Info: Huge investor promises to revamp the dynamics of Entropia Universe loot returns.

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Viperstrike

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Please note: This of course is fictional at this stage with the potential to become non-fictional.

Past life regression of Jan W MK.I: Entropia Universe has always been the love of my life, a dream which I brought into reality but never truely understood the potential of what it could be for the player. I am a humble man, but only when it comes to my own ends, not that of the people who will help me achieve my own ends, the player.

Huge investor promises to revamp the dynamics of Entropia Universe loot returns.

01/04/2013.

In breaking news today, it was reported that a large investor intends to take over MindArk AB, the creator of the widely known online game known as Entropia Universe, the designated pioneer of the real cash economy (RCE) concept and turn it into something special, something that it pretended to be but never was.

Entropia Universe is stated by many critics to be an online casino where players from across the world can convert their real life savings from US dollars to game currency with real value called PED of which they can play and lose or win big amounts from activities including hunting, mining and crafting undertaken across the multiple planets available to play on.

Here is what the huge investor, who wishes to be known as Jan.W MK.II said:

Are you sick of being taken for a fool, playing a game that is not just a game, but one which involves real money? Are you unsure if you are really playing a game or if you are at the casino with the house against you and no real odds in your favour ?

Then read on, my goal is to change all that and renew and redefine the Entropia Universe concept whilst bringing new life to the meaning and potential of real cash economies.

The way I intend to do this is through transparancy, empowering the player by giving them the tools and knowledge they need to have the odds of enjoying Entropia Universe as a affordable game worth playing for the money spent potentially stack in their own favour.

It is time for change, and today 01/04/13 will be the start of a new era!

Entropia Universe will still be dynamic, however it will no longer be known as an online casino, even by the critics. There will be no less than an 80% return promised per activity undertaken in the Universe. The remaining 20% will be made up of profit of which portions shall be returned to the playerbase as gifts for their continued play and/or hard work.

Let me explain further .... Jan W.MkII goes on to say:
I will hereby give you a rough outline of how hunting will work in relation to loot returns.


Here is a sample of how it will work - Hunting in Entropia Universe.

Let us look at what we use first - Most weapons do 2.8 to 3.2 damage per pec spent, this variance will remain as it gives some weapons advantages and value over others to compete in the real cash environment at acquiring their wealth, or losses.

As an average a weapon will do 3 damage per pec, meaning a mobs' health and regen has to be be specifically adjusted per tick to match a desired cost to kill average for each Lx mob.

Mob: Mobile object, referring mostly to a monster or creature in a computer game
Tick: A computer game developers term meaning per few seconds time has passed
Lx: Level of mob in question


In this example we will use an "Argonaut Gatherer" which has a mob level of 10 (L10)
We intend to set the HP of this level 10 mob as such that it will cover the following loot return concept.

In this example the L10 Argonaut Gatherer will have 300 HP, costing on average 100 PECs at 3 damage/PEC


Loot return concept:

80% of the cost to kill (80 PEC) will be returned as general loot, every mob will loot!

If the cost to kill this "L10 Argonaut Gatherer" was to cost roughly 1 PED and 0 PEC to kill, then 80 PEC will be returned as the "common" loot. This maybe oils, wools, extractors, tiering components, crystals, etc.

The remaining 20% (20 PEC)

The remaining 20 PEC will have a designated 20% returned to the playerbase as gifts for their continued play and hard work (4 PEC), leaving 16 PEC profit to be split between MA AB and the planet partner.

50% of this 16 PEC, 8 PEC will become MA AB profit of which will be used to pay our employees, investors and maintain the systems used to maintain the operation of the gaming platform.

The other 50% of this 16 PEC, 8 PEC will partly become profits used to pay our investors (Planet land deed holders) along with paying the planet partner staff who produce the planet based content.

The 4 PEC to be returned to the playerbase as gifts for continued play and their hard work

Concept: L10 Argonaut Gatherer (1 Ped to kill on average at 3 DMG/PEC)
  • 1. Uncommon Loot,
  • 2. Rare Loot
  • 3. General Globals/HOF/ATHs.

Out of that which is to be returned to the player, in this case 4 PEC per L10 Argonaut Gatherer Killed;

4 counters with RNG (Random Number Generators) within a specific range will decide how the finance is to be returned as loot in the form of:

1. Global & Uncommon Loot 50% counter (2PEC)
(L)imited Items - weapons, armor, MF chips, faps etc
Counter rule for "Uncommon Loot" (2PEC per kill)
RNG between 2500 kills (50 PED) and 5000 kills (100 PED)

2. HoF & Rare Loot 25% counter (1PEC)
(L)imited Adjusted or Improved Items - weapons, armor, MF chips, faps etc
Counter rule for "Rare Loot" (1PEC per kill)
RNG between 25000 (250 PED) and 50000 (500 PED)

3. HoF/ATH 25% counter (1PEC)
Oils/Wools/Common - ie. made up primarily of common loot.
Counter rule for "General Globals/HoFs/ATHs" (1 PEC per kill)
RNG between 2500 (50 PED) and 250000 (5000 PED)

A 4th and final counter would also be setup to drop "Extremely Rare" loot of a TT value of 0.01 PED (1PEC)

4. Extremely rare loot - UnL Armor parts, UnL SIB weapons, etc
Note: VALUE 1 PEC - ie. You need to repair it to use it
Counter rule for "Extremely Rare Loot"
RNG between 250000 and 500000

There you have it, stay turned for Crafting and Mining updates in the near future!

See you soon,
Signed: Viper 01/04/13
 

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31/09/2013.
Entopia files for bankruptcy protection.
Entropia the online game with Real Cash Economy today filed for bankrutpcy protection as they sought to refinance their business. Having seen out the global recession they found player numbers dropped dramatically in recent months.
A pundit from GameBlog.com commented "the players have left in droves, they say its become too dull, the thrill has gone from the game". Insiders blame Jan MKII, who implemented a complete overhaul of the games economic structure as well as the business model. A senior programmer we spoke to said they had reservations from the start "the system worked, some complained, but it had worked well for 7 or 8 years. Jan MKII's plan turned the economy in the game on its head and broke the revenue link to decay. it didn't work anymore. Then the random generator mucked up the distribution of items, we were dropping more high end items than basic items."
He went on to say "we said it should be new game, we we're happy to work on a new project, but the existing game wouldn't survive such massive change".
Former senior employee at MA, Marco commented "Its dynamic ".
 
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Viperstrike

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I am glad to see you got the sense of humor in it all ;)

However outline from the above where the loses are made to let the game go bankrupt ?
 

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So in this story you are making the loot worse? :)
 

Viperstrike

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A reply with a smile - Keep a few people happy and hundreds unhappy, or keep a few unhappy and hundreds happy.

There will always be those who say how brilliant they are saying they achieve a 90%+ return,

However the reality remains the same, even with the most eco setup most people are receiving way below 80%, some I could faithfully say 50%-60% return per run on an average day.

What this will do is make loot evenly spread for all, "providing player retention for the masses"

You get 80% returned as a norm, you also have the opportunity if lucky 1 in every 2500-5000 kills to get a global which will be a percentage of the Lx level of that mob (Keep in mind your not the only 1 killing any specific mob, 2500-5000 universally). Then there is in 25000 to 50000 and so on for the 4 counters.

Not only this, you have the opportunity to hit HoFs an ATH, Rarer Adjusted and Improved (L) equipment and not to mention UnL armors & sib weapons of a value of 1 PEC which you must repair to use.

All these things will improve the overall long term loot for "the masses" keeping many more players rentented to playing Entropia Universe, long term.

Loot will be no worse for anyone, if anything, it will be better.

Keep a few people happy and hundreds unhappy, or keep a few unhappy and hundreds happy.

Which would you choose? :scratch2:
 

Viperstrike

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We are also talking purely TT decayed, not markup.

There is the Real Cash Free Market Economy RCFME which you have the potential to sell your looted items at a markup on. So the OP is all about TT nothing more, no markups are taken into consideration.
 

nlnforever

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Nice try, However can you please play the game a bit longer, spend a bit more before speaking of loot system? Honestly, if you have less than 500k in global/hof, it is very hard for you to imagine how the system works. Play for a bit longer then you will understand.
 

Viperstrike

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Nice try also, I have been here since longer than you :) Not this avatar this is my 2nd avatar, 4th return to game in total. I have seen many changes in the loot system from VU 5 and up.
 

Viperstrike

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Honestly, if you have less than 500k in global/hof
Crafting Mining Amps 2 and the occassional low end SIBs weapon on condition adds to this quota or do we remove them out and see your tally :silly2:

Sorry couldn't resist, I know you well NLN, I have read most of your posts since joining as a newbie.

Though those 2 mining AMP2 ATHs one after the other on the same day was quiet impressive I must say ;) Very lucky.
 

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However the reality remains the same, even with the most eco setup most people are receiving way below 80%, some I could faithfully say 50%-60% return per run on an average day.
Do you have any proof of this, or just something you made up as you wrote it?

Asking because I believe this is completely false. Most people probably get above 80% longterm, with a few (sometimes loud) exceptions.
 

Viperstrike

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Do you have any proof of this, or just something you made up as you wrote it?

Asking because I believe this is completely false. Most people probably get above 80% longterm, with a few (sometimes loud) exceptions.
Ah the common asked question, do you have proof of this.

Like you nighthawk, I have kept very precise logs for work in the past when I was investigating Entropia Universe with the rest of my team. Yes it does average out long term, this is correct. However there can be immense periods of down loots and very short spikes of up loots.

Mostly immmense periods of down loots were the norm.

I do not keep records now, I am retired from work due to an unfortunate car accident, however Entropia did pass as to not being filtered by our firewall as an illegal online casino. The tax office was also happy thanks to input made by several members of our community, David S. being the prominate who contributed the most to this.

You would know him better as Deathifier.

To answer your question, yes I have gone through all that, earned my 280k skills naturally in doing so, chipped them out, sold them and here I am again, well 4th time now to play long term as a retiree.

I do not complain about loot, I play for fun :) However many constantly complain and keep their records each run.

Nicely done on your psyche, keep at it. You will get there soon FM
 
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Every game has it's own participants. So does EU now so will EU after any change. But you are only covering the revenue part here. How do you suppose to pay the costs?

Crone is not against any change, he is careful when people threaten his hobby. He does hope you made better calculations than this.

Lot needs some kind of geographical variance.
 

Viperstrike

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Crone is a wise man, but is Crone all there today.

My friend did you read the OP properly.

I wrote this to be fun, it is just a sample of Hunting at this stage, however I do have a system for mining and crafting that blends in using mechanics that are similar.

The costs are covered here per kill made:

The remaining 20% (20 PEC)

The remaining 20 PEC will have a designated 20% returned to the playerbase as gifts for their continued play and hard work (4 PEC), leaving 16 PEC profit to be split between MA AB and the planet partner.

50% of this 16 PEC, 8 PEC will become MA AB profit of which will be used to pay our employees, investors and maintain the systems used to maintain the operation of the gaming platform.

The other 50% of this 16 PEC, 8 PEC will partly become profits used to pay our investors (Planet land deed holders) along with paying the planet partner staff who produce the planet based content.
So in short,
1 PED to kill,
80 PEC back to the player as normal,
4 PEC back to the player as a potential,
8 PEC to MA AB
8 PEC to Planet Partner.

Hope that helps.
 

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01/04/2013.

See you soon,
Signed: Viper 01/04/13
First ermm we are not in 2013.

Second they can not give 80% return on every mob, as then it would be very easy for everyone to make a profit, this will result in EU crashing and burning very fast.

Third, I do not believe this is real smells like a hoax
 

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I think most of the times people get 90-105% returns if they hunt smart...And then a bad period shows up, when it does its important that u either don play or have peds to grind trough the bad loot periods when returns can be 40-80%...I think most of the players that complains about bad loot simply doesnt have enough peds to survive bad loot periods and they end up low on peds.

If people started to deposit lets say 10k peds instead of depositing 1k ped per month for 10 months the outcome would be much better, u can save loot instead of TT:ing them and get a few % extra and so on.
 

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However the reality remains the same, even with the most eco setup most people are receiving way below 80%, some I could faithfully say 50%-60% return per run on an average day.
Do you have any proof of this, or just something you made up as you wrote it?

Asking because I believe this is completely false. Most people probably get above 80% longterm, with a few (sometimes loud) exceptions.
I would agree with the 50-60% "realistic" returns. Since some loots have little or no TT value, and others have terrible MUs. Just because we get 90% no-looters "on average" does not mean that translates to 90% peds returned.

As for laws of averages? Everything can average out - even 12 million blind-folded monkeys doing coin tosses - given infinite time. Or slot machines. So this "personal loot" graph is nonsense. Everything averages out eventually.


The costs are covered here per kill made:

1 PED to kill,
80 PEC back to the player as normal,
4 PEC back to the player as a potential,
8 PEC to MA AB
8 PEC to Planet Partner.
While I follow the above - and *if* 80% is TRUE TT value returns, then this could be decent start of the baseline concept.

Tickers for the HoF/Globals cannot be static I think... as then people will KNOW when they are DUE for one = personal loot pool. Also... do they simply RECOVER the remaining 20% 16%? Or does it ever go ABOVE the 1ped investment accumulated over time?

And if 250,000 players are suddenly DUE for a global... how would that work? Where is this money coming from?

And IF the "remainder" is merely rewarded back to the players - which is still a loss after MA/partner deductions.... why would anyone wish to play knowling it a certain loss (regardless of time)?

Another issue here is: How do you know 8 pecs is good enough to keep MA and partners afloat? Have you tallied this number with their books? Is it sufficient?
 

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@ArtJennifer: this is a fiction, read the OP.

Like you nighthawk, I have kept very precise logs for work in the past when I was investigating Entropia Universe with the rest of my team. Yes it does average out long term, this is correct. However there can be immense periods of down loots and very short spikes of up loots.

Mostly immmense periods of down loots were the norm.
Hey Viper, i think the system has been adjusted after VU10. As it is now, you can't speak about "average short-term returns" and "long periods of down loots" in general any more.
Depends on the mob now, L10 used in your example belongs to the class that already gives this stable loot you are proposing to introduce in your fiction.
Breaking in through the open door... ;)

Where the current system differs from yours, is that it gives an option to "gamble" (meaning: "go through much longer periods of much higher/lower returns").
This choice: "how high i want to play this", is left for the player. You are proposing to take it away and make the whole system flat. Looks like a step backwards, the results aridash predicts are most realistic, at least with the current playerbase.
 

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Gawd people, this is meant to be fun, I wrote it for fun. :cool:

Oh man, sorry but you guys make me laugh :D

Even with its serious undertone.

But anyway, just have fun in EU!

It is not a game for making any sort of money in, just have fun damn it lol! :wise:

Off to play some more EU, blow shit up ;)

I had enough of EU at work!

Yes it has the baseline mechanics to start your own rce if you wanted to,
but yea I prefer a little gamble here and there - So Jan leave it as is.

Let the masses be unhappy and the fanbois and gals who dwindle rapidly in numbers while the market crashes to ATLs in markup value be as they are.

Now the question is ... Am I being serious in all this *grin* Fictionally signed Viper 1st second of the 1st minute of the 1st hour of the 4th month 2013. Fishy Hoxy ! :D lmao

Note to self, must not take the piss too often, bad Viper BAD!

Hi Jimmy, long time no see :)
 

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First ermm we are not in 2013.

Second they can not give 80% return on every mob, as then it would be very easy for everyone to make a profit, this will result in EU crashing and burning very fast.

Third, I do not believe this is real smells like a hoax
It's in suggestions/wishlist for a reason, chill Jenn ;P
 

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Nicely presented, but ari is right, this would kill EU within weeks.
 

Viperstrike

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And if 250,000 players are suddenly DUE for a global... how would that work? Where is this money coming from?
Re-read the OP, 4 PEC is pooled ready for the payout if that were the case, however I don't see 250,000 different mobs in EU to global on :)
 
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Viperstrike

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Nicely presented, but ari is right, this would kill EU within weeks.
Thanks bud, it was meant to be fun, I was kinda taking the piss out of all the serious number crunchers out there having been one of these in the past and way too seriously playing this game.....

It will just kill it for you long term if your serious and there is always needed the excitement of a gamble :yup:

Number crunching after 3 years of precise accurate logs for the Australian government agency I working for taught me one thing .... Don't do it in EU, your wasting your time. For the most part anyway.

You pay to play, simple as that, you invest HEAVILY to make a very small ROI. Tiny even.
 

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Huge investor scared off by angry entropians armed with pitchforks and torches

 

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eh... doesn't the loot system pretty much already work like this? :silly2:
 

Konve

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So in short,
1 PED to kill,
80 PEC back to the player as normal,
4 PEC back to the player as a potential,
8 PEC to MA AB
8 PEC to Planet Partner.

Hope that helps.
eh... doesn't the loot system pretty much already work like this? :silly2:
Yes it does. In fact it's nearly spot on. According to the OP, 84 PEC should be the average returned.

Only as it is today, the average is about 85-90 % as far as I can tell. So it would give a more stable return, but a lower average still. (Do note that the claimed 50-60 % average returned is not true. Not by a long shot. If you get that then you're doing it wrong.)

You will have to hunt soooo much more in order to build up those 4 % parts for a single (L) item in your loot. Getting an 80 PEC (L) weapon will not do much good..


Edit: Also note that "MA makes their money from decay" is a statement that needs to be greatly modified before if's true. MA makes their money from "income minus withdraws, combined with a below cost to kill returned loot". Decay only makes them money in the sense that it removes ingame value forever, which can not be withdrawn.
 

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Yes it does. In fact it's nearly spot on. According to the OP, 84 PEC should be the average returned.
the OP is suggesting outright 80% return on each loot event. not an average.

80% of the cost to kill (80 PEC) will be returned as general loot, every mob will loot!
this would make the game deathly boring. i'm the first to hate no looters and would rather a flater return pattern, but a straight 80% would be flatlining and so would the game.
 

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I would not play the game described in the OP
 

Viperstrike

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the OP is suggesting outright 80% return on each loot event. not an average.

this would make the game deathly boring. i'm the first to hate no looters and would rather a flater return pattern, but a straight 80% would be flatlining and so would the game.
This would be true as quoted my reply would be:

All these things will improve the overall long term loot for "the masses" keeping many more players rentented to playing Entropia Universe, long term.

Loot will be no worse for anyone, if anything, it will be better.

Keep a few people happy and hundreds unhappy, or keep a few unhappy and hundreds happy.

Which would you choose? :scratch2:

Looking at past history, all the complainers, all the media comments and player forum comments on Entropia.

This is pretty much what they are looking for and why they have quit, because it has no stability.

The Entropia Universe has a massive trust issue and the only way to resolve this, to bring back the players and to retentively keep them is through transparancy, a simplification of the loot system with some guaranteed variables so people know what to expect (For at least 80% of the return).

It is still dynamic in that weapons offer a 2.8 - 3.2 dmg/pec and that you use different healing equipment and armor (and plates) for mobs. You also have the skill dependency of economy using the current item wether it be 10.0/10.0 or still getting to that stage.

It is also dynamic in terms of the loot counters mentioned which could see your overall returns amass quite a bit over 100% returns if your lucky to pickup globals, hof, uncommon, rare or extremely rare loot which will all have their associated markups attached.

The common 80% loot is low level markup goods, oils, wools, extractors, tiering components, crystals (NI) etc.

Anyway let us forget it, those who claim it is flat actually do not see the bigger picture and are not understanding the full dynamics of how such as system would work - And no I am too tired to be fucked going detail on this.

So here is the basics:

All we are doing is placing in one variable quantifier offering a standard baseline 80% return along with additional factors which all impact that return such as economy/effeciency/equipment used and the counter loots as mentioned in the OP.

Putting in this what I would call a stablizing factor would bring back people to the game having a knowledge of what to expect, almost like how we lean on our chosen GOD for our faith, it is a stablizier for many in the real world. (Not that god has anything to do with this subject, it is just an example of a stablizier/crutch/firm grounding point - Let Lootius bless you all!)

Anyhoooooooo, I think this concept flew over a lot of peoples heads, some of you get it, some of you are just blind fanboys and gals and some just lack the willingness to use the potential between your ears. No offense meant but it is just so true!

Enjoy the game and have fun. I was only looking at a solution to the current predicament Jan W finds himself in with all these questionaires and wanting people to return to the game - No even bothering to ask the main question about loot and return rates /sigh, what a waste of fucking time that could be spent doing it right.

Have fun and good luck in Entropia,
Viper
 
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