Alice
Slayer
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2005
- Posts
- 7,558
- Location
- Germany
- Society
- Rising Potentials
- Avatar Name
- Alice in Wonderland
since i got several pms asking for tips about mentoring, i finally decided to give some info about my style, that might look a bit like newbie harvesting sometimes
i guess several well established mentors will agree on some parts, disagree on the others, and are invited to post their thoughts and experiences here
i try to explain those tactics i have several experiences i had
i also write this for the ppl who think mentoring is a good way of income, see the gifts i got til now, and can be disappointing, see bad experiences, and very interesting, see the the good points
a mentor is especially interesting in the first few days, to give an impression of the game, what you can do, and how
a little tp run to say phoenix should be in it (often i got something like "whoa, this is huge") to show the size of the continent, maybe with a "btw, there is another continent and 2 space stations too"
the question if depositer or non depositer or possible depositer is quite important too, so you can show sweating at the beginning, maybe a tp run to troy for sweating, but also to get an impression of how good the chances of the disciples are to graduate
avoid an introduction of "are you going to deposit?" "No" "piss off"
BUT, don't give the answer too much weight, i had had several non depositers who graduated too
in any case there should be some explanation of eco hunting (if the disciple wants to hunt, but thats usually the case)
info about decay (swords are not cheaper than rifles to use, it costs the same in the end, more or less at least), and ofc about the most common scams
a mentor IS NOT the nanny, you can't be and don't have to be online 24/7
but what happens if the disciple has questions in those time you are away ?
try to find a soc for him, and offline communcation like email adresses, pms in forums, or some ppl you know who could help him too
my experience with disciples
oki, the numbers might be shocking, and i will also name my mentor gifts
mentoring shouldn't be for the gifts, and to avoid a newbie seeing at as good income, here my statistics so far
i had around 250 disciples (who counts
), and 22 graduaters so far, with 3 that will most likely make it, maybe even 2-3 surprising candidates
that makes a finisher rate of 10% or rather a quitting rate of 90%
call the 90% bad mentoring if you want to, but before you do, rather take a look in my mentorship offer; the disciples were satisfied
pretty exactly 70% of those quitters quit during the first 2 days, 20 during the first week
atm i have 2 ppl with above 80% training in the list and doubt they will ever come back, havent seen them for months
i should mention maybe that most of the quitters were newbies i got them in PA
ppl i got with my mentorship offer here in EF graduated with around 80%, at least those who were unskilled enough that i could add them (last time i got a pm of someone asking to be mentored; and i found out after a meeting that he has level 3600 in rifle skill , and yes, i asked before if he might be too skilled)
so a solution for "effective" mentoring, especiallly if you take the disciples in PA, is to get 4 at once (i know, now the ppl will come with "but you can't care that intense about 4!!!")
well, you can
make a team with all 4, in team chat you explain controls (how to turn and move, you will be surprised how many ppl try to run through the wall because they don't know how to turn)
then you start a tp run phoenix, with the right route you won't have many mobs in between and can explain keymapping, most common scamming methos, what is a tp, how to contact you (friendlist, email,...)
this standard "introduction" takes around 20-40 min, and is quite always the same if you had some disciples before
this way you explain the basics just once, not 4 times, and remember, quitting rate 90%, so the chances to have one graduater in this group is far higher
maybe to throw another number in, a tp run to Atlas Haven takes around 1 hour 20 min, and if your chance to "waste" that time is 90%, you should think twice about a group run, just from economics
so, to summarize, a tp run with introduction has several pros, especially in a team
you teach the basics
you show the disciples around a bit
give an impression of the "size"
you get away them from the lag in PA
and you show some interest in them !
but, back to the 4 person team
after 1 week you will most likely see just one of it anymore, if any at all, so, get the next 4 person team after 1-2 weeks, if not a miracle happens and all are still there
after 1-2 weeks, your first disciple will know how to contact you, and he will know the basics, and they won't have that many questions anymore, and more intense care is more annoying then helping in most of the cases (read, no nanny)
maybe as little sidenote, because this looks a bit like mass production (it is kinda), and it doesn't seem "personal"
if you get a new disciple, you should always send a pm to him when he
comes online, like "hey :=); how are you doing?; any questions or problems?")
-first, this will build trust (ever heard of the disciple who was scammed, pmd the mentor during the scam, and didnt believe his own mentor it was a scam and rather trusted a person he never saw before?)
-second, it will give it a personal note, that should be there
-third, it allows you to track the progress and possible problems better
-fourth, ppl don't like to ask for help, especially not in soc chat, rather ask them if they want to know something in private chats, gives it a personal note anyway
a mentor shouldn't give gifts in the first week (90% quitting rate, and a full pixie worth some peds won't change that, besides, the first armor you bought from your own sweating is something special, i still have my first pixie)
but, to throw some numbers in again, full pixie is worth 12.4 (repaired ofc, since not repaired armor don't have full protection), so with weapon and some ammo, say 20 ped
ofc you have to give this all disciples, to give them the same chances
i had 230 quitters around, 460 ped (would be a nice hof, wouldn't it?) loss just due to basic equipment
except you think 20 ped will keep them ingame longer
i don't say don't give any free gifts at all, it is always nice for the disciples if you do, but think about another thing,
and ppl who never had a mentor will agree with me here
what is advising worth, i mean, how much would you lose without any info in PE?, i guess the number is higher than 20 ped
so, even if you don't give the disciple 20 ped cash in his hands, with useful advices you will save him far more cash, and you save it too (remember, 460 ped ), gifts can't compensate advice
gifts i got so far were
3 manticore deathbringer
cempell welch ME
alpha ME (last time 5 in a row) and nr 1 in likelyhood for me
Brave ME thats number 2
EP17 ME nr 3
Tasmo ME
M2725 ME
the best "profit" i got with my first mantire deathbringer, with around 80 ped, second DB was 50, but the ME gift generally lost in value due to the new limited weapons
so, basically, every advantage of those "lower" ME gifts is gone
they are either too uneco, too slow, too weak, and in most of the cases far worse than any L weapon
(maybe a little wish from me here, give mentor edition items a learning bonus MA, give them at least a reason to be here, it is disappointing for the mentor, to get a alpha ME, or rather, 5 in a row, that has no use, and disappointing for the disciple, who had liked his mentor to get something useful too)
about "bad" disciples
the worst experiences i ever had happened with disciples asking for a mentor in PA (just the matter that they know what a mentor is, and that something like mentors exists should make you suspicious already, remember, we speak about newbies, who shouldn't know THAT much)
well, maybe i should start the easiest example
once a newbie aproached me, opening a private chat (!), asking for a mentor (!) and if i could take him on a tp run (!!!!), and made a team (funny team rules, it was back in the days when equal existed, means, all team members got a share, even if the didn't shoot at all, and therefore had no cost to kill anything, but still got some loot; lets say, advanced begging even without the need the ask)
and wanted me to kill the mobs on the way ofc
well, i guess she didn't expect how well i can avoid mobs, didn't shoot once, and didn't use my sword, so not loot at all to share
so, pretty disappointing for her we arrived in billys without any loot at all, and finally the question i waited for the whole time came:"Will i get some free stuff?", "No, ofc not", and i was kicked
this is a pretty great example for disciples i call "mentor hoppers"
they go to PA, take a mentor, ask for gifts, and if they get it, they kick the mentor and search the next fool, if they don't get a gift, they do the same
next example, with a funny (for me) ending
i had a disciple once, who asked if i could mentor the brother
ofc i said, we met in phoenix, and as soon he had me as mentor, he wanted a tp run to twin (see any pattern?)
as soon we arrived he kicked me, well, i could stop here, but to the funny ending i told him something like "with this attidude you will quit in 2 weeks")
exactly 14 days later i pmd his brother, asking how my ex disciple was
well, he was killed in pvp3 and lost his stuff and quitted (would be happy if i could predict the lottery numbers that way)
third and second worst one
asked in PA too for mentorship
well, tp run to atlas haven around 1 hour 20 min, then i went hunting, since she wanted to sweat
when i reached my hunting ground i got a pm from her, she was stuck at the nice outpost south of argus, so i left everthing, rescued her (overall about 1 hour 30 min, to argus, to her, back with her)
went hunting again, and got kicked
i pmd her and asked her why
answer was a bit surprising, she (quote) "found a mentor who is kind" to her
fourth and worst one
i once had a disciple i brought to phoenix
he told me his profession will be "beggar" and justified it because some religious groups do kinda the same
well, i tried to convince him rather to sweat, and he started to insulting me with something like "all germans are Na..."
well, that were the worst examples i had actually, but there had been loads of good ones, again i want to point to my mentorship offer thread here
but some examples of the good ones
we had a little party in oxford caves once, and Coop laid some vigi shins infront of me and insisted that i take them (won't sell them ever, thx)
several disciples laid their cash together and bought me an apartment
i am still very touched, and a big, nah, huge thank you to all of you here again
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50626
and ofc, loads of funny comments, jokes, hofs (nice to see your disciples getting hofs ) and generally a great time
maybe to summarize for the ppl who think about mentoring
it will need a lot if time
the graduation gift you will gift is far away from acceptable in most of the cases
you will be disappointed with high quitting rate, with ppl trying to squeeze cash out of you, some even insulting you
on the other hand, you will get very good friends, will have loads of fun seeing how they find their way ("grow up", it is indeed a bit like watching children; first they can't move properly, run into walls, just single steps in every direction, and soon they blast atrox )
to end this post, i have never regretted having started with mentoring
i guess several well established mentors will agree on some parts, disagree on the others, and are invited to post their thoughts and experiences here
i try to explain those tactics i have several experiences i had
i also write this for the ppl who think mentoring is a good way of income, see the gifts i got til now, and can be disappointing, see bad experiences, and very interesting, see the the good points
a mentor is especially interesting in the first few days, to give an impression of the game, what you can do, and how
a little tp run to say phoenix should be in it (often i got something like "whoa, this is huge") to show the size of the continent, maybe with a "btw, there is another continent and 2 space stations too"
the question if depositer or non depositer or possible depositer is quite important too, so you can show sweating at the beginning, maybe a tp run to troy for sweating, but also to get an impression of how good the chances of the disciples are to graduate
avoid an introduction of "are you going to deposit?" "No" "piss off"
BUT, don't give the answer too much weight, i had had several non depositers who graduated too
in any case there should be some explanation of eco hunting (if the disciple wants to hunt, but thats usually the case)
info about decay (swords are not cheaper than rifles to use, it costs the same in the end, more or less at least), and ofc about the most common scams
a mentor IS NOT the nanny, you can't be and don't have to be online 24/7
but what happens if the disciple has questions in those time you are away ?
try to find a soc for him, and offline communcation like email adresses, pms in forums, or some ppl you know who could help him too
my experience with disciples
oki, the numbers might be shocking, and i will also name my mentor gifts
mentoring shouldn't be for the gifts, and to avoid a newbie seeing at as good income, here my statistics so far
i had around 250 disciples (who counts
), and 22 graduaters so far, with 3 that will most likely make it, maybe even 2-3 surprising candidatesthat makes a finisher rate of 10% or rather a quitting rate of 90%
call the 90% bad mentoring if you want to, but before you do, rather take a look in my mentorship offer; the disciples were satisfied
pretty exactly 70% of those quitters quit during the first 2 days, 20 during the first week
atm i have 2 ppl with above 80% training in the list and doubt they will ever come back, havent seen them for months
i should mention maybe that most of the quitters were newbies i got them in PA
ppl i got with my mentorship offer here in EF graduated with around 80%, at least those who were unskilled enough that i could add them (last time i got a pm of someone asking to be mentored; and i found out after a meeting that he has level 3600 in rifle skill
, and yes, i asked before if he might be too skilled)so a solution for "effective" mentoring, especiallly if you take the disciples in PA, is to get 4 at once (i know, now the ppl will come with "but you can't care that intense about 4!!!")
well, you can
make a team with all 4, in team chat you explain controls (how to turn and move, you will be surprised how many ppl try to run through the wall because they don't know how to turn)
then you start a tp run phoenix, with the right route you won't have many mobs in between and can explain keymapping, most common scamming methos, what is a tp, how to contact you (friendlist, email,...)
this standard "introduction" takes around 20-40 min, and is quite always the same if you had some disciples before
this way you explain the basics just once, not 4 times, and remember, quitting rate 90%, so the chances to have one graduater in this group is far higher
maybe to throw another number in, a tp run to Atlas Haven takes around 1 hour 20 min, and if your chance to "waste" that time is 90%, you should think twice about a group run, just from economics
so, to summarize, a tp run with introduction has several pros, especially in a team
you teach the basics
you show the disciples around a bit
give an impression of the "size"
you get away them from the lag in PA
and you show some interest in them !
but, back to the 4 person team
after 1 week you will most likely see just one of it anymore, if any at all, so, get the next 4 person team after 1-2 weeks, if not a miracle happens and all are still there
after 1-2 weeks, your first disciple will know how to contact you, and he will know the basics, and they won't have that many questions anymore, and more intense care is more annoying then helping in most of the cases (read, no nanny)
maybe as little sidenote, because this looks a bit like mass production (it is kinda), and it doesn't seem "personal"
if you get a new disciple, you should always send a pm to him when he
comes online, like "hey :=); how are you doing?; any questions or problems?")
-first, this will build trust (ever heard of the disciple who was scammed, pmd the mentor during the scam, and didnt believe his own mentor it was a scam and rather trusted a person he never saw before?)
-second, it will give it a personal note, that should be there
-third, it allows you to track the progress and possible problems better
-fourth, ppl don't like to ask for help, especially not in soc chat, rather ask them if they want to know something in private chats, gives it a personal note anyway
a mentor shouldn't give gifts in the first week (90% quitting rate, and a full pixie worth some peds won't change that, besides, the first armor you bought from your own sweating is something special, i still have my first pixie)
but, to throw some numbers in again, full pixie is worth 12.4 (repaired ofc, since not repaired armor don't have full protection), so with weapon and some ammo, say 20 ped
ofc you have to give this all disciples, to give them the same chances
i had 230 quitters around, 460 ped (would be a nice hof, wouldn't it?) loss just due to basic equipment
except you think 20 ped will keep them ingame longer
i don't say don't give any free gifts at all, it is always nice for the disciples if you do, but think about another thing,
and ppl who never had a mentor will agree with me here
what is advising worth, i mean, how much would you lose without any info in PE?, i guess the number is higher than 20 ped
so, even if you don't give the disciple 20 ped cash in his hands, with useful advices you will save him far more cash, and you save it too (remember, 460 ped
), gifts can't compensate advicegifts i got so far were
3 manticore deathbringer
cempell welch ME
alpha ME (last time 5 in a row) and nr 1 in likelyhood for me
Brave ME thats number 2
EP17 ME nr 3
Tasmo ME
M2725 ME
the best "profit" i got with my first mantire deathbringer, with around 80 ped, second DB was 50, but the ME gift generally lost in value due to the new limited weapons
so, basically, every advantage of those "lower" ME gifts is gone
they are either too uneco, too slow, too weak, and in most of the cases far worse than any L weapon
(maybe a little wish from me here, give mentor edition items a learning bonus MA, give them at least a reason to be here, it is disappointing for the mentor, to get a alpha ME, or rather, 5 in a row, that has no use, and disappointing for the disciple, who had liked his mentor to get something useful too)
about "bad" disciples
the worst experiences i ever had happened with disciples asking for a mentor in PA (just the matter that they know what a mentor is, and that something like mentors exists should make you suspicious already, remember, we speak about newbies, who shouldn't know THAT much)
well, maybe i should start the easiest example
once a newbie aproached me, opening a private chat (!), asking for a mentor (!) and if i could take him on a tp run (!!!!), and made a team (funny team rules, it was back in the days when equal existed, means, all team members got a share, even if the didn't shoot at all, and therefore had no cost to kill anything, but still got some loot; lets say, advanced begging even without the need the ask)
and wanted me to kill the mobs on the way ofc
well, i guess she didn't expect how well i can avoid mobs, didn't shoot once, and didn't use my sword, so not loot at all to share
so, pretty disappointing for her we arrived in billys without any loot at all, and finally the question i waited for the whole time came:"Will i get some free stuff?", "No, ofc not", and i was kicked
this is a pretty great example for disciples i call "mentor hoppers"
they go to PA, take a mentor, ask for gifts, and if they get it, they kick the mentor and search the next fool, if they don't get a gift, they do the same
next example, with a funny (for me) ending
i had a disciple once, who asked if i could mentor the brother
ofc i said, we met in phoenix, and as soon he had me as mentor, he wanted a tp run to twin (see any pattern?)
as soon we arrived he kicked me, well, i could stop here, but to the funny ending i told him something like "with this attidude you will quit in 2 weeks")
exactly 14 days later i pmd his brother, asking how my ex disciple was
well, he was killed in pvp3 and lost his stuff and quitted (would be happy if i could predict the lottery numbers that way)
third and second worst one
asked in PA too for mentorship
well, tp run to atlas haven around 1 hour 20 min, then i went hunting, since she wanted to sweat
when i reached my hunting ground i got a pm from her, she was stuck at the nice outpost south of argus, so i left everthing, rescued her (overall about 1 hour 30 min, to argus, to her, back with her)
went hunting again, and got kicked
i pmd her and asked her why
answer was a bit surprising, she (quote) "found a mentor who is kind" to her
fourth and worst one
i once had a disciple i brought to phoenix
he told me his profession will be "beggar" and justified it because some religious groups do kinda the same
well, i tried to convince him rather to sweat, and he started to insulting me with something like "all germans are Na..."
well, that were the worst examples i had actually, but there had been loads of good ones, again i want to point to my mentorship offer thread here
but some examples of the good ones
we had a little party in oxford caves once, and Coop laid some vigi shins infront of me and insisted that i take them (won't sell them ever, thx)
several disciples laid their cash together and bought me an apartment
i am still very touched, and a big, nah, huge thank you to all of you here again
https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50626
and ofc, loads of funny comments, jokes, hofs (nice to see your disciples getting hofs
) and generally a great timemaybe to summarize for the ppl who think about mentoring
it will need a lot if time
the graduation gift you will gift is far away from acceptable in most of the cases
you will be disappointed with high quitting rate, with ppl trying to squeeze cash out of you, some even insulting you
on the other hand, you will get very good friends, will have loads of fun seeing how they find their way ("grow up", it is indeed a bit like watching children; first they can't move properly, run into walls, just single steps in every direction, and soon they blast atrox
)to end this post, i have never regretted having started with mentoring
Last edited:
(grats for the melchi on the tp run yesterday, lady 
