimex Slime and Adj/Imp/Mod Evil.

Did it help?
Click to expand...

Yes. We need more of that. Much, much more.

@ KyrismaStarsong, instead of mod merc, you loot the control item needed to craft one. How do you feel? (An extreme example that won't happen, but you get the idea.)
 
JohnCapital said:
@ KyrismaStarsong, instead of mod merc, you loot the control item needed to craft one. How do you feel? (An extreme example that won't happen, but you get the idea.)
Click to expand...

I know the question isn't directed at me, but let me answer and shed some light from how I would feel.

I would feel somewhat happy (money) yet really crappy/sad at the same time.
I basically looted an item that I can't use to improve my hunting at all. An item I probably will not have the skill to craft.
And if your like the majority of the player base on a budget, You'd have but one option: Sell it to the crafter.
So now instead of looting my own gun that I can hunt with, I have to give it up for peds, or pay probably a hefty fee to get it crafted.

This gives crafters almost all the power in the item market, most people are happy looting UL because its an item they wouldn't otherwise be able to afford. Some go out of their way killing a mob that drops their next UL gun they want. Your average Joe won't have the money to get most of the things they loot crafted and will end up selling them.


Imo, the idea MA is trying to implement (mushrooms and the likes) I like, I believe its a good step. But to call for an outright stop of UL items is a bad idea, it would make hunting much more boring, take away the thrill of looting UL items, and again give crafters 90% control of the item market..
 
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Im with kyrisma. I'd rather loot it than sell an ingredient in order to buy it at an inflated price.
 
To be fair, it is easier for powerful crafters to monopolize than it is for hunters.
I dont know the answer, but even for a mid level hunter/crafter like myself I know that I can be bullied around in the crafting market much more than I can in the hunting loot market.

If the reason behind removing UL from hunting and moving it to crafting is to level the playing field, I believe it could have the opposite effect.

I dont know though.
 
Mining and Crafting are secondary and tertiary to Hunting. The entire EU economy revolves around Hunting... Of the three standard profession, its Hunting that the majority of players choose to spend their time and money doing. The game does not revolve around Crafting or Mining and it can be argued that the game does in fact revolve around hunting, more than any other thing.

Without unlimited item drops in the hunting loot, the incentive for players to continue hunting and grinding is even less than it already is today
 
Want to know what happens when crafters monopolize various sections of items? Look at the amp market. Now that there is more competition, the markup is going down on it.

What needs to happen is that OTHER planet partners actually have their UL shit drop instead of calypso flooding the market within 10 minutes of every event and VU.
 
narfi said:
To be fair, it is easier for powerful crafters to monopolize than it is for hunters.
Click to expand...

atomicstorm said:
Want to know what happens when crafters monopolize various sections of items? Look at the amp market.
Click to expand...

I already addressed this issue
JohnCapital said:
Make sure the (L) BPs are easy to loot during crafting. If there's too many, no matter, since you still need the control ingredient.
Click to expand...

The evil amp issue is because 1 person owns the only 3 bps ingame. But with a lot of (L)BPs floating around, it's much easier to find someone willing to click the item for you (or you do it yourself)
 
An economy is all about the trading of stuff between people. True, most people in EU focus on the hunting, but if EU is unique it's because it is a Real Cash Economy. MA should focus on their strength - the exchange of resources, like JC is asking for.
 
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with new planets and release of so many more unl weapons, and few new players compared to new items. The idea of a good economy to me seems shot in this game now.
 
Oleg said:
That's exactly what they did with Marcimex Slime and Adj/Imp/Mod Evil.
Click to expand...

As Oleg says, this is already being done on a small scale.

Those who oppose this idea in this thread: Be honest, how many of you hunt for Slime (or shrooms), even though you can't loot those adj/imp items directly?
 
Colbey Kal said:
An economy is all about the trading of stuff between people. True, most people in EU focus on the hunting, but if EU is unique because it's a Real Cash Economy, MA should focus on their strength - the exchange of resources, like JC is asking for.
Click to expand...

Agreed, trading of resources, not necessarily assets. They are close but not exactly the same.
Resources I see as thing we loot, ores from miners, or oils hides output amps etc from hunters. Mindark is working to improve the market in that area with recent loot changes and trying to give crafters more expendable stuff that both hunters and miners require.

Crafters craft 99% of all mining tools and amps, also craft enhancers, scopes and other things hunters need.
I see these as resource exchange.

Assets, guns, equipment, UL items, should not be given solely to crafters.
I see crafting profession is you supply tools and resources for hunters and miners to use that is expendable. It makes it so there is always a market for it.
Crafters making UL items in past generally kills the market for that UL, simply because people buy the one item and don't need anymore.
But where they excel at is making expendable resources.
 
JohnCapital said:
As Oleg says, this is already being done on a small scale.

Those who oppose this idea in this thread: Be honest, how many of you hunt for Slime (or shrooms), even though you can't loot those adj/imp items directly?
Click to expand...

I have never attempted either slime or shrooms. But i have successful camped for UL weapons.


edit: I am not blindly opposing, just pointing out the potential flaws. Ultimately a balance should be there between all professions without favoring any.
 
What the idea brings about is rather a gambling element to the structure wherein the rare part looted will obviously be lower priced then the ul item counterpart and as such more people get to have a share of the pie. So what would earlier be a 15-20k ped gun would now become a 5k ped/part where the crafter takes a chance to see if he is lucky enough to get a success out of the click. I think most of the hunters would rather see a 1% chance of looting a 20k ped gun rather then a 4% chance of looting 5k ped parts.

The other problem comes with crafters getting immense power over pricing the item. This can have both +ve or -ve affect depending on how they excercise that power.

The other thing is MA will need to keep very close eyes on every item rare components if they do the same for all ul items. Presently they put x number of items in loot pool and are done with it. Now parts can all fail or all succeed severely affecting the control over the number of items to be looted.

I think the present system works where some are ul item drops whereas others are component drops for crafters to enjoy with.
 
Crafters should be happy they now get to craft beacons rather than the miners finding em :p

Gawd I miss Strange Signal! :(
 
Well why would anyone wonna hunt if there is no chance of looting something UL.

I think we have seen this allready, compared to the Ten Event how many UL items dropped then compared to now. And what effect it had on the hunter activity.

Im just speculating i cant say for sure if its true but seems to me the hunter activity went Down a bit from then to now.

So MA has to keep a steady flow of UL items dropping in loot, if they want a steady hunter player base.
 
HardWrath said:
Mining and Crafting are secondary and tertiary to Hunting. The entire EU economy revolves around Hunting... Of the three standard profession, its Hunting that the majority of players choose to spend their time and money doing. The game does not revolve around Crafting or Mining and it can be argued that the game does in fact revolve around hunting, more than any other thing.

Without unlimited item drops in the hunting loot, the incentive for players to continue hunting and grinding is even less than it already is today
Click to expand...

+1

(to short)
 
KyrismaStarsong said:
What about us hunters that are still out there looking for a nice unl drop? I've been playing a long time, skilled to commando naturally, and I'm still waiting to see something like that in my loot window too.
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" and I'm still waiting to see something like that in my loot window too " me to and i have soon 8k skills in commando. :)
 
Any that think UNL items should not drop are welcome to TT the stuff.

Meanwhile, let all these newer players have the same chances older ones had, to have the excitement of seeing some unusual loot that is repairable.
 
HardWrath said:
Mining and Crafting are secondary and tertiary to Hunting. The entire EU economy revolves around Hunting... Of the three standard profession, its Hunting that the majority of players choose to spend their time and money doing. The game does not revolve around Crafting or Mining and it can be argued that the game does in fact revolve around hunting, more than any other thing.

Without unlimited item drops in the hunting loot, the incentive for players to continue hunting and grinding is even less than it already is today
Click to expand...

+1 too

:)
:)
 
Sadly, I have to disagree as well.

If there was nothing decent to look forward to looting, there would hardly be much reason to hunt anymore to be honest.

However, too much UL items would reduce the demand for crafted goods and it ruins the economy of the game.

Its a catch-22. And sometimes I wonder if the system was implemented "wrongly" in this sense.

---

What if...just what if something alternate like this were to be implemented instead?

UL weapons and armors continue to drop. Their stats and whatnots are exactly as is or maybe slightly improved to counteract the following...

In exchange, players can slot in various "mods" (that are to be made by crafters) to alter the damage types (for weapons) and protection types (for armor) that the UL items offer.

Eg. Sollomate Opalo has 8 burn dmg. If it can be slotted with different "dmg modifier" and altered to deal different types of dmg instead? (But still restricted to this 8 dmg.)

Eg. Pixie offers a total of 12 protection. If you can slot in different "protection modifier" (cut/imp/burn/...) to adapt to the mob your hunting, wouldn't that be great? (But again still restricted to this 12 protection limit.)

Would that be a good idea? Since nothing else is changed.

And following that, maybe they can start to make the mobs weak against certain dmg types...etc...

Since now, what your using to shoot at a mob is hardly important...burn...pen...cut...they all do the same dmg.

Just a random thought of mine. :laugh:
 
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I think upgrade paths are a good way to go. Involve some crafted base items as well as looted items and make every item upgradable ( looted as well as crafted. ) A crafted item can be upgraded by looted stuff ( like the shrooms ) And looted items can be upgraded with crafted stuff. The better the upgrade the more complex the path to it. And involve existing components and materials to raise demand on them.

Upgrades might offer more damage / higher crit % or dmg / Visual updates for customization without altering the stats / higher protection / giving buffs. ...

This way on base item the value might drop, but the economy is stimulated by demand on upgrade stuff.

This way people can be hapy to loot useful items they can use to iprove their gameplay and also involve all professions in the process to customize them.
 
I don't know why they going same path twice. Once we got only UL items. It occurred pretty fast that market is rather shallow. So they introduced L stuff (which I think was good move). Right now again a lot of UL stuff is dropping or given like prizes. I think that there should be some UL things but right now there is way to many. I agree with op there is something to be done to solve this.
 
Crafters would have nobody to craft for .
Im not a big time hunter but im sure i would stop huntig if there would be no chance of looting something usefull for once .
I believe many would do the same .
 
Stop - No
Reduce - maybe (if there could be only specific number of new UL items per account created, then it would be fine )

About the idea of many L bps with hard to get ingredients i dont support this idea, as it is harder for crafters to get this magical 90% already (because not possible to put in only tt input materials(like ammo and bombs in other professions).
Blueprint system is fine atm, and shouldnt be touched.

So to conclude i support the idea that UL items shouldnt be that common in loot (because the causes the loss of price in many old UL items, which will lead to ppl trying to cash out fast, which will lead to even lower prices)
But i dont support the idea of using crafting for it, as crafting is already very nicely balanced and if something costs a lot then bps also cost arm and a leg. This should only apply to hunting loots (as crafting loots are already very rarely something worth crafting for the product (and not for the hof). As we dont craft modified faps etc.. everything that is worth something comes from hunting OR in very rare cases from very very very rare L blueprints (have been few UL weapons L blueprints with few clicks.. so not much harm done by crafting)
 
Here is a better idea: Let's turn off ALL loot for hunters, except Nova Fragments and the odd Dung find here and there. Certainly that will improve the game.
 
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