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Question: What should Mindark do

350k+ ped weapons isn't going to help grow the game, it's a huge turn off for most.

Then players tier it for 100's k more and expect to sell it. Insane.

The reality is as the cost to kill mobs increased the community reduced. There was a time prots were considered as insanely priced mob to kill, now they're babies compared to some mobs. That is how far the game has moved away from simply entertainment value.

Now add in your 350k ped weapons, then the game has got no chance making this popular with the masses ever again.

The only solution to the madness i can see is running a new much cheaper version. Call it "EU global" or something, rename this one EU Pro. Then no doubt ruin the new version for another 20 years.

Rick.
 
People should not get broke by shooting mobs instead loot should be rare to reflect cost of items found that way everyone can hunt what their gear allows them to and prices of items should reflect item rarity ppl will make enough to buy ammo but wont grow rich from it unless they get lucky
 
The key is player retention. Many new players just end up broke and confused after burning through their starter gear and don’t play anymore.
They need to fix the terribly unintuitive UI, and design a more robust tutorial system. Make it a mini campaign with good instructions and clearer pathways for progression onto the next mission. There are entire swaths of mechanics that aren’t even touched on.
 
Vadio said:
Fix economy loop between hunt/craft/minning
End with this bullshit of flood of UL to create health economy

Whole premise of entropia is chance to real money if you are smart and grind for

This make you target audience people that search keywords in how make money online
that usual lead gamblers/"investor"

Its best way to catch new user and make sure they stay in unvierse , is give chance to profit in all level if they use brain/study and futher more after years of grind this chance become expand

After all is skill game rigth?
Atm game running huge ponzi hunt scheme so fragile that stop influx new hunters and fall in trust , can lead huge snowball
my2cent anyway
nvm next... still wait my rank 80 - 90 -100 - 120 - 160 - 200 finder....
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this is the key to fixing the whole game, but unfortunately I think the company MA and rest of the community is too short sighted. They don't want all their hard earned UL weapons to go to waste. UL must remain. But I really believe UL is the issue. It blocks a lot of the economic cycling. Would be very good if all 3 professions fully interacted with each other more. Even for me it is hard for me to go for L weapons. MU for UL don't really matter if you got the cash. Just buy it at whatever the MU is and after you graduate from the level, sell that UL weapons for around the same MU. You get the MU back and you saved all the L MU cost. L MU is lost forever. UL MU, you can get back. Heck it even seems like you get more MU back as UL MU keeps going up higher and higher. By the time you are done with your UL and you sell it, you get more MU and make a profit. There is just no reason to even use L at all. The effect of this is that entry to play skyrockets because UL MU keeps going up. You basically need to tie up $1500 USD or 15000 ped of MU just to play this game. New players just won't do it and they pay MU for L and just can't keep up. Maybe MA can slowly bring down the UL MU before making all UL obsolete so no one whines. Simple supply and demand so slowly increase the UL supplies until the UL MU comes down at a very slow pace. That way people can sell their UL items and that loss of MU investment won't hit them too hard and no one complains. Kinda funny how the real world we got central bank all over the world doing the same with rates. Would be funny if all the traders go out there and start buying up all UL items and cause the MU to go up even more crazy level. But that has to happen so MA will know this whole UL thing is just broken. It's breaking the game economy. Either they increase the supply or the few lucky early birds keep UL and keep that advantage forever. Which isn't fair and deters newcomers.
 
TLDR of psyche if I understand correctly: introduce so much UL that the MU comes way down over time, then remove UL entirely, but hope people don't complain because the mu was low anyway. They may even cheer it as a long-needed solution?

Sounds like crashing the economy even more on (L) and material turnovers until it suddenly becomes saved. Ouch! Still, thanks for sharing...
 
ANother "we want to get loot over ammo or play for free and have chance of making money" post.... a bit childish imho

The idea of "real cash" and F2P are sadly non-compatible. you want to make money out of thin air... i know it is not this way that world goes...

a lower entry level to game?

yes i totally support a way to "play 1 month" for 15 USD (world of warcraft style)
and would immediately build a "skilling planet" that return 100% of TT while you hunt on it,
get no items but just as many uniammo as you shoot (or mine) back
and to land on that planet you need to pay 15 usd per month

i would totally enjoy looking at my skills grow (sorry you cant sell the skills manufactured on the planet)

can you see the benefit? MU spent on the planet is sinked so there is a benefit for other players
the "skiller" has a benefit and it is a catchup zone at a lower cost.

if you go there and use just TT and kill naked, BEST you can level for free (and progress to bigger weapons that still return 100%)
at that point 80'% of playerbase would spend 15 * 12 = 180 USD per year to land and a nice 10.000 player lead to 1.800.000 to MA, just like a more than 50% revenues.

when people exit the planet rest of universe work same way... and have the chance to compete for real cash.

if this attracts 20k users, MA makes more money than now.

at some point the users will think "damn i am ready to compete" and start to pay 2% fee (on average)....
 
jetsina said:
TLDR of psyche if I understand correctly: introduce so much UL that the MU comes way down over time, then remove UL entirely, but hope people don't complain because the mu was low anyway. They may even cheer it as a long-needed solution?

Sounds like crashing the economy even more on (L) and material turnovers until it suddenly becomes saved. Ouch! Still, thanks for sharing...
Click to expand...
I have said it will be a very slow increase in supply to slowly correct the MU of UL items. Obviously sudden flood of supply will crash the MU and make a lot of people angry. But a slow decline, no one will be angry and slow introduction to more efficient L items will be good. It will give reason for people to buy L items and give reason for crafters to buy loots. Don't know how that will crash L item economy if L items becomes far superior, it will become the economy.
 
psyche said:
this is the key to fixing the whole game, but unfortunately I think the company MA and rest of the community is too short sighted. They don't want all their hard earned UL weapons to go to waste. UL must remain. But I really believe UL is the issue. It blocks a lot of the economic cycling. Would be very good if all 3 professions fully interacted with each other more. Even for me it is hard for me to go for L weapons. MU for UL don't really matter if you got the cash. Just buy it at whatever the MU is and after you graduate from the level, sell that UL weapons for around the same MU. You get the MU back and you saved all the L MU cost. L MU is lost forever. UL MU, you can get back. Heck it even seems like you get more MU back as UL MU keeps going up higher and higher. By the time you are done with your UL and you sell it, you get more MU and make a profit. There is just no reason to even use L at all. The effect of this is that entry to play skyrockets because UL MU keeps going up. You basically need to tie up $1500 USD or 15000 ped of MU just to play this game. New players just won't do it and they pay MU for L and just can't keep up. Maybe MA can slowly bring down the UL MU before making all UL obsolete so no one whines. Simple supply and demand so slowly increase the UL supplies until the UL MU comes down at a very slow pace. That way people can sell their UL items and that loss of MU investment won't hit them too hard and no one complains. Kinda funny how the real world we got central bank all over the world doing the same with rates. Would be funny if all the traders go out there and start buying up all UL items and cause the MU to go up even more crazy level. But that has to happen so MA will know this whole UL thing is just broken. It's breaking the game economy. Either they increase the supply or the few lucky early birds keep UL and keep that advantage forever. Which isn't fair and deters newcomers.
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Not exactly as any busines they are focused on making profit and there is nothing wrong with that - However they need to be able to keep their playerbase and drying everyone till they leave is not helping so i would dare to say something needs to change balance main activites in the game such as mining hunting treecuting yes and even healing service because what they did to healers is .......... ( life stealing and L resto chips ) if people do more of that and dont get broke more players will show up so company can increase it's profit margin- For me 20 years later the game is more like free to try because unless you are spending 1000$ a month you are not having fun
 
1. Improooovvvveee Support quality
2. Wait for unreal 5
Everything else is fine
 
Bring back Marco ;) replace management with creatives
 
Make the withdrawal process 100% transparent so that there is no room for speculation, everyone understands what's happening and why there is this waiting period. Generic statements that can't be proven are worthless and do nothing to stop these discussions. Money transfers into and out of the game are not part of the game about which you can keep people guessing.
 
psyche said:
a slow decline
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I understood that, which I why I said 'over time'.
psyche said:
so slowly increase the UL supplies until the UL MU comes down at a very slow pace.
Click to expand...
That is still heading for a point with an even larger amount of UL stuff that is then removed. The idea of making (L) with better stats that gets some mu would also lower the demand for UL, but it would have to be better than armatrix I think to have that effect.

It's an idea, but a bit of a cliff jump at some point, and possibly not even on a timescale of UE5 introduction if I read your meaning of 'slowly' correctly.
All good, just commenting :)
 
Make the game more fun. It's really that simple. More fun events. More interesting mechanics. More interesting ways for players to interact with each other so the game becomes less of a solo afk grind simulator.

I tried to get a friend into this game and he found the point and shoot afk combat way too boring. Mining also hasn't had an interesting update to the mechanics since... ever. Space feels largely pointless. So much untapped potential, devs have no passion for this game.

I'm optimistic about UE5 changes but I'll believe it when I see it. For EU to move forward, we need devs that are willing to take risks.
 
as per making the game more interesting, RPG have 4 class of quests
1. kill 10 rats (in EU 10.000)
2. bring me 10 rat tails
3. talk with the ratmaster to know a piece of lore or trigger event
4. escort a NPC / visit a WP

In EU Cyrene is a nice example of RPG
there are "reputation" quest (sadly its not native in the game so it is just "arc badge accumulation"
there are dailys that reward skills, there is "summoners" quest aswell, or patroling and culling quests
the opening of thorifoid mine on calypso is an example of "waypoint visiting" as well as ark moon daily clicking

Developing quests is really the main point of game development that should have a MAIN quest line (that can expand from level 1 to level 1000) and side quest that lead player to "Meet" all the 1000+ monster in game and kill em all.

yes the game is a solo grind, the interaction is to market goods, and is limited, apart the inefficient shop system all goes to AH or some Twin peak street traders.

i think that just "cyrene rangers" and "wave events" channel are an example of cooperative gaming.

as a 13 year former WOW player, i was used to "quest HUBs".. each zone has some NPC that lead to local exploration via missions to do something.

codex has nice reward but there is absolutely no immersion not fun to see a progressbar rising. the "plushie" quest on Monria is an example of a nice design with useless rewards.
Nextisland MINING VIP is an example of a bad design with a nice reward.
Cyrene epic chains are designed very well in a progression and the rewards are interesting (zorra rifle, neff fap, a six4 pistol)
IFN "military grades system" for daily is an example of "long term goals" that reward a disappointing item (dropship after 1 year grind can not fly in space)

so yes, game has to be fun, but to be fun quest need to point some where
give a sense of "achievement" and of satisfaction.

i am not a creative, i am an accountant but i am sure that some players can design incredible lore quests that go from L1 monster to L200 monster visiting every corner of the maps and doing somethinfg in every place
 
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Make ped an official stablecoin, 10 ped = 1 usd, and list it on a mayor crypto exchange. Then you get crypto players influx.
 
Spawn said:
Make ped an official stablecoin, 10 ped = 1 usd, and list it on a mayor crypto exchange. Then you get crypto players influx.
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That would not be a solution Spawn.
the PED issued as a Crypto stables will in fact
1. deplete revenues intended as 3% of fees if paid via visa or wire
3. be a 100% of amount liability and not just 33% intended as "supposed withdrawal".
4. procure NO benefit of "PED transformation into skill value to the company that is all in all the 67% seniorage profit
5. Allow player to liquidate ped on exchange depleting a 1% withdrawal tax that is now applied.

so MA would loose 4% of transaction fee
and on top loose 67% of seniorage fee.
no benefit for the company --> it will not happen.
 
Msturlese said:
as per making the game more interesting, RPG have 4 class of quests
1. kill 10 rats (in EU 10.000)
2. bring me 10 rat tails
3. talk with the ratmaster to know a piece of lore or trigger event
4. escort a NPC / visit a WP
Click to expand...
you mean shitty RPG have 4 classes of quests.

runescape released this quest in 2004:

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki › Monkey_Madness_I

and the more recent ones some of them are truly epic, and thats only from a shitty 2001 Java-based MMORPG.
 
In all seriousness, roll back to what worked.

Examine when player retention was highest and try that as globals were only achieved at 50 PED and gave myself and many a goal.

Just examine what worked when highest and try to make that a base line. Simple...
 
for starters they should streamline the whole EU ecosystem as its confusing AF for a new players. planet partners websites are outdated (both visually and the info on them), the planet calypso website looks like its from the early 2000s, there are about 6-7 websites to register to EU, some PPs are completely unresponsive for years with no comment from mindark, there is no centralized place for EU news and its just an overall shitshow of a presentation

just clean house before trying to reel anyone in. imagine trying to get people excited for UE5 yet this is what they see when they look up info on the game:

https://www.planetcalypso.com/

its like mindark hates its own product
 
xodus4000 said:
Sell/exit to a proper gaming company, like CCP, Gaijin, etc...
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If they sell to GaiJin im out of here cus nobody more than them knows how to suck the gamers dry. Same with CCP - Pearl Abyss which does everything in their power to Ruin EVE as they Ruined Black desert
 
xodus4000 said:
Sell/exit to a proper gaming company, like CCP, Gaijin, etc...
Click to expand...
Have you seen the monetization practices EVE/War thunder have? War thunder just got review bombed by the whole community because of the shit they are pulling. No thanks.
 
Gopher said:
Have you seen the monetization practices EVE/War thunder have? War thunder just got review bombed by the whole community because of the shit they are pulling. No thanks.
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In EVE online Moneteization upset the old players myself included made us simply quit in war thunder premium vehicles are op and also it's hard to impossible to progress without subscribtion as costs to maintain vehicles and resuply them equals terrible earn per battle and have a roof what you can earn in 1 batttle making repair costs as much as what you earn even more
 
nightbloom said:
how can you even say that with a straight face when you play entropia lol mindark is 1000x worse when comes time to suck us dry
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Suck you dry im still floating 20 years later and i never put a single cent in the game does that make the game fun ?- no it dosent can i afford it - yes i can - will i spend 1000$+ a month - hell no . I do spend money in games simply not Entropia and while i like Entropia becuase of it's unique enviroment if MA would change their ways i would gladly put money in on regular basis but paying 1000+ a month to just shoot monsters is not my ideal fun . Had the game had more people playing they could make more money if they didnt try to dry everyone
 
I cant complain , maybe start invest some money buy some gear and actualy start pull mu in order to get payed.
 
I want to state the overarching point here: It defies all logic that a company who states their income is from in-game activities, would artificially create such a high barrier to entry to stop people from creating revenue. More players shooting bigger guns = more revenue. All I see is a shoddy attempt at money-laundering, otherwise the most inept business development team I've ever witnessed.

Most people only see me poking at MA these days, and to be honest it's really more tongue-in-cheek on my end; I've left any emotion I've had for MA 10 years in the past. However, it's still disheartening they managed to destroy one of the greatest, and obviously not easily-reproducible games on the market. Even 20 years later they have no real competition.

So why then is the game not more successful? Many posts already hit it on the head: the cost related to the enjoyment you get.

After loot 2.0, much of that fun was taken away. As well, with the advent of SIB and L gear the prices of even average gear is so inflated it's hilarious. The fact we used to have Orange Paint in the terminals and it's been as high as ~500% is a joke. Top-end kits for a long time cost around 1k USD, by the time I invested properly in 2005 it was around 3-5k USD, and by the time I took a significant investment away from MA we were already over 20k USD. What is the top kit now, 50k USD? 100k USD? I don't even pay attention any more it's so silly. We used to TT things daily that now cost in the hundreds of dollars.

A simplified account of course - being an RCE game there are many factors, especially those external to MA, that influence the prices. Simple supply and demand could be used in a real life argument, but MA has the power to create whatever supply they want at zero cost which influences the system artificially. Don't even get me started on the game-breaking bugs that allowed people to print money (both through bugged items and loot drops) which are never corrected by MA - they only sweep it under the rug. That's a huge red flag to someone who isn't at the top of the food chain, because it shows MA doesn't actually care.

I've never been a gambler, and although the returns are stated to be higher, the feeling is the same I'm sure as those decrepit people pulling on a slot machine for 12 hours at a time. It was more fun to be stupid and lose $20 in 20 minutes than to be stupid and be bored for 2 hours and gain 1$. At the very least, losing that $20 also had a good chance of you finding something that actually impacted your dopamine, which is the only reason we do any of these activities to begin with. With such thin margins everyone wants to get their pec, which has completely destroyed any real market related to crafting/mining/hunting.

Now it's just a boring, auto-clicker game of whales who are fighting to see who can be at the top. These same people will tell you of all the great opportunities you have to make money, which even a child with basic logic can understand that is not how the world works. 99% lose, 1% gain in systems like these, it's just a fact of life. Even putting your money in a low interest savings account is better than the ROI on anything in EU. I'm not salty about that fact either, but don't take away all the enjoyment the rest of us had for those chasing pennies, because in the end they won't actually keep the game alive. People spending 20-50-100 a month are going to far outweigh an investor who puts in 10k and withdraws more because they gamed the system. That's just money out of the bank for MA because not only did they lose however many players were affected, they never actually retained the "10k investment".

This is not an attack on the individual either, so please don't see it as such. If you enjoy and have the liquid cash to risk in something like EU, I can only ever wish you the best. The blame is squarely on MA.

It's a far more complicated discussion worthy of a real research paper to analyze all of the failings over the years. I've tried to describe the major impacts on an average player like myself who coincidentally finds their only excitement through gaming. To think at one point I was a top player for less than 10% of the current cost makes it very easy to not have a second thought about ever returning in a serious way.

I say all of this with a pit in my stomach, and embarrassed to say at one point Entropia saved me from myself. When's the last time you stopped and had a banter with someone in Twin while seeing how long you could last in the ring? :)

To answer the original question TL;DR: A good start would to be to actually drop items again and give players a sense of accomplishment rather than a daily grind just so you can invest more to lose more.



(I put this in sometimes not to sway opinions, or to turn you against MA, but as a fact of their incompetence: There are people in this game, quite a large number in fact, who used a bug to create more of something than should naturally ever exist. This still has a profound effect on the market 10 years later. MA knew about it, but they never admitted it openly, or punished those players in any form. So if you think MA has YOUR best interest in mind, you're fooling yourself.)
 
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jetsina said:
I understood that, which I why I said 'over time'.

That is still heading for a point with an even larger amount of UL stuff that is then removed. The idea of making (L) with better stats that gets some mu would also lower the demand for UL, but it would have to be better than armatrix I think to have that effect.

It's an idea, but a bit of a cliff jump at some point, and possibly not even on a timescale of UE5 introduction if I read your meaning of 'slowly' correctly.
All good, just commenting :)
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In my opinion L weapons should be vastly upgraded from where they are.
An lr-35 @64.4eff for example can cycle 969 ped and costs 12 ped in mu atm, 12/969 = 1.24% extra return needed to make up the mu spent
a ranked hk1750@ 55.1eff ,its closet ul rival ,64.4-55.1eff translates into .651% more return on the lr-35, 1.24%-.651= losing .589% buying L vs UL. Halve the decay, or add in 10eff and then the majority of (L) beats UL) without having to nerf ul or increase the tt of the weapons
 
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