Petition to remove Explosive BPs (or change them)

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Moonbiter

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Hello everyone.

As some of you might be aware, i was an active miner a couple of years ago, and was playing pretty actively since 2006. In recent years some RL issues prevented me from actively playing, but i kept an eye on the market. This month i came back to pick up mining again, and frankly was horrified to learn what happened to markups.

After a bit of investigation, it turns out that Explosive projectiles with ingredients from TT is to blame. While i can understand the attraction of cheap residue, this in effect has ruined mining. While markups were steadily declining over the years, with some spikes for certain minerals, mining was still one of the safest professions when playing smart, and even allowed for certain risk taking with bigger amps in certain areas. Now however vast majority of areas are just worthless. There are only a select few minerals still having any reasonable markup, and they are usually among other worthless crap.

I really can't see how this change benefits anyone, except for maybe gambling crafters who are getting materials at TT price. So, i ask Entropia's mining community (and anyone else concerned about this change) to join me in this petition and demand a change.

If you agree with this petition, please reply with your full avatar name, and i will include you in the list below this post. Any insights into the issue and discussions are welcome. Thank you for your attention.

Edit: I have received some comments that this issue is affecting not only miners. This petition is by no means exclusive to miners, so if this fundamental change to economy affected you in a negative way, feel free to sign.
 
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Moonbiter

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GoNi

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Well mining still got some markup, much better markup than hunting and crafting.

Now its a little more difficult on mining, no longer granted profits for those with knowlege and all start to whine.
Some cheese to it!

Hardest proffession to break even always was and still is crafting.
Then comes hunting, without item drops there is nearly nothing with some markup left.

And there is mining, at momnet still offering best markups for many ores/enmatters, a lot better than other proffessions.


Leave the Explo how it is, fair enough that crafters can play at only TT input instead always have to pay markup!

Do you have to pay markup for your probes?
Do you have to pay markup for repairing your finder and extracter (well if it is L yes, but nobody forces you to use L)

Why all want crafters beeing forced to be only able to play when paying markups to other proffessions that like to break even on markups or even profit, while there is nearly nothing left that a crafter could sell with markup, as there is tons of looted stuff way better than anything craftable.

So STFU

Adapt or leave, and don´t let the door hit you in the back.

Regards

a CRAFTER !
 
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montekis

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Not that a petition will help change something because MA reps won't bother to look at it, but you can add me: Miranda Montekis Nu
 

Saurn

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add me

Frickin get rid or change the materials for this bp.

Saurn Accolade Cerillas

Don't listen to rude crafters post above
 

Haruto Rat

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Although explosive BPs indeed have screwed things up, I'm afraid change by petition is much more dangerous. Just think of all the commies, fairness warriors and other idiots out there, and what petitions they could set up.

Hence no, please don't create a precedent.
 

jqkill

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Did you mean "Adapt and leave"? :rolleyes:

I think main problem is 20 ped BP. You don't get level 13 amps in TT. Yet.

It would still be adapt or leave
 
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Hell no.

Ep bps made all crafting cheaper. It is great. Hunting also got cheaper (armors, faps etc).

Mining isn't broken at all, you just must change your tactics.
 

Moonbiter

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Hell no.

Ep bps made all crafting cheaper. It is great. Hunting also got cheaper (armors, faps etc).

Mining isn't broken at all, you just must change your tactics.

Well, changing tactics hardly works when most minerals are 106% Unlike hunting where you can get items with nice markups, or crafting with BP drops... MU is the only way to bridge the returns gap.
 

ermik

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Welcome to the world hunters have been living in since 2009.
 

Granny Rowan

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I will sign this petition.

I am crafter/hunter and occasional miner, so have seen, experienced all the various dips in loots.
However this isn't about any 1 profession it is about the whole economy.

Having a BP that only gives ped to MA for mats is plain greed on the part of MA, and more than a little short sighted.
Not only will new crafters now skill on explosive projectiles because level I and ii Bps cheap for skilling, but the endless globals from the IV is distorting the picture.

If skillers use this BP they are not buying ores/enmats or hunt loots, therefore prices crash, the usual stacks for skilling become worthless and the hunters and miners are both screwed.

If other more experienced crafters start using it - chasing the swirlies - their cycled ped are 'outside' the economy in 2 ways.. no purchase of hunt/mining loot and no low level items to sell to newer players. So reduces the likelihood of player retention as everything suddenly above their range or ped card.
The huge globals/Hofs etc are draining the craft loot pool such that many crafters have either taken a break, rather than add their ped to this madness, or have joined in making explosives out of desperation.

At the very least this BP should be changed to use at least some stackables or other lootables in order to enhance the economy, and give vitality to trading between the main professions.
Alternatively it should be seriously nerfed or better yet removed.

MA need to think outside the box when they look at ways of increasing their income, and consider the overall effect on the economy, short term planning rarely leads to long term gain.
 

Neil Stockton

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Yes, remove them or change them to be a part of the in-game economy like all other BPs.

Neil Greenleaf Stockton
 

GoNi

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Avatars who signed petition:
Luke Moonbiter Sinclair
lllllllllll Sachi lllllllllll
Miranda Montekis Nu
Saurn Accolade Cerillas
Granny Rowan Render


Don´t forget to add those to that list that are against this Petion, obviously I am not alone
 

Joat

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Hello everyone.

As some of you might be aware, i was an active miner a couple of years ago, and was playing pretty actively since 2006. In recent years some RL issues prevented me from actively playing, but i kept an eye on the market. This month i came back to pick up mining again, and frankly was horrified to learn what happened to markups.

After a bit of investigation, it turns out that Explosive projectiles with ingredients from TT is to blame. While i can understand the attraction of cheap residue, this in effect has ruined mining. While markups were steadily declining over the years, with some spikes for certain minerals, mining was still one of the safest professions when playing smart, and even allowed for certain risk taking with bigger amps in certain areas. Now however vast majority of areas are just worthless. There are only a select few minerals still having any reasonable markup, and they are usually among other worthless crap.

I really can't see how this change benefits anyone, except for maybe gambling crafters who are getting materials at TT price. So, i ask Entropia's mining community (and anyone else concerned about this change) to join me in this petition and demand a change.

If you agree with this petition, please reply with your full avatar name, and i will include you in the list below this post. Any insights into the issue and discussions are welcome. Thank you for your attention.

Maybe the bolded part is one of all reasons why they introduced that BP? ;)
Imo, the reason why MU drops in most parts ingame is due to EU have too many players seeking
profit instead of just playing a game. Way too few are willing to spend PEDs just for fun.
 
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I'll also sign this petition, for the reasons stated above by Granny and Neil, and also the fact that the nanocubes are essentially casino chips and MA has abandoned all pretense of EU not being a slot machine. I wonder about the legalities of all this...
 

Art Jennifer

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It should be in the TT now. MU is rock bottom, put it in the dam tt
 

atomicstorm

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I want it changed as well.
 

Moonbiter

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Don´t forget to add those to that list that are against this Petion, obviously I am not alone

Well, as this is petition for a change, and you are satisfied with status quo, i see no point in that.
 

billairboy

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Honestly, anybody that don't agree that miners have a lot better when it comes to markup and return are a bit silly. So it's a bit hard for me to feel that sorry about miners compared to hunters and craters. And I myself mines now and then. I don't say miners have a great return, just the rest have it even worse.

Also, removing "gamblers" from the demand of resources also removes a "false demand" on the resources. It was not the real economy, craters and item users that demanded the resources. Problem now is that it instead is flooding the market with residues and destroyed the mark-up that was a source of some markup for craters. So it's not only miners that loose some on it.
 
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Well, changing tactics hardly works when most minerals are 106% Unlike hunting where you can get items with nice markups, or crafting with BP drops... MU is the only way to bridge the returns gap.

Oh right, because you get full tt L1100 in every other loot (hint: no). And no, there are no bps with mu worth mentioning dropping from low level armor, equipment, weapons. Tools and amps yes, but without a bigass bankroll you are screwed.

106% on average? Stop mining at icarus. When I mine the average mu is most often a lot higher.
 

Moonbiter

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Oh right, because you get full tt L1100 in every other loot (hint: no). And no, there are no bps with mu worth mentioning dropping from low level armor, equipment, weapons. Tools and amps yes, but without a bigass bankroll you are screwed.

106% on average? Stop mining at icarus. When I mine the average mu is most often a lot higher.

I didn't say my average was 106%. Most materials are at that price currently. And this thread is not about me. As i said, i'm playing since 2006, so i know a few things how the mining works. Please discuss the issue of this petition, if you have more things to contribute.
 
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Hello everyone.

As some of you might be aware, i was an active miner a couple of years ago, and was playing pretty actively since 2006. In recent years some RL issues prevented me from actively playing, but i kept an eye on the market. This month i came back to pick up mining again, and frankly was horrified to learn what happened to markups.

Horrified? Because markups are only far above the average of the rest of the professions? That you just can't go out and drop probes at random and still break even?

After a bit of investigation, it turns out that Explosive projectiles with ingredients from TT is to blame. While i can understand the attraction of cheap residue, this in effect has ruined mining. While markups were steadily declining over the years, with some spikes for certain minerals, mining was still one of the safest professions when playing smart, and even allowed for certain risk taking with bigger amps in certain areas. Now however vast majority of areas are just worthless. There are only a select few minerals still having any reasonable markup, and they are usually among other worthless crap.

Mining is not ruined. Most minerals still beats hunting and crafting by a mile. It is still safe.

I really can't see how this change benefits anyone, except for maybe gambling crafters who are getting materials at TT price. So, i ask Entropia's mining community (and anyone else concerned about this change) to join me in this petition and demand a change.

It benefits pretty much every low and mid level player in game.

If you agree with this petition, please reply with your full avatar name, and i will include you in the list below this post. Any insights into the issue and discussions are welcome. Thank you for your attention.

I really don't.
 

Chuck Wholrey

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I do not see a need to remove the BP's, just change the materials a bit.... keep the MU low, just add some player resources.

shrapnel can make nanocubes, or add shrapnel along with the nanocubes and something like nova frags.

nice and simple, nova and shrapnel, high volume availability and perma low MU, but it would help the economy not trash it.

We all like to craft with low res MU, and buy low MU amps, but I mainly see the multiple account crafting, and resale avatars able to take advantage of the situation. The low guy, and mid range player gets stepped on. Make frags and shrapnel worth an extra % or 2, and help out the growing players, not just the guys with multiple accounts.
 

Magnus Mag

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It benefits pretty much every low and mid level player in game.

how??...

buy low mu stuff for level 2 crafting and get ATH?
sometimes i think the people throwing money at MA don't understand why others play this game and enjoy..and how they don't like the new changes..
but then again which players does MA want to please and stay?

as said above they should add something from economy...something looted like few sweat and shrapnel
 
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how??...

buy low mu stuff for level 2 crafting and get ATH?

Well.....

You can buy every crafter armor a lot cheaper now, every crafted fap is cheaper. So that way it helps hunters. For crafters, you can craft a shitload of stuff now with low markup. It is a lot cheaper to skill all the crafting professions.
 

Magnus Mag

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Well.....

You can buy every crafter armor a lot cheaper now, every crafted fap is cheaper. So that way it helps hunters. For crafters, you can craft a shitload of stuff now with low markup. It is a lot cheaper to skill all the crafting professions.

skill crafting professions for what?
("and one day i can gamble on this explo iv bp")
 

Neil Stockton

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It benefits pretty much every low and mid level player in game.

ROFL. Seriously, think about what you're saying. Entropia is supposed to be a real cash economy game, based on the crafting of items from resources gathered by hunters and miners. Explosive projectile BPs, and the fact that they are now used by crafters more than the other BPs which support the efforts of hunters and miners, have created a massive disconnect between mining, hunting, and crafting.

There are other recent game developments as well, converting Entropia into more of a "social" singleplayer game rather than a MMORCE. Perhaps they had to fire the balancing manager and they just feel that the economy balancing is too much for the janitor to handle full time, so they want to phase out the economy aspect of the game. I don't know, but they're changing it in dramatic steps, and I think we as players need to let them know that's not the game we want.

To sum up, those low and mid level hunters and miners who want to sell their resources for MU, they're getting screwed by the Explosive Projectile BPs.
 
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ROFL. Seriously, think about what you're saying. Entropia is supposed to be a real cash economy game, based on the crafting of items from resources gathered by hunters and miners.

Explosive projectile BPs, and the fact that they are now used by crafters more than the other BPs which support the efforts of hunters and miners, have created a massive disconnect between mining, hunting, and crafting. There are other recent game developments as well, converting Entropia into more of a "social" singleplayer game rather than a MMORCE. Perhaps they had to fire the balancing manager and they just feel that the economy balancing is too much for the janitor to handle full time, so they want to phase out the economy aspect of the game. I don't know, but they're changing it in dramatic steps, and I think we as players need to let them know that's not the game we want.

To sum up, those low and mid level hunters and miners who want to sell their resources for MU, they're getting screwed by the Explosive Projectile BPs.

Miners have always been spoiled. Still are. Hunting MU remains sucky despite the EP BPs, but hunting got a bit cheaper.
 
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