Why Macroing is bad and should receive a mass banwave

[Shamshe]

Mayhem started an I hear and see a lot of people using macro's again.
Personaly I think it gives an unfair advantage to the people using it and gives them an edge on getting the items from the traders + it also fucks up the economy of the pills.
Therefor can we have an offcial statement of MA that says its actualy forbidden?
and maybe ban people using it for the duration of mayhem and longer of the repeat the offense.
I personaly have never used it but i am willing to be part of the problem if no solution is found for this...
one could even argue that if no botters where in the game there still would be plenty of good items in the mayhem vendor

Change my mind

 

[Barmonk]

Gues you dont know how to make a Macro, or dont have the funds to do it.
btw I just read the headline

 

[Shamshe]

Gues you dont know how to make a Macro, or dont have the funds to do it.
btw I just read the headline

I dont but I know plenty that do or have one and offered me one
Also 1 google search and 3 different ones pop up

so i dont get ur argument 90% of players dont know how to program yet still use a loottracker. Same thing

 

[AckerZ]

Ultimately MAs business model favours macro'ing - the inclusion of 'press F' for everything kind of confirmed that. A basic keyboard macro can do that for you with ease, no third party software needed. There was a post by an MA support staff a while back that said they have no real way to detect when players are doing it and will only act if someone clearly macroing is impacting other peoples play (mob stealing etc).

Even if you read the EU TOS they don't clearly state anywhere that keyboard macros are forbidden, they do mention something about intercepting packets (no clue that that means) or blatent hacking will result in a perma-ban but (I believe) they are intentionally vague about macroing because ultimately it benefits them. I think the only real way they could stop botting is if they fundamentally change the core hunting mechanic but in reality from a business perspective this would mean only significant revenue loss so I personally don't see them doing that anytime soon. Its a shame but it is what it is.

Im mainly a miner so this doesnt really affect me too much however the oversaturation of high level hunters does seem to make hunting near impossible to profit from without an uber build and associated looter levels. Hunting MU is mostly dead bar rares which is quite easy to blame the macro hunters for this but in reality I think the big decision that ultimately flatlined hunting MU was the inclusion of EP crafting needing only TT nanocubes, obviously for MA this has been a massive revenue boost however that came at the expense of hunters having extremely low mu to contend with >supply with <demand. They have removed EP BPs as a drop now but ultimately there are still thousands of them left in the game so I highly doubt we will see a fix to this problem nor the macro problem anytime soon as they both are good for MAs bottomline... personally i think the expression "if you cant beat them join them" is the only route to go here until MA give better clarity or change the core hunting mechanics.

 

[Shamshe]

well ultimatly like I said if nothing can be done about it and if you cant beat them just join them.
But MA should just state is it allowed yes or no. I mean it is a simple yes or no question.
I have over 40k EUR invested in my account so i dont rly want to risk it and i enjoy playing the game while chatting with friends or playing hearthstone on the side.
Still i need to sleep as i am not a robot so in order to level the playing field there seems to be no other option.
This is like a chain reaction where more and more people start botting wich we both agree on doesnt benefit the game or its players but only MA.

 

[Nik-Elas]

Just get your macro and farm those tokens brotha!!!

 

[Shamshe]

its like what Asmongold stated for wow can be applied here aswell if blizzard would add a button to the game where when you push it you receive 1 million gold we can all agree its bad and should be removed. Yet we all know every single player is gonne push that button.

This is the same thing

And yes i am a fan of Asmon, bite me

 

[messi91]

And yes i am a fan of Asmon, bite me

99.99% doesn't know who asmon is.You are safe.

 

[Alina]

And yes i am a fan of Asmon, bite me

Ice Poseidon made Asmon

 

[Killahbee]

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF I wasFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF not FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF afk.

WhatFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFsup?FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

 

[Shamshe]

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF I wasFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF not FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF afk.

WhatFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFsup?FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

you forgot the 6-24 hour delay on the actual answer

 

[Katie Chalmers]

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF I wasFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF not FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF afk.

WhatFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFsup?FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Nah we fixed that remember?

PSA - How To: Avoid Chat Spam While Hunting

Alright, now that I have your attention - there is a major problem. I've seen several participants of Entropia Universe who are using MindArk approved methods of hunting spamming chat with F or other keys unintentionally. Whether it's a PM, trade chat, or whatever - this can easily be avoided...

www.planetcalypsoforum.com

 

[mastermesh]

Carpel Tunnel is a reality.

 

[Legends]

I would rather MA put effort into finding a solution regarding people creating multiple accounts to get around the hassle of travelling between planets or to gain 30 additional slots on the auction...

 

[Rocket192]

banning macro users directly harms MA's revenue.


unless it directly interferes with the gameplay of another player they will not do anything about it. economic repercussions of macro users does not "directly" interfere with the gameplay of another player.


it sucks but it's just the way this game will operate.

if it were a problem they wanted to fix they would have rolled back the "f to win" update from 2018.

 

[SoberPhil]

MA did say they are working on a new hunting mechanism, they didn't specify how radical the changes are going to be, but there's a clear hint at it becoming more interactive. That might put an end to botting or severely limit it, which would be great. I don't expect them to do anything about it now because they need more players.

The fun part is reading posts by those who claim to actively hunt 20 hours a day every day like it has no health implications and anyone can go on like that forever.

 

[Gopher]

MA did say they are working on a new hunting mechanism, they didn't specify how radical the changes are going to be, but there's a clear hint at it becoming more interactive. That might put an end to botting or severely limit it, which would be great. I don't expect them to do anything about it now because they need more players.

The fun part is reading posts by those who claim to actively hunt 20 hours a day every day like it has no health implications and anyone can go on like that forever.

Hopefully that reload feature we saw on the hud isnt the only countermeasure, its easy to put an extra button on a macro/bot.

 

[jetsina]

In the evolution of developing new strategies, it is the 'aggressor' that moves first, and the defender that responds if a threat is serious.
However, the defender can also respond by adapting positively to the attack and welcoming it.
Birds eating seeds with no coating caused plants to add protection just strong enough to survive digestion and were thus spread far and wide in a still fertile state. Plants even rewarded birds with juicy outer parts (the concept of fruit) to pay them for the dispersal.

MA benefits from 'mild' afk playstyles imho and thus has made it easier with 'f', for example. The crazy thing is not allowing us all to use simple macros openly, or, for that matter, not allowing us multiple avatars officially.

We shall see if changes are just token moves that do very little to defeat anybody wishing to bot, or if the moves can both deny bots AND make gameplay enjoyable for real people at the keyboards!

 

[infamousH4]

its all one big joke

 

[Goldenboy24]

a very long time ago, there was no "select next target", there was no autolocking on target, when you shot the air, ammo got consumed, was there any bots hunting back then, when human input for success was needed ?

and I know what the dummies will say, oh, you will hurt everybody by removing these features
YES
you wanna get rid of bots, you will have to make a little sacrifice, if you don't wanna make that change, then accept that bots are here to stay

 

[Katie Chalmers]

a very long time ago, there was no "select next target", there was no autolocking on target, when you shot the air, ammo got consumed, was there any bots hunting back then, when human input for success was needed ?

and I know what the dummies will say, oh, you will hurt everybody by removing these features
YES
you wanna get rid of bots, you will have to make a little sacrifice, if you don't wanna make that change, then accept that bots are here to stay

That would be the equivalent of putting a shotgun to your face to stop your nose itching.
MA will not commit commercial suicide. The game has become more inclusive to a wide array of people for a reason.
Instead, MA could just give a very small benefit for aiming manually, say a higher crit chance. The rest of us can just keep effing our butts off.

To add. Your proposal won't stop bots. It will only stop F spam macros. People will just develop better bots that get used in other FPS games to headshot everything.

 

[Gopher]

That would be the equivalent of putting a shotgun to your face to stop your nose itching.
MA will not commit commercial suicide. The game has become more inclusive to a wide array of people for a reason.
Instead, MA could just give a very small benefit for aiming manually, say a higher crit chance. The rest of us can just keep effing our butts off.

To add. Your proposal won't stop bots. It will only stop F spam macros. People will just develop better bots that get used in other FPS games to headshot everything.

bots will never be stopped, only that it would become way easier for MA to see that they are bots when obstacles are put in the way

 

[Westy]

I think MA have gone too far down macro path already to say no. e.g. Press F, press auto use for extracting, AFK crafting. Likely you need to ban all of these. I think if you want to auto shoot in a solo instance your not bothering anyone. But if your doing that in a open space with other avatars and affecting their play (which we do see) that is not right.

 

[lethal]

I also would really like a statement on whether macroing is ok. For those of us who follow the rules in EU and don't want to test our luck it would be nice to know for sure. I could actually have the time to hunt a lot if I could macro, but overall I have mixed feelings on how bad it is for the game. Too many players with a big advantage DPP/EFF/looter wise macroing kills the markup on loot overall and makes normal hunting a big loss almost everywhere for the casual masses. If it's allowed though I would also like to take advantage of it even though I would just be feeding money with my ugly adjusted maddox and beast combo to skill up.

 

[Shamshe]

they have no real way to detect when players are doing it

you dont need to detect it just need to prevent it or minimalize it. they could for example make the instances last 1hr or make them make u a different interaction after killing each boss. Just make this game botproof plz and ty

 

[Gopher]

you dont need to detect it just need to prevent it or minimalize it. they could for example make the instances last 1hr or make them make u a different interaction after killing each boss. Just make this game botproof plz and ty

If f is removed then bots would be easy to see, one slipup and they get a perma, so stuff doesnt need to be added like that to diminish the average players experience. If MA actually cared about enforcing their TOS, most ubers would be banned, which is really sad. Botting hurts the game long-term even if it benefits MA short-term. It seems MA doesnt care about the players and only cares about $$, which is ironic since they act like a bank and banks need people to function. If most casual/non-uber players quit the game, MA would go bankrupt since ubers would have no one to buy their stuff, leading to them eventually quitting too.

 

[DrGirlfriend]

botting and f spam and macro and all that will be gone in ua5

 

[Atrax]

botting and f spam and macro and all that will be gone in ua5

Ah crap it's a shame we're getting UE5, then.

sorry I couldn't help that.

F-spam may be gone, or the button changed. Botting will never be gone from gaming, and as long as we're using keyboards, we'll have keyboard macros. I have no idea what plans they have for the changeover but at least if they swap some basic functions around, it will cost macro users the time to re-code.

That's such a confident statement though, I'm wondering if you have secrets ....

 

[Goldenboy24]

That would be the equivalent of putting a shotgun to your face to stop your nose itching.

removing autoselect next target, removing auto-aim, and adding cost to missed shots, oh yes, how unthinkable to play in such a barbaric way

MA will not commit commercial suicide. The game has become more inclusive to a wide array of people for a reason.
Instead, MA could just give a very small benefit for aiming manually, say a higher crit chance. The rest of us can just keep effing our butts off.

talking about inclusivity, I have heard, that if you make make the game as generic as possible, so that it can attract as many people as possible, makes your game very unique and very successful, in fact, don't you understand that what really makes entropia the most inclusive game of them all, is the difference between having autoaim, and not having it, its just that simple lel

To add. Your proposal won't stop bots. It will only stop F spam macros. People will just develop better bots that get used in other FPS games to headshot everything.

very true, we all know that games that require a lot of human input are dominated by bots just as much as games where all you need is a autoklicker to play, because developing a bot who can mimic human behaviour would basically just take extra 5 mins, I will write the code right now

"if enemy, execute "perfect bot code""
"if enemy dead, loot enemy"

 

[tazb]

unless it directly interferes with the gameplay of another player they will not do anything about it. economic repercussions of macro users does not "directly" interfere with the gameplay of another player.

Wish that was true. Made alot of tickets for guys that were botting in open space hunting zones such as warlocks / feffoids (components)
even with videos recorded and screenshots sent.

Guess what was the response or rather lack of it : )))