Obtaining and Running a Shop in Entropia Universe

[INTERNUT]

Also as mentioned before, MA has said to send in support cases or contact the planet partner of people are interested in getting a shop or land deed back on the auction. They likely won’t do it for one interested person, but it does sound like of there is enough interest, they’ll auction. I’ve seen MA having on occasional Marcus auction for houses-apartments in the last few years at least.

I sort of like this idea, but would MA pay much attention to support cases about not enough retail estates in the auction?

 

[kingofaces]

I sort of like this idea, but would MA pay much attention to support cases about not enough retail estates in the auction?

It's more getting the word to the Planet Partner since they hold the deeds rather than MA in most cases.

Also others brought up a good point earlier related to the price of shops. They used to be a bit cheaper, but I forgot about needing to pay that rental fee and when it was removed. That could in part be why prices were lower 5-10 years ago, and there may have been a delayed effect on shop prices increasing in part because of that.

 

[INTERNUT]

It's more getting the word to the Planet Partner since they hold the deeds rather than MA in most cases.

Also others brought up a good point earlier related to the price of shops. They used to be a bit cheaper, but I forgot about needing to pay that rental fee and when it was removed. That could in part be why prices were lower 5-10 years ago, and there may have been a delayed effect on shop prices increasing in part because of that.

Yes, for planets other than Calypso, that makes sense to lodge support cases with planet partners, but what about Calypso itself where estates are owned by MA/MCTEB?

 

[kingofaces]

Yes, for planets other than Calypso, that makes sense to lodge support cases with planet partners, but what about Calypso itself where estates are owned by MA/MCTEB?

MA and planet partners are technically separate entities, even for Caly. I asked MA specially about some Caly land and they said they’d forward it on to the Caly planet partners. They’re just not easy to get a direct line to unlike the other PPs like Cyrene, Toulan, etc. that can be easily reached on discord.

 

[INTERNUT]

MA and planet partners are technically separate entities, even for Caly. I asked MA specially about some Caly land and they said they’d forward it on to the Caly planet partners. They’re just not easy to get a direct line to unlike the other PPs like Cyrene, Toulan, etc. that can be easily reached on discord.

So MA owns and runs the EU platform but not Calypso? Anyway, how did you approach MA? Through their official site? But at least they said they would forward it and didn't reject it out of hand.

 

[kingofaces]

So MA owns and runs the EU platform but not Calypso? Anyway, how did you approach MA? Through their official site? But at least they said they would forward it and didn't reject it out of hand.

Through a support case. There's a convoluted separation I wouldn't be good at explaining where Calypso is MA owned, but they have a separate entity within acting as the Planet Partner, while they have others focused on the EU platform as a whole.

 

[Legends]

Through a support case. There's a convoluted separation I wouldn't be good at explaining where Calypso is MA owned, but they have a separate entity within acting as the Planet Partner, while they have others focused on the EU platform as a whole.

It's called "First Planet Company", they are the entity that owns and creates new content for Calypso.

MindArk owns the Entropia platform and First Planet Company, which owns 50% of Calypso.

 

[INTERNUT]

Through a support case. There's a convoluted separation I wouldn't be good at explaining where Calypso is MA owned, but they have a separate entity within acting as the Planet Partner, while they have others focused on the EU platform as a whole.

That surprises me, wouldn't have thought it would be as simple as starting a support case. Anyway, did you get any response from the planet partner running calypso, or did it just fizzle out?

 

[INTERNUT]

It's called "First Planet Company", they are the entity that owns and creates new content for Calypso.

MindArk owns the Entropia platform and First Planet Company, which owns 50% of Calypso.

So FPC owns half of calypso but is itself owned by MA that also owns the EU platform? Didn't know that, wasn't expecting this.

 

[kingofaces]

That surprises me, wouldn't have thought it would be as simple as starting a support case. Anyway, did you get any response from the planet partner running calypso, or did it just fizzle out?

I mentioned it earlier, but Planet Partners generally aren't going to respond to that. I was told that if enough people showed interest, the PP might release the deed on auction, no direct sales to an individual player trying to deal with the PP directly.

 

[INTERNUT]

I mentioned it earlier, but Planet Partners generally aren't going to respond to that. I was told that if enough people showed interest, the PP might release the deed on auction, no direct sales to an individual player trying to deal with the PP directly.

No, wouldn't have thought so. Direct sales to players would be sort of like insider dealing, so definitely off the table.

 

[DRAGUNOV44]

It's more getting the word to the Planet Partner since they hold the deeds rather than MA in most cases.

Also others brought up a good point earlier related to the price of shops. They used to be a bit cheaper, but I forgot about needing to pay that rental fee and when it was removed. That could in part be why prices were lower 5-10 years ago, and there may have been a delayed effect on shop prices increasing in part because of that.

They are cheaper in reality the only thing holding the price as high as it is right now is MA holding back 80% of the property in cold storage. Might be wrong but for me thats unfair

 

[INTERNUT]

They are cheaper in reality the only thing holding the price as high as it is right now is MA holding back 80% of the property in cold storage. Might be wrong but for me thats unfair

Agreed, and don't understand why MA's doing this. Would like to know when they're going to put some of it back in the auction.

 

[San]

They would all get hoarded by speculators, no matter how many more are released. Unless some measures are taken against such developments but whatever one can consider, it's always controversial.

 

[INTERNUT]

They would all get hoarded by speculators, no matter how many more are released. Unless some measures are taken against such developments but whatever one can consider, it's always controversial.

You mean collectively they would be bought up by many players, some of whom could be speculators, or buying on behalf of them? If MA released more estates into the auction, which I think they should, at least this would keep estate prices down and possibly allow others to have more of the cake. As it is, most players are simply priced-out of estate owning.

 

[San]

This is only possible if the number of available estates was kept close to the number of active players at any time, or at least those who in some way have expressed interest to own one. Like, if they would release a new batch as soon as increasing demand is detected. And would commit to doing so indefinitely. Everything else creates scarcity, which creates the market conditions we have.

Of course, this is by design, so one would need to convince them to change their mind about it. A possible rationale might be that it would create an income stream for them which is directly proportional to the increase in participants (they don't benefit from aftermarket trades). There may have been reasons in the past why this was just not happening, but with the new engine there should be hope to turn the trend around. Then there is only the issue of this having been condoned for so long that many take the status-quo for granted, and there would be significant adversity from existing estate holders.

As a sidenote since we're about shops specifically, I am thinking the same about shopkeepers. The way their market price has developed makes them an interesting object for speculation in itself, rather than just a tool for running a business. I think they should be craftable without any choke points in their supply chain, and should have never been made rare at all.

 

[Legends]

They would all get hoarded by speculators, no matter how many more are released. Unless some measures are taken against such developments but whatever one can consider, it's always controversial.

The best way to mitigate this, is for PPs to issue these as Event prizes. Sometimes they issue Apartments as prizes, I don't think they have ever issued shops as prizes but they should have a serious look at possibly doing this to give everyone a chance to get one.

Yes it's true that the prices of shops have increased a lot lately, but it's not really because of speculators. Though there have been some resellers getting involved lately, this is only as an after effect of demand for shops having drastically increased. Shops were not scarce and for a long time, they just were not seen as an interesting business in Entropia, but with the many improvements made to EU in recent years, and the new crafteable ArMatrix and AP armor plates, shops have become a very attractive business now, so demand for them and for shop keepers has surged.

My hope is for MA to revise it's limits on Item Points because as it is, I think the limit is too low (I already inquired about this in a support case and iirc, for large shops, PA mall limit is like 160 item points, Twin is 250 and Emerald 350). Secondly I hope MA will figure out a way so that Shops aren't constantly having to compete with the Auction system, i.e. having to sell for less AND struggle to keep the offering decent despite crappy/low item points.

Anyway, there are shops available on other planets, I actually started out on RT. Anyone who is serious about being a successful shop owner can learn a lot from running a shop on another planet first and figure out if this is what they really want to do; it's really time consuming and tedious tbh, not for everyone.

 

[INTERNUT]

This is only possible if the number of available estates was kept close to the number of active players at any time, or at least those who in some way have expressed interest to own one. Like, if they would release a new batch as soon as increasing demand is detected. And would commit to doing so indefinitely. Everything else creates scarcity, which creates the market conditions we have.

Of course, this is by design, so one would need to convince them to change their mind about it. A possible rationale might be that it would create an income stream for them which is directly proportional to the increase in participants (they don't benefit from aftermarket trades). There may have been reasons in the past why this was just not happening, but with the new engine there should be hope to turn the trend around. Then there is only the issue of this having been condoned for so long that many take the status-quo for granted, and there would be significant adversity from existing estate holders.

As a sidenote since we're about shops specifically, I am thinking the same about shopkeepers. The way their market price has developed makes them an interesting object for speculation in itself, rather than just a tool for running a business. I think they should be craftable without any choke points in their supply chain, and should have never been made rare at all.

Yes I agree that the size of the active player base is an important factor so wouldn't be a good idea for MA/MCTEB to release too many shops, shop stalls, etc all at once, but a few every month or so would help redress the balance. As to detecting increasing demand, I suppose the only way for MA to gauge this is if enough players open support cases.

 

[San]

The best way to mitigate this, is for PPs to issue these as Event prizes. Sometimes they issue Apartments as prizes, I don't think they have ever issued shops as prizes but they should have a serious look at possibly doing this to give everyone a chance to get one.

Yes it's true that the prices of shops have increased a lot lately, but it's not really because of speculators. Though there have been some resellers getting involved lately, this is only as an after effect of demand for shops having drastically increased. Shops were not scarce and for a long time, they just were not seen as an interesting business in Entropia, but with the many improvements made to EU in recent years, and the new crafteable ArMatrix and AP armor plates, shops have become a very attractive business now, so demand for them and for shop keepers has surged.

Of course, it is both. The effect is self-amplifying. Once increasing demand is detected by the market, it also brings out speculators. Any item which is believed to have enough upside potential can catch this type of attention.

I do not think that event prizes are the way to mitigate this. (Btw it was already done this way by several planet partners.) As these things are mere tools for running a business, and the opportunity of running a business is one of the core selling points of this game, they should be much more common and easy to obtain. Instead, the design choice is to simulate real-world entry hurdles to brick-and-mortar businesses. But we're in VR and being successful on the market there should focus on the skills required for that. There are good reasons for scarcity with other items, but not these. Therefore, I think this shoud change fundamentally.

 

[True Juan]

Maybe with the new game engine Mindark will change the way deeds work so whoever owns the deed actually owns the place and this rental mess that causes so many headaches, messes, and support tickets will go away as 'all trades are final'

I disagree. Lots of shops that are owned by players are dead. (TI, Genesis HQ etc)

Best example of rental is Medusa, which has pretty active shops due to this.

MA should have made a system where players could have rented shops directly from them for a fee, and if they stop paying, just simply put everything in inventory. This way, most are dead.

 

[INTERNUT]

I disagree. Lots of shops that are owned by players are dead. (TI, Genesis HQ etc)

Best example of rental is Medusa, which has pretty active shops due to this.

MA should have made a system where players could have rented shops directly from them for a fee, and if they stop paying, just simply put everything in inventory. This way, most are dead.

Or MA could bring back the maintenance fee, which I believe used to be 10peds a month many years ago going by veterans I've talked to. In return estate holders would have full rights, including the option of sub-letting space for larger estates.

 

[mastermesh]

Or MA could bring back the maintenance fee, which I believe used to be 10peds a month many years ago going by veterans I've talked to. In return estate holders would have full rights, including the option of sub-letting space for larger estates.

10 ped a month was the cheap places like Treasure Island apartments. I think some apartments were 15 peds?

Malls were much more than that. I cannot find the old comparison chart since I think it got deleted from the server, but I believe it was like 15-20 usd per month in some of the malls....

and you paid the fee up front each month just to open the door to the place. No fee paid and no one could enter the estate other than the owner... been a long while ago. There's some thread on here where owner of mall begged Mindark to change it and so they did.

 

[jwestonmoss]

in terms of absolutely entry level of shops, what kind of ped outlay should i expect just for getting a stall or shop?

 

[Katie Chalmers]

in terms of absolutely entry level of shops, what kind of ped outlay should i expect just for getting a stall or shop?

Probably 10k for something underneath an Omegaton complex or on Crystal palace or something. 15k if its in a half decent spot. If you are relying on organic traffic I wouldn't even bother with them though, hardly anybody knows they are there, you would need a mall shop.

 

[GeorgeSkywalker]

There is also the cheap option of getting an apartment (around 900peds to 1.5k peds) and one shopkeeper (around 4.4kpeds)

 

[Deemer]

I want to open a shop specialized in Rubio and Azuro rifles.
I think it would be a good idea if the shop is close to the new players... next to Camp Icarus and/or next to Vixens in RT.

Do you think it is possible and how much would it cost me?

 

[Katie Chalmers]

I want to open a shop specialized in Rubio and Azuro rifles.
I think it would be a good idea if the shop is close to the new players... next to Camp Icarus and/or next to Vixens in RT.

Do you think it is possible and how much would it cost me?

Not a great idea because a shop can only sell for a minimum +1.0 PED markup, pricing these guns well above their worth. Noobs will buy them of course because they don't know any better but its a scummy tactic to prey on the uninitiated.

Nice Sig. PED to the MOON!

 

[Deemer]

Not a great idea because a shop can only sell for a minimum +1.0 PED markup, pricing these guns well above their worth. Noobs will buy them of course because they don't know any better but its a scummy tactic to prey on the uninitiated.

Nice Sig. PED to the MOON!

I thought it was possible for 20 pecs each

The moon's name is pulsar, my favorite.. moon.

 

[INTERNUT]

10 ped a month was the cheap places like Treasure Island apartments. I think some apartments were 15 peds?

Malls were much more than that. I cannot find the old comparison chart since I think it got deleted from the server, but I believe it was like 15-20 usd per month in some of the malls....

and you paid the fee up front each month just to open the door to the place. No fee paid and no one could enter the estate other than the owner... been a long while ago. There's some thread on here where owner of mall begged Mindark to change it and so they did.

Right, so much more than 10 ped a month for retail outlets... But still, players might be prepared to pay this if they had full estate rights in return.

 

[INTERNUT]

in terms of absolutely entry level of shops, what kind of ped outlay should i expect just for getting a stall or shop?

Last time I looked at estates in the auction, there was a market or shop stall for about 14k peds. Full shops are many times higher, but not a lot has been showing in the auction lately.