Why is this allowed?

[Robotek]

What really amazes me in this thread, is that almost everyone is against ND and his team using known characters that are essentialy monitored by all the community, but are perfectly ok in the knowledge that MA's personel does have secret Avi's that might figure on the hof list all the time without us knowing who they are. Let alone having second accounts 'at home' that MA doesn't know about as was stated above.

Got to love the irony...

That... and their friend`s accounts..., there has been in the past some players who knew some info on whats about to emerge and they even publicly announced that they know some info on ef.

Its a natural process, ppl talk to each other about their work etc. with close friends/relatives and so on...

I guess It all comes down to that "withdrawal" button... I think, the employees of MA were always under close monitoring, regarding their income/capital other than their salary`s. But to monitor their relatives/friends financial status, thats another story...

With money there always comes competition, being fair or not. Sadly usually the corrupt deeds come out in the public or under prosecution when the damage is already done...

Cheers and happy holidays everyone!

Robo

 

[NotVF]

so like when FPC told people which mobs would drop highend SGA items? (OK clues that were very easy to work out)

So FPC have been guilty of this on the forum?

No. Because that info was out there for everyone to see. Not just a few people within the business.

sadly, I did not submit a support case at the time cos the deed in my storage with the weaopon at bank-teller dissapeared, and because of that I felt I had no way to prove it. Shit I am actually cryin about my lost Plasma all over again as I am writting this. I just dont wanna go there i am still hurting bout that weapon, I loved it, it was awesome and cost me a bundle too.

Like others stated, file a support case. If any of the banks abuse the powers they have, then it ought to be dealt with. My understanding was that none of the banks would have access to the items in their inventory until the deeds to them expired. In other words, the items ought to be in some kind of an escrow account, and should only be available to the bank after the deed for the loan expires.

If there's misconduct going on, people ought to be made aware of which bank this happens at. And if that misconduct is done by one of the people in the inner circle, then I have a hard time imagining they will be honest in their other business conducts.

On the other hand, if nothing dodgy happened, then that should also be made clear.

This fact scares off investors, other planet partners, and potential participants in a number potentially multiple times the current player base.

Not only that, but it also influences the upcoming planet partners. If there is a conflict of interest with one of the planet partners, and that COI scares off potential or existing players, at the same time it influences THEIR upcoming planets, and the marketing efforts put into it. Where players have several thousands at stake, PPs are investing millions.

The hint of a COI should just not be there, period.

 

[sky west]

With money there always comes competition, being fair or not. Sadly usually the corrupt deeds come out in the public or under prosecution when the damage is already done...

We have a WINNER!

SHOW ME DA MONEY! Or rather, put it in this brown paper bag....

I love you hunnybunny....

 

[cuilwenevey]

Evey: If Force Pissed on your cheerios this morning, just brush your teeth and move on - Cause ya seem to get along with him just fine, when he includes you in recess - right right?

How did my name come in on this??? I don't have anything to do with this thread.. so please leave me out of it.

I have no hatered really towards anyone and only love making friends. and if force pissed me off well i will not make it public knowledge as it is only between me and him.

 

[CuilwenOnnedhie]

................................

 

[cuilwenevey]

sweety that was not in regards to pking.. was trying to film something with pop dragon, had no radar on and did nto see anone around. so it was my fault that force got argoed on by pop dragons.
second what was talked between me and force was somethign i dont' want public. i talked with you and only you about it.

please do not continue this. We will talk on skype soon

plz delete all posts NOW

 

[CuilwenOnnedhie]

..................................

 

[Lavawalker]

Right well then, back to topic.

It will be interesting to see how MindArk decides to handle this whole fiasco.
My personal feeling is that it will be swept under the carpet and ignored since that is their main talent;
However I may be wrong, we may see some reform come from it.

Who knows.
One thing that is important though is to kill off all conflict of interests for the integrity of both the game and its financial environment that all are involved in, from the small $ 20 a month depositors through to the millions of dollars investors. (partners and the such - Both present and future)

ND & company employed are only one small partner in a much larger playing field, they should have no advantages over other partners nor players; including limiting their ability to push boundaries as far as they have thus far.

 

[Kemp]

One upon a time it was a rule that MA employees did not actively play Project Entropia. This rule has been stretched and stretched and stretched, every time it benefited a big investor. Nothing else to it.
I mean common, how can Jon (for intimi) ever remain WORLDS MOST FAMOUS AVATAR and still be a big investor in EU when he isn't allowed to playout his ego ingame. Cut the man some slack....

 

[aven]

Ethics

In professions where a conflict of interest can occur, particularly when monetary or legal outcomes are possible, it is the duty of the professional or company to publicly state those conflicts of interest and, if not remove themselves from transaction entirely, make the transaction as transparent as possible to remove any doubt of bias. It is the duty that they owe their customers. A stock broker must disclose his personal holdings when making recommendations about a particular stock. An audit firm cannot also sell accounting services to a client it audits. A judge cannot oversee a case where a close friend is involved. Family members of anyone who works for a state lottery cannot participate in that lottery.

It has nothing to do with the honesty or integrity of the individual or company. All that matters is that there is no reason to doubt the transaction. All of the above examples are regulated by state and federal laws in the United States, and when it comes to some accounting and financial practices, are even more stringent in foreign markets.

In the case of Planetary Partners, simple disclosures of avatar names may not be sufficient, particularly when it comes to secondary avatars, friends, and family members. All names must be disclosed, and all transactions between these avatars must be public record or at the very least monitored by a third party. Paid employees of a Planetary Partner company cannot be allowed to participate in the game beyond a visual presence, meaning no inventory and no transactions of any kind, be that buying or selling, hunting or mining, or deposits and withdrawals. No, these things are not required in other MMO's, but that is simply because no other MMO involves a real cash currency.

 

[filibert]

Like many others I think this will remain totally unconsidered/uninvestigated. I've read alot in my 1 year experience, and from many many sides MA and partners have shown an incredible talent to avoid any regulation of any kind. They decline to be ranged as a mmo because of the RCE, but they cleverly avoid to be controled (by any instance) by having not been classed with classic cash games rooms. I allways laugh when I see "the swedish blablabl" as this is a fairy tale: MA is paying taxes in Sweden, no official instance will state laws to stop them in their own country. This created a "bubble" as a new thing, and thus no financial judge/institute of any other country will invest time and energy to make a first case unless millions are in balance.
To resume the problem is almost "pyramidal". The very rare people that would have the power to engage a procedure are the ones that are having profit/advantage. The little-medium people are suffering but unable to do anything as their weight in balance is zero, and the people between ND institution and the mass people..well are just dreaming to have same story as ND so they wont cut the branch their sitting on.

The sure thing is that for an activity to be regulated you need laws and classifications, and atm i clearly doubt there is anything done. My only hope is USA actually, because many players are from there, and after all when we read texts it appears that nowadays they are maybe regulating these things more than any other country.

This and the curious balance behavior before events or some new patches makes me so disappointed that I even went back to play CIV IV last days ...

filibert

 

[sidxx]

where are FPCs comments on this thread? why have they failed to notice this issue? hmmm

 

[SpikeBlack]

where are FPCs comments on this thread? why have they failed to notice this issue? hmmm

on this occasion it's nothing to do with FPC and only MA and NI. MA don't talk to players we don't exist.

 

[JJO]

Well now this thread is about to run out of steam :/ kinda sad really.

I don't think I saw one intelligent comment from the people under scrutiny. Unless I lower my IQ to around 80, then the childish "neverdie" reply makes perfect sense.

Ah well, lest we be called WHINERS again.....

 

[Corey 'Greyfox']

Look, everyone is assuming that there are no regulations just because some VERY low value items where looted by ND's "posse". None of us know if or what the regulations on planet partners are.
Of coarse MA is not going to answer you here, this is a FPC forum. Any respionse here would be mutalated to mean whatever people want it to mean. You want answers then send a message to MA directly. Until you go to MA directly stop insinuating that ND is not being regulated, that he has the ability to cheat, and that having said ability means he will cheat.
I mean seriously everyone is getting pissed off about what is purely speculation.
This makes as much sence as going into a 7-11 and accusing the clerk working of comiting lottery fruad, just beacuse they handle lottery tickets.
So far ND has done nothing to suggest he is not being regulated. So far ND has not cheated. So far MA has not said Planet partners are not regulated.
So far the majority of you assume that ND is not being regulated. So far most of you assume ND is in a position to cheat. So far the majority of you assume that MA does not regulate planet partners.
Man that's alot of assumptions. Until you have facts(real facts, not hearsay) leave ND alone, he has done nothing to deserve being put on public trial before a mob. Go after MA to release what rules Planet partners have to follow.


BTW, when you send a message to MA directly, expect a generic responce back. That's not because they don't care about your concerns, it's called PR. They don't want to say anything to you that you could distort to mean something completly different. So unless you have the money to become a Planet partner, or are good friends with one, I have a feeling that you will never know exactly what is covered in the Planet Partner contract. The best we can do is each of us petition MA to release what the general guidlines are for Planet Partners. I sent mine just prior to editing this post.

 

[Lavawalker]

Look, everyone is assuming that there are no regulations just because some VERY low value items where looted by ND's "posse". None of us know if or what the regulations on planet partners are.
Of coarse MA is not going to answer you here, this is a FPC forum. Any respionse here would be mutalated to mean whatever people want it to mean. You want answers then send a message to MA directly. Until you go to MA directly stop insinuating that ND is not being regulated, that he has the ability to cheat, and that having said ability means he will cheat.
I mean seriously everyone is getting pissed off about what is purely speculation.
This makes as much sence as going into a 7-11 and accusing the clerk working of comiting lottery fruad, just beacuse they handle lottery tickets.
So far ND has done nothing to suggest he is not being regulated. So far ND has not cheated. So far MA has not said Planet partners are not regulated.
So far the majority of you assume that ND is not being regulated. So far most of you assume ND is in a position to cheat. So far the majority of you assume that MA does not regulate planet partners.
Man that's alot of assumptions. Until you have facts(real facts, not hearsay) leave ND alone, he has done nothing to deserve being put on public trial before a mob. Go after MA to release what rules Planet partners have to follow.

And your assuming that it is regulated, yet you also state there is a conflict of interest in a previous post which points to it not being regulated.

It is not about insulting ND, its about clearing up the situation and removing all conflict of interests.

It was his decision to cross the line from player to developer, and in this decision all policies must follow.

Meaning you can't keep the cake and eat it at the same time.

MA decision to enforce policies whatever they may be such as they have done with FPC will effect all present and future partners and player investors into which path they take with their decision to build & invest into Entropia.

 

[Rockchick]

I see a clinic full of cynics
Who want to twist the peoples' wrist
They're watching every move we make
We're all included on the list

The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum

No nuclear the cowboy told us
And who am i to disagree
'Cos when the madman flips the switch
The nuclear will go for me

The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum

I've seen the faces of starvation
But i just can not see the points
'Cos there's so much food here today
That no one wants to take away

The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum - take away my right to choose
The lunatics have taken over the asylum - take away my point of view
The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum - take away my dignity,
Take these things away from me
The lunatics have taken over the asylum
The lunatics have taken over the asylum - take away my family,
Take away the right to speak
The lunatics have taken over the asylum take away my point of view,
Take away my right to choose

 

[Lavawalker]

In professions where a conflict of interest can occur, particularly when monetary or legal outcomes are possible, it is the duty of the professional or company to publicly state those conflicts of interest and, if not remove themselves from transaction entirely, make the transaction as transparent as possible to remove any doubt of bias. It is the duty that they owe their customers. A stock broker must disclose his personal holdings when making recommendations about a particular stock. An audit firm cannot also sell accounting services to a client it audits. A judge cannot oversee a case where a close friend is involved. Family members of anyone who works for a state lottery cannot participate in that lottery.

It has nothing to do with the honesty or integrity of the individual or company. All that matters is that there is no reason to doubt the transaction. All of the above examples are regulated by state and federal laws in the United States, and when it comes to some accounting and financial practices, are even more stringent in foreign markets.

In the case of Planetary Partners, simple disclosures of avatar names may not be sufficient, particularly when it comes to secondary avatars, friends, and family members. All names must be disclosed, and all transactions between these avatars must be public record or at the very least monitored by a third party. Paid employees of a Planetary Partner company cannot be allowed to participate in the game beyond a visual presence, meaning no inventory and no transactions of any kind, be that buying or selling, hunting or mining, or deposits and withdrawals. No, these things are not required in other MMO's, but that is simply because no other MMO involves a real cash currency.

This is a well stated post

 

[Corey 'Greyfox']

Lavawalker,
I know I said that earlier, but on standing back and taking some more time to think about this I am going to say now that the potential is there for COI, but because I do not know what is covered in the Planet Partner contract I do not know if this is as simple as it seems. I am going to urge everyone to petition MA directly for at least some general guidlines that Planet Partners are held to. If people can't be bothered to do that then I am going to assume that they really don't care, and are just complaining for the sake complaining.

By the way, I also sent a message to ND personaly, citing this thread, asking him if his employees where under any regulations of his own making. Don't expect a reply back any time soon though. Last time I sent him a message(asking how much CND made a year) it took over a month before he responded.

 

[Kitty]

BTW, when you send a message to MA directly, expect a generic responce back. That's not because they don't care about your concerns, it's called PR. They don't want to say anything to you that you could distort to mean something completly different. So unless you have the money to become a Planet partner, or are good friends with one, I have a feeling that you will never know exactly what is covered in the Planet Partner contract. The best we can do is each of us petition MA to release what the general guidlines are for Planet Partners. I sent mine just prior to editing this post.

Actually I e-mailed Frank at his MA address with a link to this thread and asked him to please read it. So I have contacted MA directly.

 

[Corey 'Greyfox']

Actually I e-mailed Frank at his MA address with a link to this thread and asked him to please read it. So I have contacted MA directly.

Well thank you Kitty. I doubt an official responce will come from MA, but if it does that would really clear things up. If nothing else, thanks for trying

 

[Aio]

Personally, as the thread starter and taking a obvious good view of all the comments, I believe we've all said our piece.

Any more discussion on this topic is only going to cause slander (MA/FPC/ND) or grief (the community) and thus I respectfully request this thread to me locked (ty Hanne love <3).

I really do hope that MA take good view of this, personally I do still believe FPC to be the "good guys" (just from the personal connection I feel to the older members (Marco n co) and the newer members (we've all spoken to them in-game ). But the onus is on MA to fix these problems that have been highlighted.

Fix them, improve the community. Seriously - it's good business sense to have your customers holding you in high regard. Cos at the moment, I'm not the only one saying the people are good but the company is shit

Lock it up, and please FPC keep us updated with developments. It may not be "your" area, but honestly, you're the only link to a very vague company that we have.

As a complete side not, I'm a little disappointed in the FPC response, but I kinda understand as it's wholly not your area to deal with. Would be nice to have more "active" liaisons tho - anyone who's worked in a multinational like myself knows it takes about 30minutes for a piece of info to travel the whole distance via e-mail

 

[T79x]

lets hope all this change something

 

[Corey 'Greyfox']

Aio,
I would like to suggest that this thread not be locked until we see if Kitty's message to MA is answered. I have my doubts that it will be, but if it is it would clear alot of things up.

 

[MindStar9]

Actually I e-mailed Frank at his MA address with a link to this thread and asked him to please read it. So I have contacted MA directly.

And I will send an email to David Simmonds and ask him to check the thread out as well.

 

[jod]

In professions where a conflict of interest can occur, particularly when monetary or legal outcomes are possible, it is the duty of the professional or company to publicly state those conflicts of interest and, if not remove themselves from transaction entirely, make the transaction as transparent as possible to remove any doubt of bias. It is the duty that they owe their customers. A stock broker must disclose his personal holdings when making recommendations about a particular stock. An audit firm cannot also sell accounting services to a client it audits. A judge cannot oversee a case where a close friend is involved. Family members of anyone who works for a state lottery cannot participate in that lottery.

It has nothing to do with the honesty or integrity of the individual or company. All that matters is that there is no reason to doubt the transaction. All of the above examples are regulated by state and federal laws in the United States, and when it comes to some accounting and financial practices, are even more stringent in foreign markets.

In the case of Planetary Partners, simple disclosures of avatar names may not be sufficient, particularly when it comes to secondary avatars, friends, and family members. All names must be disclosed, and all transactions between these avatars must be public record or at the very least monitored by a third party. Paid employees of a Planetary Partner company cannot be allowed to participate in the game beyond a visual presence, meaning no inventory and no transactions of any kind, be that buying or selling, hunting or mining, or deposits and withdrawals. No, these things are not required in other MMO's, but that is simply because no other MMO involves a real cash currency.

This is the best post in this thread to easily understand what people are getting at here and I've bolded the relevant parts for you.

Look, everyone is assuming that there are no regulations just because some VERY low value items where looted by ND's "posse". None of us know if or what the regulations on planet partners are.Until you go to MA directly stop insinuating that ND is not being regulated, that he has the ability to cheat, and that having said ability means he will cheat.

Would you say the red part I've bolded in the OP is being adhered too in any way?
Because this is the standard that is required if you wish to be taken seriously in a business environment and it would seem its no different in our niche of the business world.

To the blue part of your post I would point to the blue part of the original quote.Which has been explained to you numerous times,Continually going back to an argument that has been answered is redundant and pointless.
And again you bring up the value of the items when it has been explained numerous times the value is irrelevant.

To answer your point that none of us know whether they are regulated or not I would point to the red bolded parts of the original quote as an example of how they are either not regulated or are not sufficiently regulated.So again that part of your argument has been answered,no need to go back to it again.

I mean seriously everyone is getting pissed off about what is purely speculation.

And yet none of us would have anything to speculate on if the coloured points raised in the original quote were adhered to yet we have zero indication that any of it is and in case of the red part exactly the opposite is certainly the case-this part is not speculation.

So far ND has done nothing to suggest he is not being regulated. So far ND has not cheated. So far MA has not said Planet partners are not regulated.
So far the majority of you assume that ND is not being regulated. So far most of you assume ND is in a position to cheat. So far the majority of you assume that MA does not regulate planet partners.
Man that's alot of assumptions.

Again the red part of this quote is answered by the red part of the original quote.There is way more evidence that there is little to no regulation than to say there is any regulation at all.
The black bolded parts are essentially the same assumption and these 'assumptions' are not completely baseless and without merit to the point they be thrown out as fanciful.This argument goes to all the planet partners not just ND its just that his is the 'test' case if you like and the one that brought it to the fore on a much larger scale.
The evidence may be circumstantial and not enough for a conviction but it is certainly enough to warrant further inquiry.

Until you have facts(real facts, not hearsay) leave ND alone, he has done nothing to deserve being put on public trial before a mob. Go after MA to release what rules Planet partners have to follow.

Again this is about all planet partners not just ND and tbh we shouldnt have to ask MA,the planet partners should be pro-active in dealing with any potential CoI and be as transparent as possible by following the points outlined in the original quote.Its in their best interest to do so.

They don't want to say anything to you that you could distort to mean something completly different.

Or they could make strong unambiguous rules and a public statement on the subject that leave no room for distortion or 'interpretation'.
But yes this is MA and its hard enough to get the wizard to come out from behind the curtain in any way since the company was split.They seem to have completely ignored the user base since that time and use FPC as a middle man.

But again MA's rules should be just a safety measure,the Planet Partners should already take it upon themselves to follow the whats outlined in the original quote,It just makes sense.

 

[Lavawalker]

So to summarise, there are 4 main Conflict of Interests looming:

1. Bank Neverdie needs to be sold off
- Otherwise this would be like Marco as a developer & CEO owning Bank Marco on another planet for personal gain.

2. Island Neverdie on Next Island needs to be removed or moved to Rocktopia
- Otherwise this would be like Marco as a developer & CEO creating his own island on another world for personal gain.

3. Neverdie the player needs to resign his avatar and create an official CEO avatar
- Otherwise this would be like Marco playing a normal avatar amongst the general gaming population for personal gain.

4. Neverdie staff members need to resign their playing characters and have official avatars created.
- Otherwise this would be like Hanne|FPC playing her Skam avatar amongst normal players for personal gain.

All in all, Neverdie stepped over the line from player to developer and CEO.
Proper policies should be followed and conflicts of interest removed in their entirety.
There are no excuses to be made of but, but, but... These are the facts of CoIs

- Otherwise this would make David Simmonds look like a fool with his recent statements:

David Simmonds concluded his interview in the Sep issue of the EntropiaTimes by saying ...

"To build a truly diverse universe that can cater for all ages, countries and personal preferences, we must
allow our Partners to build and cater to their preferred sector of Internet users. All content is checked
before implementation by MindArk, and we have strict rules and regulations our Planet Partners must follow with regard to certain sensitive areas and content.​

If anyone at MindArk or here on the forums is still confused, re-read this:

In professions where a conflict of interest can occur, particularly when monetary or legal outcomes are possible, it is the duty of the professional or company to publicly state those conflicts of interest and, if not remove themselves from transaction entirely, make the transaction as transparent as possible to remove any doubt of bias. It is the duty that they owe their customers. A stock broker must disclose his personal holdings when making recommendations about a particular stock. An audit firm cannot also sell accounting services to a client it audits. A judge cannot oversee a case where a close friend is involved. Family members of anyone who works for a state lottery cannot participate in that lottery.

It has nothing to do with the honesty or integrity of the individual or company. All that matters is that there is no reason to doubt the transaction. All of the above examples are regulated by state and federal laws in the United States, and when it comes to some accounting and financial practices, are even more stringent in foreign markets.

In the case of Planetary Partners, simple disclosures of avatar names may not be sufficient, particularly when it comes to secondary avatars, friends, and family members. All names must be disclosed, and all transactions between these avatars must be public record or at the very least monitored by a third party. Paid employees of a Planetary Partner company cannot be allowed to participate in the game beyond a visual presence, meaning no inventory and no transactions of any kind, be that buying or selling, hunting or mining, or deposits and withdrawals. No, these things are not required in other MMO's, but that is simply because no other MMO involves a real cash currency.

Every planet partner present and future should be aware of this looming situation imho before deciding to invest heavily into MindArk as an ethically operating company that applies its policies and procedures without prejudice.

 

[Chrome]

I feel the last few posts have nicely summarized a long, passionate thread by many community members...
Thank you.


If folks really want to see some changes, maybe refrain from spending time/money at any ND establishment?

It's been said before by others, but "voting with peds" may make a strong financial statement to the individuals in question.

 

[Casay]

I feel the last few posts have nicely summarized a long, passionate thread by many community members...
Thank you.


If folks really want to see some changes, maybe refrain from spending time/money at any ND establishment?

It's been said before by others, but "voting with peds" may make a strong financial statement to the individuals in question.

Overall though, it's not about just ND. It's about planet partners in general and the ethical and conflicts of interest and how we can be assured it's monitored. ND just happens to be the first one. Again, this all came up over RT and should have been settled by MA then!

 

[MindStar9]

To Lavawalker ... your post was a perfect summary, so thanks for taking the time to put it together. In all fairness though, the only thing I would point out is the fact that David's statement was referring to the theme of a planet, and that is what's checked. It was referring to content and certain sensitive areas that might be offensive or inappropriate, and had nothing to do with conflict of interest. So we still need to find out what MA's position is on all of this.

The other fact remains ... ND is involved with the first two planets launched, and this issue came up before when ROCKtropia went live, but nothing was said or done about it by MA. Quite frankly, I don't think they give a rat's ass about the current community, but are banking on new players coming in who don't know anything different, or who might not give it a second thought. However, conflict of interest is conflict of interest, and I don't think the community should let this die this time. I'm sure that's what they're hoping will happen yet again, but it can't. This is far too important. I'm surprised the media hasn't picked up on this yet as a major controversy within a real cash economy.