News: Information regarding Withdrawals

[Igorl]

Saying layoffs is good is about the most american backwards thinking thing i've heard all day.

...

So layoffs in a non us company, is generally not accompanied by anything good. Even less so in a scandinavian country where workers rights and all that stuff is even higher put than in general europe for example.
...

And if you clock in to much the goverment will ram a first down your throat. God i love not working in usa, same money less mental hassle

Yup american way. If poor guy even knew how COSTLY is to fire someone in EU -> he would be bedazzled.

As a TLDR to our US friends:
- in EU you MUST take 3 weeks paid holiday, at least
- making ppl working more then 8 hrs / day costs employer arm and a leg (up to 100% more hourly)
- in my country having more then 250 paid overtime hours per YEAR is not allowed and anything over 180 needs to be announced in advance on paper, reason given (Ill do the math for you - that is on average 3.4 hours / week overtime allowed)
- for any worker with the company for more than 2 years you need to give between 1-4 months advanced termination notice (dependent on union contract / length of employment)
- pay one monthly paycheck per year of service with company (yes, 12 years with company will cost you one whole year paycheck to the guy you fired), its called severance pay and its embeded in law in most EU countries

Those are just some glimpses. You cant treat ppl like dirt here in EU. And afaik SE is still here with us...

I.

 

[robber]

oki he got his money can we lock this thread ?

 

[Igorl]

oki he got his money can we lock this thread ?

Still no official "withdrawals are no longer delayed" post. So I guess its still relevant. Why not let healthy "is Mindark solvent" discussion to bloom.

I.

 

[Kaiser]

on the contrary i think it's great. less labor expense = more money for development or just padding cash reserves. layoffs are good.

delayed means delayed... whether 70 days or 120 days.

The problem is they laid off the developers of their next product in order to get into "AI". What exactly are they thinking there? They haven't even been able to fix bugs in a 15yo game engine.

Agreed the effects are good, but the train for the layoff is not (reduced revenue).

Anyway, hopefully I see the funds by Friday .

Agreed delayed is delayed but I don't believe for a minute it is due to an upgrade. I feel liquidity issues.

 

[Kaiser]

oki he got his money can we lock this thread ?

I haven't gotten anything just a word on a web page .

Takes a week to actually receive the transfer.

 

[Orion]

Fun fact:
My deposits are as delayed as the withdrawals are...

 

[San]

Why can't we just stop fooling around and try a productive discussion instead. I find it unlikely that the size of their development staff has anything to do with withdrawals, equally unlikely as the chance of credit card chargebacks being the sole reason for such delays, especially for people who don't use them. I want the company to do away with this obscurity, with pacifiers for explanations, with the bs corporate lingo. Withdrawals aren't secret sauce like the loot algorithm and need to be understood by everyone. If the game was an investment fund, this would be mandatory. Like in a real estate fund, everybody understands that the money is tied down in things that aren't liquidated at the push of a button. Is it something like that we have here? Then please explain.

 

[Mika]

Why can't we just stop fooling around and try a productive discussion instead. I find it unlikely that the size of their development staff has anything to do with withdrawals, equally unlikely as the chance of credit card chargebacks being the sole reason for such delays, especially for people who don't use them. I want the company to do away with this obscurity, with pacifiers for explanations, with the bs corporate lingo. Withdrawals aren't secret sauce like the loot algorithm and need to be understood by everyone. If the game was an investment fund, this would be mandatory. Like in a real estate fund, everybody understands that the money is tied down in things that aren't liquidated at the push of a button. Is it something like that we have here? Then please explain.

because if you have genuine worries for the game and the company, but are not a ‘ultra rich’ person. You should check your priveledge and sod off poor trash. /s

But gl having a productive discussion with someone who thinks a 4wd car with only 2 wheels installed will perform better. You can try ofc but most of us others find it a little hard to not always bite these rich idiots baits with their trolling. Most of us do not wish to invest thousands into a 0 guarantee 100% risk thing, especially not when we get so little info. Like orion said i think its somewhat reasonable to say ‘my deposits are delayed as long as my withdrawls are’ that sentance about sums up all of it

 

[Igorl]

If the game was an investment fund, this would be mandatory. Like in a real estate fund, everybody understands that the money is tied down in things that aren't liquidated at the push of a button. Is it something like that we have here? Then please explain.

No. Explanation:

https://www.mindark.com/investor-relations/financial-reports/documents/2023/MindArk-Interim-Report-Q1-2023-EN.pdf

Page 9 and 10.

TLDR:
Short term investments ~900k$ (thats liquid)
Long term investments + receivables: ~500k$ (thats not that liquid)
Cash / equivalents on hand: ~2.5M$
Short term receivables: ~1.3M$

They dont have any publicly traded debt. (they cant default or need ot pay intrest which is great)

Their biggest "debt" is in books as "Allocation unconsumed user holdings" - money they calculated they owed for PED: 4.5M$ (that is ~30% of PED value in game)
And they need to pay 1M$ in taxes for that.
Along that in short term liabilities (payables and immediate expences) they need 1.5M$

The rest is complicated GAAP shit which is mostly irrelevant to us - consumers.

I.

 

[Msturlese]

i think i commented already the balance account.
company is HEALTHY and had just high staff cost (was in fact addressed this quarter)
company is listed in a small stock exchange. this commands even bigger disclosures so expect half year or even quarterly positions published andf filed to the exchange.

People that consider "DEEDS" and investment because have a yield of 7..8% are simply non considered risk weighted returns to deem those interesting.
intesad it is way better to buy company shares that are a regulated product and is supervides. DEEDS are not a supervised product, the formation of the payoff is not public, buyer rely on a pec value that is not certificed nor disclosed in the foramtiion.

That said the delay is simply IMHO
1. to see if in the withdraw windomw someoned files an allegation for scamming or stealing PED by the requester
2. to disincentive the "Quick cycling of ped" in keys

as i posted more than once i got some mates that regularly withdraw (adn deposit, too) that are paid under the 50 days.

the rest is conspitaition theory and stress related

 

[Igorl]

i think i commented already the balance account.
company is HEALTHY and had just high staff cost (was in fact addressed this quarter)
company is listed in a small stock exchange. this commands even bigger disclosures so expect half year or even quarterly positions published andf filed to the exchange.

This. Company is public. You have fresh report every 3 months. Company is very healthy. No debt, good cash / receivables file. With a little liabilities to their name. If I wanted to buy a gaming company - it would be good option.

But "Allocation unconsumed user holdings" is not solvent at this moment. But that was pretty much the case for most of its existance, so no big worries there. That would play into account only if someone decided to take over for the content and depeg PED from dollar.

I.

 

[Kaiser]

Why can't we just stop fooling around and try a productive discussion instead. I find it unlikely that the size of their development staff has anything to do with withdrawals, equally unlikely as the chance of credit card chargebacks being the sole reason for such delays, especially for people who don't use them. I want the company to do away with this obscurity, with pacifiers for explanations, with the bs corporate lingo. Withdrawals aren't secret sauce like the loot algorithm and need to be understood by everyone. If the game was an investment fund, this would be mandatory. Like in a real estate fund, everybody understands that the money is tied down in things that aren't liquidated at the push of a button. Is it something like that we have here? Then please explain.

I suspect that because MA holds a banking license there are legal requirements that aren't being followed. They get upset when you mention Fi, their financial regulator.

 

[Kaiser]

Funds arrived business day 89.

 

[Msturlese]

no one had doubts it would happen.

 

[San]

I suspect that because MA holds a banking license there are legal requirements that aren't being followed. They get upset when you mention Fi, their financial regulator.

Great to hear that you got it at last. But I suggest to rethink publicly expressing any suspicion of willful wrongdoing, unless there is real evidence. All we know is that there is a procedure which is both intransparent and unusual. But we haven't seen a single incidence of a default. Consider that they would risk everything in an audit. I can't imagine they would be that foolish and repeat that I hold no such sentiments, all the criticism notwithstanding.

 

[Heidi S]

I made a 10k withdrawal in April and it turned up this week a day early. Go figure.

 

[Igorl]

I made a 10k withdrawal in April and it turned up this week a day early. Go figure.

My 10k euros came in today as well.

A week early. Go figure that.

I.

P.s.

For all my fellow europeans... always request euro transaction. It literally 0.99 × amount / ECB usd-eur rate. At the date requested! Not payout. Getting dollars or any other currency costs some BS mid bank fees.

 

[Kaiser]

Great to hear that you got it at last. But I suggest to rethink publicly expressing any suspicion of willful wrongdoing, unless there is real evidence. All we know is that there is a procedure which is both intransparent and unusual. But we haven't seen a single incidence of a default. Consider that they would risk everything in an audit. I can't imagine they would be that foolish and repeat that I hold no such sentiments, all the criticism notwithstanding.

I can express any suspicion I want to. Especially when I am not the only one experiencing issues.

 

[Lucy_Luck]

Withdrawal made approximately 64 days ago and received today . Thanks MindArk for not letting me down

 

[jetsina]

The thread's been going for seven weeks or so now and people are seemingly getting their withdrawals, according to those who spoke about not getting them within the 50 business days (maybe more in other dedicated thread). I think it's time to rest this for now at least.
My only point would be to wish MA puts better time info in the thread title, such as May 2023 in this case...

 

[Alina]

So far with who i spoke they said there is no patterns (bank or country etc). Some players always had to wait 50 days some 70-80 days.

 

[Evey]

A week early. Go figure that.

You should send support case and complain they LIED! They said there will be delays.. wtf MA, can't even keep a promise....

Joke aside, think the excessive complaining on forums helped money come faster?

 

[Msturlese]

Joke aside, think the excessive complaining on forums helped money come faster?

I think some player have submitted more evidence of ID and VISA and Bank ccordinates
in my specific case i made a deposit via Wire transfer, my bank account is for sure registered,
i dont plan to withdraw anything but i am sure i am correctly profiled for AML/KYC duties.
i would, before asking for a withdrawal,
provide to support an updated ID, a proof of residence and a matching name IBAN (or bic/swift+ Account number.
this would 100% speed up process.

 

[Evey]

this would 100% speed up process.

I wish there was an ingame checklist of stuff they need, a player could submit, to be 100% fast as possible, before they have to ask it.... but maybe UE5 will fix this as well?
My experience is the commits are within -5/+10 working days; seems to be the case for everyone I spoke with as well. Panic and suspicion appears in those cases where "approximately" word is missing from ppls dictionary.

 

[Sulje]

Wondering what happened to the "system" behind withdrawals and how the process is improved overall?

ps. never had withdrawal late (beyond 50 working days), except the first one that was late for a few working days.

 

[PreyNaika]

What is this withdraw everyone speaks about ?

 

[Igorl]

You should send support case and complain they LIED! They said there will be delays.. wtf MA, can't even keep a promise....

Joke aside, think the excessive complaining on forums helped money come faster?

I dont believe that is related to any amount of forum rant. I believe it was just a short liquidity crunch.

I mean - lets be real. 2 month withdrawals? Cmon. Lets not kid ourselves. Its just to prevent bank runs until something else comes up to either attract more deposits or pull out excess liquidity. MA 10k states they are currently insolvent (as I already said - nothing new or wierd, but with instant WD they could go bust in a matter of days, for sure)

Anyways - hope things stay great like they did for now. I have a bit over 1000E left in the game that Ill play with casually, I dont care what happens with that. Bottom line is - dont let your livelyhood depend on what you have in EU.

I.

 

[Msturlese]

Mindark is now a listed company and needs to fulfill lobligations. Among these there is publication of INTERIM Reports:

https://www.mindark.com/investor-relations/financial-reports/documents/2023/MindArk-Interim-Report-Q1-2023-EN.pdf

Before bullshitting it is important to understand how to read figures (and the reason for PED.......
1 USD = 10.7 SEK
1 USD = 10 PED
1 PED = 1.07 5SEK (please allow me to consider SEL = PED for ease of reading

- Turnover amounted to 26.5 MSEK (21.9 MSEK).
TEHSE ARE PED SOLD .... 2.600.000 usd IN 1Q 21% MORE THAN BEFORE

• Work in progress amounted to 7.7 MSEK (6 MSEK).
THIS IS THE VALUE OF UNREAL INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY MOST PROBABLY itis worth 170.000 usd more (disappointing, programmers dont work free so its a small progress, but still 20% more)

• Operating profit amounted to 4.2 MSEK (4.7 MSEK).
• Profit before tax amounted to 4.5 MSEK (3 MSEK).
This is interesting just because some investment lead to 30.000 USD profit (or the exchange rate helped some extra returns)

• Cash & cash equivalents including short-term investments 37.1 MSEK.
THIS IS THE MONEY IN BANK AND AVAILABLE, 3.700.000 USD, SO NO FUCKING SHORTAGE OF CASH OR LIQUIDITY CRUNCH, READ THE NUMBERS

• No interest-bearing liabilities.
these are PED debit (reserves post seniorage profit) that bear no interest in favor of players that can withdraw

• Provision for unspent user funds 47.4 MS
THESE ARE RESERVES TO FULFILL WITHDRAWAL REQUESTS.... so... an instant request of 4.500.000 USD can be paid from MA without any problem
one of the TOP players has posted once a total value of his storage of 1m ped....
no one came to say PEASANT and shot a 2m TT storage so i suppose it is to be considered a BIG amount

Remember that MA dont pay MU so a NANOBALDE is worth its TT Value on withdrawal.... the rest is player assigned value.
please all ppl that make weird consideration, goto MY ITEMS and check value....
probably it is something ranging 1k to 100k ped (TT VALUE ONLY) for 90% of players
then a 5% that is over 300k

please believe numbers, OFFICIAL, sent to a MARKET AUTHORITY and CERTIFIED:
dont believe bullshit, conspiration theories and people that can barely calculate a markup

Peace

 

[Sulje]

Mindark is now a listed company and needs to fulfill lobligations. Among these there is publication of INTERIM Reports:

https://www.mindark.com/investor-relations/financial-reports/documents/2023/MindArk-Interim-Report-Q1-2023-EN.pdf

Before bullshitting it is important to understand how to read figures (and the reason for PED.......
1 USD = 10.7 SEK
1 USD = 10 PED
1 PED = 1.07 5SEK (please allow me to consider SEL = PED for ease of reading

- Turnover amounted to 26.5 MSEK (21.9 MSEK).
TEHSE ARE PED SOLD .... 2.600.000 usd IN 1Q 21% MORE THAN BEFORE

• Work in progress amounted to 7.7 MSEK (6 MSEK).
THIS IS THE VALUE OF UNREAL INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY MOST PROBABLY itis worth 170.000 usd more (disappointing, programmers dont work free so its a small progress, but still 20% more)

• Operating profit amounted to 4.2 MSEK (4.7 MSEK).
• Profit before tax amounted to 4.5 MSEK (3 MSEK).
This is interesting just because some investment lead to 30.000 USD profit (or the exchange rate helped some extra returns)

• Cash & cash equivalents including short-term investments 37.1 MSEK.
THIS IS THE MONEY IN BANK AND AVAILABLE, 3.700.000 USD, SO NO FUCKING SHORTAGE OF CASH OR LIQUIDITY CRUNCH, READ THE NUMBERS

• No interest-bearing liabilities.
these are PED debit (reserves post seniorage profit) that bear no interest in favor of players that can withdraw

• Provision for unspent user funds 47.4 MS
THESE ARE RESERVES TO FULFILL WITHDRAWAL REQUESTS.... so... an instant request of 4.500.000 USD can be paid from MA without any problem
one of the TOP players has posted once a total value of his storage of 1m ped....
no one came to say PEASANT and shot a 2m TT storage so i suppose it is to be considered a BIG amount

Remember that MA dont pay MU so a NANOBALDE is worth its TT Value on withdrawal.... the rest is player assigned value.
please all ppl that make weird consideration, goto MY ITEMS and check value....
probably it is something ranging 1k to 100k ped (TT VALUE ONLY) for 90% of players
then a 5% that is over 300k

please believe numbers, OFFICIAL, sent to a MARKET AUTHORITY and CERTIFIED:
dont believe bullshit, conspiration theories and people that can barely calculate a markup

Peace

Sorry to say, but your math is way off this time mate.

 

[Msturlese]

Sorry to say, but your math is way off this time mate.

if you mean that Q2 is a total disaster company is loosing all progress made, the cut of workforce lead nowhere... well maybe but it is not yet public....
and Q2 will close in 4 days so.. it is the future

MA CEO words:
The strong finish that MindArk had during the last quarter of 2022 has continued into Q1 2023. The first quarter of 2023 is the best Q1 in MindArk’s 20-year history in terms of revenue, marking the third consecutive year of record revenue for Q1.

CONCERNING WITHDRAWALS:
Historical figures show that 27-35% of funds deposited
and reserves are set to 33% ...
so there is no shortage at all for the cashing-out players.

i missed a number... TOTAL value of avatars in game in TT terms is 136.600.000 PED, the rest of deposits is decayed or transformed into skill value