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Intuition ?

Stormer

Stormer

Prowler
Joined
Jul 21, 2005
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Calypso
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Freelancer
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The Legendary Stormer Deluxe
When does Intuition unlock?

My guess would be lvl 80 Evader

No other skills unlocks over lvl 80 (Killstrike is lvl 80 -damage- for example and is the uberskill for hunting)

Can anyone confirm this? (even if its not common these days to trigger this uberskill)

:dodge:

EDIT: my own research shows that its between lvl 72 <-> lvl 85
 
Kyl said:
optimist eh? ;)
Click to expand...

Seriously.


Good luck with this, Stormer. I couldn't even get anyone to volunteer information about Quickness until someone new unlocked it.

Due to the way the system is designed it was previously only possible to get up to level 83 evader without Quickness, but that isn't going to help narrow down things for Intuition much.
 
Unlocks between 7-7,5k natural evade I heared. I hope you dont start from scratch :)
 
Akoz said:
Unlocks between 7-7,5k natural evade I heared. I hope you dont start from scratch :)
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hehehe, im lvl 73 evader with only 5k evade and 4k avoidance

maybe i should post my skills for the skilling-researching-crews
 
I would really like to see you skills for level 73 evader. I'm level 37 with 4.6k evade and 3.2k avoidance. Massive difference.

Edit: oh, I vaguely remember reading that Intuition unlocked at level 75, although thats probably someone guessing - of course I can't find the post now, so could be a figment of my imagination - lol
 
Trabin said:
I would really like to see you skills for level 73 evader. I'm level 37 with 4.6k evade and 3.2k avoidance. Massive difference.

Edit: oh, I vaguely remember reading that Intuition unlocked at level 75, although thats probably someone guessing - of course I can't find the post now, so could be a figment of my imagination - lol
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Very big difference.

Could this be due to any other skills you chipped in or out? Or maybe one of you has a bigger Dodge skill. Course there's all the others too. Which all don't necessarily come from hunting. ALso could this gap be something to do with attributes?
 
I can confirm that you do not get intuition at level 75 evader.
 
Dom_sufc said:
Very big difference.

Could this be due to any other skills you chipped in or out? Or maybe one of you has a bigger Dodge skill. Course there's all the others too. Which all don't necessarily come from hunting. ALso could this gap be something to do with attributes?
Click to expand...

I bet the big difference is caused by stormer's ~10k level in athletics, courage and combat reflexes.

We tried to research the evader profession in this thread and those are the most influencing defensive skills (apart from evade itself, obviously).

stormer, we're lacking some uber-data in that thread to finish the research, so you're welcome to post your skills... :)

/jdegre.
 
73.8 evader here and no intuition yet but selling evade now not gonna yet intuition in a long while
 
intuition

new reseaching shows that intuition unlocks at lvl 80 Evader

im going to post new data info very soon
 
My Current Defence Skills:

Alertness: 9997
Athletics: 9890
Courage: 9918
Quickness: 8092
Serendipity: 9614
Combat Reflexes: 9948
Combat Sence: 9792
Avoidance: 4023
Evade: 5230

Evader: 72,2

With that low Avoidance/Evade i might get lvl 80 evader "quite cheap" :scratch2:
 
Stormer said:
Alertness: 9997
Athletics: 9890
Courage: 9918
Quickness: 8092
Serendipity: 9614
Combat Reflexes: 9948
Combat Sence: 9792
Avoidance: 4023
Evade: 5230

Evader: 72,2

With that low Avoidance/Evade i might get lvl 80 evader "quite cheap" :scratch2:
Click to expand...


Im virtually in the same boat as you, lemme know how "cheap" it turns out to be ;)
 
Stormer said:
Alertness: 9997
Athletics: 9890
Courage: 9918
Quickness: 8092
Serendipity: 9614
Combat Reflexes: 9948
Combat Sence: 9792
Avoidance: 4023
Evade: 5230

Evader: 72,2

With that low Avoidance/Evade i might get lvl 80 evader "quite cheap" :scratch2:
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Relatively. I'll trade you a korss H400 for your aimk2 so you don't have so much trouble killing mobs before they can attack you.

Nice skills. :eek:
 
Wee i broke the forum again. :D
 
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Doer said:
Relatively. I'll trade you a korss H400 for your aimk2 so you don't have so much trouble killing mobs before they can attack you. :yup:

Nice skills. :eek:
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UL korss?
.
 
Although I unlocked Intuition in the old skill system (back in July 2006), I recorded my skill levels when it unlocked.

Alertness: 9169
Athletics: 9244
Courage: 10131
Quickness: 8859
Serendipity: 8726
Combat Reflexes: 10017
Combat Sense: 9044
Avoidance: 8541
Evade: 8055


Perhaps by plugging these in to Evade prostanding formula may help in determining the required Evader level to unlock Intuition.

(The skill notice which resulted in the unlocking of Intuition was Combat Sense, fwiw).
 
neomaven said:
Although I unlocked Intuition in the old skill system (back in July 2006), I recorded my skill levels when it unlocked.

Alertness: 9169
Athletics: 9244
Courage: 10131
Quickness: 8859
Serendipity: 8726
Combat Reflexes: 10017
Combat Sense: 9044
Avoidance: 8541
Evade: 8055


Perhaps by plugging these in to Evade prostanding formula may help in determining the required Evader level to unlock Intuition.

(The skill notice which resulted in the unlocking of Intuition was Combat Sense, fwiw).
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Thanks Neo. We don't know how much Quickness contributes but I am guessing somewhere between 6 and 11 percent because there is 17% missing with the current breakdown, which lacks only Intuition and Quickness (and Agility).

If Quickness contributes 11% then the professional standing from your skills when you unlocked Intuition was ~84.4. A smaller 6% contribution from Quickness (the same as Avoidance's) yields an uncanny level 79.95 Evader standing. It seems very likely that Stormer's prediction of a level 80 unlock is correct.

It is most unfortunate it's so high because with a ~10% contribution to Evader professional standing, Intuition is quite useful, yet it's so absurdly unattainable now by skilling.

Edit: I forgot to account for the capping of skills at 10k when doing this calculation. The result is still similar, though: see jdegre's follow-up.
 
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Doer said:
Thanks Neo. We don't know how much Quickness contributes but I am guessing somewhere between 6 and 11 percent because there is 17% missing with the current breakdown, which lacks only Intuition and Quickness (and Agility).

If Quickness contributes 11% then the professional standing from your skills when you unlocked Intuition was ~84.4. A smaller 6% contribution from Quickness (the same as Avoidance's) yields an uncanny level 79.95 Evader standing. It seems very likely that Stormer's prediction of a level 80 unlock is correct.

It is most unfortunate it's so high because with a ~10% contribution to Evader professional standing, Intuition is quite useful, yet it's so absurdly unattainable now by skilling.
Click to expand...

It must be higher than 80 for this reason: I recorded the skill levels the instant I unlocked intuition. Note that all related skills are above 8000. Regardless of the relative weights assigned to the various related skills, if the requirement were Level 80 evader, I would have unlocked it sooner.Since I did not, the required prostanding must be above 80, no? Of course there is also the possibility that the requirements were adjusted in the "new" skill system.

On a side note, I do not think we in fact even have a "new" skill system, only that we can now see more data. I believe what we see now already existed in the background; MA simply provided us a more complete picture of skills and their relation to prostandings when the "skill VU" was introduced.
 
neomaven said:
It must be higher than 80 for this reason: I recorded the skill levels the instant I unlocked intuition. Note that all related skills are above 8000. Regardless of the relative weights assigned to the various related skills, if the requirement were Level 80 evader, I would have unlocked it sooner.Since I did not, the required prostanding must be above 80, no? Of course there is also the possibility that the requirements were adjusted in the "new" skill system.

On a side note, I do not think we in fact even have a "new" skill system, only that we can now see more data. I believe what we see now already existed in the background; MA simply provided us a more complete picture of skills and their relation to prostandings when the "skill VU" was introduced.
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Totally agree with that, MA didnt change to skil system in that sence, but they have made it harder to skill up. its much harder to gain skills above 5k now then it used to be, so in that sence its harder to unlock,

Pro standings have not changed, just gave out more info.
Ma gives out info as soon as the players found out how it works, then they give it out. thats how it works.

Neo, there is some % left in the skill calc for evader like intuation so u need to take the % u hvnt got any in off your total. ao if intuation is 10% off yourt evader skill u need to take 10% off all your skills, and then calc what your evader is i think.
 
CycoKick said:
Neo, there is some % left in the skill calc for evader like intuation so u need to take the % u hvnt got any in off your total. ao if intuation is 10% off yourt evader skill u need to take 10% off all your skills, and then calc what your evader is i think.
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Good point. So you are saying that if Intuition for example constitutes 10% of Evader prostanding, then because it is only at 1 until it gets unlocked, it brings down the weighted average, resulting in the need for other skills to be higher to reach the necessary prostanding to unlock the "frozen" skill. Makes sense I guess. One way to test this is to chip out some evade or other related skill from an avatar with about 3k Intuition, and thereby recalculate the relative weights, comparing avatars with intuition, and those without.
 
CycoKick said:
Neo, there is some % left in the skill calc for evader like intuation so u need to take the % u hvnt got any in off your total. ao if intuation is 10% off yourt evader skill u need to take 10% off all your skills, and then calc what your evader is i think.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Having a skill level over 8k for 9 out of the (possibly) 10 skills involved, does not make your pro-standing to be over 80.

In fact, setting quickness at 6.5% almost nails down your level at 80 at the moment of unlocking intuition and it is also very accurate for stormer's skills (72.12 calculated vs. 72.20 real).

I've made the calcs assuming that those skills over 10k are capped at this level, which was something widely believed at the time you unlocked intuition, and probably was changed in VU 8.8.

It is possible that quickness is somewhat lower and that agility plays a greater role. This is uncertain atm.

And I also agree 100% that all pro-standings that we can see now, have been there always. No change there.

/jdegre.


BTW, stormer, I've done a very very fast calc about what would it take for you to get to level 80 by chipping evade and avoidance and, with the last skill nerf, and current skill chip prices, I'd be surprised if you can get it cheaper than 50k ped.
 
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jdegre said:
Exactly. Having a skill level over 8k for 9 out of the (possibly) 10 skills involved, does not make your pro-standing to be over 80.

In fact, setting quickness at 6.5% almost nails down your level at 80 at the moment of unlocking intuition and it is also very accurate for stormer's skills (72.12 calculated vs. 72.20 real).

I've made the calcs assuming that those skills over 10k are capped at this level, which was something widely believed at the time you unlocked intuition, and probably was changed in VU 8.8.

It is possible that quickness is somewhat lower and that agility plays a greater role. This is uncertain atm.

And I also agree 100% that all pro-standings that we can see now, have been there always. No change there.

/jdegre.


BTW, stormer, I've done a very very fast calc about what would it take for you to get to level 80 by chipping evade and avoidance and, with the last skill nerf, and current skill chip prices, I'd be surprised if you can get it cheaper than 50k ped.
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Yes, my Evader is a bit under 7,2..more likley 7,15 or maybe even 7,12 as you say ( i looked fast yesterday)

"only" 50k peds :D well that have to be a future project...
 
Stormer said:
Yes, my Evader is a bit under 7,2..more likley 7,15 or maybe even 7,12 as you say ( i looked fast yesterday)

"only" 50k peds :D well that have to be a future project...
Click to expand...

just keep on hunting Second Entity with your girlfriend and youll get that 50k soon enough :p
 
All I can say is :drool:

I shall continue to dream of these heady heights! :)
 
neomaven said:
It must be higher than 80 for this reason: I recorded the skill levels the instant I unlocked intuition. Note that all related skills are above 8000. [...]

On a side note, I do not think we in fact even have a "new" skill system, only that we can now see more data. I believe what we see now already existed in the background; MA simply provided us a more complete picture of skills and their relation to prostandings when the "skill VU" was introduced.
Click to expand...

Most people unlock Avoidance (level 25 Evader) at around 3600 to 3900 Evade. ;)

There is indeed no reason to believe skills were changed. All of the old unlocks still happen where expected based on other indications (HA, min dmg %, etc). Indeed, predictions were made about what professional standing was required for various unlocks based on the old information, and then confirmed. MA simply revealed the inner workings of the skill system.

Of course, the changes i was alluding to were the changes to the rate that skill levels progress above 5k.

jdegre said:
I've made the calcs assuming that those skills over 10k are capped at this level, which was something widely believed at the time you unlocked intuition, and probably was changed in VU 8.8.

It is possible that quickness is somewhat lower and that agility plays a greater role. This is uncertain atm.
Click to expand...

That will teach me to do a quick spreadsheet at 2:00 AM. I completely overlooked the fact that some of the skills were over 10k, and when the result came out so nice i took that as a bit of a check. Thanks for doing your own calculation.

I actually had put Avoidance at 6.5% for my internal calculations and found that i was getting better results, but changed it back for the sake of this calculation. It could be that it, not Quickness, should be at 6.5% (they are at very similar levels for neo)--I haven't checked this much but my own skills work out better that way. Coincidental rosy results of table napkin calculations will be the end of me. :rolleyes:

I do believe that if we are going to find a discernible effect for agility in any prostanding, it will be in Evader. I seem to get much more agi from defending than from offensive combat.
 
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all this talk of how intuition fits into the evader professional rankings is very interesting.

what I would like to know, thoush, and perhaps neo wrote it down with his other numbers, is what were someone's levels in perception and alertness when they unlocked intuition.
 
kira-red said:
all this talk of how intuition fits into the evader professional rankings is very interesting.

what I would like to know, thoush, and perhaps neo wrote it down with his other numbers, is what were someone's levels in perception and alertness when they unlocked intuition.
Click to expand...

Yeah it's a bit unintuitive. ;) However unlocks are due to professional standing level so i think MA was a bit constrained when setting this one up. Only alertness contributes to Evader of those two so perception level wouldn't be relevant.
 
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