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Rebalanced Mission Rewards

Dennis blighter said:
Yes, true, but stamina is a highly valued, unknown attribute. The 8 when trying to get the max on it is a massive difference.

What 22 compaired to 30? Now that they have tokens, give everyone that doesnt have those additional stsmina 800 stamina tokens.

OR make stamina a gainable attribute.
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This is like saying give everyone that just started the skills that old school players got from Beta and a bit after. You missed the boat my friend sorry. I have the Stamina but still a lot I missed the players before me got easy. In that case Nerf everyone for their 1st year playing triple skills to be fair? Don't think so.
 
Svarog said:
I agree it wasn't fair, but if MA would start making up for all the past unfairness and you get this retroactive change - what compensations would get the victims of the more earlier nerfs?

I don't mind you having +8 to stamina if I'll get a year... damn, just a couple of months! of hunting with pre-vu8.8 skilling progress, or a chance of looting such a then-tt-food as A106, or whatever else I missed out by joining too late, just like you did :silly2:

Every next wave of players gets screwed more and more deeply but you can't unscrew one wave without making the others feel screwed once again :)
Click to expand...

Exactly what I am talking about :)
 
StarGlider said:
This is a nerf on the individual player though.
If stamina is good for, say health, why was it capped at 1, then added as a mission bonus, only to be capped a few years later again?
I think anyone who reaches level 50 in anything is pretty much dedicated to the game (passed level 50 btw :) )

If it is going to be capped, everyone should get the initial 9, and if it's as some say, an wortless attrbute rather than skill, why are they capping it?
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All attribute give health, stamina way more than others, so saying attributes are worthless depends strongly on how you value additional health.




And i think you need to look up "capped" - you use it a lot in you last two posts here, but it seems you haven't really understood what a "cap" is - if you rephrase your question and not use capped where it isn't appropriate, you'll have way better chances getting an answer.
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
Unfortunately there are no plans to delay the release or postpone the rebalance to next year. Although there were no plans to postpone it from August to October either so I guess you never know:scratch:. I wouldn't count on it being delayed anymore though.

No your mission counter will not be reset.
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Great early info, public relations and a good bit of community interaction, so first and formost thankyou for that. Rewards instead of frgments is much better and I'm not bothered about attributes particularly so I like the changes on the whole.

That said I'd vote for a 1st Jan start also as a number of people are calling for. OR perhaps there is a way to have one further option on missions you are midway through at the point of switch over on October 9th that option being the old reward?
 
Slapnuts said:
OR perhaps there is a way to have one further option on missions you are midway through at the point of switch over on October 9th that option being the old reward?
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This^! Also I would like to suggest the option that a mission that a player has begun (even with 0 kills) gets the old reward. That would help a lot of people greatly, I think. Then again that must be a lot of work to implement. It would be easier just to postpone a bit. Postponing the nerf would also enable players to continue to spend huge amounts of MONEY. Money MA/FPC/whoever would lose otherwise. Just saying. ;)
 
I think it is a shame, that all missions is not about killpoints. When you dont get extra for killing high maturity mobs then you have no mission reason for killling anything else then the lowest maturity.

Make that change next time you are looking into missions.

The bigger mob the more fun :)
 
First off, +rep to Charlie for posting the info and participating in the subsequent discussion.

Now, my 2 PECs on the topic:

1) Change the HP on Argo Scouts. That's long overdue.

2) One negative effect of spreading rewards out over the 5 stages is that it will allow newer players to gain profession levels faster, thereby lowering demand for lower level weapons that are crafted or looted. On the other hand, that may increase the demand for mid-level weapons, but those drop much less frequently. So I have to wonder if loots will be adjusted to offset the acceleration in prof gains? For example, lower level weapons drop a bit less frequently and mid-level weapons a bit more frequently. Similarly adjust mining resources to drop a bit more of the resources needed to craft mid-level weapons.

3) Despite #2, I like that the skills are being standardized and distributed across the 5 stages. What I don't understand is something Charlie touched upon...skills & attributes have no TT value. So what real difference does it make if the reward is 10 PED or 15 PED of a particular skill? Let's face it, once you hit 5-6k point in a skill, 10 PED or 15 PED worth makes very little difference in terms of the number of skill points gained from it. In the long run the PED value is pretty insignificant except to lower level players. Yeah, they could chip it out and sell it, but then doesn't that mean somebody deposited to buy it?

So why not adjust the new reward formula to reward a bit more skills so that the new rewards are at least very nearly equal or greater to the old ones? Having the new ones less just begs for disappointed cries of "unfair" and bad blood that lingers for years.

If it's being unfair to the older naturally skilled players that you're worried about, how is that unfair? They can get the exact same PED amount of skills as anyone else. Yeah, it helps a new player close the gap to 5-6k skills much, much quicker, but I think few of us would have a big issue with that. Quite frankly, I would applaud it as it will help to retain new players who get discouraged so quickly by the seemingly slow skill gains.

So, I just see win-win to reward the same or more amount of skill (but spread out across the 5 stages) versus lowering it. What am I missing?

4) I thought the attributes were always a no brainer. 5 stages, 5 attributes = 1 per stage. Attributes don't really do THAT much anyway, so why not? As far as capping them, why not reward the planet partners who invest more into their planet and create more mobs & iron missions for us players to choose from by just standardizing on a 5 stage/5 attribute system. The more content the PP deliver to attract players, the more the PP is rewarded. Wouldn't that be more fair for PPs? In fact, don't let the MA developed/owned mobs (that any PP can use) reward attributes, only those mobs developed by the PP can reward attributes to ensure that the PPs are indeed creating new unique content and are rewarded for their efforts by being able to offer the rewards that attract players to that planet. As for non-iron missions, don't let those reward attributes.

However, do please reward the attributes a 1 full token so that people can indeed choose when to take the reward. That does indeed make it more fair to the newer players.

Well, that's my food for thought on the topic.
 
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Let me start with thanking you for the post so we know upfront what the rewards will be. THANK YOU.
Gotta add, it's not really ample time before 9th or 15th or whatever beginning October.

I also do have some other comments...

Charlie|Calypso said:
Yea you're right, I'll edit that in tomorrow.

@Atami
The total amount of Stamina Tokens in these missions is 2055 (20.5 stamina points) if I remember correctly. I think that is pretty close to the amount available from all missions on Calypso atm.

There are no plans for making the Tokens sellable since attributes are kind of the only thing that can't be bought in game. I have however considered the possibility of using them as event prizes, nothing thats decided though but could be fun.
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I'm sorry to enlighten you, but stamina reward is not very close after the rebalancing. It's 29 stamina for the missions now (and an additional +1 stamina for the swamp mission). It will be become as you say 20.55 stamina. That's a decrease of almost 50%. That's no way close to what it was. But he, there will be new missions with stamina, right? Any word on that?

I am too in favor btw of keeping just the +1 stamina for every iron mission. And why are there stamina tokens anyway. These can't be gained naturally, so there is no point to save them up.

Axis BRX said:
I am really glad everyone can now see what they face in the future, excellent work for posting this in advance. But dayum! Some of those are really nerfed big time. EG. Aurli 10k from ~200ped Athletics down to 105ped. That is killer, and is just increasing the rift between older players and newer players, which is disappointing.
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Charlie|Calypso said:
It looks a bit worse than it actually is, the 200 PED it was before was for all 16600 kills so you have to add all these together to get the comparable reward now, of course if you were on stage 5 already then its worse yes but then you also got more attributes instead so might be prefered for some and not for others.
1.05 PED Athletics skill.
5.25 PED Athletics skill.
10.5 PED Athletics skill.
52.5 PED Athletics skill.
105 PED Athletics skill.
=174.3 PED I don't remember exactly what the old reward was on that one but It's not that big of a change when you sum them up.
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Sorry to correct you here again... 200 ped athletics with +5 attributes as it is now. (or 4 attribs + 1 stamina as I guess MA does not call stamina an attribute)
174.3 it is indeed, after rebalancing, BUT WITHOUT any attributes, which is almost 13% less. Would you call a salary decrease of 13% "looks worse that it actually is"??
Some people, like me really perceive the attributes as more valueable. Yes, we'd could argue skills are more valuable, but you also said attributes and skills don't have value, so let's not go there, ok?
So if I would go for attribs after the infamous rebalancing, it's 4.2 attributes ehm 3.1 attributes + 1.1 stamina, but with only 104,3 ped athlectics. Sorry man, am fully in disagreement. This particular nerf is worse than people actually realized. It's one of the biggest, almost 50% decrease. Few people can't survive a salary decrease of 50%, so to speak. (to make a point)

Artrat said:
This change was necessary, and overall I'm happy with the result. It's pretty much what I expected, in fact they have not nerfed the attribute rewards nearly as badly as I thought they would. In fact, as John B said, I should actually end up with more attribute rewards than if I had just started on the missions now, due to the attribute rewards being shifted to the higher end.

I am very happy with my decision to go after the attribute missions before the deadline. As I stated at the beginning of my mission log, I care more for attributes than skills.

In all cases except Stamina and Strength, I have come out better than if I had done just the old, or just the new.

Here are some of my numbers (apologies if I have made mistakes, the info on Entropedia is not complete):
Stamina
Agility
Intelligence
Strength
Psyche
Old Rewards
30
25
16
24
16
New Rewards
21.55
14.98
10.2
12.5
12.05
Rewards gained
under old system
2
13
11
10
8
Rewards available in
new system
20.05
13.2
10.1
11.6
11.6
Total if all new
missions done
22.05
26.2
21.1
21.6
19.6
Click to expand...

Overall there are some nice adjustments... but I really hate the fact that if you go for attribute (tokens) you end up with a lot less skill as it was... why?!?

Charlie|Calypso said:
If you account for the fact that you can now save your Attribute Tokens and turn them in later when you have a higher level already I think you will find that the actual potential "Attribute value" is much much higher. If you take an average player of let's say 70 Agility and he gets 1 point of Agility from a mission taking him to 71 then that is something he could have gotten by just shooting without to much trouble.

If he saves the Tokens until he has 90 or even 100 Agility it's suddenly worth probably 1000 or 100000 times more. This is of course true for all attributes except stamina atm and the newer a player was the worse the rewards were, now at least they can choose to think long term and save them until later if they want to.

Imagine if the skill rewards were 100 Points of Rifle, it wouldn't really be worth doing that mission unless you already had 10k Rifle skill or something.
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Good point, very, very good point. I agree with you that the less attribute rewards can be compensated by turning the tokens in later.
But as I have said before. Why are there stamina tokens? No need to turn these in later...
Please keep the +1 stamina reward (unless there are plains to be able to gain stamina otherwise, are there?)

Nighthawk said:
Mission Clear The Area requires you to kill 200 animals within a certain area. The mobs in this area includes Bristlehog and Araneatrox (why I said it was mixed) and the mission gives +1 psyche and a choice of some MF skills.
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Question to Charlie. We so focus on those iron/bronze/silver missions. Will the attribute increase of all those non grinding mission stay? I guess not all... Calypso Gateway certainly is/will be removed (collector of fragments +1, crafting 101 lesson 2 +1 int....
Will these missions keep their attribute reward???:
* Private message from Mr Lyndon or Officer Book? +1 psy
* Clear the area? +1 psy
* Patrol the swamp camp? +1 sta
* The pub crawl? +1 psy

And despite my critisism, I'm all in favor of the rebalancing by MA over all PP/Planets, but we have not been given ample time... :(

:O and about the argo scout... yes, ok, I guess the scout should have 350 HP, but you should increase the reward for iron mission tooooo, not only the bronze by 25%. If not, I find it too a nice quirk in the game, which is part of the Entropia/Calypso charm.
Now the mission rebalancing of Iron Argo is also hurting.... it's skills are soo much decreased:
+1 Str, +1 Psy, +1 Sta and 60 ped Perception or Combat reflexes versus
0,5 Str 0,1 Psy, +1 Sta and 6,73 ped Perception or Combat reflexes???????
You gotta be kidding!

regards Paul
 
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I have to say, I don't understand why attributes have to come at the expense of skills. You guys said that they are mostly meaningless, so why do we have to sacrifice so much of the mission skill rewards to get them?

And yes, stamina should be rewarded at the end of every significant mission as sort of a counter. It's only 1/9 of a health point guys. You really are going to be that stingy?
 
Thanks Charlie for the post, I really like the new system and think, going forward, that this system is much better for the long term future of Entropia.:yay:

A lot of people seem to use Stamina as a count of missions and/or bragging rights. How about a suggestion to MA:

Make the count of missions completed show when scanning someone. It will have zero ped value, cannot be traded, has no cost to MA or PPs but will satisfy the people who like to know how they rate vs others in the mission stakes.

It also has the advantage of removing the "gap" between old players and new players in respect to old vs new rewards and old vs new starting stamina amount. In other words, it will be a fairer display of the effort put in by the player, not biased by how long ago they started.

This then breaks that particular link with stamina and I think will allow a lot of people to get over their issues with this change.
 
Now that i think about it... I am quite discusted that attributes take such a LARGE portion of skill rewards.
Attributes shouldnt effect the skill gain on missions.

And i think the "newer" players should still gain the 8 stamina or make that attribute gainable.
 
Dave Stevens said:
Make the count of missions completed show when scanning someone. It will have zero ped value, cannot be traded, has no cost to MA or PPs but will satisfy the people who like to know how they rate vs others in the mission stakes.
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There's a lot of cleaning up to do before anything like this should be implemented. Until we implement a change to do something about planet partners creating missions with expiring deadlines (past and future ones), it would be wiser to remove the completed mission log entirely, if we care at all about the open-ended nature of Entropia's game play. This is also a problem with the achievement system that needs to be taken care of one way or another.
 
I have thought of a compromise:

Implement just a few of the changes on the scheduled date. These should be newbie missions, because a) the new system is meant to benefit newbies, so they say; and b) that allows people struggling to complete 1k steelbirds, 10k aurlis etc the badly-needed extra time.

The rest of the changes should be re-scheduled (for just after christmas? This seems to be a popular suggestion).

Not only would this compromise please a sustantial number of players, it would allow the impact of the changes to be assessed, and bugs(you know there are gonna be bugs, right?) identified and fixed before wholesale chaos sets in.

jay:)
 
jaywalker said:
that allows people struggling to complete 1k steelbirds
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The Steelbirds issue could easily be solved by a nice temporary spawn. There's still a couple of weeks, plenty of time to finish it if it came soon.
 
Jimmy B said:
The Steelbirds issue could easily be solved by a nice temporary spawn. There's still a couple of weeks, plenty of time to finish it if it came soon.
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If I get it right, the general problem with steelbirds is that the spawn slowly floats "up". It's like when a steelbird is killed, next one spawns 10m up. And after 15 runs in the area (or 15 avatars doing 1 run each) all the newly spawned ones are out of reach.

So, the spawn either has to be monitored and reset, or the "bug" fixed (so they spawn within reach from the ground).
 
BlueEyes said:
And why are there stamina tokens anyway. These can't be gained naturally, so there is no point to save them up.
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Holy dung, this is a very fine point! Then again maybe they plan to introduce a way to gain Stamina naturally!

:yay:






(Nah.)
 
Jimmy B said:
The Steelbirds issue could easily be solved by a nice temporary spawn. There's still a couple of weeks, plenty of time to finish it if it came soon.
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That's a pretty big "if" :laugh:


Ok so what about the "aurli's etc."? was only using SB as an example, you know. I don't personally know how many of the bigger mobs people might be struggling to finish, but I do not that it's it's certainly not a spawn problem with aurlis. They just take too long, for those who can't play 24/7, and those whi have to manage on a reasonably modest monthly deposit.

Heck , even doing 10k allos took me a month (and I CAN play pretty much full time)
 
I get so :mad: I have to let some steam out before I finish reading the thread...

Come on! Stop messing with Atributes and skills! These are supposed to be earned and reflect the hard work of really comitted partisipants. We have loads of ppl that spent all free time building their skills and become admired by the lazy ones.
Aren't you happy with the ESI? Those should never have come aswell or... sold to partisipants when they decide to leave the universe!
This way "free skills" would have been high MU and in high demand by ppl ! Like Mod fap or Mod Merc . It's not for everyone just because they want it. Sorry, you can't have it!!!
Now after making most items used by the mid level partisipants (weapons / faps etc.) useless and almost worthless you go after the last thing with value... our skills!
Will skills become (L) too? Maybe it isnt as dumb as it sounds at first!? :scratch2: but really... stop changing the rules everytime I'm close to catch up

I'm by far too upset to get everything on this matter out atm but you can count on that I'm not the onlyone thinking this and ppl will start venting when they realise how screwed we get by these "rebalansing" things


:smoke:
 
slupor said:
I would really like to see the reward for completing a mission chain to remain a Stamina. If a full Stamina is too much, a percentage could be granted.

The reason is that Stamina is the tracker for completed mission Chains. It shows dedication to the game in a unique way, and is the reason lots of people hunt shit-looting mobs. Replacing Stamina with other attributes destroys the tracker & status function. Bad idea.

/Slupor
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Xen said:
I have to say, I don't understand why attributes have to come at the expense of skills. You guys said that they are mostly meaningless, so why do we have to sacrifice so much of the mission skill rewards to get them?

And yes, stamina should be rewarded at the end of every significant mission as sort of a counter. It's only 1/9 of a health point guys. You really are going to be that stingy?
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BlueEyes said:
And despite my critisism, I'm all in favor of the rebalancing by MA over all PP/Planets, but we have not been given ample time... :(

:O and about the argo scout... yes, ok, I guess the scout should have 350 HP, but you should increase the reward for iron mission tooooo, not only the bronze by 25%. If not, I find it too a nice quirk in the game, which is part of the Entropia/Calypso charm.
Now the mission rebalancing of Iron Argo is also hurting.... it's skills are soo much decreased:
+1 Str, +1 Psy, +1 Sta and 60 ped Perception or Combat reflexes versus
0,5 Str 0,1 Psy, +1 Sta and 6,73 ped Perception or Combat reflexes???????
You gotta be kidding!

regards Paul
Click to expand...

Thanks for reporting before the change date. Better late than never...

The quotes sum up my three questions/concerns:
  1. Why must attributes come at such a skill cost?
  2. Why can't stamina remain as a mission counter, at least in some fraction?
  3. Will the non-grinding missions with attributes change?

And on a related note, remember this thread? Could you please pass on to tech support that this is a defect? I'd still rather have ~5 PED rifle than Psyche.
 
I know diving into a thread where old players (mostly many 2/3 of my age probably) are fighting can be hazardous to anyone health... BUT:

I'm glad I did all low mobs missions in my power, got my attributes soon enough which otherwise will cost a fortune to make them - not that I care about them now (I did at first), but saw "ubers" full of s...kills with 10 agility less than me (got 55, saw avas with 45 and L50+, I'm merely L23 and going down). 1k and 5k missions would bring me a better reward now, sadly I will not be able to do them. 10k is out of the question, money mostly but also my brain wirings. I feel for those who planned for long term rewards too, but hey... RL is dodgy, don't put your hopes into a virtual environment!

Older players saw a lot of nerfs coming, for an informed new player there are a lot of warning signs around... Never intended to reach the 100 or 50 level mark, reading various outlets anyone can understand it will a costly job, or time consuming without chipping in my yearly income.

But I can see is the first time MA publish mission rewards and all changes before hand - very positive sign, and a big GZ!, hopefully is not a sign made out of desperation but of business understanding!

Keep us informed beforehand, I'm not one of the spenders but some people are, those are the backbone of this game - keep them happy! Give them the damn stamina for 10k, AND either remove 6 points from old avas (NOT DESIRABLE!) or give us - the new cannon-fodder - 6 points via a funny mission (like visiting PA, check the stamina points, oh you're a new player here you go.. IF you finish XXXX easy 10ped cost mission)
 
How about a new MindForce personal effect chip? It would require no skill to use (unless you want to tie Stamina to MindForce, which may not be a terrible idea after all since MindForce gives so little Health gain), and perhaps it could be a reward for a mission that requires you to collect all available Calypso Teleporters. The chip itself would be unlimited, and would require repair after each use (it would decay the whole way like an injection); there might also be a Mind Essence cost. When activated, the name of a weapon is selected at random from all non-MindArk weapons in the database (might be Opalo, might be Ancient Mod Merc), and displayed on the screen near the personal effect timer. Until the timer expires (5 minutes? 10 minutes?) shooting a target with the selected weapon gives a "pretty decent" chance of a Stamina gain, similar to an Agility gain, a Psyche gain for MindForce, etc. It is the clickers responsibility to acquire the weapon if they don't want to waste the decay/ME cost.

Pros:
Stamina is difficult to acquire, but there is a fair and unlimited method to acquire it for those motivated enough to do so.
There is a reward for collecting all planet-side Calypso Teleporters.
There is a new use for Vibrant Sweat.
There is a slight increase in demand for random weapons such as Jester D-1, etc.

Cons:
Someone will point out one or two I'm sure. =)

Possible Variations:
Timer duration could be different.
Chip could be acquired a different way.
Chip could be (L) IF AND ONLY IF it comes from a UL blueprint. (L) (L) defeats the concept of giving players some control over their Stamina.
Chip could decay less and use more ME.
Chip could use a different type of ME.
Chip could require skill to use, which would add a link between MindForce and Health gain to the "Pros" of this concept.

Thoughts anyone?
 
Charlie? Care to respond?

Hi Charlie,

Again ty for the heads-up.

Care to respond to some questions asked before this post?

BlueEyes said:
It's 29 stamina for the missions now (and an additional +1 stamina for the swamp mission). It will be become as you say 20.55 stamina. That's a decrease of almost 50%. That's no way close to what it was. But he, there will be new missions with stamina, right? Any word on that?

Overall there are some nice adjustments... but I really hate the fact that if you go for attribute (tokens) you end up with a lot less skill as it was... why?!?

Good point, very, very good point. I agree with you that the less attribute rewards can be compensated by turning the tokens in later.
But as I have said before. Why are there stamina tokens? No need to turn these in later...
Please keep the +1 stamina reward (unless there are plains to be able to gain stamina otherwise, are there?)

Will these missions keep their attribute reward???:
* Private message from Mr Lyndon or Officer Book? +1 psy
* Clear the area? +1 psy
* Patrol the swamp camp? +1 sta
* The pub crawl? +1 psy
Click to expand...

Xen said:
I have to say, I don't understand why attributes have to come at the expense of skills. You guys said that they are mostly meaningless, so why do we have to sacrifice so much of the mission skill rewards to get them?

And yes, stamina should be rewarded at the end of every significant mission as sort of a counter. It's only 1/9 of a health point guys. You really are going to be that stingy?
Click to expand...

Doer said:
  1. Why must attributes come at such a skill cost?
  2. Why can't stamina remain as a mission counter, at least in some fraction?
  3. Will the non-grinding missions with attributes change?
Click to expand...


regards Paul
 
Montaque said:
Come on! Stop messing with Atributes and skills! These are supposed to be earned and reflect the hard work of really comitted partisipants. We have loads of ppl that spent all free time building their skills and become admired by the lazy ones.
Aren't you happy with the ESI?
Click to expand...

As looting a big ESI from time to time seems the only real markup I gain with hunting I am very thankful that they were introduced :yup:

They pay off hard hunting-work for the skillers more than a few green lines do :smoke:
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
If you account for the fact that you can now save your Attribute Tokens and turn them in later when you have a higher level already I think you will find that the actual potential "Attribute value" is much much higher. If you take an average player of let's say 70 Agility and he gets 1 point of Agility from a mission taking him to 71 then that is something he could have gotten by just shooting without to much trouble.

If he saves the Tokens until he has 90 or even 100 Agility it's suddenly worth probably 1000 or 100000 times more. This is of course true for all attributes except stamina atm and the newer a player was the worse the rewards were, now at least they can choose to think long term and save them until later if they want to.

Imagine if the skill rewards were 100 Points of Rifle, it wouldn't really be worth doing that mission unless you already had 10k Rifle skill or something.
Click to expand...


Hello Charlie,

thanks for commenting on posts here, some is useful.

This post made a raising a question up beside some other.

The change to make applying attributes flexible at a time a player chooses to do so leaves indeed more room on the players side to be able to tweak an avatar. But im not yet sure if the flexibility on attributes is alone compensating for the lower total volume. There can be more missions in the future maybe but that doesnt change the raise on effort side.

Considering this it would be very helpful to the community and maybe necessary now to get a explaination of why Mindark starts now to value the attributes that high when it wasnt that of a topic in the past.

If I want to help players which reach a higher level to save the attributes for later its a good move though lowering the volume equals the gain of help here out.

If I ask around 10 players what they think about attributes and their effects in general I will get about 35 different answers. Specially Stamina seems to have reputation for making hitpoints regenerate on avatars faster and alot seem to believe that is one of the reasons its so rare to get etc. Seems like alot rumors are existent about Stamina and its reason to even exist.

Can we have please a developer notes about attributes?
Im sure that this can help to get more acceptance to the new system as well lead to more confidence in the system.

Thanks+Greets,
 
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