Why Mindark doesn't perma ban exploiters ?

Alina

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There been so many exploiters during the years and they didn't got perma ban ...why ?
 
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Aio

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I don't mind temp locks for small stuff like VTOL hunting, trapping, etc. Or even temp locks for "1st time offences" on all stuff. Because MA need to keep as many people as possible cycling PED.

But if someone is locked after exploiting they should be watched for any other new reports, or if it was a hunting bot periodically checked to see if they are hunting afk, and on a 2nd offence banned (or long locks like 6mo).
 

Alina

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I don't mind temp locks for small stuff like VTOL hunting, trapping, etc. Or even temp locks for "1st time offences" on all stuff. Because MA need to keep as many people as possible cycling PED.

But if someone is locked after exploiting they should be watched for any other new reports, or if it was a hunting bot periodically checked to see if they are hunting afk, and on a 2nd offence banned (or long locks like 6mo).

i agree perma ban for first time exploiting its to much but they should give them at least 1 week then if the guy its still getting caught like a final warning
 

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They should use permabans more often. This game is being destroyed by exploiters but it seems MA doesn't care.
 

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i agree perma ban for first time exploiting its to much but they should give them at least 1 week then if the guy its still getting caught like a final warning

Yeah, they need to be stronger. There are plenty of well known cheaters wandering around at the moment, and I don't actually know of anything which will get a player perm banned at the moment - even a lot of trust scams seem to be overlooked.
 

mastermesh

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Unfortunately a lot of exploiters, cheaters, etc. Deposit heavily, and make up a bunch of Mindark's Profit... I suspect that if Mindark kicked em all out Mindark would be fearing bye bye next month's paycheck. Also, I don't think Mindark really has the staff to do massive exploit investigations as they should... so they just 'let it slide' over and over and over again... or really, they have 'no clue' about what to do even if things do get reported to em...

Classic support response to suspected exploiter report that I personally reported a few years back:
Hi,
Thank you very much for the detailed information. However, we are unsure of what exactly do you want us to do with it. Please let us know if there's something we can do to help you.
Kind regards,
Entropia Universe Support
 
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Aio

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Unfortunately a lot of exploiters, cheaters, etc. Deposit heavily, and make up a bunch of Mindark's Profit... I suspect that if Mindark kicked em all out Mindark would be fearing bye bye next month's paycheck. Also, I don't think Mindark really has the staff to do massive exploit investigations as they should... so they just 'let it slide' over and over and over again... or really, they have 'no clue' about what to do even if things do get reported to em...

Classic support response to suspected exploiter report:

But that attitude doesn't quite match with them sending out official avatars to chat with people who look like they're playing AFK.

It's an odd one, why bother making a small effort if you subsequently won't perm ban?

I said it in a thread a few weeks ago - MA need to make an official statement on a "crackdown" over cheating/exploiting in any form (from vtol hunting to intentional scam auction orders) and from that announcement be much harder on those who try to play outside the rules

It's hard policing your own game but it would boost the confidence of those similar to my situation - heavy depositors who don't have a thought to cheat.
 

Yoshii Lem

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Was doing research on issue of exploiting games and this is problem for all games with multiple players. Was doing this research because I was feeling frustrated with Mind Ark. That is not to say we should "do nothing" but it did give me perspective that Mind Ark along with other gaming companies struggle with this issue.
 

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Does perma bans really help ?

If a cheater gets perma banned, what will stop him to create a new account and do it again?

From my point of view its better to do temp bans and let the players be ingame, easyer to check in the future as this player already is suspicious, so it could be controlled better.

If cheater exploits again, after a temp ban, another temp ban for longer time.

It should also be an option for MA, if a player repeatedly received temp bans, to charge an unlock fee after ban time is over.

F.E. -- after 5 temp bans, this player has to pay 100 PED to get his account unlocked again.
 

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Unfortunately a lot of exploiters, cheaters, etc. Deposit heavily, and make up a bunch of Mindark's Profit... I suspect that if Mindark kicked em all out Mindark would be fearing bye bye next month's paycheck. Also, I don't think Mindark really has the staff to do massive exploit investigations as they should... so they just 'let it slide' over and over and over again... or really, they have 'no clue' about what to do even if things do get reported to em...

Classic support response to suspected exploiter report:

This is a lot speculation on your part. Players do get warned, temp banned and permanently banned. They do need proof as they could find them selfs in court if they lock a players account with thousands of dollars in. Also not many players are going to say yes I been warned or temp banded for being a naughty boy.
 

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This is a lot speculation on your part. Players do get warned, temp banned and permanently banned. They do need proof as they could find them selfs in court if they lock a players account with thousands of dollars in. Also not many players are going to say yes I been warned or temp banded for being a naughty boy.

Good points.

I wonder if the same applies to planet partners? I mean if they do naughty things do they get warned, temp banned, or even permanently banned for cheating? Can that even make sense , perhaps they need to have those avatars etc to run their planet or if a planet partner is permanently banned they could just make another avatar because they may have powers to create as many avatars as they want. I wonder when a planet partner creates an avatar for themselves if they can just add peds to that account out of thin air and if they can then withdraw those peds? thereby cheating everyone playing the game and MA out of money.
 

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Planet partner avatars created by mindark cannot withdraw peds. Their former accounts are locked/frozen.

With all that being said, neverdie seems to be the exemption to the rule of freezing avatars. Perhaps he has something in his pp agreement.
 

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Planet partner avatars created by mindark cannot withdraw peds. Their former accounts are locked/frozen.

With all that being said, neverdie seems to be the exemption to the rule of freezing avatars. Perhaps he has something in his pp agreement.

planet partners also have undercover avatars i.e. avatars that act and behave like real avatars. It's those avatars that can get upto some mischief in my opinion.

Ironically neverdie is probably the honest one at least he stands up for what he believes in. Which I cannot say for some other planet partners.
 

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Good points.

I wonder if the same applies to planet partners? I mean if they do naughty things do they get warned, temp banned, or even permanently banned for cheating? Can that even make sense , perhaps they need to have those avatars etc to run their planet or if a planet partner is permanently banned they could just make another avatar because they may have powers to create as many avatars as they want. I wonder when a planet partner creates an avatar for themselves if they can just add peds to that account out of thin air and if they can then withdraw those peds? thereby cheating everyone playing the game and MA out of money.

It sounds like you are giving pp far to much power. As far as I know they can't even withdraw PEDs and certainly can't make PEDs. They can't even make a super eco gun, without MA giving it the nod. I would of thought MA pays Pp after they deducted and freebies.

I have heard that if you keep making alts to get freebies, all accounts locked till money is paid back.
 

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It sounds like you are giving pp far to much power. As far as I know they can't even withdraw PEDs and certainly can't make PEDs. They can't even make a super eco gun, without MA giving it the nod. I would of thought MA pays Pp after they deducted and freebies.

I have heard that if you keep making alts to get freebies, all accounts locked till money is paid back.

Mostly true. Pp are not autonomous. They have to go through mindark for almost everything. There are safeguards etc in place for those that try to slip stuff in (thanks ND for that....).

They really can't do anything for free.
 

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Mostly true. Pp are not autonomous. They have to go through mindark for almost everything. There are safeguards etc in place for those that try to slip stuff in (thanks ND for that....).

They really can't do anything for free.

That's right I am sure George remembers when MS was released ND had to buy one from global auction to give out as a prize.
 

GeorgeSkywalker

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It sounds like you are giving pp far to much power. As far as I know they can't even withdraw PEDs and certainly can't make PEDs. They can't even make a super eco gun, without MA giving it the nod. I would of thought MA pays Pp after they deducted and freebies.

I have heard that if you keep making alts to get freebies, all accounts locked till money is paid back.

Mostly true. Pp are not autonomous. They have to go through mindark for almost everything. There are safeguards etc in place for those that try to slip stuff in (thanks ND for that....).

They really can't do anything for free.

I don't know the extent of their powers and wouldn't like to guess or make assumptions just keeping an open mind.

However what I do know is they can easily abuse powers that they do have. For example when I had a shop on Arkadia I had a sign in the shop. The message got removed and the sign placed in my inventory. At that time I didn't know that and I assumed I must have been mistaken how else could the sign be in my inventory maybe I only thought about putting a message on and placing sign in my shop. It's easy to delude yourself so I placed the message on sign again and placed it in the shop. Again the message was removed and sign placed in my inventory. This time I knew for certain someone had done that. So I made a support case. To this date I have not be refunded (placing message on signs and placing in shop can be expensive) just some vague comment from arkadia staff that they presumably didn't like the message. All the message said was I was closing shop and moving to calypso it may also have given details about contacting me for purchase of shop I'm not absolutely sure if I put those contact details on or not. Nothing in the message warrants the message to be removed and sign placed in my inventory because there isn't any swearing, pornographic, criminal etc. Nevertheless that's exactly what they did twice.

This shows to me planet partners have powers to alter your things and move your equipment about. Certainly from in game to your inventory. Not sure if they need to go through mindark or not to do that. It suggests they may also have powers to move things from your inventory to in game. So it may be possible for them to steal items, if someone has 40 copies of same item in inventory e.g. rk5's if one went missing would you realise it's missing? probably not.

If they decide to abuse just those powers there isn't didly you can do about it either except stop going to that planet.


As to withdrawing peds if they can't directly withdraw peds it's fairly easy to circumvent they could give or drop peds to an avatar that can withdraw peds.

As for creating peds there must be a mechanism to do that it's fundamental to the game. For example when my message got removed from sign I lost peds and I should rightly have been compensated. I'm sure others have mentioned they lost peds due to such and such and may have been compensated the peds. There has to be a mechanism to compensate peds and if there is it could also be abused.

As for not having powers to create super eco gun we know that can also be abused for example there was an arkadian sword made that couldn't be used with an amp or a certain amp I forget the details but for sure something wasn't right about it. I think it was owned by atomicstorm who posted above. Arkadia staff should not have made that sword because it triggered an internal MA mechanism that disallowed it to be used in some circumstances. Why did Arkadia make it in the first place? either they were ignorant of what they are making or deliberately tried to make it. I doubt they were ignorant, one way to attract players is to make super items.

No matter what mechanisms MA place to safeguard super items coming into game it seems to show they can be abused by PP. If pp need a nod from MA to place super item in game then how was it abused in this case? Did they give false details , or amend specs of item just before its placed it in i.e. amend after being given go ahead? I don't think we'll ever know for sure. Just people making speculations including myself.
 

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Sure is a lot of conspiracy and antedoctal rubbish in your thread. I can't speak to the experiences you've had or being booted off the planet (from what I understand from the populace, you deserved it). However, the planet partner has the right, within the rules of their agreement and to the extent of the ingame powers they are given to manage their planet. We don't know what was in your sign, you haven't shown us what it was. We just get one side of the story. That's not sufficient. I would have not faulted neverdie to have done the same when gewitter went on a bender and told rocktropia population to (paraphrasing) f themselves on a sign in his tangerine shop from doing the same thing.

As for the sword, this fault lies with mindark and neverdie. The safeguard is there because of neverdie 9dpp weapon. Mindark didn't tell arkadia about it and mindark isn't exactly transparent about how items work. It's a great sword that has limitations with the mod 8 amp. Ofc they designed it to be super eco. That's the draw and they had to pay mindark for it to be made. That's how it works. They can't just make stuff out of thin air.

To get you off your arkadia conspiracies (you should really stop and try to be impartial with your commentary), this same safeguard actually applies to the imk2. The imk2 cannot use the alpha amps (except for a couple ways I know of). This tells me that this safeguard is to prevent the absorption of all decay on the weapon so that it could cause problems with the game (remember ma and pp make money on decay not deposits) and also to prevent extremely high dpp weapons like 9 that ND introduced. This fault is with mindark for not telling players this existed. It took 4 months with the help of ark officials to find out what the problem was. They were as surprised as I was and I appreciate them doing that investigative work.

Not everything is a grand conspiracy. If you want to live in this world of (rather dangerous) hypotheticals, you should really just sell out and go do something else. You will drive yourself mad.. if not already. Life is too short to be forever in this mindset and no one will take you seriously if you do.
 
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mastermesh

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However what I do know is they can easily abuse powers that they do have. For example when I had a shop on Arkadia I had a sign in the shop. The message got removed and the sign placed in my inventory. At that time I didn't know that and I assumed I must have been mistaken how else could the sign be in my inventory maybe I only thought about putting a message on and placing sign in my shop. It's easy to delude yourself so I placed the message on sign again and placed it in the shop. Again the message was removed and sign placed in my inventory. This time I knew for certain someone had done that. So I made a support case. To this date I have not be refunded (placing message on signs and placing in shop can be expensive) just some vague comment from arkadia staff that they presumably didn't like the message.

Is the pc upload still on account or was sign a typed out message? If an upload it should still be in the system?... if it was PC you uploaded you should be able to do the thing in the system to at least get some of the peds back from it...
 
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GeorgeSkywalker

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Sure is a lot of conspiracy and antedoctal rubbish in your thread.

What conspiracy and anecdotal rubbish is there exactly? can you be more specific? All I did was mention some possibilities and say I was keeping an open mind.

I can't speak to the experiences you've had or being booted off the planet (from what I understand from the populace, you deserved it).

You can't get "booted" from a planet. It's by my own choice I decide not to go there.
Can you please explain why I deserved to be "booted"?

We don't know what was in your sign, you haven't shown us what it was. We just get one side of the story. That's not sufficient.

So we need to evidence every small thing we do in the game? Sure evidence is better and with hindsight I should have taken a picture but who takes pictures of irrelevant small things that are not problematic whatsoever?

I would have not faulted neverdie to have done the same when gewitter went on a bender and told rocktropia population to (paraphrasing) f themselves on a sign in his tangerine shop from doing the same thing.

Are you implying my sign deserved to be taken down?


To get you off your arkadia conspiracies (you should really stop and try to be impartial with your commentary)...

The only person being biased and impartial here is yourself. You seem to be blaming ND, Mindark and myself for some things which you can't possibly know the true facts about without being a developer or having some insider knowledge. Before you jump on your conspiracy bandwagon again no I'm not saying your a developer or have insider knowledge. Your more likely to be someone making assumptions without knowing the true facts.

Not everything is a grand conspiracy.

Totally agree.


If you want to live in this world of (rather dangerous) hypotheticals, you should really just sell out and go do something else.

Keeping an open mind I think is for the better. Your welcome not to keep an open mind that is your right.

Also you just said earlier about being impartial and to be impartial involves keeping an open mind.

You will drive yourself mad.. if not already.

On the contrary keeping an open mind and wits about yourself stops you from going mad and make better decisions.
 

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I really don't intend to teach you the meaning of words in the dictionary. But you've used many that are incorrect.

First, you yourself said you got booted from arkadia. So now we know this was a lie. Thanks for clearing that up.

Second, we have no idea what action your sign should bring since you have not shared what that was with proof. If it was a picture, it's still on your account. If it was text, the cost of applying it on a sign is so small that it is absolutely ridiculous that you would make such a big deal out of it (<5ped). Your track record does not allow me specifically to take you at your word that your sign was benign. I will defer to the point that planet partners can manage their planets with the power mindark gives them. If you have issue with Arkadia or have claims of abuse, make sure it isn't that your feel goods are hurt and file a support case. Mindark will deal with it.

Third, I cannot be biased AND impartial. Dictionary.com can help you figure out which one you think applies. Please don't pretend you are all innocent and open minded. When your name is brought up, everyone says oh that guy.. the Arkadia basher. You have a vendetta. You take every thread and twist it into an off topic rant against arkadia. Because I call you out on it, you will just say I'm biased and defending arkadia, however I also have a history of being critical of arkadia but constructively to make entropia a better place. You're stuck here on PCF making antedoctal comments or hypotheticals about the potentials of abuse or conspiracies to drain ped out of the game by multiple characters (in this thread). This is not constructive and potentially accusing folks of things they didn't do (libel) for possibly nefarious reasons. I would still hold this position if I had no arkadia land areas. My most critical target of criticism planet is rocktropia and at least neverdie is trying to improve player engagement. Hats off to him there. I just disagree with the content.

As for being in the know, I said it in my thread that it's in my support case. I shared all that information in the pcf thread about the topic with permission from mindark and arkadia. You just have selective memory, which is no surprise. We do not get any special information from ark officials or Mindark. You can believe that or not. It makes little difference to me. But if you want to believe it and continue spouting off about it being false, expect me to call you out on it.. again.

My lunch break is over.. so I will leave you to your bashing. Happy bashing! This popcorn was quite delicious.
 
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Xen

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There been so many exploiters during the years and they didn't got perma ban ...why ?

Maybe you should ask that in your own soc first?
 

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That's right I am sure George remembers when MS was released ND had to buy one from global auction to give out as a prize.

Not really. He's plan was to have MA create a limited MS which at the end never panned out and a lot of us were up in arms about the prize being a LIMITED MS. So after fighting with MA Neverdie ended up having to give up his own MS -- which a lot of us were very happy since he was using it manly for Pirates to use freely.
 

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Does perma bans really help ?

If a cheater gets perma banned, what will stop him to create a new account and do it again?

Loosing all stuff and PED kinda has a preventive effect.
 

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Maybe you should ask that in your own soc first?

I don't want to bring this "war" in the thread but some of your guys are acting like playing CS in gold nova ranks and accusing everyone of cheating...im done.

I was thinking u are smarter tho lol.
 

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Sadly many who do exploit use the same excuse "Well i seen many others do, so it most be ok!" and when you do confront them, you are put out as the evil one.

So honestly i think MA dosnt want to do that cleaning of ppl exploiting. To much work, to many complains about the consikvens, to many avatars being put on hold from a period of time and then not so many putting in the money pool!

Even at a place as the oil rig, do you see noobs picking oil in there planes under mobtrains or getting killed, cuz you apparantly can fly around the pump now even tho its a none ship zone, its just bugged so if you dont pick up your ship you can use it, but if you do its not able to be spawned inside the PVP zone....

So yeah some ppl are prepered to do alot of things for a few free peds or saving money.

But if you ask me, MA needs to draw a line soon otherwise it will go overhand, more then it already is.
 

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I don't want to bring this "war" in the thread but some of your guys are acting like playing CS in gold nova ranks and accusing everyone of cheating...im done.

I was thinking u are smarter tho lol.

No, not everyone, just some people who seem to never miss...
 

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i see certain number of ppl makes new ava again and again to get free noob stuff for ped and transfer it to main to keep playing, some have more than 30 avas, i suck at tech stuff but there shud be something like IP block to prevent that. some one who do such thing unlikely to have more than 2 PCs so it shud prevent pretty much most of the multiple ava explotitation method. made a report to MA a month ago tho so far no reply as expected.
 

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there are some permabans
just take the example of some members of riga team
 
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