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Cost of killing a mob with different weapons (inc. skill based, overkill, regen, amp, enhancers etc.)

Switched to using DataTables instead. Pagination is done by default of 100 results. Everything is on the client side and in javascript though, so switching between pages is instantaneous.

Also dropped the previous column sorting code, resulting in lightning fast sorting (sorting is done on all pages, not just the page currently showing).

Results can further be filtered using DataTables "search" input box, filtering the results in real time. Multiple columns can be searched for at the same time. Example, try entering "laser pistol (L)" and only limited laser pistols will be shown (without a page reload).

Rendering time of the page is reduces quite a bit also, so it should be easier to handle larger result sets now.
 
scorch said:
Thanks! The markup comes from Entropedia, ans is sadly not updated automatically. It gets updated whenever I reimport weapons from Entropedia, which isn't all too often. Last time the import ran was 2012-06-07, so the markup is about eleven days "old".

If I find a way to update the markup regularly and automatically I will add it, though as of now I don't know if it's possible.
Click to expand...

market value data with auctiondata is updated each 6 hours....... in my signature
dc
 
Dragon Boat Festival update!

  • Valid HTML5,
  • Implemented BrowserID login,
  • Search filters can be hidden with the "Show/hide filters" link.

Nothing can be done so far when logged in. I'm trying to think about fun things you should be able to do while logged in; possibly saving searches, default search options and preferred language.
 
  • Minimized and combined css and js for less connections and smaller size,
  • Static header height so the g+/BrowserID button doesn't shift everything when loaded,
  • No creature needs to be selected to calculate cost, as long as there are positive real values in the HP/Regen boxes it will be shown,
  • Amp ammo burn, amp decay per second and amp decay per use is now included in the results (previously it was included in the weapon decay per sec/use for some reason).
 
Interface that connects to several databases and is still lightning fast.
Hmm.. maybe this is not inevitable that everything is so slow and buggy? :silly2:

Reminds me there's a difference between a bunch of losers and the real programmer. :)

+rep
 
Fifth said:
Interface that connects to several databases and is still lightning fast.
Hmm.. maybe this is not inevitable that everything is so slow and buggy? :silly2:

Reminds me there's a difference between a bunch of losers and the real programmer. :)

+rep
Click to expand...

As long as you work with billions of datarows it is supposed to be fast, just a couple of thousand rows should be performant otherwise the developer should reconsider what they did. However - load is not only produced by complex datastructures but also by concurrent access of several thousand users so network bottlenecks, weak machines and so on may also be an issue - not only the programmer who wrote the code, but was not involved into the process of planning the infrastructure.

Sry for going off-topic.
 
Hello,

Are you still working on this calculator? If yes, then please kindly look at the way the finishers are incorporated into the costs of the kill. It seems off in a sense.

Maybe it does work for the higher hp mobs, but it doesn't seem that way if you look at the lower hp mobs.

For instance, a carabok puny which has 10 hp and 0.1 regen according to your calculator.

And according to your calculator,
Without Finishers
Case 1: Using S.I. Psy-Blade, the kill cost is 0.0407 (PEDs).
Case 2: Using S.I. HK110, the kill cost is 0.0409 (PEDs).
(I understand that these are the average costs taking into account critics and misses and some kills taking 2 to 3 hits while others taking 7 but averaged it becomes around 4 hits.)

But what I don't get is the below with finishers.

With Finishers
Case 1: Using S.I. Psy-Blade first then switch to S.I. HK110 (as finisher), the kill cost becomes 0.0324 (PEDs?).
Case 2: Using S.I. HK110 first then switch to S.I. Psy-Blade (as finisher), the kill cost becomes 0.0386 (PEDs?).

Quite some difference in this case right? Since both weapons have the same cost per shot (decay+ammo vs decay only) as well as same damage range (2.0 to 4.0). And therefore, ought to have the same kill costs regardless of which one is used as well as which one is used first.

The only reason I could think of for this discrepancy is because of the "regen" of the mob being the "devil" here.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

After thinking things through, I think that probably your right and the calculation isn't wrong. However, if that's the case, then it really gives us alot of insight into our choices of weapons (which at the moment seems to be upon "dmg/pec" and eco).

As your calculator will reveal that this isn't so and rather we should also consider the damage per second factor as well as mob hp and mob regen. As in the above example, using S.I. Psy-Blade (which has more atks per second and thus deals more dmg/sec) first and then switching to S.I. HK110 "actually"** reduces the costs per kill because the regen hp becomes less significant than compared to using the S.I. HK110 first. (Even though both has the same dmg/pec "eco").

Frankly, I can't wait and see the results when you complete this calculator. Fantastic work imho. :wtg:

TY,
Eri.

** This is the part my brain can't comprehend. Imagine this scenario, if using S.I. Psy-Blade first and then switch to S.I. HK110 for the kill. Shouldn't the cost be the same as using the S.I. Psy-Blade all the way and even for the finishing kill (Since both have same costs per hit)?
 
Last edited:
sawachika said:
As your calculator will reveal that this isn't so and rather we should also consider the damage per second factor as well as mob hp and mob regen. As in the above example, using S.I. Psy-Blade (which has more atks per second and thus deals more dmg/sec) first and then switching to S.I. HK110 "actually"** reduces the costs per kill because the regen hp becomes less significant than compared to using the S.I. HK110 first. (Even though both has the same dmg/pec "eco").
Click to expand...

When doing calculations on mobs with so low HP, the calculator won't really be that realistic. It's more of a long-term, mid-mob helper. :)

But anyway, the theory behind it is the same for any kind of mob. Since the Psy-Blade deals more damage per second than the HK110, it would be usefull to start with the Psy-Blade because the mob will die faster, so it won't be able to regenerate as much as it would if you had used the HK110 first, right?

If you ignore the finisher, the mob would die faster witht he Psy-Blade and thus not be able to regenerate as. But since the damage/use of the Psy-Blade is higher than the HK110, the average overkill with the Psy-Blade is higher than the HK110, so it would make sense to use the HK110 for a finisher to lower the average overkill cost. And since as soon as your Psy-Blade has "reloaded", you can just as easily switch to your HK110 and use it for the last shot as you could have used your Psy-Blade, so the attacks per second doesn't matter for the finisher if it will kill it in one hit (which is taken into consideration, hit, miss, crit).

When looking at it the other way, it's just unfortunate that the HK110 isn't such a good weapon to use against the Carabok Puny, so the "finisher" Psy-Blade is suggested. But only since it's cheaper to use than the HK110 for the Carabok Puny.

I hope that clarifies some of the questions, hehe. It's a little hard to explain, and I guess even harder to understand if you havn't thought about it for a long time and written a calculator for it. :p

sawachika said:
Frankly, I can't wait and see the results when you complete this calculator. Fantastic work imho. :wtg:
Click to expand...

Thanks! Little low on ideas for new features except huge ones which will take some time, so I don't really know when a new update will come.

PS.

I just updated the weapons database, updating all existing weapons with updated information from Entropedia and also adding 28 new weapons discovered since the last import.
 
Thank you for the prompt reply and explanation.

BTW, I did a small data collection and found out that your calculator's cost per kill isn't too far off. Using Sollomate Kiwio Mk. II (L) on punies, I found my average kill cost to be about 0.0431904 while your calculator shows 0.0428. When I used S.I. Scorpion, my average kill cost is around 0.0418238 while your calculator shows 0.0409.

Overall, the actual cost is only about 1% - 2% more than your calculator's, so its a fantastic piece of work you've done. :thumbup:

Eri
 
sawachika said:
Thank you for the prompt reply and explanation.

BTW, I did a small data collection and found out that your calculator's cost per kill isn't too far off. Using Sollomate Kiwio Mk. II (L) on punies, I found my average kill cost to be about 0.0431904 while your calculator shows 0.0428. When I used S.I. Scorpion, my average kill cost is around 0.0418238 while your calculator shows 0.0409.

Overall, the actual cost is only about 1% - 2% more than your calculator's, so its a fantastic piece of work you've done. :thumbup:

Eri
Click to expand...

Thanks. :)

Nice to know! I have actually never tested if any of this is correct, haha. I've only done the calculations and know it's correct in theory (as long as there are no bugs, of course!).

The hard thing about estimates on "average" is that you need a very, very long test run to make it more or less exact, preferably infinitely long, hehe, so it's natural that it's off a little.
 
Minor update that can be seen, lot of work was done on the backend though. Planning to release the code on Github sometime in the future, so have to do some cleaning before that.

Backend:

  • Lots and lots of refactoring, getting the code ready to go on github,
  • Some optimization.

Frontend:

  • Moved the filters to the right of the selections, better use of available space,
  • Moved some other small stuff around to fit better.
 
  • Fixed a division by zero bug when finishers weren't strong enough to kill the selected mob,
  • Added a "Weapon ID" search field to limit result to a single weapon; mostly used when linking to a finisher.
 
Added 29 new weapons discovered since 2012-09-03, some of which are from the new VU.

I have also been asked to incorporate the tool with entropialife, which I plan to do as soon as I have the time to make the necessary changes!
 
Very nice tool, good effort! +rep

Hope you keep updating it :cool:
 
scorch said:
Added 29 new weapons discovered since 2012-09-03, some of which are from the new VU.

I have also been asked to incorporate the tool with entropialife, which I plan to do as soon as I have the time to make the necessary changes!
Click to expand...

That's great news, this is by far one of the most useful tools I've come across in Entropia so far :)
 
Fixed some bugs that came with the earlier refactoring update.

  • Selected amplifiers are now remembered after a search,
  • Enhancers are no longer a show stopper,
  • Some division by zero issues when weapon DPS was exactly the same as creature regen,
  • Amplifiers too strong for a weapon were not discarded,
  • Added 60 new weapons discovered since 2012-10-11.
 
Fixed a bug were professions were not applied correctly, giving incorrect dmg/pec and cost.
 
Scorch,

Awesome tool. Do you plan on adding the Herman Ark-30 Jungle weapon to the list or creatures like Rextellum and Levis?

Regards

RRT
 
Roy Tyrell said:
Scorch,

Awesome tool. Do you plan on adding the Herman Ark-30 Jungle weapon to the list or creatures like Rextellum and Levis?

Regards

RRT
Click to expand...

Thanks! The ARK-30 Jungle (L) is there, see here. No unlimited exists on Entropedia though.

There is no known regen rate on neither Leviathan or Rextellum on Entropedia, so I can't add them. Any creature who's not in the tool is because either its HP is not known or its regen rate is not known. Same goes with weapons; if the decay rate of a weapon or the number of attacks per minute is not known, it will not be shown in the tool.

I've also imported 30 new weapons and 4 new creatures since 2012-10-26.

New weapons:

Code: 
[0] => CalyTrek CR Soul MK.I (L)
[1] => CalyTrek CR Spirit Mk.II (L)
[2] => CalyTrek CR Spirit Mk.III (L)
[3] => CCA/Chikara LR-3 Colonial (L)
[4] => Chikara Oni-Go (L)
[5] => Chikara Oni-San (L)
[6] => Corrosive Attack Nanochip VIII (L)
[7] => Corrosive Attack Nanochip X (L)
[8] => Corrosive Attack Nanochip XI (L)
[9] => Cryogenic Attack Nanochip V (L)
[10] => Cryogenic Attack Nanochip VII (L)
[11] => Enkidd Howler S.5 (L)
[12] => EWE LC-150 Tactical (L)
[13] => Genesis Icerage (L)
[14] => Herman SIR-40
[15] => Herman SIR-50
[16] => Imperium Pilot Scorpion Rank 16 (L)
[17] => Isis LC-55 (L)
[18] => Isis Project Zero-Nine (L)
[19] => Isis Project Zero-One (L)
[20] => Isis Project Zero-Six (L)
[21] => Isis Project Zero-Three (L)
[22] => Jashonich SIF-S (L)
[23] => Kinetic Attack Nanochip III (L)
[24] => Lacerating Attack Nanochip IV (L)
[25] => Lacerating Attack Nanochip IX (L)
[26] => Lacerating Attack Nanochip VIII (L)
[27] => MarCorp Kallous-3 (L)
[28] => MarCorp Kallous-4 (L)
[29] => Starkhov LPR-4 (L)

New creatures:

Code: 
[0] => Crystal Pede Single Maturity Mob
[1] => Nusul Old
[2] => Pirate Skeleton Quartermaster
[3] => Tiarak Young
 
Thanks for the prompt reply, Scorch.

I think I found why i couldn't see the Ark-30 Jungle the first time. When you don't enter anything in the hit and damage fields, all of the weapons appear. However, if I enter in 67 in both, the the Ark-30 Jungle (L) doesnt appear at all. What I do is enter in selection criteria for BLP, Rifle and select Dante as the amp.

I also had some interesting error results when I tried to find meele weapon costs. I'll take a screenshot of those and email it to you. Please take a look and see if you experience the same thing.

Finally, thanks for explaining why some mobs dont appear. I'll see if I can find the regen info for these or somehow come up with a close approximation to enter in Entropedia.

Regards,

RRT
 
ya melee costs dont seem to work

i either get Warning: Division by zero in /var/www/eldslott.org/entropia/include/calculator.php on line 50 or Warning: Division by zero in /var/www/eldslott.org/entropia/include/calculator.php on line 590

--dale>
 
dalewj said:
ya melee costs dont seem to work

i either get Warning: Division by zero in /var/www/eldslott.org/entropia/include/calculator.php on line 50 or Warning: Division by zero in /var/www/eldslott.org/entropia/include/calculator.php on line 590

--dale>
Click to expand...

Thanks for mentioning. Can you post a link to a search where you get that?
 
Roy Tyrell said:
Thanks for the prompt reply, Scorch.

I think I found why i couldn't see the Ark-30 Jungle the first time. When you don't enter anything in the hit and damage fields, all of the weapons appear. However, if I enter in 67 in both, the the Ark-30 Jungle (L) doesnt appear at all. What I do is enter in selection criteria for BLP, Rifle and select Dante as the amp.

I also had some interesting error results when I tried to find meele weapon costs. I'll take a screenshot of those and email it to you. Please take a look and see if you experience the same thing.

Finally, thanks for explaining why some mobs dont appear. I'll see if I can find the regen info for these or somehow come up with a close approximation to enter in Entropedia.

Regards,

RRT
Click to expand...

The problem with the ARK's have been fixed, thanks for telling me!

Still looking into the melee problem, but haven't been able to reproduce it yet. If you can post a link to a search that fails it would help a lot!
 
scorch said:
The problem with the ARK's have been fixed, thanks for telling me!

Still looking into the melee problem, but haven't been able to reproduce it yet. If you can post a link to a search that fails it would help a lot!
Click to expand...

Scorch,

Thanks for fixing the issue with the Arks!!

As for shortblades, here is an example of the error that appears when I select shortblades, enter in a level of 36 and put in some damage enhancers:



It shows the error appearing on line 590. Thanks again for this great tool!!

Reagrds
 
Roy Tyrell said:
Scorch,

Thanks for fixing the issue with the Arks!!

As for shortblades, here is an example of the error that appears when I select shortblades, enter in a level of 36 and put in some damage enhancers:



It shows the error appearing on line 590. Thanks again for this great tool!!

Reagrds
Click to expand...

Glad you like it! :)

I've fixed the line 590 errors. Problem with float values for some weapon markups.

I was never able to fully reproduce the errors though, I got the line 590 errors, but I still got the result list. In your screen shot it looks like you got the errors and no results... Can you see if the problem is fixed for you?
 
nice tool ..
 
scorch said:
Glad you like it! :)

I've fixed the line 590 errors. Problem with float values for some weapon markups.

I was never able to fully reproduce the errors though, I got the line 590 errors, but I still got the result list. In your screen shot it looks like you got the errors and no results... Can you see if the problem is fixed for you?
Click to expand...

Scorch,

That seemed to fix the issue with the blades. Ran accross another error which I am trying to recreate consistently to report to you.

Another thing I noticed is that now all of the weopon markups appear as 100%, even when you slect the check box to use the markup in the calculation of the cost to kill.

Again, great work on this. I'm now going to try and figure out how to calculate regen on some of the mobs that I am interested in hunting, but lack any regen info in Entropedia. I may have to reverse engineer a number, if I cant find info on how folks got to that number in the past.

Regards,

RRT
 
Are the pop dragons in yet? ;)
 
Roy Tyrell said:
Scorch,

That seemed to fix the issue with the blades. Ran accross another error which I am trying to recreate consistently to report to you.

Another thing I noticed is that now all of the weopon markups appear as 100%, even when you slect the check box to use the markup in the calculation of the cost to kill.

Again, great work on this. I'm now going to try and figure out how to calculate regen on some of the mobs that I am interested in hunting, but lack any regen info in Entropedia. I may have to reverse engineer a number, if I cant find info on how folks got to that number in the past.

Regards,

RRT
Click to expand...

Markup showing as 100% has been fixed now, sorry I missed your reply. :)
 
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