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Space, again Burglars and time lost

Sulje said:
Doesn't apply to PVP, you are overconfident about something you have no idea what you are talking about. Everything is allowed in pvp.
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Why dont you try it on your account. You have pvp in pvp. No issue there. When you grief someone, thats when problems come.
Same logic could be applied to KSing mobs. Its allowed to dps a tagged mob. If you do it multiple times, and intentionally, youll get (should) be punished.
 
The Mind said:
Because its against TOS to repeatedly kill someone, who you know has no loot, or in non lootable pvp. Its called griefing.
There is no reward, intended by the system, and prevents people, like this player, from enjoying a "normal gameplay" of traveling through space.
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There is probably a much weaker version of this claim that is reasonable. "You cannot interfere with any other Participants ability to use and enjoy the Entropia Universe" would seem to be violated if one player excessively kills another player who is trying to leave the PVP Zone by any avenue they can. So in space, killing someone trying to leave a non-planet space station for an hour would probably qualify. That doesn't necessarily mean they get to cross space to their destination. Maybe they need a better ship for that. But they should at least be able to leave the way they came. I don't think that depends on whether it's lootable or non-lootable. The pirate is entitled to PVP for fun just as much as profit.
 
Ye, all those "pvpers" getting cocky in tab and shoot game. Amusing.
 
TheOneOmega said:
There is probably a much weaker version of this claim that is reasonable. "You cannot interfere with any other Participants ability to use and enjoy the Entropia Universe" would seem to be violated if one player excessively kills another player who is trying to leave the PVP Zone by any avenue they can. So in space, killing someone trying to leave a non-planet space station for an hour would probably qualify. That doesn't necessarily mean they get to cross space to their destination. Maybe they need a better ship for that. But they should at least be able to leave the way they came. I don't think that depends on whether it's lootable or non-lootable. The pirate is entitled to PVP for fun just as much as profit.
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It would definitively qualify. More if you see them repeatedly exiting SS you sent them to.
 
Sulje said:
Your favourite mob is kerberos which explains your confidence on high level topics.
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My favorite mob was hunted during 1.0. I TT profited doing it and gained 30-35 combat skills in the process. Shows how much you know.
 
The Mind said:
It would definitively qualify. More if you see them repeatedly exiting SS you sent them to.
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Maybe in some contexts. Generally I'd put the burden of communicating their intent on the player who wants to leave the PVP Zone. For all the PVPer otherwise knows, the player may be leaving the space station to fly to a mothership to end the PVPer's kill streak or otherwise passively engaging in the PVP battle.
 
So the point made is basically "rules are rules" and lootable pvp in space is allowed.

Here is what you can do about lootable pvp in space
  • Comply with the rules, take the chance by flying yourself or pay the service providers (warp services) or some other protection solution
  • Complain to Mindark
  • Quit the game

Only MA knows how much lootable pvp in space is worth to themselves. I think lootable pvp in space will remain for as long as MA can make a case in favor of keeping it.

Good luck
 
The Mind said:
More if you see them repeatedly exiting SS you sent them to.
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Join #crt and have The Calypso Rescue Team save you. That's literally the intention of the developers, seen in the choices of activity you can choose in the Society info.

Lootable PVP is the best part of the game and it's unfortunately been handicapped to the point it's barely relevant, namely because the population numbers don't support a healthy dicotamy between pirates and protectors.
 
The Great Adventurer said:
Join #crt and have The Calypso Rescue Team save you. That's literally the intention of the developers, seen in the choices of activity you can choose in the Society info.

Lootable PVP is the best part of the game and it's unfortunately been handicapped to the point it's barely relevant, namely because the population numbers don't support a healthy dicotamy between pirates and protectors.
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CRT never goes into space to do the rescue. Only for the planet.
 
#space_travel
 
RT_Tony said:
wait, so you created a support ticket because your cheap ass didnt want to pay for a warp?

why waste their time like that man i mean come on
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Explain this to those who haven't completed their mentorship yet .

FYI : I know what to do to avoid content i don't like.
 
The only reasonable argument I can think of to change space is to adjust the game to be more in sync with us humans, we are developing as a human race and it can be seen more clearly than ever right now in 2023 and with it comes a new set of expectations. Many are waking up to the reality that perhaps lootable pvp in space is no longer an appropriate feature and rightfully expressing their concerns regarding that. "Rules are rules" is a rather cold and soulless approach to defending lootable pvp in space.

If we look in our recent history on Earth, we can see that it is really not that long ago that families got together to watch people being beheaded. Yes, children and adults went there to watch it, and it was exciting. If anyone tried this in our modern society it would be seen as inappropriate and swiftly dealt with, and that is the point I am trying to come across, we change. Lootable pvp in space can be considered an inappropriate feature despite it being allowed by MA rules.
 
TheOneOmega said:
A helpful idea might be to revisit this situation later, after the emotional impact has subsided,
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a side note
i was looted not more than few ped, IDGAF, i loose more in 2 hour shooting
again no need to "loose money levelling", my avatar is 9k Eur above my deposits so i am not in the "looser whiners" team

i am ok to pay 20 ped for a 3 ped TT warp, the 17 (or 30 ped) are the cost of the TIME of the pilot that has a value.

if there is a risk, there MUST be a reward
space is RISK without REWARD: this is not correct
put a random "fly on this and gain xxx" spot and its ok

@ The great adventurere,: it is pretty clear that you like PVP, and dream of a EVE style space....
wake up, there is nothing like that here it is just a boring 20 minutes in the void,
 
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Simpleton said:
Very nicely written.

One thing to consider. Is it a mere roleplaying when real money is on the line?

Is there functionally any difference between walking up to a person in real life and taking his/her valuables versus bringing some players avatar hitpoints down to 0 and receiving his/her items in a video game where items can be cashed out for real money? In both scenarios, the robber takes away valuables from the robbed.
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this post is my same answer to ONEOMEGA
i started WOW on a pvp server, i was "ganked" by horde players camping respawn just for annoying purposes.
this involved my TIME and not my MONEY
(actually i moved to a PVE server and played for 13 years thereafter, never did PVP content that i dislike (its clear)

BUT
1. this game loots LESS than spending so items are not "just 20 minutes away" but a kill in lootable is actually A FINANCIAL LOSS for the pked player. this means a RISK. and in RCE there must be a reward. i can accept PVP3 where shooting is a financial loss for the shooter (and in fact apart someone looking for some fun it never happens
2. in PVP4 shooting a player rewards WAY MORE than a monster, that is average LESS THAN KILL COST... a 300 HP player is taken down with 1 ped. hard to loot less. make a LOOT on player 98% of the "cost to kill" and no attachers in space will happen.

a player with a PeGleg and a Parrot on his shoulder is Roleplaying a pirate, there is one trader in Boreas with a parrot, saw it. a pirate in space is someone that INTENTIONALLY makes his calculations, risk say 5 ped (not sure of cost to kill a quad) hoping to collect more.
this "WHATEVER AMOUNT" is a financial loss for the traveller that is ambushed, because in Entropia all items have a DOLLAR VALUE

so sorry, i can't divide the moral action of intentionally stealing items from a scammer, a lowballer to newcomers, or a space pirate.

all of these categories are BAD for gaming experience.

Maybe i am full PVE inside and i see anyone that "interfere" with my monster slaughtering just annoying.

i appreciate some comments, sarcastic ones are not relevant, but there are some ideas

developing space is impossible, because of lootable. it is pretty stupid to go fight a space monster and be looted thereafter, so also this need adjustment

maybe "travel corridors" PVE and "interesting spot for special resources" with pvp enabled......
 
Msturlese said:
Forum rules prevent namne posting
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Why? Pirating in space is not against game rules, not cheating, why cant you say xy killed me in space?
If its not allowed, than why allowed saying xy killed a mob in Caly, both are legal ingame activities.
 
Msturlese said:
developing space is impossible, because of lootable. it is pretty stupid to go fight a space monster and be looted thereafter, so also this need adjustment

maybe "travel corridors" PVE and "interesting spot for special resources" with pvp enabled......
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Just on those last two points:
the planetary hunting grounds are now in non-lootable pvp space and have been for a while. Thus no longer a problem in itself, but interplanetary travel still has the gap of lootable to overcome.
I've always been in favour of longer but safe "travel corridors" and also support having lootable pvp areas with interesting resources that might attract larger-scale battles with motherships and privateers in the mix too. There could even be control of space area battles with space area income from mobs and resources.
 
Lets make a case for removing lootable pvp from space

First, let me be clear that it is not my intent to harm or grieve anyone. Some players will without a doubt disagree with me due to their own interests or other reasons, and that is ok. The following is simply my attempt to bring to light potential issues with lootable pvp in space (and possibly lootable pvp in genaral in this particular game).

Now, lets address what lootable pvp in space does. It acts as a wall between planets. It tries to divide the planet economies to make them separate but the economy is mostly on Cally so the tendency for players is to just go there with the loot so in the end it basically is just walling off Cally from the rest of the planets.

The potential problems with lootable space
  • - Mafia. No matter how benevolent the warp service providers actually are, coming to the conclusion that the warp service providers are a mafia is inevitable. The limited number of warp service providers means that anyone without a warp capable ship wanting to move safely and quickly with or without loot between planets must contact any one of the warp service providers. They can refuse doing business with you and they can be offline when you need the warp. Basically, the playerbase is under the heel of the warp service providers when it comes to moving loot between planets. It is also possible for warp service providers to fund the pirates, to occasionally go in space and shoot down players, since the warp service providers have the most to gain from other players using their warp services.
  • - Fraud/Moneylaundering. Unlike normal trading where players need to be able to give explanations for one directional trading (i.e. getting high value for next to nothing), no such restrictions are in place in lootable space. It seems like the design of lootable space is to try to get alot for very little. You can claim you got lucky looting some player for alot of peds and its basicly irrefutable.
  • - Harassment. Some players actually tried (or succeeded?) in looting other players by flying their quad or other space capable vehicle on top of hunters, hoping they would enter the vehicle and then fly them up to space to be looted.
  • - Pirates, the opportunistic players that risk very little to potentially gain alot at the expense of other players. One thing I always wondered was whether MA or PP employees do or did pirating in lootable space. Space is MA territory after all.

Why should we make space nonlootable?
  • - It would address the 4 problems of lootable space mentioned above, these problems all scream "This is inappropriate, MA what are you thinking?!"
  • - It opens up space to players to explore and move around the universe at their own leisure.
  • - Trading can become a bit easier due to not requiring to schedule a warp between planets to move loot around as safely as possible.
  • - PvE and trading is the core of the game. If we compare PvE vs PvP, I think PvE is the breadwinner for MA by far. Why grieve the PvE players with unwanted lootable PvP areas to satisfy the few at the expense of the rest?

Lastly
  • - The warps are still available for the players that choose or need the speed of warps.
  • - Lootable PvP can still be in the game, just put it somewhere that only lootable pvp players go to have their fun.
  • - If MA spent some time developing space content then the big space vehicles can be used for other purposes than moving players around the universe
  • - Rules that breed inappropriate behavior can be changed or removed. They are not set in stone forever.


If anything I said above is just outright wrong, feel free to comment on it.

Did I miss anything? Agree? Disagree? Speak up, its the only way to bring about any meaningful change for the better.
 
Space should be it's own economy and enhance the planets and not be used to silo them off from each other. The only way to make that happen is to expand space content a great deal and create safe travel lanes and PVP areas that contain rewards that are worth the risk.

Ships should be more plentiful with multiple layers of customization and the ability to repair on the fly (astromech style). Ship customization levels could be based on commerce, fighting, and mining. Allow some ships the ability to generate wormholes like a wormhole chip to fast rally squadrons. There is a laundry list of things that could be added to a base ship like armor plating, energy shields, different weapon types, cloaking generators, actual auto pilot via waypoints, enhanced grav based storage, grapplers, and tractor beams. The list could go on an on. No two avatars are completely identical so no two ships should be either.

Create a mining and salvage system as well as a contract system for moving goods between planets for motherships and privateers. There are so many games old and new these systems could be modelled on so I am unsure why its not been implemented to this day.

If you want to keep lootable PVP then implement a bounty system. If you want to be a pirate then be prepared for notoriety and a price on your head.

To encourage PVP then create gates that allow access to safe space lane travel. These need to be defended and claimed. This could also be space grabs with taxed mobs and taxed resources in sections of space that are free of lootable PVP.

If you want threats in space have an ongoing cycle of patrolling robots or some other alien force that attack space stations and outposts in space areas.

I am hoping UE5 will enhance the space options in EU. When they first implemented space I thought I would make it a permanent place for my avatar but I found myself sticking to one or two planets and playing the X series of games instead.

I've always had big hopes for space but as it stands now I only travel on my own with my one piece of poo or I pay for a warp.
 
Sirhc said:
Space should be it's own economy and enhance the planets and not be used to silo them off from each other. The only way to make that happen is to expand space content a great deal and create safe travel lanes and PVP areas that contain rewards that are worth the risk.

Ships should be more plentiful with multiple layers of customization and the ability to repair on the fly (astromech style). Ship customization levels could be based on commerce, fighting, and mining. Allow some ships the ability to generate wormholes like a wormhole chip to fast rally squadrons. There is a laundry list of things that could be added to a base ship like armor plating, energy shields, different weapon types, cloaking generators, actual auto pilot via waypoints, enhanced grav based storage, grapplers, and tractor beams. The list could go on an on. No two avatars are completely identical so no two ships should be either.

Create a mining and salvage system as well as a contract system for moving goods between planets for motherships and privateers. There are so many games old and new these systems could be modelled on so I am unsure why its not been implemented to this day.

If you want to keep lootable PVP then implement a bounty system. If you want to be a pirate then be prepared for notoriety and a price on your head.

To encourage PVP then create gates that allow access to safe space lane travel. These need to be defended and claimed. This could also be space grabs with taxed mobs and taxed resources in sections of space that are free of lootable PVP.

If you want threats in space have an ongoing cycle of patrolling robots or some other alien force that attack space stations and outposts in space areas.

I am hoping UE5 will enhance the space options in EU. When they first implemented space I thought I would make it a permanent place for my avatar but I found myself sticking to one or two planets and playing the X series of games instead.

I've always had big hopes for space but as it stands now I only travel on my own with my one piece of poo or I pay for a warp.
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Bounty system is too exploitable. If you have a bounty on you, just get a friend to kill you and you two can share the profit. Easy money. And whos going to pay for that anyway? All it does is open up another way for fraudulent money transfers between players, just like lootable pvp in space does.

I am not sure that we need to encourage PvP. I am aware that some players are drawn to PvP and others stay away from it. I say, have a dedicated area for PvP and lootable PvP somewhere away from the PvE players so that only the PvP players can go there and have fun with each other. If PvE players are forced to suffer the PvP directly like fish in a barrel then I think that some will just leave the game rather than tough it out. Is that what we want?

Other than the above points, I agree with you that space shouldnt be used to silo planets and there is a great untapped potential for space in terms of possible content. Not sure if it should be just a straight up copy from other games though.
 
If i was MA, I would make none planet partner space area's/stations landgrab areas allowing owners to set tax on space spawns in region and ability to activate PvP, or disable for that area of space for period between fights for control.

This way players and groups would set the pvp/non pvp and if worked together could create/block safe routes through space.

Some of course will be against, others for but would at least give players ability to create routes through space
 
Simpleton said:
The only reasonable argument I can think of to change space is to adjust the game to be more in sync with us humans, we are developing as a human race and it can be seen more clearly than ever right now in 2023 and with it comes a new set of expectations. Many are waking up to the reality that perhaps lootable pvp in space is no longer an appropriate feature and rightfully expressing their concerns regarding that. "Rules are rules" is a rather cold and soulless approach to defending lootable pvp in space.

If we look in our recent history on Earth, we can see that it is really not that long ago that families got together to watch people being beheaded. Yes, children and adults went there to watch it, and it was exciting. If anyone tried this in our modern society it would be seen as inappropriate and swiftly dealt with, and that is the point I am trying to come across, we change. Lootable pvp in space can be considered an inappropriate feature despite it being allowed by MA rules.
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Lootable pvp is "Inappropriate" and "Soulless" ?? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
Mrjoseph said:
Lootable pvp is "Inappropriate" and "Soulless" ?? :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
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Claiming "its the rules", no matter how inappropriate they are is not good.

Edit: Also, in a game that is mostly played for PvE and trading, I think lootable PvP can be considered inappropriate when forced upon the PvE players that dont want anything to do with PvP at all.
 
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Sulje said:
Not true, no such rule exists in Entropia when it comes to pvp, if you don't want to let someone access the pvp area, and you are stronger to enforce that, you can.

Really interesting dumb opinions and suggestions here, imagine comparing being looted in pvp in game withing the game rules to being robbed on the street, which is against rules (law), that's one thing, another thing, you are being warned at least 2 or 3 times you are entering a zone where you can loot or be looted by another participant, and still you decide proceeding knowing that information, and then suggest on forum to remove space and pvp, just because it's an uncomfortable experience for you. It is so childish, dumb and selfish.
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Imagine abusing the system and finding an exploit by dragging players minding there own buisness hunting in normal areas into lootable pvp in space by ships to loot them, my oh my. Dont think the community forget how grubby you and your buds act and your alts. Then to come on here and preach 😂 you sure are an arrogant one.
 
shaun117 said:
Imagine abusing the system and finding an exploit by dragging players minding there own buisness hunting in normal areas into lootable pvp in space by ships to loot them, my oh my. Dont think the community forget how grubby you and your buds act and your alts. Then to come on here and preach 😂 you sure are an arrogant one.
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I am in lootable pvp 24/7 you have all opportunities to come and deliver some justice. I don't have alts, I have 25 alts, and my buddies as well have 30 alts each.

You are the arrogant one, claims that one have alts while not providing any proof of the claim. As well for the other retardation, where you claim things by not providing any proofs.

For anything else go ahead and open support case against me, or publish all proofs you have here on the forum.

See you in pvp small guy.
 
as someone who first signed up in 08/2020

space has been a consistently annoying and useless part of the game without exception since day 1 for me. maybe back in the day it was a happening place with a fun purpose, but i've never seen that.

it costs small amounts of oil and a lot of wasted time traveling the normal way

never carry loot because of pirates

or else pay $1-$3 to another player just to move from planet to planet, one way, each time, if i don't want to waste 45 minutes of my time only to get jumped 3/4 of the way there anyway

don't get me wrong, i understand some small few make their whole gameplay from that mechanic. but for most average players like me, it just sucks. it's a waste of time and money.
 
Give us space suits gas bottles and rpgs. When we get shot out of the quad at least let us fight to our death rather than disable us and have us sit there like ducks.

Give us space suits with refillable gas bottles so we can breathe as well as fly around and dodge fire. Not make it so easy for the pirates.

Regards
Tees
 
jwestonmoss said:
as someone who first signed up in 08/2020

space has been a consistently annoying and useless part of the game without exception since day 1 for me. maybe back in the day it was a happening place with a fun purpose, but i've never seen that.

it costs small amounts of oil and a lot of wasted time traveling the normal way

never carry loot because of pirates

or else pay $1-$3 to another player just to move from planet to planet, one way, each time, if i don't want to waste 45 minutes of my time only to get jumped 3/4 of the way there anyway

don't get me wrong, i understand some small few make their whole gameplay from that mechanic. but for most average players like me, it just sucks. it's a waste of time and money.
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This!

It's really crazy that we still have space after failing year after year. Annoying people every day and locking the auction to only work on one planet only killing the other economies. Time to wake up MA this is hurting PP and new players bad and at the same time snnoying the majority of the older players.
 
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