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Suggestion: Solution to botting

Rocket192

Rocket192

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Sean Rocket Connors
Remove auto-target in any form.... all hunting has to be manual targeting.


edit: double hitbox sizes
 
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The solution is to BAN them all. But MA won't do it yet, because it doesn't out-way the benefits of 24/7 revenue.
I mean cmon, the playerbase still competing in Mayhem even after people got caught cheating, and MA didn't disqualify said cheaters, and apparently the exploit on yog horror petys still not fixed (only fixed for laser weapons).
 
Sub-Zero said:
The solution is to BAN them all. But MA won't do it yet, because it doesn't out-way the benefits of 24/7 revenue.
I mean cmon, the playerbase still competing in Mayhem even after people got caught cheating, and MA didn't disqualify said cheaters, and apparently the exploit on yog horror petys still not fixed (only fixed for laser weapons).
Click to expand...

about 1/3 of the top mayhem hunters on EL have been shooting for 24h straight for nearly 6 days now.. idk how they do that without going into organ failure for lack of sleep.

MA should just intro-duce an "auto-play pill" you can buy for 5 ped from the TT and it will shoot and loot for you for 12h
 
Rocket192 said:
about 1/3 of the top mayhem hunters on EL have been shooting for 24h straight for nearly 6 days now.. idk how they do that without going into organ failure for lack of sleep.

MA should just intro-duce an "auto-play pill" you can buy for 5 ped from the TT and it will shoot and loot for you for 12h
Click to expand...

and don't forget, to have shrap auto-convert to universal ammo
 
anti-botting.jpg


Easy.

This was heavy sarcasm, please check the batteries on your sarcasm detector.
 
Rocket192 said:
careful, "you know who" and company might buy some of these
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I don't know who buy them but I know at least 3 solid sources that sells them ingame and 1 of them post it publicly that no user got banned by mindark, the other 2 used made sources buys it between 5k-15k peds and works like a charm.
No one is locked or banned therefore I can only deduct botting is legal.
 
messi91 said:
I don't know who buy them but I know at least 3 solid sources that sells them ingame and 1 of them post it publicly that no user got banned by mindark, the other 2 used made sources buys it between 5k-15k peds and works like a charm.
No one is locked or banned therefore I can only deduct botting is legal.
Click to expand...

exactly.. they should just make it into a ring and sell it on the webshop.


"botter ring 2020" 50k peds.
 
Rocket192 said:
exactly.. they should just make it into a ring and sell it on the webshop.


"botter ring 2020" 50k peds.
Click to expand...

If I wanted, I could make a robot out of kinetic legos that just pressed F all day.

You can't stop it.
 
Rocket192 said:
Remove auto-target in any form.... all hunting has to be manual targeting.


edit: double hitbox sizes
Click to expand...

That doesn't stop botting, that just means the bot programmers have to stop being lazy and actually code something decent. Until MA start banning people using bots, they can use a lazy coded program to bot.

The hard part is confirming 100% that someone is using a bot. If you ban someone that isn't or has never used one, then that becomes a lawsuit. Its not like they go around naming their bot program, EUBot1_0.exe ....actually they probably do :laugh:
 
well... skills matter and we can't keep up skill-wise against botters.

if you can't get rid of botting then i want a skill boost to compensate me against botters.
 
They could get rid of the F key and demand manually targetting, or create bodyzones on creatures and put an incentive on them if they were killed in a manual more efficient way of targetting, but it would require alot of development work.
I would love manual targetting, thats how i have been hunting in space for many years - just missing the bodyzones.

If one makes rules they should be able to enforce them or people get frustrated about unenforced rules and ask why they need to obide when others dont - either way it would be good if they put meassures in place to reward players actively playing the game over player who use autoclickers/bots - if there was an incentive to put in the work and rewards/returns would get worse if someone didnt adjust because he/she wasnt there then this would drain botters in the long run - but not everyone has time and not everyone has money - it is important for the game to provide both ways for a wider audience and to keep the balance between those who have one but not the other (one could argue that if one doesnt have the time, dont be a hunter be a crafter and use the build in 'autoclick' for the bp farming sessions, etc).

An extrashot opportunity that needed to be spotted to give better loot when hit in combination with manual targetting could win out against bots provided the bot couldnt automate the action required - just as an idea.
Many games do use special complicated attack combinations to reward player skill - this doesnt mean some 'expert' out there cant build a cyborg but it for sure would shift the lvl of effort and reduce the number of cheap bots.
 
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One more thing to add, i think people are more upset about others gaining an advantage from using a bot then from them using a bot. I was already alluding to this in my previous post - incentivice active gameplay then it wont matter if someone uses a bot to accomplish some progress with limited personal time.
The argument i use in space to advocate for a fix of logged out stackable transport is the same planetside - players who dont play the game should never have an advantage over players who do.
As a game developer you just dont want your players to do something else, you want to imerse them as thats what is your best advertisement for the game.
 
The first things to do before proposing miracle solutions...

Would be, first, that MA wants to fight cheating. (which is not really the case)

Second, that they set up a team whose full-time job would be to fight against cheating. (which is not the case either)

Without that, and especially 1st point, all proposals are a complete waste of time.

But who knows, after all scandals lately, one after one, maybe MA will wake up eventually someday on this..
Hope is the lifeblood.. :rolleyes:
 
I don't really give a damn about bots for hunting, and I don't really understand why this is such a big deal to people tbh...

The only person that should care about it is messi since he's trying to be the top player and this is just a lazy way of getting there. But the money investment required is beyond what I'm willing to do so to me it's inapplicable and so I really couldn't care less.

Not to mention, I can park my Avatar at a crafting machine and set it up for an all day long crafting run, shut off the screen and go to work. Why shouldn't hunters or miners be able to do that too...

And PS: Manual targeting is never gonna happen, that would be a step backwards, MA is trying to bring Entropia into the 21st century, not send it back to the 1980s..
 
Part of my post in other thread. This is a possible semi-solution I think.
Sub-Zero said:
5. What steps are being taken to insure that botters can't get such a big advantage from human players?
For example in another game they have a "Stamina timer" (like 36 hours) after certain amount of hours (lets say 16 hours) you will get less skill points. If your stamina hours goes down to 0 you will get 0 skill points.
When you logout the stamina timer goes up based on the amount of hours you were logged out. So for example if you sleep for 8 hours logged out, you could get 16h stamina. This should help prevent 24/7 skilling. Maybe even give the player a X% debuff on loot return after 20 hours of continuous active gameplay.
Click to expand...
 
I really don't know if MA at any point in its history understood automated hunting as a problem. Or if it is only a means to promoting higher incomes to their economy. However since some players believe it is. It could be understood when players competing in Mayhems, automated hunting could be an inequality problem, in that case and only in that case, it would certainly be a problem, then I suggest Mayhem instance could be played as PVP, where it must shoot the mob without automated targeting it, and to treat the mob as just another PVP player.

Likewise, and understanding inequality as the main problem, I suggest that the environment of the Mayhems be like the Cyrene Hub, where you cannot use special rings, special cloaks, neopsions implants, unique armor and unique weapons, special pills, pets, etc. because all of them also break the equality of conditions to compete.

Thats my two pecs. :wtg:
 
i think the bigger issue is just lack of action at all.. i report botters in real time, apollo comes to check it out, gets no DM response from the player for over 30 minutes, issues a warning, and then vanishes again. (i beleive messi and soko both have videos/stream clips of this exact same avatar botting and getting talked to by apollo, yet that player is still in game every. single. day.)

MA never mentions/institutes policy/systems to counter botting to even make us feel like they care to do something about it.
 
the only soloution the players can do to end botting is to simply withdraw everything. let MA go broke and see if they start caring. im honestly sick of this attitude of MA. thankfully i withdrew nearly everything i had and am living on a few deed returns now. they wont get a single depo from me anymore. they fucked up too many times.
 
Since bots are allowed and entropiaraider on market over 7yr

Where boys to develop some minning bot? and screw up whole game economy that lead huge loss in markup wise
make even hard to someone breakeven or profit where this action eventual people are forced to deposit

See boys? its win/win to mindark its why they not CARE
If markups go 101% , mindark wins , its why mindark keep hand adjust loot tables to minimun possible make explore and min/max useless Have fun
 
Sub-Zero said:
The solution is to BAN them all. But MA won't do it yet, because it doesn't out-way the benefits of 24/7 revenue.
I mean cmon, the playerbase still competing in Mayhem even after people got caught cheating, and MA didn't disqualify said cheaters, and apparently the exploit on yog horror petys still not fixed (only fixed for laser weapons).
Click to expand...

It would not surprise me to see people punished after the fact that decide to use the Yog glitch with BLP or some other weapon in Mayhem. It's pretty clear MA doesn't want people using the Yog buff to achieve 55% reload speed and compete in Mayhem w/ others. They've removed scores of people that did that already, they'd do it again. Only, I think the next time they have to wipe a score there would be more consequences attached.
 
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Rocket192 said:
i think the bigger issue is just lack of action at all.. etc etc
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Maybe we dont understand the actions taken by MA

I play 12 years this game. In 12 years I have never seen a single serious advertisement for this game, neither on films, nor on TV, nor on radio, nor on the Internet. And after that I understand that the game's business model is not interested, at least for this moment, in making more money by increasing the number of players. Their current lagged platform does NOT seem to support more players, more over players who don't spend in-game.

That is why I think they have created the F key function (aims, shoots and loots), the promotion of tiers by returning the money for their creation, raising the TIR of all weapons so that can grow in tiers more quickly, returning all hunting expenses that were not done before. Among other measures for us veterans to invite us to recycle more PEDs.

In my opinion, I think many of us have NOT understood the message. The game cannot invest in more platform for new players who do not want to spend money because they are just starting out and only recycling a very few PECs. The game wants us (old players) to recycle more PEDs. Perhaps after of that, MA can invest in a new platform to summon new players and increase the player base and the economy.

Finally, I don't think it's a problem that they don't listen to us. I think rather, we have not understood what they need. We have not identified the problem correctly. The problem is not that people can hunt faster and spend more. That is what the game needs!. The problem is that in competition events, it can be played on equal terms. If we suggest that, it seems to me that they can hear it.

In my opinion this "big" problem started when a couple of players took it upon themselves to interpret the EULA in their own way. The EULA itself says if you think something is wrong, report it with MA and MA is the only one who decides whether or not the EULA was violated.

However I think inequality is a reeal problem when avatars compete for a prize in Mayhems. And it is only fair that it be corrected.

GL M8 :wtg:
 
Rocket192 said:
Remove auto-target in any form.... all hunting has to be manual targeting.


edit: double hitbox sizes
Click to expand...


Yes, it would solve it sure, all the shooter games have next target button i guess, that is why there is aimbot for every single shooter game exist, getting rid of it will sure solve the issue as there is no aimbot for any shooter game without next target button.
 
Since botters are being reported regularly and nothing (or very little) is being done about it, is it fair to say that botting is officially allowed?

And you're right, JBK, people, including myself, are frustrated about this because botters have an advantage in hunting, they can cycle faster while being efficient, skill their looter and other profs faster, get more MU per cycle, etc., while I can't. However, I can do this in crafting, can't skill looter prof this way, but it is what it is.

To those that think botting has no advantage, I'll tell you one simple thing. When you kill smaller mobs 24/7 for a prolonged period of time, your returns in the longrun would range from 95% to 100%+ with MU depending on the mob, wether you mine/craft and how the stars are aligned. Basically botters are able to efficiently cycle large amounts of PEDs, but those who hunt casually with ~90% returns have to constantly deposit to maintain the same cycle. There are other implications here that I'm not going to go into, bot those those who hunt (and hunt only) with ~90% returns... good luck.

This is why I have to agree with Rocket192, either make autohunting available to everyone (like autocrafting) in the form of pills, rings, or maybe a subscription, that would allow you to hunt while offline, or do something about it. Because what we have right now is people with hunting bots making constant profits and probably withdrawing as well, and the money they are withdrawing is being deposited by legit hunters.
 
Rocket192 said:
about 1/3 of the top mayhem hunters on EL have been shooting for 24h straight for nearly 6 days now.. idk how they do that without going into organ failure for lack of sleep.

MA should just intro-duce an "auto-play pill" you can buy for 5 ped from the TT and it will shoot and loot for you for 12h
Click to expand...

easy
More that one playing same account.
 
removing target next and other F key functionality will NOT solve the problem. It'll just result in more actual players ending up with RSI... which is a bad move for the game.

Also, with as much lag as we have removing this stuff will just result in a lot more players missing more often, and then they'll all come back here to complain...
 
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