Speed exploit or Positional geometry?

Xane

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Kane Xane Crossing
I killed [Me Really Never] today and he says hes making a support case to get me banned for speed exploit.
He said he was recording so hopefully he posts it.

Let me explain the concept of an intercept with this illustration

wZVxvye.jpg


Fig.1 the two planes are flying parallel and therefor the distance between them is constant.

Fig.2 the intercepting plane's flight path is on a course that will eventually cross the other planes flight path and therefore the distance between them will decrease until their flight paths cross. OFC this is only 2D but the principles are the same in a 3D environment.

So this is why I can be "behind" you and out of range and yet it's still possible to catch you. I'll say this again to everyone as I said to [Me Really Never] stop wasting supports time with your stupidity.
 
Giving an example of how it could work, doesn't mean you're not using an exploit.
 
Giving an example of how it could work, doesn't mean you're not using an exploit.

It does mean if this is what you see someone doing and you still accuse them of exploiting then your either an idiot or a liar.
 
Fig.2 the intercepting plane's flight path is on a course that will eventually cross the other planes flight path and therefore the distance between them will decrease until their flight paths cross. OFC this is only 2D but the principles are the same in a 3D environment.

If they are both travelling at the same speed then chaser will cross leading planes flight path behind it, how far behind depends on the angle of the intercept, the shallower the angle the closer they will be but it will take a longer.

It's impossible for the chaser to gain ground if they are travelling at the same straight line speed if you follow the diagram.

The only way it will work is if the chaser is using a strafe, i.e. can move horizontally i.e. it doesn't change where on the horizon it's pointing.
 
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Unless your ship is flying faster than theirs, the distance between ships would actually increase using the flight path in FIG 2.

Signed: Geometry.
 
Unless your ship is flying faster than theirs, the distance between ships would actually increase using the flight path in FIG 2.

Signed: Geometry.

i was thinking that, but if you draw two even length lines as below

attachment.php


they will cross, but the factor is, did the pursuing ship just happen to be travelling the right angle before they first met or was able to jink a little without much distance loss? but would require near pinpoint accuracy before either ship knew of each others location.if the pursuing ship was ever directly behind then left the radar and returned ahead, thats not possible.

the photo posted by OP does look wrong as the line for the target is shorter than the chaser

ADDED EDIT: if you were on the radar slowly catching up, i doubt that too, the such narrow angle required to catch the target would likely take much longer than the size of the space map
 
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M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M M ..... etc

Could also be the answer :laugh:

Most know about it now, but guess new players wouldn't.

Spamming map open/closed makes your ship fly faster if another is in sight. Odd glitch but one thats been used a while now, the kronan checked it out and confirmed (thread is somewhere on pcf),
 
I hope that you don't get banned - if only because it would likely start yet another interminable whine thread.
 
The only way to minimize lost ground is to keep the angle of attack as shallow as possible.

Or if the chaser can move sideways without affecting speed to the horizontal and veritcal in a 3d environment then they can get behind.

No idea if EU has strafe in space but that would also give a speed boost if used in the right way as the strafe imparts speed, keeping the attack angle low and strafe at the same time could increase speed in theory.
 
LOL Xane, failed in geometry? In Figure 2. there is no chance you would gain speed. If you guys would go the same speed, you would fall more behind.

It would only work for you, if YOU went parallel(not him), but according to your figure, thats not the case :)

Here, you can gain some knowledge:
https://www.mathsisfun.com/pythagoras.html

True:bandit:
 
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If they are both travelling at the same speed then chaser will cross leading planes flight path behind it, how far behind depends on the angle of the intercept, the shallower the angle the closer they will be but it will take a longer.

It's impossible for the chaser to gain ground if they are travelling at the same straight line speed if you follow the diagram.

The only way it will work is if the chaser is using a strafe, i.e. can move horizontally i.e. it doesn't change where on the horizon it's pointing.

You are wrong
 
Unless your ship is flying faster than theirs, the distance between ships would actually increase using the flight path in FIG 2.

Signed: Geometry.

you are wrong
 
LOL Xane, failed in geometry? In Figure 2. there is no chance you would gain speed. If you guys would go the same speed, you would fall more behind.

It would only work for you, if YOU went parallel(not him), but according to your figure, thats not the case :)

Here, you can gain some knowledge:
https://www.mathsisfun.com/pythagoras.html

True:bandit:

you are wrong
 
Give a few minutes and I will show you how this works
 
The thing to remember is not that the pirate quad has to meet or overtake the other quad, just come into range.

Each ship has a range "bubble" around it. In the figures the blue quad is too "low" to shoot. By turning onto the path of the other, he loses time and there for distance. If he can close this width apart whilst maintaining the correlating distance, he might well end up in range of that bubble, if not the actual ship. Then there are the notions on pc speed, latency, connection etc that I know bugger all about, but I am sure some smart people here do!
 
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Two questions:

1. Are both planes flying in a straight path?
2. Are they flying at the same speed?

Thx
 
I raised this argument about 2 years ago. There was no intercept the pirate was miles behind me and caught up directly behind me waving side to side. Gaining on me, with some cheat. It was a hack and overclocking their computer....or whatever they do.

So not interested debating the same argument over and over again, parcelled up in another format.

Rick
 
Unless your ship is flying faster than theirs, the distance between ships would actually increase using the flight path in FIG 2.

Signed: Geometry.

Well said! I hope the vid gets posted too. Pythagoras would have had a field day (or not :yay:).
[edit: actually the comment is not correct, nor my next paragraph under certain cirumstances.

Take 45 degrees as an example of an inefficient intercept. Distance to target 1, Flight path 45 degree intercept. Pirate and target can both fly 1 unit of distance and the separation is reduced to .414.

When you see a pirate who is out of range you need to pick a course AWAY from them, even if you don't really want to go that way. ...]

In some descriptions of the apparent use of exploits, the complainer has provided the essential information that the attacker disappeared from radar, that they then flew in a straight line, but were then still caught up with shortly after. This is not possible under normal vector analysis.

In other cases, the complainer has just said things like "flew in a straight line". On its own, this does not mean a pirate will necessarily fail to intercept when on an intercept course. It depends on the starting positions and the flight paths.

Let's see PLEASE PLEASE, who is wrong in this case! - and I have no verdict before I see the evidence!
 
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What about, if the red ship don't stay at a stright forward line course?
If i know some one chase me, i change my course all the time.

This math on the picture work only, if the red ship hold the course.

Would like, if space ships would have a boost option for some seconds so the ship is faster, while the boost.
The boost using energy from a energy bar. If the bar is down, no more boost possible, while the energy need to be regen.
This would make space more interesting, for pirates and no pirates.
 
I raised this argument about 2 years ago. There was no intercept the pirate was miles behind me and caught up directly behind me waving side to side. Gaining on me, with some cheat. It was a hack and overclocking their computer....or whatever they do.

So not interested debating the same argument over and over again, parcelled up in another format.

Rick

Yes I have been there before also. Pirate ship not even on the screen, me with great connection, fast pc etc. Aligned 100% horizontal, flying completely straight with no deviation. Pirate appeared on screen, and took about 10 mins to catch up. Most likely the M spam back then though.
 
I raised this argument about 2 years ago. There was no intercept the pirate was miles behind me and caught up directly behind me waving side to side. Gaining on me, with some cheat. It was a hack and overclocking their computer....or whatever they do.

So not interested debating the same argument over and over again, parcelled up in another format.

Rick

wasn't that fixed? i heard spamming Z then C over and over gain a speed boost
 
Dammit I'm only thinking of the horizontal axis only. The distance from A to B will decrease but distance in the horizontal will increase. But they will never meet at the same point.

sorry me being an idiot and thinking of catch up as in at the same point. I'm thinking it's the same as the old cat and mouse strategy to test neural networks.
 
you are wrong

you are a pretty good example of the american education system being one if not the worst of all first world countries. there is no physically possible way, not in 2d nor in 3d, that if someone is behind someone else and NOT in shooting range of his weapon can catch up a vehicle flying a straight line when both have the exact same maximum speed. there were no movements from me in any kind as i was not touching keyboard nor mouse.

but this heavy fail in geometry is just laughable. i allready knew he was stupid but this is some world class stupidity right there. pythagoras would die in shame if he he knew that.
the hypotenuse is allways longer than any of the other 2 sides. and the hypotenuse would be the side that would be needed to catch up. in ideal case the attacker ship is right behind on the same axis which means that a=c but that would also mean that he is never being able to catch up as the speed factor can be counted out as it is the same on both ships. ridicolous that i even have to explain this.
 
you are a pretty good example of the american education system being one if not the worst of all first world countries. there is no physically possible way, not in 2d nor in 3d, that if someone is behind someone else and NOT in shooting range of his weapon can catch up a vehicle flying a straight line when both have the exact same maximum speed. there were no movements from me in any kind as i was not touching keyboard nor mouse.

but this heavy fail in geometry is just laughable. i allready knew he was stupid but this is some world class stupidity right there. pythagoras would die in shame if he he knew that.
the hypotenuse is allways longer than any of the other 2 sides. and the hypotenuse would be the side that would be needed to catch up. in ideal case the attacker ship is right behind on the same axis which means that a=c but that would also mean that he is never being able to catch up as the speed factor can be counted out as it is the same on both ships. ridicolous that i even have to explain this.

You could have made your point without country bashing, you afrIcan Asian monolithic Canadian flamingo.
 
you are a pretty good example of the american education system being one if not the worst of all first world countries. there is no physically possible way, not in 2d nor in 3d, that if someone is behind someone else and NOT in shooting range of his weapon can catch up a vehicle flying a straight line when both have the exact same maximum speed. there were no movements from me in any kind as i was not touching keyboard nor mouse.

but this heavy fail in geometry is just laughable. i allready knew he was stupid but this is some world class stupidity right there. pythagoras would die in shame if he he knew that.
the hypotenuse is allways longer than any of the other 2 sides. and the hypotenuse would be the side that would be needed to catch up. in ideal case the attacker ship is right behind on the same axis which means that a=c but that would also mean that he is never being able to catch up as the speed factor can be counted out as it is the same on both ships. ridicolous that i even have to explain this.

The key factor in this is the exact nature of the word "behind". It has to be COMPLETELY behind, not behind and to one side. It is up to the person being attacked to "straighten" their own flight path to make no catching up possible (i.e. no intercept point, no matter how far away that point may be).
 
The key factor in this is the exact nature of the word "behind". It has to be COMPLETELY behind, not behind and to one side. It is up to the person being attacked to "straighten" their own flight path to make no catching up possible (i.e. no intercept point, no matter how far away that point may be).

well if he were coming from south while i was flying west or east (to make it simple) it would be different. but we both came from the same space station so he was pretty much directly behind me. maybe in an angle of max 10°
 
The key factor in this is the exact nature of the word "behind". It has to be COMPLETELY behind, not behind and to one side. It is up to the person being attacked to "straighten" their own flight path to make no catching up possible (i.e. no intercept point, no matter how far away that point may be).

Doesn't matter. I can fly in space and pirates will come out of no where and catch up. I've also seen them catch up a few times to an equus that was not overburdened.. and not in thr manner xane describes although it was never xane in those scenarios. Whether it be the speed hack or differential in performance of the individuals pc.. the inability for space vehicles to use more strategy than just fly at a max speed makes space broken and a useless feature that inhibits growth and investment in the game.
 
I raised this argument about 2 years ago. There was no intercept the pirate was miles behind me and caught up directly behind me waving side to side. Gaining on me, with some cheat. It was a hack and overclocking their computer....or whatever they do.

So not interested debating the same argument over and over again, parcelled up in another format.

Rick

Oh, Dear God.....

:laugh:
 
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