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How space can ruin game experience

TheOneOmega said:
Well, if you are using the term "thief" in the same sense in all four instances, then sure, it's just a statement of fact by tautology, but if you intend this quote to have some nontrivial meaning, then perhaps you should make the senses explicit. The most plausible principle I can extrapolate from the statement, "a thief is a thief," would be something like "moral designations are invariant across fictional representation," which seems clearly false.

Surely you would recognize a relevant moral difference between an actor stealing something and a character they play stealing something. Surely you would recognize a relevant moral difference between an author telling a lie and a narrator they create telling a lie. Surely you would recognize a relevant moral difference between kidnapping and capturing a piece in a game of chess (even if there is a mutually agreed wager on the chess game such that the capturing action results in financial loss for the opponent). Even sticking to Entropian examples, I bet you'd recognize a relevant moral difference between shooting someone IRL and fictionally representing your avatar shooting their avatar at the Twin PVP ring.

Thus "a thief is a thief" is not at all obvious. Doing X is generally not morally equivalent to, or even a factor in analyzing, fictionally representing doing X. There would need to be some explanation given for why this particular moral designation transcends this particular fictional representation, as it would be, by far, the exception rather than the rule. The RCE element doesn't seem sufficient as an explanation; even if we modify the chess wager example to attach a dollar value to each individual piece, the line between doing X and fictionally representing doing X remains intact.
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Yes.
 
People can twist and turn this all they want. Especially knowing there are MS transport ships available which are designed to safely transport goods, if you carry loot and get looted, in a lootable PvP zone in Entropia Universe, this is *COMPLETELY* different lol from me going to the neighbors house and helping myself to her wallet. And if you are someone that can't see that anymore, you might be over-invested.

I will leave it at that. I certainly don't play for the online friendships, I got my Quad lol, but Entropian judgement strikes faster than the blast of a Kismet when it comes to looting in allowed zones. A pirate laughed at me when I told him i never loot. He said; Don't matter, they will judge you the same. No truer words ever spoken.

Oh well, spring is almost here
 
Gianna said:
I certainly don't play for the online friendships,
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Aw that's kind of sad =( Having friends is fun.

How on so you fly 27,777.77 AU a month? or like 77 hours a month? Fuck that sounds even more boring than regular entropia.
 
yea most days the Quad flies 12-14 hours non stop as I play and work at same time. It's about 800 oil a day. But its 100% worth it. I wouldn't have it any other way really. I just circle around from SS to SS. Listen to music and hope to do some pvp. And I scrapbook while I fly a lot, so it works out well.
 
I have to word this very carefully or it will vanish like so much else. Signatures' are there for a reason after all. I will sign this one off with a 💊

Mindark make money from Decay.

Two players shooting each other in PVP is Decay, Mindark win. No mob loot window correct?

Other MMORPG games that feature a lot of PVP, the developers are often the players. Adam had a wife as was well known.

Items lost have to be re-bought, auction fee is Decay on the Ped Card and so is all the 🛢️ on vehicles. You dont get that back, ever.


As far as I can determine, I didn't break a single forum rule on the above post, but if it disappears obviously there was one. :D

 
So it took me 20 days but I see it now. You can never loot in PvP zones in EU as it currently stands. No matter what color the skulls are....you are stealing, and it isn't right. I looted one time by mistake, by shooting an ava when both skulls were red, and I was very casual about taking 3 peds. But maybe this person worked for those 3 peds for an hour, maybe 3 peds to them means a lot?? what do I know really...

Being naive is one of my flaws, and although spending an evening at Carolines on Next Island with 2 pirates, was quite frankly my best evening in EU...but when people talk about buying a new television set using stolen funds from other players, that sort of put the night in perspective for me.

I still danced, that didn't change. But I won't steal.

I will continue engaging ships at complete random. But killing avas in space is out until they fix the system.
 
Gianna said:
So it took me 20 days but I see it now. You can never loot in PvP zones in EU as it currently stands. No matter what color the skulls are....you are stealing, and it isn't right. I looted one time by mistake, by shooting an ava when both skulls were red, and I was very casual about taking 3 peds. But maybe this person worked for those 3 peds for an hour, maybe 3 peds to them means a lot?? what do I know really...

Being naive is one of my flaws, and although spending an evening at Carolines on Next Island with 2 pirates, was quite frankly my best evening in EU...but when people talk about buying a new television set using stolen funds from other players, that sort of put the night in perspective for me.

I still danced, that didn't change. But I won't steal.

I will continue engaging ships at complete random. But killing avas in space is out until they fix the system.
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"Green dot is the best markup in game"
 
Still not 100% what you mean, but I assume you mean there is little cost to piracy and potential for great gain, which might be true. That having been said, I don't have the patience for it. I rather move SS to SS and blow up ships and not loot. It gives me way more targets, nobody gets to worked up...people still get upset, but when they realize they won't lose their belongings...that helps....

If I want to watch paint dry, I will just paint. Pvp is the name of my game...not theft..

anyways..enough said.
 
Gianna said:
Still not 100% what you mean, but I assume you mean there is little cost to piracy and potential for great gain, which might be true. That having been said, I don't have the patience for it. I rather move SS to SS and blow up ships and not loot. It gives me way more targets, nobody gets to worked up...people still get upset, but when they realize they won't lose their belongings...that helps....

If I want to watch paint dry, I will just paint. Pvp is the name of my game...not theft..

anyways..enough said.
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Enough said... until someone thinks differently :D

It's cool that you don't want to loot them. But shooting players who are not willing/prepared to fight is not pvp, either. In other games this is called ganking. Should we ever have a meeting of such kind, I will not take my hat off to you. And before the next one comes "but, but, you HAVE to be prepared when you go to a pvp area..." and "but, but, you don't HAVE to go there, you can choose to stay at home..." broken records are spun again, the reduction of lootable space was a good move, but if we, even with some delay, get a ganking "culture" instead, be prepared that many will invoke pure harrassment and every time support turns them down, the screaming will only get louder. The pitcher goes to the well until it breaks.
 
San said:
Enough said... until someone thinks differently :D

It's cool that you don't want to loot them. But shooting players who are not willing/prepared to fight is not pvp, either. In other games this is called ganking. Should we ever have a meeting of such kind, I will not take my hat off to you. And before the next one comes "but, but, you HAVE to be prepared when you go to a pvp area..." and "but, but, you don't HAVE to go there, you can choose to stay at home..." broken records are spun again, the reduction of lootable space was a good move, but if we, even with some delay, get a ganking "culture" instead, be prepared that many will invoke pure harrassment and every time support turns them down, the screaming will only get louder. The pitcher goes to the well until it breaks.
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Yea I agree. As it stands, pvp in EU is not really viable or that enjoyable. When 99.9% of the community hates pvp, why have pvp. But who am I to question MA's wisdom. I am sure the red skulls were put there for a reason.

Explaining to people, as a new player, there are pvp zones in space was fun on day 1, pretty cool on day 3, and now it gets highly annoying. I shouldn't have to explain the rules of space to people playing since 2002, or get their abuse when I shoot them down. But I got thick skin, so I keep shootin.
 
Gianna said:
Yea I agree. As it stands, pvp in EU is not really viable or that enjoyable. When 99.9% of the community hates pvp, why have pvp. But who am I to question MA's wisdom. I am sure the red skulls were put there for a reason.

Explaining to people, as a new player, there are pvp zones in space was fun on day 1, pretty cool on day 3, and now it gets highly annoying. I shouldn't have to explain the rules of space to people playing since 2002, or get their abuse when I shoot them down. But I got thick skin, so I keep shootin.
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I didn't mean to state the above as personal opinion (while I can't prevent obvious bias shining through) but as a prediction that the reactions to this playstyle might not be what you expect, or might change if this catches on and gains wider popularity. Thick skin or not, RCE makes all this different from other games (where the rest of all our pvp discussions sound almost identical). We know that MA has a pretty thick skin about all this, but they can and do change things eventually.
 
San said:
Thick skin or not, RCE makes all this different from other games
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yes, maybe "gold coins" instead of peds is the reason why other gaming companies have monthly subscribers in the millions.

"gaming" doesn't sound as sexy as "real cash economy", but gaming companies make an awful lot of money. MA can keep the RCE in place, once you commit to something like that, there probably is no turning back. How easy it will be to get new players to sign on for this, especially when you tell people there really is no fun options for space pvp, in a game about space and different planets...I dunno, good luck with that I guess.

If you look at mmos with a large player base, you will see that pve servers aren't used much. New players want pvp. No pvp, no new players. That easy.
 
Ignoring every other aspect, and coming from someone who was a competitive player when they were younger: space pvp in Entropia cannot even be called that other than the fact one person has the ability to end the life of another. That is literally the depth of space pvp, and honestly why it's so shocking it's still in the game. It's like a child's first attempt to make a 3D game.

You can have a literal monkey at the controls, all they have to do is smash a button over and over and they magically have the money of someone else. That's why it's ridiculous, and that's why people who defend it are delusional
 
Gianna said:
If you look at mmos with a large player base, you will see that pve servers aren't used much.
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See, this is wherein the hypocrisy of all this lies. A significant portion of those who call themselves pvpers aren't in it for playful battle with like-minded people. It's about exercising power over the rest. You get to be the gatekeeper who decides if another player may move along or not. The exact same discussions you can see e.g. in Elite: Dangerous, a space mmo where the in-game money isn't real and carries very little weight, but the loss of exploration data upon getting killed wipes out your entire journey until then (it is only saved when you return to human-inhabited space and deliver your data to the "universal cartographer"). The game attracts peaceful explorers with its great beauty and at the same time lets the gankers in on them (unless they choose to play in solo mode, never to meet anyone else; there are also private groups with a non-pvp policy but violations can only be dealt with after the fact.) It's just blatantly obvious that the cultures pvp and non-pvp don't mix. In Entropia it's about money and emotions, elsewhere about time and emotions. Here is an article away from the player forums which describes the struggle between the different groups quite well. Pure pvp games (e.g. MechWarrior Online) are an entirely different beast, and the culture in there is totally different.

Gianna said:
New players want pvp. No pvp, no new players. That easy.
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This is an assertion you cannot prove, one of those typical generalisations used to try and remove an argument from criticism.
 
Gianna said:
So it took me 20 days but I see it now. You can never loot in PvP zones in EU as it currently stands. No matter what color the skulls are....you are stealing, and it isn't right. I looted one time by mistake, by shooting an ava when both skulls were red, and I was very casual about taking 3 peds. But maybe this person worked for those 3 peds for an hour, maybe 3 peds to them means a lot?? what do I know really...

Being naive is one of my flaws, and although spending an evening at Carolines on Next Island with 2 pirates, was quite frankly my best evening in EU...but when people talk about buying a new television set using stolen funds from other players, that sort of put the night in perspective for me.

I still danced, that didn't change. But I won't steal.

I will continue engaging ships at complete random. But killing avas in space is out until they fix the system.
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thats cute lol of course you're stealing that's the whole point of being a pirate

glad you found the "light" and are on the good side now, but dont call yourself "naive" for not following the majority of the playerbase. it is OK not to agree with others lol

be safe in space, hope we dont cross paths (because i sure as hell havent found the light yet and will shoot on sight >:) )
 
Well if you look at the Crafters of War mmo. When you create your toon, you can pick from a bunch of servers. Some pvp, some pve and even roleplay. Some a mix. The pvp servers have much much larger player populations. So new players, when given the option when they start their journey, choose pvp.
Not trying to be a hypocrit, just saying.
 
haxx said:
thats cute lol of course you're stealing that's the whole point of being a pirate

glad you found the "light" and are on the good side now, but dont call yourself "naive" for not following the majority of the playerbase. it is OK not to agree with others lol

be safe in space, hope we dont cross paths (because i sure as hell havent found the light yet and will shoot on sight >:) )
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But you're not though Haxx lol....all I have done is fly around for 4 weeks. I have shot fewer than 50 mobs planetside. Any MS captain will tell you that indeed, all I do is fly around...and I have never run into you Haxx lol not once...

I have had conversations with every active pirate from Zeus to Monria to Toulan. Most tend to work busy real life schedules and only play 2 hours per night tops. Some only log 2-3 per week.

You are not a pirate Haxx, you might be a part-time lurker, but not someone who earns an active income from stealing.

Feel free to shoot me down, based on what I have seen so far....not worried lol
 
My point being is there is virtually no active pvp, let alone piracy. Everyone takes MS...if I fly around 12 hours on a day...I might run into 3-4 quads..tops...

And I have seen the screenshots of all the pirates' loot blah blah ....you had a hof...1 time....get over it...

There is barely enough stuff to shoot at in non-loot zones...don't pretend you are making a killing in loot zones, stealing from people.
 
Gianna said:
My point being is there is virtually no active pvp, let alone piracy. Everyone takes MS...if I fly around 12 hours on a day...I might run into 3-4 quads..tops...

And I have seen the screenshots of all the pirates' loot blah blah ....you had a hof...1 time....get over it...

There is barely enough stuff to shoot at in non-loot zones...don't pretend you are making a killing in loot zones, stealing from people.
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Please come in Arkadia pvp, i want to show you my new rifle.
 
Alina said:
Please come in Arkadia pvp, i want to show you my new rifle.
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Unless your new rifle is a kismet, no thank you. Not interested.
 
Gianna said:
But you're not though Haxx lol....all I have done is fly around for 4 weeks. I have shot fewer than 50 mobs planetside. Any MS captain will tell you that indeed, all I do is fly around...and I have never run into you Haxx lol not once...

I have had conversations with every active pirate from Zeus to Monria to Toulan. Most tend to work busy real life schedules and only play 2 hours per night tops. Some only log 2-3 per week.

You are not a pirate Haxx, you might be a part-time lurker, but not someone who earns an active income from stealing.

Feel free to shoot me down, based on what I have seen so far....not worried lol
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i dont think my avatar has logged in the past 20 days...maybe once or twice to transfer stuff around, but i havent been actively playing in over a month so no, you wont see me in space.

i just find your 180 a bit off. you were vigorously defending stealing from people not even a month ago calling people hypocrites

Gianna said:
My point being is there is virtually no active pvp, let alone piracy.
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took you that long to figure out huh...

if you want to pvp just go to ashi, oil rig...theres always people there. you chose piracy, not pvp. you are confusing two things as if they were one. this game is full of pvp, you can choose to turn a blind eye to it, pretend its not there because its not what you want it to be, but it IS there if you want to participate
 
Space in EU serves it's purpose i guess, but there are way way better games out there for space PvP with vast play areas.

Land PvP in EU is ok i guess, but again there are much better pvp games out there if thats what floats your boat (and they are a damn sight cheaper and more challenging/fun).

Don't get me wrong i love EU and have been around on and off for a long long time. However using PvP and EU in the same sentence makes me chuckle some, EU PvP is kinda underwhelming and a rich toys game. Space is more a level playfield although it isn't elite or SC, which have lots of customisations, play area and ship types etc.
 
Dibbler said:
Space in EU serves it's purpose i guess, but there are way way better games out there for space PvP with vast play areas.

Land PvP in EU is ok i guess, but again there are much better pvp games out there if thats what floats your boat (and they are a damn sight cheaper and more challenging/fun).

Don't get me wrong i love EU and have been around on and off for a long long time. However using PvP and EU in the same sentence makes me chuckle some, EU PvP is kinda underwhelming and a rich toys game. Space is more a level playfield although it isn't elite or SC, which have lots of customisations, play area and ship types etc.
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yes to all of that

entropia players are here for the rce...the game sucks in all other aspects. go play literally any recent games and they're all more fun on a purely gameplay point of view. all aspects of this game except the real-cash aspect i guarantee you theres another game doing it better...but none compares to EU in terms of economy/trading
 
No other game then EU gives you the ability to actually feel like you are living/residing somewhere else. A strange, exciting world. We all know this. It has incredible immersion on all levels...except space pvp I guess. It always feels somewhat like bullying. So the problem really isn't with me. Most people don't want to be bullies, or thieves. The problem is with the current way pvp works in EU. And if there were a way to reward space pvp., like someone important proposed before, where the system gives you loot for pvping, new players will be more excited about EU and be more likely to stick around, and venture into space and other planets, and buy all your stuffs so everyone wins.

I will continue my space work. I think I will get to lvl 20 mounted laser this weekend, but for now I will shift a lot of my focus to opening an art gallery. Maybe do monthly themed showings of Entropia based art. I could do "Piracy in Entropia" or "Entropia of the Past", "Wildlife of South East Calypso"....so many choices really...Not to sell anything, it wouldn't, just for display. My MU will be horrible. I can already tell it won't be cheap, but maybe people will go to Ark or FOMA and say; "hey, after the hunt/mining, u want to go check out the weird gallery real quick?". I think this is important. Things like this breathe life into a virtual world. It enriches them.

this might be more fun than space oO I always wanted my own gallery....
 
I really dont understand why it's such a problem for people.

No one is forcing anyone to go to other planets or into pvp. Especially with stackable items.

It's our choice. Our decision. We need to own our decisions. Take responsibility. Not blame others for them.

I fly regularly, I've run into a warpmine, I've been shot at, I shot back. Was killed a few times, but also killed when attacked. All part of my decisions. Good or bad 🙂

Mindark created a platform, how we use it is up to us.
 
True Juan said:
I really dont understand why it's such a problem for people.

No one is forcing anyone to go to other planets or into pvp. Especially with stackable items.

It's our choice. Our decision. We need to own our decisions. Take responsibility. Not blame others for them.

I fly regularly, I've run into a warpmine, I've been shot at, I shot back. Was killed a few times, but also killed when attacked. All part of my decisions. Good or bad 🙂

Mindark created a platform, how we use it is up to us.
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I can confirm that I have shot at TJ and he has shot me down even I think, and he is one of the very few always super good about it (y):)
 
Pirate who doesn’t pirate? Weird lol.
I might be taking a weird stance here but if you’re going to waste my time shooting me down, at least loot me to make your motives actually worth it. Don’t worry I don’t be carrying anything for you, but that’s not the point.
 
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