AT-every-F*n-day

[DavinFelth]

Um, I keep logging on tracker before I think about logging in EU. I saw that 93k or so Levi ath one day and said, welp forget that. Then today I log in and see 67K or so Levi ath. Discussion of ATH in general aside, do you feel like they happen too often lately? Will I be happy if I am the one to get one? Of course. Am I jealous? Not exactly. I just feel like they came once a month maybe, and lately it's like 2-3 a WEEK. WTF is going on? Why so many? God bless those that have played for years and got that ATH. I'm glad you did. I just don't see why they are so common lately....
It's making either not a big deal for me, or a reason not to play. I see that and it crushes all ambition for the day (even though ATH isn't my goal) I got about 14k tower and didn't even consider withdrawing it, but if I got 67k or 93k I think I would. I don't see how that helps MA and the EU economy.
I just wanna hear other peoples thoughts about the frequency of ATHs recently. thanks.


Adding a log for all future ATH:

1 Tonny TcooL Svan Longtooth 81,492 PED
2 rob pk72 deg Leviathan Mature 69,169 PED
3 Mrs Peel schools HuntingN8 Eomon Young 68,898 PED
All times are GMT. The time is now: 04:25 | Calypso Time:4:25 29th of August 2011

Simple III Plastic Ruds 102,148 PED Thursday, September 01, 2011 20:52
Mulmun Overseer Elite 91,337 PED Sunday, September 04, 2011 05:22
Exarosaur Old Alpha Elite 47,236 PED Tuesday, September 06, 2011 22:25
Level 2 Finder Amplifier (L) 66,417 PED Monday, September 19, 2011 17:13
Level 9 Finder Amplifier (L) 61,632 PED Monday, September 19, 2011 19:16
Proteron Young 40,071 PED Thursday, September 22, 2011 09:45
Typonolic Steam 41,401 PED Saturday, September 24, 2011 17:11
Big Bulk Generation 01 77,262 PED Tuesday, September 27, 2011 17:59
Level 2 Finder Amplifier Light (L) 54,189 Thursday, September 29, 2011 13:53
Big Bulk Generation 01 79,277 PED Saturday, October 01, 2011 20:00
Steel Bird Generation 02 38,294 PED Sunday, October 02, 2011 22:10
Cumbriz Stone 78,279 PED Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:47
Proteron Old 66,979 PED Saturday, October 15, 2011 07:35
Level 2 Finder Amplifier (L) 77,654 PED Friday, October 21, 2011 11:26
Rextelum Watcher 43,201 PED Saturday, October 22, 2011 22:03
Araneatrox Young 43,404 PED Sunday, October 23, 2011 10:13
Ganganite Stone 65,125 PED Monday, October 24, 2011 01:31
Typonolic Steam 42,438 PED Thursday, October 27, 2011 06:26
Proteron Young 43,287 PED Saturday, October 29, 2011 19:10
Leviathan Dominant 102,744 PED Saturday, October 29, 2011 20:04
Melchi Water 78,600 PED Thursday, November 03, 2011 09:07
Level 4 Finder Amplifier (L) 51,080 PED Friday, November 04, 2011 13:18
Iron Stone 53,486 PED Monday, November 07, 2011 18:00
Gazzurdite Stone 51,153 PED Friday, November 11, 2011 04:55

 

[Ludvig|MindArk]

Would rather see more small globals and HoFs for sure

 

[Manique]

You see a lot of random ppl that are not the biggest players getting those huge jackpots or some nice sprees for weeks / months.
Then you suddently see ppl not getting a thing from a moment to the other.
You can get my example, I used to loose on TT easilly, even with the hofs i had.
Since i withdrew, Its been about 1year since i got a loot hunting over 300 PED, and about 9-10 month since i got one at all in any profession. And playing activily.
But thats an example
My point is, this leads to a lot of demotivation to play at all, ppl like me or others that put a lot of effort, and time in-game not to make money, but to play the game, and its almost just impossible unless you are one of those latelly.

PS: for those that want to ask about TT loses? I can tell you they are over 80k ~

 

[JohnCapital]

Would you be complaining if it was you that got an ATH?

Or if you did get one, how would you feel coming to the forum and finding folks complaining about it?

 

[hojlund]

Um, I keep logging on tracker before I think about logging in EU. I saw that 93k or so Levi ath one day and said, welp forget that. Then today I log in and see 67K or so Levi ath. Discussion of ATH in general aside, do you feel like they happen too often lately? Will I be happy if I am the one to get one? Of course. Am I jealous? Not exactly. I just feel like they came once a month maybe, and lately it's like 2-3 a WEEK. WTF is going on? Why so many? God bless those that have played for years and got that ATH. I'm glad you did. I just don't see why they are so common lately....
It's making either not a big deal for me, or a reason not to play. I see that and it crushes all ambition for the day (even though ATH isn't my goal) I got about 14k tower and didn't even consider withdrawing it, but if I got 67k or 93k I think I would. I don't see how that helps MA and the EU economy.
I just wanna hear other peoples thoughts about the frequency of ATHs recently. thanks.

My biggest is 6400 ambu young, loooong ago.. and i dont mind fequency, sizes, or type of hofs i just play..

next goal 300k skills should be there in 2-3 months

 

[Nukem]

Would you be complaining if it was you that got an ATH?

Or if you did get one, how would you feel coming to the forum and finding folks complaining about it?

For me personally, if I was to get a ATH that big, yeah I would complain. I would continue to wonder why some people get these massive ATH, while others are left to losing so much money on their activities. I will be honest here, I have never liked the balancing system in this game. I would much rather see the loot from a ATH distributed more evenly throughout the community, to keep people from losing so much and leaving this great game we all know as Entropia Universe.

I don't personally lose that much but I never gain much either, without that gain coming directly out of my bank account. If I was to personally get a ATH, I would personally put it right back into my society, so it helped everyone in my society, not just the "Chosen Few" (Pun intended) Sound like bullshit? Think what you want but anyone that really knows me knows full well that's what I would do, and even then knowing that I did the right thing with the ATH, I would still complain.

Emphasis on the word 'Personally' because I know my opinions are usually not shared with the community in general.

 

[Ace Flyster]

Personally i say big gratz to all the ATHers, it will be me one day

Rgds

Ace

 

[DavinFelth]

my main point was the frequency of ATHs lately. A few a week? A handful a month? Makes them less "special"

 

[DavinFelth]

"93k Levi Old

Hadn't played for a few days, logged in and got this on my 5th mob...

It nearly gave me a heartattack when I saw the size of the hof.

Was it deserved? Hell no
Is loot fair? Hell no

Am I the happiest guy atm? Hell yeah"

That's the response I would have, I imagine. I really like when he posted that after that Levi, made me feel better about it somehow.

 

[Chrome]

Would you be complaining if it was you that got an ATH?

Or if you did get one, how would you feel coming to the forum and finding folks complaining about it?

Rather than answering a question with irrelevant questions, maybe actually provide your thoughts on the topic?

I just wanna hear other peoples thoughts about the frequency of ATHs recently. thanks.

Frequency does seem high on Levis...

I remember they used to be high like that on Prots for awhile, and they were like that on Houns (Arkadia) for a couple of weeks. Maybe it is as simple as the sheer amount of individuals hunting (and spending peds) on any one partiular type of mob...

 

[Ace Flyster]

To help the op, can someone download the raw data off tracker, and sort it by date for loots over 10k peds. This will give a frequency and actual data to post comments

Otherwise this thread is kinda useless

Feelings are most often wrong with stuff like this, we need data

Rgds

Ace

PS i am far too lazy to do this, as i have no issues with ATH frequency, and personally dont think it has changed much

 

[jupiajo]

To help the op, can someone download the raw data off tracker, and sort it by date for loots over 10k peds. This will give a frequency and actual data to post comments


PS i am far too lazy to do this, as i have no issues with ATH frequency, and personally dont think it has changed much

I did analyzis. Dont have data anymore as I dont hunt levis anymore. There are to small set of data I belive but compared to argo: more I class (biggest) loots
So it is compensated somwhere else. Maybe there are even more no loots than argo. Maybe mid loots are smaller or less likely. Dont know, but rant seems legit

 

[narfi]

With the HP to No Loot ratio that Leviathan have they are going to hit big, especially with as many people as are hunting them.

narfi

 

[Ace Flyster]

I did analyzis. Dont have data anymore as I dont hunt levis anymore. There are to small set of data I belive but compared to argo: more I class (biggest) loots
So it is compensated somwhere else. Maybe there are even more no loots than argo. Maybe mid loots are smaller or less likely. Dont know, but rant seems legit

"Seems legit" this is exactly why we need some data.

Untill then, as i said, kinda pointless

People by nature remember bad easier than good

Rgds

Ace

 

[jupiajo]

"Seems legit" this is exactly why we need some data.

Untill then, as i said, kinda pointless

People by nature remember bad easier than good

Rgds

Ace

It has a point if people feel cheated because distribution is moved toward jack-pot. Ofc I don't believe that money spent on levi hunt somehow leak etc, it must return to players.
The point is: levis are big gambling. Not only it has high hp and it does resemble lower mobs loot distribution. It exceeds it. Ofc it needs further analysis and I'm not statistician in any way.

 

[Shapememory]

seems to me that there is a lot more peds being cycled now with space. plus the mothership sales have shifted a lot of ped around, perhaps MA put some back into the pool. finally, they locked those guys using the mining exploit which seems to have been a big drain. i know my loot doesnt have as large of variation since they have done that

 

[Oleg]

60%-every-F*n-day for me at the moment and that's on Drones.

12 out of the top 20 HoFs when I logged in today were Leviathans.

That should tell you something about my opinion and about that of the player base in general.

 

[Menace]

Discussion of ATH in general aside, do you feel like they happen too often lately?

Nope. A TONNE of money gets lost by players on them fish every day. That's the ONLY reason why the ATH so often. Not to mention that unless you get lucky and get an ESI they offer NO markup at all. So a 150 PED global in a 750 PED ammo hunt will still mean a loss after ammo/decay considered.

Menace

 

[Kuber]

Do I care if there are 4 that month? If I get a 50,000 ped ATH, I'm going to consider it EXTREMELY SPECIAL.

 

[Rakuuz]

There was a time i could say: "Wow...an ath omg"

But now its like: "Hm another ath...ok whatever...next.." xD

 

[DoubleWolf]

I'm slowly becoming convinced that there is no such thing as a loot pool. I think the idea that another person's losses fund some other person's gains is false.

It was the amp bug miners that pushed me to believe this. It's pretty easy to see that these players had to be profiting at the TT, with the amount of equipment and skills they were able to achieve in a very short period of time. I find it hard to believe they could have achieved all that as quickly if the only difference was that they weren't paying markup for the amps.

So this led me to believe that they either had to be sucking a lot of TT value out of the "loot pool" during that time, or the value they were getting was simply generated based on what the system "thought" they were spending. I look at the difference in systems for this. The system could track what every single person is doing at every second, and compares and balances that against every other person, and also the total amount of peds in the game. I would think to accomplish all that would take some pretty serious computational power, along with the amount of coding and testing that goes into that. And we all know how much MA likes testing their codes...

Or the system could be based individually, perhaps with some of the code residing client side, and simply sends a "what did you spend?" message, and receives a "this is what you get" message, based on a few parameters like where you are in your own loot cycle, predetermined drop rates of items, and so on.

I've seen a lot of people say that they had bad loot while they were using their exploit. But when do people NOT find a reason for their poor loots? I mined almost exclusively during that time, and I actually had pretty good results. I track all my spending and I can say for certain that I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary during that time. Combined with the fact that I've been able to see some patterns in my own returns that would appear to have no dependence on anything else going on in the game, and it leads me to believe that what we loot (at least the TT value) is much more independent of other players than some might think.

Also bear in mind that the total value of ped in the universe is seen as a contingent liability on MA's books. It's not backed by anything tangible, so they can create as much of it as they like, and it will never affect them until someone requests it to be withdrawn. Even then, they can simply just delay the withdrawal.

Now there might be a lot of factors that go into WHY someone would get an ATH, but I don't think that seeing one that happened recently should be a reason to stop you from playing. Obviously if you've seen a lot happening recently, it shouldn't be a factor, as if you had played when you saw the first one, you might have been able to catch the next one.

 

[Norbert]

......................................................................

 

[DavinFelth]

There was a time i could say: "Wow...an ath omg"

But now its like: "Hm another ath...ok whatever...next.." xD

EXACTLY!!

 

[remontoire]

Used to hunt 50% less than usual on any day that the top hof was more than 20K - break if the system was liberal in giving peds to somebody else. But it got way too restrictive over time.

Then again, I haven't really had very bad loots lately, and thats rather strange.

 

[Miles]

The clustering of rare events doesn't mean they are suddenly more common - what is the average number of ATH's per month for the last few years?

I look at the HOF board most days, and it seemed like we had been going through a relative dry spell on ATH's for while, prior to the recent rush. The thing is, we are talking about a very small number (and percentage) of loot events, so it is particularly hard to draw any meaningful conclusions from them. ATH's happen, and will continue to happen - they will also continue to be extremely rare.

Watching the tracker seems to affect people's perceptions more than anything else. Not watching it works for me.



Miles

 

[Butch C]

I would prefer to see 10 players get a 10k hof or 20 players get 5k hofs than 1 person get a 93k hof.

Would you be complaining if it was you that got an ATH?

Or if you did get one, how would you feel coming to the forum and finding folks complaining about it?

I dont see him as complaining i see him as voicing his feelings at that moment and his thoughts on ATH's in general.

It's what forums are for.

 

[KijkkiJikki]

I'm slowly becoming convinced that there is no such thing as a loot pool. I think the idea that another person's losses fund some other person's gains is false.

-snip-

So this led me to believe that they either had to be sucking a lot of TT value out of the "loot pool" during that time, or the value they were getting was simply generated based on what the system "thought" they were spending. I look at the difference in systems for this. The system could track what every single person is doing at every second, and compares and balances that against every other person, and also the total amount of peds in the game. I would think to accomplish all that would take some pretty serious computational power, along with the amount of coding and testing that goes into that. And we all know how much MA likes testing their codes...

Or the system could be based individually, perhaps with some of the code residing client side, and simply sends a "what did you spend?" message, and receives a "this is what you get" message, based on a few parameters like where you are in your own loot cycle, predetermined drop rates of items, and so on.

It's not that tough for the system to track the total value of one or more loot pools if they exist and use that to limit the amount of payout.

Assume there are n lootpools (n has some value between 1 and a gazillion).
After probe drop, craft, or mob kill a request is sent to the loot server give_me_the_loot(pool_id, param_List).
the algorithm checks a stored value pool_total(pool_id) in determing the returned amount and also deducts the amount stored total. Decay adds to the stored amount.

There's really no need to track what every other person is doing apart from updating a value in a table. Not much computational power needed. Might be some issues with database locking but those are easily solvable.

Regards,
KikkiJikki

 

[Butch C]

Assume there are n lootpools (n has some value between 1 and a gazillion).

i bags the gazillion

 

[Corey 'Greyfox']

Well of coarse your not jealous, you can't be jealous of something you don't have.

Sorry, just felt like being a smart ass.

Meh, more ATH is good, means there's more peds being cycled in game.

 

[Butch C]

Well of coarse your not jealous, you can't be jealous of something you don't have.

I can, its real easy.

have 93k ATH not jealous
dont have 93k ATH a tad jealous.

Did your dad also tell you the ice cream man only rings his bell or plays music when he has no more icecream left?