Another Session of SPce Flaming and B*@ching !

[Sakuba]

I see a lot of threads in the "Space" section of these forums that all seem to be geared around the needs of a few. These few are Service Providors, Traders and Pirates. These threads seem to be mostly geared around the needs and wants of these small groups with little or no consideration given to the average player.

1. "Logging off on Warp Ships must be removed!"

Who gains from this? I believe that only the Pirates would.

PS: Last Dreadnought kill happened within 40seconds and we will get faster, its not safe to travel on a pirate ship !

It seems that dawn may soon be breaking for the first time and the sun may actually come up over the horizon for some people.

I believe the Dreadnought has around 70 K or 80 K SI. This is only a shortfall from 100 K..
Imagine if the Dreadnought gets a full crew going.
Now imagins a Warp Mine III dumping you at a Warp Gate.
"YES I SAID AT A WARP GATE ! The Pirates know how to use warp mines and where to use them. They have for some time. The minimum range you will be from the Security of a Space Station is 3 AU. 15 minutes minimum at Sub Warp Speed.

Now lets take out logging off in Warp Ships. Within 48 hour s the Dreadnought will have a full crew and a dozen quads. Its quite possible that you will see some other warp ships suddenly become active as well.

End result: NIOTHING WILL MOVE IN SPACE. aLL The existing Planets will all become individual and seperate game platforms.

It has been claimed that MindArk announced that logging off on Warp Ships was a bug and not supposed to be used:

My primary question att his time is in regards to the logging off of Avatars who are on the guest list of the Ship. Is it permitted that they may log out of the game whilst in transit from one planet to another to protect their stackables from PVPer/Piracy attacks. Is this aspect of the Guest List a part of the game mechanics or is it taking advantage of a minor loophole

Reply:

1)I have been informed that this is an intentional feature from the design team and not a bug. However, this issue is under revision by the design team and may be changed in the future. Please stay tuned to the News section and Release notes for future information.

George | Planet Calypso Support

Maybe I am wrong but MindArks response to my suppoer case seems to disclaim the afore-mentioned claim.

2. It has also been claimed that "Once a certain number of Warp Ships achieve 100 k Structural Integrity or more, the "logging off" feature in these ships will be removed.

My question here is:

Is 100 K SI that which is pronouned by Warp Ship Owners and Service Providors.
That is: 25 k SI X 4 repair Points on MS = 100 K SI
or:
Is it when I look at my "Space Craft" deed and go to the line that says "Structural Integrity".
If my MS had the structural integrity of 100 K as in the method mentioned above this line would read:

Structural Integrity ............................................ 25000

For this line to read:

Structural Integrity .............................................100000

This would require an ivestment of over 20,000 USD in gold ingots@ TT value to achieve. If this claim is correct and MindArk are going by what our "Deeds" show There is not one ship anywhere near to haveing 100 K SI.

3. Individual Planets need to establish their own Economies.

Hello ....is there anyone home ?
They are doing exactly that and guess what ....It's not through the stackables items that can be looted in transport from Planet to Planet.

I believe Planet Arkadia may have been the first to get it right. They saw a gap in the SIB Weapons on Calypso. (exasmple) From the LR43 to the LR48 there is a gap where you have little choice but to use the LR43 for two or three level before the LR48 becomes an economical weapon to actually use. This is only one example and Planet Arkadia stepped up and filled those gaps. They have a range of weapons that fill a range of these gaps. This is Eonomy Stabilizing as these require Planet Arkadia Specific Materials.

They have also done similar things in the Tailoring and Texturing fields.

Planet Rocktropia seems to have caught on as well. Their D-Class Amp is in all aspects as good as the Calypso Level 8 Amp. It is, on the surface, seemingly cheaper to produce and uses Rocktropia Specific Materials. They both have the same TT Value and and function exactly the same as each other. The D-Class sells at around 8% less of a mark-up then the Level 8 Amp. This makes it a more viable Amp and is probably why two thirds of this range of Amp sold on the Auctions per day is the D-Class, while one third is the Level 8 Amp.

Gratz to both of these Planets and their Developement Teams. Jobs well done, keep it up.

It is not through the "Stackable Items" that Economies will be built and established, but through the "Non-lootable Finished Products".

4. In regards to my views on the recent statements made in"The State of the Universe"" please read this post.

 

[Alainax]

Sakuba seriously? just threads after threads of Bitching and Drama...Like a blooming stuck record!

I am sick and tired of all the bad mouthing bitchiness drama and down right rudeness that seems to have arisen from some within the space industry - they really need to get a blooming grip and chill the fcuk out! Worse than high school at times

Your title said it all... "Another Session of SPce Flaming and B*@ching !" which made me wonder -are you looking for this drama? Trying to create a flaming and bitching session? and to what end? to wind people up? or just to start a fight for the sake of one?

I guess me thinking that space had dawned a new era of camaradarie and an excting new future in space for all us was too much like wisfull thinking


I still hold out hope that the good people of space also hate this dramatic flaming crap.... does my head in!

 

[John B Knight]

You realize that what we all bought was just the startup package Sakuba right ?
I mean you knew about Mindarks statement of how many guns there will be on a mothership later on in time plus torpedos and the possibilty to launch quads.
So if you made your calculations before buying the Bismarck it should have been obvious to you that motherships will most likely be upgradeable to about 1,000,000 Structual Integrity or more.
Anything less could be blown up in a mere few seconds when fleet battles arise.
We will need to pay the value of an landarea and then some to keep our ships safe over time - thats millions and millions of peds which will boost the economy for all the miners out there - making sure they get good markup on their finds.
It was never intended by mindark to make players log out of their own game to play something different meanwhile nor did they introduce huge motherships to be used as autopilot shuttles run by multiaccounts and lets face it the way the system currenty works its possible for a single person to claim a dozend different spacecrafts for a dozend different shared accounts which all could be run on autopilot and then there would be no other player needed up in space anymore...

 

[JustinStarry]

Well, my 2 cents.... I've quaded my loot in space, and got it pirated. Lesson learned. Then I took an MS and didn't log off, got 5k tt stolen. Lesson learned. Yes people said it was my fault, and yeah it was. I've accepted that.

But now that log off will be disabled (or a seemingly exact counterpart in accordance with the State of the Universe roadmap), I dunno, will everyone really want to risk 10k tt stackables in Space?

Picture people being on an MS, *hoping* that the repair crew and gunners can take out the 50 pirates who KNOW there's 10k+ loot on board because it's a scheduled flight (so we all have to VIP now? lol?).

I'm pretty sure most of our beloved space providers are secretly happy , and well if I owned an MS and provided services, I would be too! Warp prices would go up, and maybe an additional protection fee. I know the MSes with the highest SI's will be flocked with passengers... and the lower SI MSes will probably be avoided.

I guess it will be interesting. And as people have told me, we'll just have to "adapt".

The better question to ask is "do you really want to risk your loot in space, knowing that it is not risk-free?" Sensible people would say no. But what happens when you're forced to? . I think the Arkadian economy will grow for sure People will be forced to sell at their planets.... And what happens when Ospra can't be bought in caly anymore? Muahahha.

 

[Kri]

You realize that what we all bought was just the startup package Sakuba right ?
I mean you knew about Mindarks statement of how many guns there will be on a mothership later on in time plus torpedos and the possibilty to launch quads.
So if you made your calculations before buying the Bismarck it should have been obvious to you that motherships will most likely be upgradeable to about 1,000,000 Structual Integrity or more.
Anything less could be blown up in a mere few seconds when fleet battles arise.
We will need to pay the value of an landarea and then some to keep our ships safe over time - thats millions and millions of peds which will boost the economy for all the miners out there - making sure they get good markup on their finds.
It was never intended by mindark to make players log out of their own game to play something different meanwhile nor did they introduce huge motherships to be used as autopilot shuttles run by multiaccounts and lets face it the way the system currenty works its possible for a single person to claim a dozend different spacecrafts for a dozend different shared accounts which all could be run on autopilot and then there would be no other player needed up in space anymore...

Can we stick to the facts please? not some wild fantasies?

 

[Cerb DCLXVI]

:

I am sick and tired of all the bad mouthing bitchiness drama and down right rudeness that seems to have arisen from some within the space industry - they really need to get a blooming grip and chill the fcuk out! Worse than high school at times

From what Sakuba has mentioned, only thing I see anything resembling highschool is, the lesson to be learned. He was only quoting and setting facts straight about logging out on a warpship not being a "cheat", he only tried to announce and give info that "maybe" if your SI reaches 100k you will no longer be able to log (which is good to know because every ship needs a crew, and that would mean more recourses for a crew) out. Also in a sense, he is looking out for the games well being and future prospects to keep the motherships in business, and not have dead worthless planets.

While looking like it was taken in a more serious manner, and not carefully read through....a lot of the information is actually quite helpful if anyone decides to invest in a warp capable ship. look out for warpmines, how long will a warpmine take you out for, where will you hit a warp mine, what do you need to survive a warpmine. While tone is a hard subject in the matter to understand in text. the text itself was carefully worded enough to imply a warning/wake up method it seems to teach us what to look out for and how to do so properly to keep our warp services safe and ongoing.

 

[Alainax]

From what Sakuba has mentioned, only thing I see anything resembling highschool is, the lesson to be learned. He was only quoting and setting facts straight about logging out on a warpship not being a "cheat", he only tried to announce and give info that "maybe" if your SI reaches 100k you will no longer be able to log (which is good to know because every ship needs a crew, and that would mean more recourses for a crew) out. Also in a sense, he is looking out for the games well being and future prospects to keep the motherships in business, and not have dead worthless planets.

While looking like it was taken in a more serious manner, and not carefully read through....a lot of the information is actually quite helpful if anyone decides to invest in a warp capable ship. look out for warpmines, how long will a warpmine take you out for, where will you hit a warp mine, what do you need to survive a warpmine. While tone is a hard subject in the matter to understand in text. the text itself was carefully worded enough to imply a warning/wake up method it seems to teach us what to look out for and how to do so properly to keep our warp services safe and ongoing.

This is all information that is already here, on the many multiples of threads which discuss all of the above. It appears the point of this thread - as per title - is a deliberate attempt at berating and creating more drama than is ever necessary.

 

[Sakuba]

I am sick and tired of all the bad mouthing bitchiness drama and down right rudeness that seems to have arisen from some within the space industry - they really need to get a blooming grip and chill the fcuk out! Worse than high school at times

I deliberated for some time on the title for this post and concluded that because it did cover several issues that have been raised before and no doubt it would spiral as usual into the nromal flaming and griping session. Like you, I too am rather tired of them, but was hhoping my statements here would show at least a little reasoning.

I guess me thinking that space had dawned a new era of camaradarie and an excting new future in space for all us was too much like wisfull thinking

It is my hope that your wishful thinking is actually bearing fruit as I believe that to some degree you are correct.

 

[Cerb DCLXVI]

Anything less could be blown up in a mere few seconds when fleet battles arise.
We will need to pay the value of an landarea and then some to keep our ships safe over time - thats millions and millions of peds which will boost the economy for all the miners out there - making sure they get good markup on their finds.
It was never intended by mindark to make players log out of their own game to play something different meanwhile nor did they introduce huge motherships to be used as autopilot shuttles run by multiaccounts and lets face it the way the system currenty works its possible for a single person to claim a dozend different spacecrafts for a dozend different shared accounts which all could be run on autopilot and then there would be no other player needed up in space anymore...

When the game moved ores to other planets, that was supposed to up the ore market also, making people visit and move and out of their way, making it more troublesome, so only the die hard miners, or miners that didn't mind going places able to get these ores/enmatts. Markets for the most part have settled back down, small moves like this only spike the market for maybe a few months at a time. and if its too hard to find, then the miners don't profit from it because its basically "nowhere to be found" in a way. Only a handful of people would get the stuff. which would mean that it would be the same amount of money flowing through, only to a specific person, and not the whole economy itself.

Everything seems to work out in theory, but as we've all seen, once implemented it's not always what he have in our mind, such as space travel. Just because mindark said we would have more on the motherships, weaponwise and SI wise, doesn't always mean we are going to get it..... such as bringing back animal taming, bringing back makeup masks (which they did, then took away) make us change our avatar (that was supposed to be 2 months ago about) and now we have no more makeup masks. So lately all you can really work with is what we have now, we can't really expect too much until it happens, because even what they say is executed in a different manner. As the quote says " you test the waters with one foot, not both" out of context, but we all get the point.

Everyone has to play smart as not to invest in the wrong thing ahead of time and spend money in aspects that will be pointless or lost in a vu.

 

[Falagor]

I have not seen other threads of Sakuba so mayby i miss here something. But i can fully understand her and i agree with her at least to some point.

From a MS owner perspective - how to earn money on it:

• doing MS warps (best way scheduled) - its steady but very slow income. It is driven by market needs for reasources/items on different planets. A little rare it is driven by just need to travel (cost is nearly the same by traveling with own quad comapred to one time 5ped MS warp fee). It is faster and little cheaper but you need to wait for it like you wait for the bus.
• leting people skill repair on MS with also hunting options - also steady and still slow income. Driven by the need of skilling up crafting (either for selling skills or reaching certain level to start craft). When all players would skill this - finally price of skills will drop and everyone who needs it would reach desired levels. So in late future it may be less used.
• renting MS for parties, flying for fun or any other option player may think of. I am not sure how oten players take this option but i guess it is not that often.

I see no other possibilities (mayby there are but i just do not see them). Imho it is already very low income possibility that you already need to put some work to get it.

If the logging out would be "turned off" i am sure first option would be non existant. So most steady income would be taken away. MS would be useless in my eyes.

And if i would be MS owner i would just sell the whole f***ed up system and invest somewhere else (even CLDs would be better and i still consider them very low investment option already).


How this would influence markets on each planet - probably they will be very closed one - which is not good at all. Most planets would be deserted. Curent market status of planets:

• Caypso - steady market even though there are many things missing here
• Arkadia - planet with growing market and oportunities (good job on dev side here)
• Rocktropia - planet that has temtping items/resources but for some reason many players dont like it (bad job on dev side here)
• Cyrene - new planet that had no chance to show true nature yet (hatchling) - we will see in the future
• Next Island - dead. Few players probably fly there to check it out and mayby loot something better in Ancient Greece (i have never been there so no idea just what i see/hear).

Market status of planets if the "log off" functions is disabled:

• Calyspo - even better and more stabile market because most trading must be done here (like old time Calypso without other planets)
• Arkadia - developing possibilities have been cripled. Planet has good (not great) but not evolving closed market. It is dead end - planet can't develop anymore.
• Rocktropia - i see no point going there - deserted.
• Cyrene - ppl will check it out from time to time but definetly this planet chance to develop and follow Arkadia way is not longer avaible anymore
• Next Island - well still dead.

I see nothing good happening from this. Players who would want to try planet trading would be the risky ones only. Noone would use sheduled warps (becasue pirates knowing the date - will most likely set a trap). VIP warps also are not safe - there can be spy on board. Only valid option to sneak the resources is - flying in your own lonely quad hopeing no pirate will spot you leaving space station safety - pirates can easily coutner this by settin 2-3 watch guards on each stations and cover whole safe area.
So it would be heaven for pirates and i am sure soon we would see few socs for pure pirates (to have better organisation and comunication between them).

I know that space is badly designed from start but removing the "log off" would just kill the planets and probably cripple whole game development.

Falagor

 

[Cerb DCLXVI]

This is all information that is already here, on the many multiples of threads which discuss all of the above. It appears the point of this thread - as per title - is a deliberate attempt at berating and creating more drama than is ever necessary.

Not everybody notices stuff the first time its posted though, rather it be lack of interest, or just not really noticing it. A post becomes useless after people stop learning, but some of the stuff I didn't know, and some of the stuff other people don't know also, takes consistancy to keep something moving. People watch the same stuff on the news everyday, people do the same stuff at work everyday, but yet people can still learn new stuff from seeing the same things over and over again, because things can be overlooked by reading too much into it, or too less into it. It's how an individual takes information and replies it to everyone else.

If you are a person that isn't normally interested in something, yet keep seeing the same thing over and over again, you'll eventually get curious and click it due to human mannerisms, curiosity always tends to win at some point, and that will spread knowledge of the person that clicked it, forwarding it to other people that might be unkowing of space travel, or have little knowledge. Making EVERYONES warp service held in higher regaurds. Which brings both Sakuba and JBK more business as the other warp capable ship owners also. So I don't see how knowledge can be hurting.

 

[John B Knight]

Can we stick to the facts please? not some wild fantasies?

Facts:
A skilled gunner hits in the 350ish range and up to 400 and when crits get fixed it will be up to 800 again.
This is based on gun turrets which consume about 1 ped per shot on armament device I.
Mindark has stated that there will be gun turrets which consume up to 5 ped per shot in future.
Motherships do have 7 active gunner seats of which 3 can be used at the same time.
Motherships do have 12 currently not yet useable seats but the gun turrets (another 8 not yet accessible gun turrets plus cannons that are mounted sideways) to match them are already mounted outside.
The sideway cannons where viewable in action from the Ringhorne mothership down on calypso which was fireing on the valcano.

Assumptions:
I think its safe to assume that when 3 of 7 turrets at the start can be used we will be able to use at least 7 of 19 when the ships are fully upgraded.
I also think its safe to assume that a gun turret that does 400 dmg for 1 ped, might be able to do 1-2k dmg for 5 peds.
7 turrets multiplied by 1k dmg yields 3500dps from turrets alone.
Considering that torpedos will be a slower and more damaging weapon then turrets we have to assume that a torpedo can outdamage the entirety of turrets otherwise it would be pointless to fire them. However their reload time might be slow - so i will go with 10k damage per minute and 2 torpedo launchers - which should still be moderate assumptions towards the lower end. Yielding 333dps.
Now the quads - a mothership can be operated with up to 50 persons of which we may deduct 1 pilot , 1 co-pilot, 7 gunners, 2 torpedo engineers, and atleast 9 repaircrew on rk-20 - leaving 30 people to man quads.
A kismet laser is currently the best quad weapon, thought its safe to assume that their soon will be weapon upgrades for quads - however lets go with the rough estimate of a kismet laser to be ~100dps (this also depends alot on the respective mounted laser profession levels and can be easily higher when crits get fixed)
30 quads each with 100dps are about 3000dps.

Adding up all of the above gets us to 6833dps and this is still assumed on the lower end.

Of course there will be shields in future otherwise this would be deadly for everyone, but noone should expect that he can operate a 10, 20, or 100k si ship in a 100% secure manner in 2 years from now.

 

[JustinStarry]

I have not seen other threads of Sakuba so mayby i miss here something. But i can fully understand her and i agree with her at least to some point.

From a MS owner perspective - how to earn money on it:

• doing MS warps (best way scheduled) - its steady but very slow income. It is driven by market needs for reasources/items on different planets. A little rare it is driven by just need to travel (cost is nearly the same by traveling with own quad comapred to one time 5ped MS warp fee). It is faster and little cheaper but you need to wait for it like you wait for the bus.
  
  If the logging out would be "turned off" i am sure first option would be non existant. So most steady income would be taken away. MS would be useless in my eyes.
  

• 
  
  No? I don't think MSes would become obselete. Would you rather be on an MS with 10k loot, or in a quad? I'd go with the MS..... At least there's a fighting chance.
  
  What will happen is, all the low SI ships will be forced to upgrade in order to continue their operations. That's not fair, but, that's how it goes in EU when MA makes a "revolutionary" new change.
  
  Besides, with the Dreadnought being a pirate MS... it can take a quad down really quickly... I'd really rather be on an MS

 

[Fishface]

No? I don't think MSes would become obselete. Would you rather be on an MS with 10k loot, or in a quad? I'd go with the MS..... At least there's a fighting chance.

What will happen is, all the low SI ships will be forced to upgrade in order to continue their operations. That's not fair, but, that's how it goes in EU when MA makes a "revolutionary" new change.

Besides, with the Dreadnought being a pirate MS... it can take a quad down really quickly... I'd really rather be on an MS

These aren't the only options though. Everyone seems to be taking the small view on this.
If I were going to be putting 100k USD into a space transport service, I'd skip the MS's entirely.
A MS would be useful only for travel, and not for transport.

Instead, imagine a service where you give me your 5k ped of belkar in the quarry. I put it in my storage, and we both hop on a MS and fly to Caly. I then remove 5k ped of belkar from my storage there and return it to you, minus fee.

I then transport the belkar you gave me from ark to caly at my convenience, and at my risk.

Welcome to the future.

 

[Kri]

Motherships have also snooker/pool table and there is/was a golf course on Calypso too... They are all assumptions.

 

[Falagor]

No? I don't think MSes would become obselete. Would you rather be on an MS with 10k loot, or in a quad? I'd go with the MS..... At least there's a fighting chance.

What will happen is, all the low SI ships will be forced to upgrade in order to continue their operations. That's not fair, but, that's how it goes in EU when MA makes a "revolutionary" new change.

Besides, with the Dreadnought being a pirate MS... it can take a quad down really quickly... I'd really rather be on an MS

I would not travel with loot at all - like 95% (or more) players. When travling between planets without loot i would use my quad (independant - not waiting for MS warp so can go anytime i like). I would never visit Rocktropia, Cyrene or Next Island - no point in going there.
And on Calyspo and Arkadia i would hunt/mine/craft only those resources that could be sold on that market (i.e. carabok would be still valid option on Ark) or those that would drop items (non stackables).

Basicly i am sure most players would do similar - that would lead to closed market planets - and like i said in my previous post (pointed out what i think would happen when closed markets come): that is no good at all.

Falagor

 

[John B Knight]

These aren't the only options though. Everyone seems to be taking the small view on this.
If I were going to be putting 100k USD into a space transport service, I'd skip the MS's entirely.
A MS would be useful only for travel, and not for transport.

Instead, imagine a service where you give me your 5k ped of belkar in the quarry. I put it in my storage, and we both hop on a MS and fly to Caly. I then remove 5k ped of belkar from my storage there and return it to you, minus fee.

I then transport the belkar you gave me from ark to caly at my convenience, and at my risk.

Welcome to the future.

I wouldnt wonder if mindark introduced some longrange radars when they continue to develop space - the assumption that quads are more safe is only based on how things currently work and we still do have beta space.

 

[Fishface]

I wouldnt wonder if mindark introduced some longrange radars when they continue to develop space - the assumption that quads are more safe is only based on how things currently work and we still do have beta space.

Ofc, that assumes I would transport by quad, and not by MS at an off-hour, where the risk is greatly reduced.
The point being that I could transport ores at any hour, or not transport them at all, according to my ped buffer.

You take the view of a MS owner, not of an ore transporter. There are many, many ways to transport an ore.

 

[Killahbee]

yay

 

[John B Knight]

Ofc, that assumes I would transport by quad, and not by MS at an off-hour, where the risk is greatly reduced.
The point being that I could transport ores at any hour, or not transport them at all, according to my ped buffer.

You take the view of a MS owner, not of an ore transporter. There are many, many ways to transport an ore.

When there is loot to have then there will be pirates round the clock at some point, always hoping for that offhour transport which is run by a single person and can not defend.
I can still remeber when i started up scheduled flights with the Normandie in early space and there were so many people concerned that a schedule would never be possible because the pirates could plan for it - however it turned out to be the opposite way - just because we had a schedule we also had a strong crew for defence and were able to take on any challenge that occured.
When logged out stackable transport stops being possible, then there will be alot less one person vip/transport flights and alot more scheduled flights were people stand together and help each other to make the journey secure.

 

[JustinStarry]

I wouldnt wonder if mindark introduced some longrange radars when they continue to develop space - the assumption that quads are more safe is only based on how things currently work and we still do have beta space.

Once MA introduces long-range sight of triangles...... It's gg. Even I wouldn't risk space travel. I'd probably move to caly (since I'm a miner), since the arkadian ore/enmatter economy is not that great (to say the least).

 

[Falagor]

Once MA introduces long-range sight of triangles...... It's gg. Even I wouldn't risk space travel. I'd probably move to caly (since I'm a miner), since the arkadian ore/enmatter economy is not that great (to say the least).

See . As for you long range radar is the point where you stop travel with stackables - for many the MS non "log off" option is already this point . And you already said where you will move (most probably). Now can you disagree with the points i mentioned about planet closed markets cons?

Falagor

 

[Fishface]

When there is loot to have then there will be pirates round the clock at some point, always hoping for that offhour transport which is run by a single person and can not defend.
I can still remeber when i started up scheduled flights with the Normandie in early space and there were so many people concerned that a schedule would never be possible because the pirates could plan for it - however it turned out to be the opposite way - just because we had a schedule we also had a strong crew for defence and were able to take on any challenge that occured.
When logged out stackable transport stops being possible, then there will be alot less one person vip/transport flights and alot more scheduled flights were people stand together and help each other to make the journey secure.

The main drawback, however, is the question: what happens with whoever is wrong?

In my case, I'm left holding some ores. I can sell those.
In your case, you have put all of your ores into increased SI, and have a ship which is good for transporting people who arent carrying ores. That's a lot of eggs to throw into one basket. Especially considering that the more SI you put into the ship, the harder it will be to recoup your investment. The higher you'd have to profit to recoup, and the more crew you'd need to call it a business plan.

It's all a matter of viability.

My whole point is that everyone is taking a very one-sided view of space, and that it is never, ever one-sided. There are many players in EU, and the needs of most players are very different than those of mothership services.

Sure, they could introduce radar, ore detectors, import fees, tractor beams, or any number of other things. But that's all conjecture. There's no indication that MA has ever considered any of these, nor that they would do so just to suit the needs of a single mothership owner in a game of 10's of thousands of players.

I'll always adapt to the game. I'm very good at that. That's what I do. That's all I do.

 

[Alainax]

I'll always adapt to the game. I'm very good at that. That's what I do. That's all I do.

And this is exactly what all the transport services will have to do when the big changes come

It would be so much more benificial for everyone to do exactly as you said above - welcome the changes in space - and adapt


Nothing worse than those who look to the future with dread - instead embrace it and work out how to keep on doing this things we love

Sure the next stage might get costly so I can understand why some MS owners are pissed off, hence these threads - but being prepared before, and being capable to adapt, as said above is the key

 

[Fishface]

Sure the next stage might get costly so I can understand why some MS owners are pissed off hence these threads - but being prepared before, and being capable to adapt, as said above is the key

I totally agree with you!
That's why I'm stockpiling ores in my storage units already. I'll be ready when the time comes.

 

[RavenJade]

I really hated the title of sakuba's thread too. I winced and thought... well that's not going to go over well.

I don't think he's pissed off about the changes coming at all though. I think in his grumpy old fart way he was trying to make people aware of issues he feels are still relevant.

I'm actually quite excited at what's to come. I see many possibilities. At least I hope they're coming soon... (and not the soon time frame they've been giving us on taming uggh lol)

Sure the next stage might get costly so I can understand why some MS owners are pissed off, hence these threads - but being prepared before, and being capable to adapt, as said above is the key

 

[Sakuba]

The OP was supposed to be more a statement of CUEEWNT FACTS, rather than an endless tiraid of conjecture and assumptions of what may or could be somewhere at the end of an ever-winding path that that culmintaes in the wonderous discovery of TAMING !

My primary concerns have never been about what it may or may not cost me or what am I going to get out of owning a Mothership. In fact they have always been more about what can I do with the Bismarck to help the Entropia Community Grow and increase its Participant Base. It is my belief, that with these improvements and growths my returns will also increase and improve. With such investments as this, the ROI is not always about the immediate return on the investment.

In the past, I have found that by being open with people about what your probable costs may be helps them to be more understanding and supportive of your aims and situation. To assume that because I came late into the possession of a Mothership and it took me most oif last year to pay it out, that my finaces are insecure and unstable. Taking Entropia Fleet Alliance and the Bismarck into the future is in no way reliant on the ROI. In fact the opposite is true. The ROI is reliant on my personal income being solid, secure and consistant. It may not be huge, but its enough. Considering I have not had a Real Life Job in over five years (through choice not nescessity) funds for the future look good.

In the last year I have invested around 100 000 PED in the Bismarck, Entropia Fleet Alliance and a support system for its continued growth and success. It is my intention to hopefully continue this trend and invest an additional 100 000 PED over the next year to ensure our continued growth and stability.


In my OP I placed a link to an earlier statement I had made on another thread. This link seems to have been passed over so I have copied the statement here and I apologise for the seemingly endless wal of text:

In the State of the Universe Address 2012, we mentioned plans for expanding and improving space. Several other projects received higher priority in 2012, resulting in the plans for space development being pushed forward to mid-2013. The early focus will be on addressing several issues that currently allow for practically risk-free travel between planets. Space combat and weapons will also be adjusted to improve hunting space creatures and ship to ship PVP combat. Towards the end of the year, we hope to implement several completely new features to space, perhaps even space mining.

Seriously, how insightful and intellegent are some people ? I can't help but wonder if anyone read this statement and seriously thought about it or simply made an assumption and ran with the it.

The only thing seriously looked at in this entire statment was:

The early focus will be on addressing several issues that currently allow for practically risk-free travel between planets.

I think there may be a few Bull-Riders come in from the Outback for the big Rodeo."Hang on to your hats boys and girls, this twister could be one hell of an 8 second ride !"

While it is possible that this statement refers to "all" logging-out in space, it may have been put in this context to test how deep the water is. To gauge the reaction of the general "Player Participant Base" and the overall effext it may have if this was done.

"Sow a few seeds of doubt and see what we can grow."

From past reactions on this subject it is pretty obvious that it would be hugely negative for the entire Entropia Universe Experience in so many ways. I can not accept that MindArk believs that the majority of the Player Base would be willing to depot 300 USD today, fly to Arkadia or Rocktropia. Spend the next three or four hours hunting or mining, jump on a Mothership or Privateer and then give all the results of their 300 USD to a Pirate who depoed 20 USD to be able to take it from them.

I'm afraid that dog has a lot more bark then bite.



Perhaps the statement should have been read a little more closely:

The early focus will be on addressing several issues that currently allow for practically risk-free travel between planets. Space combat and weapons will also be adjusted to improve hunting space creatures and ship to ship PVP combat.

The " issues that currently allow for practically risk-free travel between planets" may just be referring to the many complaints about people who have been seen to log out when they see a Pirate chasing them to avoid losing the loots they have on them in open "Lootable PVP" space.

"Space combat and weapons will also be adjusted to improve" I am sure everyone is aware of the differences between the ranges of the guns on Quads, Motherships and Privateers causing a huge imbalance on thier active useability for both defence and offence. For those of you who are not aware a Quad can sit outside the range of a Motherships guns, and even further outside the range ofa Privateers guns, and be able to hit them, risk free and successfully preventing them from warping anywhere. We have all seen the abuse of this tactic in the past few months.

I could be totally wrong with my assumptions, however, from the average Players point of view, I feel the original line of thought on this statement would be very bad for Entropia as a whole.

From a Mothership Owner and Service Providors view, either way may be good, but I prefer the latter train of thought rather than the direction this thread has gone thus far.

Let's hope I am right for a change.

 

[John B Knight]

No reason to become defensive quoting yourself Sakuba, you run a usefull service to the community utilizing certain possibilities to their maximum extend.
Im sure there is no serious transport service providers who would be looking for an complete return of their investments any time soon - we are on a long travel through beta space and i personally can see this journey going on for well beyond a decade - requireing additional investments along the way to keep passengers secure at all times.
Some service providers have relied on stackable logged out transports being possible more then others, which has led to them having less of a crew when it comes to offensive defence - in so far i can see that there is worries about getting blown up by a pirate mothership - however there is a few things that can be done to be secure from pirates: train gunners, raise more active crew, upgrade ships, train pilots, adjust schedules so they can back their own flights where needed, etc. - just all in all involving more of the playerbase for making flights secure.
This is the main reason why i welcome the changes to come cause it will leverage the playing field, it will stop the currently often performed exploits of multi and shared accounts being used to afk-shuttle people with all their possessions through space, it will be required that transport providers really put some effort in the task of transporting passengers through space.

 

[Granny Rowan]

logging of on a MS

I have read the thread with interest, and can see many very valid points both for and against allowing logging off.
I would however ask 2 very basic questions.

1. Why aren't MA policing dupe accounts as per the User Agreement. This would remove much of the problem
regarding multiuser movements through space. Or if not going to police it, why have that clause at all.

2. What would happen to someones ava if their pc crashed, they had to log off for unexpected rl reasons or
that oh so rare event a CTD happened (note the sarcasm).
Would they be penalised by being returned to source planet, or could they lose their lootables.
If the latter, then you could kiss goodbye to most users of the motherships.

Just a little food for thought.

 

[forgo]

I can completely respect the investments made by the owners of a MS.
The scary thing I see with all though, is ideas based on assumptions related to that investment.

Assumptions similar to "MS has 12 gunner seats so it should be used later." Or logoff after x amount of SI or what have you for a possible future evolution of a MS, (and hopefully something that helps get a return on the investment). Nice thoughts, logical, makes sense. I wanna see that DPS in full action too.

But logic and MA do not go hand in hand.

They have hangers, have had them for some time, so we could assume they were to be used later. Just like all of the guns on a MS. Except they wont use hangers, they are a dead notion and its been acknowledged. Those are not light investments either, given up on, no time to pursue. It has happened , and it will happen....many features we want or would like to see will never be seen.

They are all awesome possibilities nonetheless, I just hope that many of you are not blind to the possibility of meeting disappointment in the end regarding your investment and any hopes you may have for it. We all get a little blinded by the things we love.

If anyone has the power to most mold the whole industry, outside of MA control, obviously its you guys, and you all seem to adapt quite well as it is. Overall I think the players got a great deal in who bought the active MS's, it could have been so much worse.

I dont see much concern for the future of the MS knowing the players will adapt in clever ways. I do see more ideas than could possibly come to be, I hope there aren't many eggs in those baskets, else a few will break.

Truth be told, as things change, I have faith you and the passengers will adapt quick to face those changes, so my concerns about space are very little, log on log off whatever. People will always find a way.