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Impact of skills on professions

Jimmy B said:
wizz I will dig it all out I should still have everything hidden away somewhere :D

But probably will be after Saturday WoF now.
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Sure, take your time, it's been unresolved for quite a while now, few days won't make a difference ;)

And jdegre, you maybe missed my post, as i've unfortunately posted my results on percentage loss on chipping out directly after some other stuff: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/skills/65283-impact-skills-professions-32.html#post1374917
 
wizzszz said:
Sure, take your time, it's been unresolved for quite a while now, few days won't make a difference ;)

And jdegre, you maybe missed my post, as i've unfortunately posted my results on percentage loss on chipping out directly after some other stuff: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/skills/65283-impact-skills-professions-32.html#post1374917
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so, regarding the ESI loss, the idea is to change the % from 10% to 10.527%, right?. the only thing would be to maybe double check that result, so see if it is consistent, or maybe it varies somewhat.

then, if this value is consistent, adding it to the tools is just a matter of seconds. (just note that the error introduced by the skills->TT aproximation is higher than that, but in any case, if we know that the real value is 10.527%, and not 10%, there's no reason to keep the wrong value).


on the material professions topic, i received additional data from avas with levels around ~15 in both professions, and the current formulas (already in chipping optimizer) predicted their levels within 0.01 precision.

so, now what we need is data from:

avas with surface composition unlocked, but no other higher unlocks (i.e. no quality sense)


sorry for shouting... :laugh:
so, ask around your soc mates, and make them report their skills and profession levels.
 
jdegre said:
surface composition[/SIZE][/B]
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I am 1.3 lvl texturizer (yes began when I got bored and haven't been able to manage a stable line connection due to a storm+rain damaging my line :( so haven't got any higher) but will be there soon enough :)
 
Nice going guys, I'll update the posts on page 12 or whatever it was when I get a chance :)
 
jdegre said:
so, regarding the ESI loss, the idea is to change the % from 10% to 10.527%, right?. the only thing would be to maybe double check that result, so see if it is consistent, or maybe it varies somewhat.

then, if this value is consistent, adding it to the tools is just a matter of seconds. (just note that the error introduced by the skills->TT aproximation is higher than that, but in any case, if we know that the real value is 10.527%, and not 10%, there's no reason to keep the wrong value).
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I did that mostly out of curiosity, because i noticed that it isn't exactly 10% a while ago, and the ingame warning message says "you will lose approx. 10%"

Wasn't much effort to have a first rough direction, not sure why it's such an odd number though. An even 10.5% would have been more than just one milliPEC off, so this is not because of rounding.

Maybe anyone else can post another set of numbers, not going to chip out more of my valueable skills in the near future ;)

However, i'm aware it's not a big deal, but it will lessen the accumulative error and the effort to tweak the percentages in the tools out there should be minimal, didn't want to make a lot of fuss about almost nothing, so i posted it here instead of starting a separate thread.
 
i've received additional data from an ava who just unlocked material extraction methodology at level 5 in material manufacturer, and the current %'s predicted a level of 5.00 sharp for her skill set.

so, that's great news... now only the very very high level unlocks remain unsolved for this profession. so, more data is still welcome from uber-crafters.
 
Nice jdegre, sounds good.
 
Projectile Launcher Engineer
Jimmy B said:
Code: 
Intelligence*20   2%
BPC              28%
EPWT              9%
Machinery         6%
Manufacture Weps  9%
Wep Tech          9%
Engineering      26%
Industrialist     6%
Manufactng Meth   5%

Industrialist and Manufacturing Meth are guesses based on similar professions - I have no data to back those up. The rest I'm pretty sure about.
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Are you sure with the values for Blueprint Comprehension (28%) and Manufacture Weapons (9%)? All other Engineer values (Gauss Weapon Enginner, Laser Weapons Engineer) have much higher values for Manufacture Engineer than for BPC.
:scratch2:
 
Falco said:
Projectile Launcher Engineer


Are you sure with the values for Blueprint Comprehension (28%) and Manufacture Weapons (9%)? All other Engineer values (Gauss Weapon Enginner, Laser Weapons Engineer) have much higher values for Manufacture Engineer than for BPC.
:scratch2:
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Yep we thought it was odd at the time, but we checked it pretty thoroughly if I recall right.

I even in the end sent MA a support case asking them if they'd got the percentages the wrong way round. They said everything was as intended.

So I think its correct, no need to revisit it unless someone is seeing their profession levels coming out wrong.
 
Jimmy B said:
I even in the end sent MA a support case asking them if they'd got the percentages the wrong way round. They said everything was as intended.
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:D
My guess: they made it wrong way round, but can't admit...
But, however, the % is like it is now. Thanks for your answer.
;)
 
Just realised I had not yet updated the figures for the last two professions. Bit hard to track the numbers on this thread so I've just copied them from the Chipping Optimiser.

Are these right, as we currently have it?

Jimmy B said:
Code: 
Texture Eng.        33%
BPC                  7%
Carpentry            5%
Mat. Ext. Meth.      8%
Make Textile        11%
Tailoring            5%
Engineering         20%
Quality Sense
Surface Comp.

89% resolved. Data from avatars with Quality Sense and Surface Comprehension required.
Click to expand...

Jimmy B said:
Code: 
Coloring           5%
Carpentry          4%
Fashion Design     6%
Texture Pat. Mat. 40%
Material Comp.    12%
Color Matching     3%
Make Textile      10%
Tailoring          6%
Surface Comp.
Quality Sense

86% resolved. Data from avatars with Quality Sense and Surface Comprehension required.
Click to expand...
 
Jimmy B said:
Just realised I had not yet updated the figures for the last two professions. Bit hard to track the numbers on this thread so I've just copied them from the Chipping Optimiser.

Are these right, as we currently have it?
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yeah, i put into the optimizer the most accurate %'s i could come up with from the number-crunching sessions. so far they seem to be pretty accurate, at least i've not received data proving them wrong.
 
Just got some new data which should be helpful for the gaps, but waiting for a few missing skill levels. jdegre - am I right in thinking skill scanner doesn't yet pick up stuff like Quality Sense, Industrialist, Glamour, Surface Comprehension, Coloring Methodology, etc?
 
Jimmy B said:
Just got some new data which should be helpful for the gaps, but waiting for a few missing skill levels. jdegre - am I right in thinking skill scanner doesn't yet pick up stuff like Quality Sense, Industrialist, Glamour, Surface Comprehension, Coloring Methodology, etc?
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yes, that's correct. i've received some of those bitmaps so, for the next version, i'll add them to the scanner.
 
Right my received data says the following.

Quality Sense at 5% as previously assumed correctly predicts profession level to 0.06 (profession levels received are estimated not screens so I think we have to say they are only accurate to within 0.1).

For Colorer we have a problem, as current percentages produce a result that is much too high (>0.3). Reducing Coloring Methodology to 12% fixes that so I think that's the best bet at the moment.

Assuming percentages in the posts above to be correct, for Material Manufacturer there is 1.34 profession levels (to within 0.1) needed from 1720.8 Quality Sense and 2598.8 Surface Comprehension. One possibility seems to be 0% QS and 5% SC but other things like 4%,2% or 3%,3% or 5%,2% or 6%,1% are also possible.

Similarly for Material Designer there is 2.37 profession levels required from those two skills. So 0% QS, 9% SC is possible as is 8%,2% or 7%,3% or 6%,5% or 5%,6% or 4%,8% or 3%,9% or 2%,11% or 1%, 12% or 0%,14%.

So need another data set to pin those down better. Might be able to figure it out if we got profession screens so we could get the profession levels exact, but if any skilling has been done since I'd need a whole new data set of skills too. But in any case I think we probably need another data set from someone else for confirmation purposes anyway.
 
Im chipping out Hit i chipped out some perception and dexterity... which arent listed as dmg , well i lost some damage so i think either perception or dexterity does effect dmg... just thought id let ya know

now i think about it im pretty sure it was dexterity that caused loss of dmg so maybe you need to review the damage skills...
 
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Snabble said:
Im chipping out Hit i chipped out some perception and dexterity... which arent listed as dmg , well i lost some damage so i think either perception or dexterity does effect dmg... just thought id let ya know

now i think about it im pretty sure it was dexterity that caused loss of dmg so maybe you need to review the damage skills...
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Is it possible that you re-locked Serendipity (or Marksmanship) by chipping out?

Locked skills do not contribute to Professions levels as long as they are locked - MMS and Serendipity both contribute to (Hit) as well as to (Dmg) Professions.

It's pretty safe to say that neither Dexterity nor Perception contribute to any (Dmg) Profession - unless MA nerfed the %'s... and thats highly unlikely as well: Noone else reported any observations.
 
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wizzszz said:
Is it possible that you re-locked Serendipity (or Marksmanship) by chipping out?

Locked skills do not contribute to Professions levels as long as they are locked - MMS and Serendipity both contribute to (Hit) as well as to (Dmg) Professions.

It's pretty safe to say that neither Dexterity nor Perception contribute to any (Dmg) Profession - unless MA nerfed the %'s... and thats highly unlikely as well: Noone else reported any observations.
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I'd guess its a relocked skill effect too. If MA had changed the %s we'd have errors reported from discrepancies observed on the skill scanner+chipping optimiser.
 
I think its dexterity and i chipped out about a 20 ped chip and it just reduced my dmg by .1 so its possible its a 1% effect on dmg so it would be very hard to notice... but i know for sure i chipped just perecption and dexterity and i lost .1 dmg so one of the 2 definiatly have an impact, no question...
as far as MA changing things, i can also see MA reading your fine work on skills and how they effect stuff and making some changes... thats just MA
they can do thing like that and have no obligation to tell us....

Its all good i just want this skills effect thing to be as accurate as possible.....
I think this thread is some of the best work anyone has ever done to understanding this game... much respect
 
Snabble said:
I think its dexterity and i chipped out about a 20 ped chip and it just reduced my dmg by .1 so its possible its a 1% effect on dmg so it would be very hard to notice... but i know for sure i chipped just perecption and dexterity and i lost .1 dmg so one of the 2 definiatly have an impact, no question...
as far as MA changing things, i can also see MA reading your fine work on skills and how they effect stuff and making some changes... thats just MA
they can do thing like that and have no obligation to tell us....

Its all good i just want this skills effect thing to be as accurate as possible.....
I think this thread is some of the best work anyone has ever done to understanding this game... much respect
Click to expand...

I find it very unlikely. Certainly neither used to contribute anything to those profession levels, they were checked beyond any doubt. Its vaguely possible MA changed the breakdowns, but that would have caused overnight changes in people's pro-levels and would have been noticed I think.

A screenshot of your professions window and a list of skills recorded by the skill scanner would be interesting to see in order to figure out whats going on.
 
Snabble said:
so its possible its a 1% effect on dmg so it would be very hard to notice...
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it's hard to notice if your dexterity is at low levels, but it is definitely noticeable when your dexterity is around 7-8k (at 1%, that would mean 3/4 of a full level, so that's pretty easy to notice).
 
i've received new data regarding mining professions. the skill "miner" seems to contribute to all 4 mining professions:
- Prospector: 5%
- Surveyor: 5%
- Miner: 10%
- Driller: 9%

with these data, prospector and surveyor both add-up to 100%, so for the other two, it looks like the only skill missing is "drilling expertise". if we give them the remaining % up to 100%, it would be:
- Miner: 7%
- Driller: 8%

if someone with drilling expertise could confirm the above, all 4 mining professions would be fully solved.

(i've already added these %'s to the chipping optimizer)

cheers,
/jdegre.
 
Nice one jdegre, I've added that to the relevant posts.
 
more data:

- scientist: 3% to paramedic

we are still lacking the contribution from "doctor", but unless MA changes things there, well, i think nobody will care too much about that :D

of course, all credits go to the ubers that send me data about those high-level unlockables, but i'll keep names private.
 
jdegre said:
more data:

- scientist: 3% to paramedic

we are still lacking the contribution from "doctor", but unless MA changes things there, well, i think nobody will care too much about that :D

of course, all credits go to the ubers that send me data about those high-level unlockables, but i'll keep names private.
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Thanks jdegre, and anonymous uber :D
I've assumed Doctor fills up the remaining 12% for now then.

I guess Scientist can be unlocked via Paramedic at level 60? And Doctor do we know? lvl 70 maybe? lvl 80 seems too high given its percentage, especially as there's a fairly high attribute contribution too.
 
about mindforce

you need the skills -force merge-
 
iulrorck said:
about mindforce

you need the skills -force merge-
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Yes, there's also Mindforce Harmony though, and only a couple of players have either, so we don't know the percentages yet.
 
Great stuff.

Could you guys also get one of the higher skilled players to test if Quickness is the skill that fills up the remaining 2% in the Animal Tamer
 
Brawler Skills

Brawler HIT

Agility*20 7%
Inflict Melee Dmg 5%
Kill Strike 10%
Melee Combat 5%
MDA 14%
Power Fist 25%
Wounding 10%
Serendipity 4%
Anatomy 20%

Brawler DMG

Agility*20 2%
Strength*20 3%
Combat Reflexes 3%
Combat Sense 4%
Commando 3%
Light Melee Weps 7%
Power Fist 36%
Martial Arts 9%
Melee Combat 12%
Bravado 6%
Coolness 6%
Courage 4%
Dexterity 2%
Perception 2%
Serendipity 1%


Im gonna upload a screen to confirm this... or maybe you already know this and havent edited the skills, but you get AIM from using TT Power fist..

aim_on_fist3.jpg


I guess its a no brainer to assume its gonna be tied with Brawler Hit
 
Brawler Skills

Brawler HIT

Agility*20 7%
Inflict Melee Dmg 5%
Kill Strike 10%
Melee Combat 5%
MDA 14%
Power Fist 25%
Wounding 10%
Serendipity 4%
Anatomy 20%

Brawler DMG

Agility*20 2%
Strength*20 3%
Combat Reflexes 3%
Combat Sense 4%
Commando 3%
Light Melee Weps 7%
Power Fist 36%
Martial Arts 9%
Melee Combat 12%
Bravado 6%
Coolness 6%
Courage 4%
Dexterity 2%
Perception 2%
Serendipity 1%


Im gonna upload a screen to confirm this... or maybe you already know this and havent edited the skills, but you get AIM from using TT Power fist..

aim_on_fist3.jpg


I guess its a no brainer to assume its gonna be tied with Brawler Hit
 
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