Info: Restoring Sweat & ME Value

[exovirus]

Welcome to the Sweat Restoration Thread

Our Goal: Find a way MA could restore sweat price to .5 that would be both beneficial to Mindark and to the players.

Thread Rules:

- This is not a thread for debating why or why not restore the price of sweat.
- It isn't a thread for complaints, whining or non contributing critizism of this effort.
- Please try to keep all post on topic.

Debates should remain focused on how a method will or won't work.

please try to make contributions first, and back all arguements with well written facts, not opinions.

I have reserved two slots below to mark and update with both pass and fail methods. All reasonable scenerio methods will remain in pass until proven failed.

 

[exovirus]

Pass Methods to Restoring Sweat Value

1. Monthly collectables available @ terminal in exchange for x amount of sweat
2. Players organized ME hunts. Using mindblast chips.
3. New Mind Force Chips, with more appeal & usefulness
4. Include sweat as a crafting material in a low lvl blue print.

 

[exovirus]

Fail Methods to Restoring Sweat Value

Method / Reason

1. Giving Sweat TT value - Financial Danger to MA
2. Restore Sweat Cap - Reduce MA's Popularity, Player Harmful
3. Sweat Strike - Always someone willing to sell, Player Harmful
4. More Depositers - Always more Play for free vs. Pay to Play users, Doesn't directly effect sweat demand.

 

[ForrestPark]

The only way to raise sweat price without MA changing the dynamics of the game is for sweaters to organise Mindforce-only hunting events.

If you want to get MA to change the dynamics of the game, you could be waiting ten years. So if you want something doing, take it into your own hands!

Forrest

 

[exovirus]

The only way to raise sweat price without MA changing the dynamics of the game is for sweaters to organise Mindforce-only hunting events.

If you want to get MA to change the dynamics of the game, you could be waiting ten years. So if you want something doing, take it into your own hands!

Forrest

Actually a very good idea Forrest.

However would sweaters be able afford the initial Implant, implant inserter, and mind blast chip in order to do a mindforce hunt?

The initial investment for a new players would be:

tt( minimal 5 ped ) + 2 ped for Nerve Blast Chip
21.99 ped for implant
15.00 ped for implant inserter

Puts initial investment @ nearly 45 ped... plus as the price of sweat/ME rises so does the cost of these hunts.

Sweaters would need to collect atleast 16k of sweat in order to have the ped for implant, chip, inserter and a little ME for ammo.

You are also paying 160% - 165% on ammo, instead of tt for medium cell for opallo.

 

[Teranoz]

if all sweaters would start depositing instead of complaining the price would go up again..

 

[exovirus]

if all sweaters would start depositing instead of complaining the price would go up again..

I don't believe having more depositers would increase the value of sweat directly. I believe the goal here is to some how increase the demand for sweat.

Can you supply a fact based reason of how you believe having more depositers would increase sweat value?

 

[DaveFoz]

if all sweaters would start depositing instead of complaining the price would go up again..

In fact in a round about way this would work. if all the ppl who complain about the price deposited then they would not sweat. that would leave fewer players sweating. so less sweat on the market meaning the price would rise.

However you are never gonna stop ppl moaning as it is what ppl do when they want something for nothing

That is my opinion and 2 pec.

I am also sorry to say getting sick of the get the price of sweat back up almost as much as i am sick of the "feel sorry for me i got myself scammed" threads

 

[exovirus]

In fact in a round about way this would work. if all the ppl who complain about the price deposited then they would not sweat. that would leave fewer players sweating. so less sweat on the market meaning the price would rise.

However you are never gonna stop ppl moaning as it is what ppl do when they want something for nothing

That is my opinion and 2 pec.

I am also sorry to say getting sick of the get the price of sweat back up almost as much as i am sick of the "feel sorry for me i got myself scammed" threads

Ok, I am not sure if you read the thread rules but:

1. You are posting an opinion, no fact involved. Explain how more people depositing would do more to improve sweat prices.

2. Depositers will always be outnumbered by freebie lovers. As there are always more people looking for hand outs vs. paying for something.

3. If you are sick of these threads, stay out, post else where. thanks!

BTW: This is not a feel sorry for me thread in any way. It is a thread with hopes for collaborative efforts to improve the game for players, depositing or not. Please be respectful.

( Just to make it clear, I deposit myself around 50US$ - 200US$ every month into entropia. )

 

[ForrestPark]

Actually a very good idea Forrest.

However would sweaters be able afford the initial Implant, implant inserter, and mind blast chip in order to do a mindforce hunt?

Well, what I mean is. . . a group of sweaters would get together and organise a MF-only hunting event on a LA - largely for non-sweaters. By that I mean only heal chips, focus chips, Nerve Blast chips and Firestorm chips are allowed. Maybe someone could even run a wormhole for people to get to the LA. Whether the sweaters pay to use the events system or run it on EF is up to them.

It is not the sweaters themselves that compete in the event - they just:
- organise it
- sell ME to contestants before, during and after the event
- check everyone is competing under the rules (if the event is run under the EU events system)

So if it is "highest loot wins", the person with the highest loot posts the screenie of it (hopefully a global) with the swirlies in the picture and the MF weapon or heal chip wielded at the time, as confirmation they did it under the rules. Anyone submitting a global pic to EF would need to also explain all their previous visible 'hits' and 'heals' if they don't 'fit the picture' of the wielded weapon or heal chip.

Any organiser catching a contestant not using a non-heal-chip FAP or non NB/FS chip to hit the mob can disqualify them. Most players with any reputation in game or on EF would not want to be caught cheating.

The benefit to the sweaters is they are able to sell ME at the time of the event, and more importantly, the event consumes, say 200 or 300k ME which is then taken out of circulation.

I think a weekly event like this, on a LA with e.g. Exarosaur Stalkers would be just about the only way to keep the sweat price up. But even a monthly event on EF - "Best Mindforce loot of the month - post your screenies" would help ME to be consumed!

 

[Teranoz]

Can you supply a fact based reason of how you believe having more depositers would increase sweat value?

Because the majority of sweaters can or will not pay money to play.
Sweating is free, and people that have peds are not waisting their time to sweat for hours. Instead they just buy it.
It might be even faster to earn money from some vague pay to read email construnction than from sweating.

Just calculate how many dollars you have for working an hour as sweater..

IF (and that wont happen because of all the leechers) all people stop sweating that means no more ME, no more using tp chips and the price goes up again.

It used to be that you could only gather sweat until a certain level. At that time sweat sold for 2 pec per bottle.
So its not the depositing that would increase the price, but the non sweating and so bringing less sweat into the game.

Just the same rules of supply and demand apply here as anywhere in the world

 

[DaveFoz]

( Just to make it clear, I deposit myself around 50US$ - 200US$ every month into entropia. )[/I]

So just why do you care about the sweat price then?

If you deposit then unless you sweat just for the defensive skills does not seem to be a lot of point for this thread

 

[exovirus]

Actually I see that is something that is very possible.

Have a suggested prize that would motivate people to compete?

Tickets pay for prize?

Best Mob to hunt? I think exar stalker is a little high maturity for pure ME hunt.

I would be willing to host this event if the community showed enough interest.

 

[exovirus]

So its not the depositing that would increase the price, but the non sweating and so bringing less sweat into the game.

Just the same rules of supply and demand apply here as anywhere in the world

So basically your saying have less free to play, players. In order to do this MA would have to impose some sort of very unpopular regulating action, such as sweat cap. Due to the unpopularity it would be harmful to MA, which MA won't do.

 

[demonseedgfx]

Simple make mind essence worth something. Apart from the TP chip I dont use any of my others. Its just not worth it they do nothing. Maybe if I use nerveblast and had a chance of more skins as the body isnt shredded by ammo that sort of thing. Not as effective at low levels but chance of more or exclusive loot. Using chips gives a chance of some sort of exclusive loot yea I like that idea. More people would use it then. TP and get a random loot when you get there. Heal some random folks and get loot. Yea that would work. People would then use ME more and the price of sweat would go up due to demand. Or we could just not bother about the price and live with it.

Soon people will get bored at getting nothing for the time spent gathering and stop, slowly supply would stop and the price will go up. Or we could just not bother about the price and live with it.

 

[exovirus]

So just why do you care about the sweat price then?

If you deposit then unless you sweat just for the defensive skills does not seem to be a lot of point for this thread

1. This is breaking a thread rule in which you are debating why it is worth restoring the value of sweat.

But to answer your question. At my lvl of play you can burn through 100$ - 200US$ in less than a day, even being eco, hunting smart etc.

So sweating or swunting is an activity I participate in when I am looking for good conversation, or when I wish to skill, defense, sweat, mindforce etc.

During that time I would like the activity to have monetary value as well, since the game easily sucks so much of my PED away.

I hope this answers your question and you can either contribute an idea or stop destructively critizing the thread.

 

[exovirus]

Simple make mind essence worth something. Apart from the TP chip I dont use any of my others. Its just not worth it they do nothing. Maybe if I use nerveblast and had a chance of more skins as the body isnt shredded by ammo that sort of thing. Not as effective at low levels but chance of more or exclusive loot. Using chips gives a chance of some sort of exclusive loot yea I like that idea. More people would use it then. TP and get a random loot when you get there. Heal some random folks and get loot. Yea that would work. People would then use ME more and the price of sweat would go up due to demand. Or we could just not bother about the price and live with it.

Soon people will get bored at getting nothing for the time spent gathering and stop, slowly supply would stop and the price will go up. Or we could just not bother about the price and live with it.

I partially agree, and I did forget to post this method. MA could produce other mind force chips such as, stealth, flying, sprinting, carry weight buffs of some sort. Or chips that would be of more usability and logical economy to use.

I believe this is a great way for MA to increase demand for both ME, and sweat.

It also leaves open for some very exciting possibilities for abilities!

 

[Teranoz]

So sweating or swunting is an activity I participate in when I am looking for good conversation

EU is not a chatbox. They invented SL for that.

 

[exovirus]

EU is not a chatbox. They invented SL for that.

Your point is invalid to the subject of the thread. You shouldn't be attacking or trying to undermine the thread, by trying to devalue my motives for creating the thread or how I play the game.

Please either keep your arguements to how a method of sweat restoration can or cannot work or don't post in this thread.

If you wish to debate things clearly against the thread rules feel free to PM me I will be happy to discuss these things with you outside the thread.

 

[Zabler]

Easiest way and allready mentioned is ofcourse for MindArk to give a boost to mindforce with different new unneccesary functionalities..

Levitation Chip (Allows you to levitate at the same speed you are running, but hey.. you are above the ground)

Fireworks chip (Allows you to produce fireworks in the sky)

and some that could be real:

Chill Chip (Chills the creature you are aiming at reducing its speed, very effective in hunting mobs at distance)

Cloak Chip (Mobs seem to aggro you less, other players however seem to see you as good )


Meteor Chip (Sends a meteor with AOE effect down on the mobs you aim at, warning will possibly mass aggro.. )

 

[exovirus]

Easiest way and allready mentioned is ofcourse for MindArk to give a boost to mindforce with different new unneccesary functionalities..

Levitation Chip (Allows you to levitate at the same speed you are running, but hey.. you are above the ground)

Fireworks chip (Allows you to produce fireworks in the sky)

and some that could be real:

Chill Chip (Chills the creature you are aiming at reducing its speed, very effective in hunting mobs at distance)

Cloak Chip (Mobs seem to aggro you less, other players however seem to see you as good )


Meteor Chip (Sends a meteor with AOE effect down on the mobs you aim at, warning will possibly mass aggro.. )

I agree, New chips seem to be the way, hopefully MA is just waiting till v10 for these? Likely just holding our breath.

btw a chill chip... like the idea that at a certain lvl you can use mind force to cause mob to un'aggro for maybe 30 seconds.

 

[Aandar]

And the best solution for every side is:

TO LOWER THE PRICE OF SWEAT
To about 0.2 to 0.25




















By DOUBLING the amount of bottles in every pull.

Good for sweaters because they will sweat about the same amount of PED per hour (or more if Mindforce comes back to life thx to lower prices or ME).

Good for mindforcers because ME could then be about 125% (if MA increases the amount of Nexus to about Crude Oil level thus lowering its markup to 102%-103%) making the Mindforce actually ECO.

Good for MA because they will keep the "try before you buy" part of the game alive.

And good for MA coders because they can just change 2 values to fix the big problem:
From 2 to 4 and from 22 to 44 lol

 

[exovirus]

Well I wouldn't disagree there, other than reducing nexus prices cause then it effect depositing miners.. and it is allready hard enough to find MU of 120% on regular finds.

MU is the only thing that makes mining break even.

 

[Nihilist]

best way is to start a mafia.. and enforce strict buying practices by whatever means necessary.

 

[exovirus]

lol... how would a mafia in entropia enforce anything? come on this isn't kids camp.

 

[Nihilist]

sorry.. these sweat threads just bring out the jokes. - ; P

on a serious note.. i believe that there should be more uses for ME thus increasing the demand.. BUT.. even with an increased demand of ME you will bring the price of nexus up maybe.. sweat however is in unlimited supply and will forever plummet in value..

 

[exovirus]

sorry.. these sweat threads just bring out the jokes. - ; P

on a serious note.. i believe that there should be more uses for ME thus increasing the demand.. BUT.. even with an increased demand of ME you will bring the price of nexus up maybe.. sweat however is in unlimited supply and will forever plummet in value..

No worries.. jokes are better than bad critizism. a rise in nexus MU% or anything really is never a bad thing when it comes to entropia the only thing that helps anyone break even is the MU.

I think that is why there needs to be an independant and appealing method of purging the mass amounts of sweat from the system. Such as sweat in exchange for fun items that can bring no profit or loot but provide entertainment...

paintball, maybe exclusive wearables, or some sort of activity providing item that has no tt value itself but can only be acquired through exchange of sweat for said item. The item can even decay if that will help MA, hell even make it L.

 

[mastermesh]

1. Giving Sweat TT value - Financial Danger to MA

Sweat already has a TT value. It's just not a TT value you like. Put 1k sweat in the TT machine and it will give you 1 pec. That IS the TT value of sweat. Asking MA to get something more "official" would be like asking them to "officially" change the TT value of a mod fap to whatever the latest market value was... it's not gonna happen. The community determines the price of items by being willing to pay a certain price above TT value for items. MA does have some impact on that by making resources either more rare or more available through the game engine, but they don't determine how much people are willing to pay above TT value on something... The individuals in the community determine markup. An item is worth only what people are willing to pay for it. No more, no less.

I do agree, MA would be smart to give us better uses for sweat. Perhaps it could be used to mix with sweet stuff to make a different kind of nutrio bar... maybe new and better mindforce chips can come in to play... I'd be all for making the warmup phase of weapon chips go away. That would automatically make nerve blasts weapons just about the most economic and highest damage/pec item in the game! Maybe I better hang on to that last nerve blast chip I just bought instead of selling it, lol.

 

[Nihilist]

No worries.. jokes are better than bad critizism. a rise in nexus MU% or anything really is never a bad thing when it comes to entropia the only thing that helps anyone break even is the MU.

I think that is why there needs to be an independant and appealing method of purging the mass amounts of sweat from the system. Such as sweat in exchange for fun items that can bring no profit or loot but provide entertainment...

paintball, maybe exclusive wearables, or some sort of activity providing item that has no tt value itself but can only be acquired through exchange of sweat for said item. The item can even decay if that will help MA, hell even make it L.

thats not entirely true.. lower MUs would indeed help the buyer break even. - ; )

collectibles traded for 100k's of sweat would be cool. - ; )

 

[Zacariaz]

Restoring sweat/ME prices to what they were or what it should be?