CLD Future Price Speculation

[Kemp]

Determing the potentail value of CLDs is a very complex matter. Even though EU is a RCE, it still is a game and most players treat it that way. Players are people with all emotions that come with our species. This means that most players will not treat CLDs as a stone cold investments, like a stock market. They all have their own ways to deal with CLDs. I will try to summarize them into 5 categories:

1. The real hardcore, longterm players. People like Star, Rei and Angel from cK, NZR and Akoz. I do not know anything about the CLD balance of these players, these names just popped up first.
These kind of players are always on top of the game. Almost every new system or opportunity they try out right away. At the point when it costs alot of PED to even do so. They gain more skills in particular systems earlier then others and they benefit from early high sales prices of new crafted/looted items or their possibility to use the new system more advance before others do so they can offer a service. For example when the tiering system was introduced.
These kind of players have stuffed inventories, a high PED balance and 10+ years of experience with EU. They will have bought tons of CLDs right from the start, afraid to miss out any extra ped they can make when the system turns out to be a succes, taking once again the chance that MA screws up. With trading prices low, even below 1000 ped for a short while, they probably even have bought many more from their early weekly ROI payouts.
They already sat on a pile of CLDs before prices started rising seriously and they probably did not buy or sell many during the last year. They get a nice addition to their ped card every week and they wait to see how their investment develops.
2. A few bigshots holding a large amount of CLDs
3. The traders. They drive up the prices for quite some time already. They try to make a few buck for every transaction. They have always been here and they always will stay here. When prices settle, they get rid of their CLDs and find new ways to trade. They aren't ingame for longterm investments in entertaining their selves, let alone they care for any type of role-playing.
4. The dedicated average players. They play quite some time, they really play the game for fun, they have some CLDs might there ever be the possibility to build houses on the lots. Meanwhile they enjoy the extra ped they get every week.
5. The individuals, all with their own reasons to own and hold or sell CLDs.

When will all these different types of players decide that it is enough? Will they hold their CLDs, will they sell?
You tell me and I tell you.

 

[TiveXO]

you quote me and then ask me something which is answered in my quote already @Disabled

Hmm........

deeds are anyways only a good investment if you have to many ped ingame to use or trade them.
4 ped i do easy with 200 ped on trading per week.
so is it really worth ?? i'd say it really depends on your bankroll.

 

[valivill]

Here we got another doomsayer)) The sky is falling! everyone save your investments!!))





well i have more than 50 clds, i wonder how much time per week should u spend to make same revenue that i make out of 50 clds?

I know some people who has 400 clds or more. Whats your answer Mr. TiveXO?

Tive clearly said that it depends on the amount of ped on your pedcard.
If you only got 70k ped = 50 cld.
What he means is that you need to make a choice about the time you want to spend in this game.
When you got barely any time to make deals with ped vs items like ores/enmatters/armos/guns etc its better to put it all in cld.
When you got plenty of time its way easier to trade stuff to make 4 to 5 peds (weekly revenue ) vs 1 cld.

When you got plenty of time make a wise choice how much ped you want/need for trading and how much you want to keep for cld


This should be sufficient to answer your question.

 

[DISABLED]

If you only got 70k ped = 50 cld.

lol i got your point

 

[Wollongong]

Hmm........

seriously , who the fu** cares about houses ?

I do.

there are plenty, and doesnt matter where they are. no one wants them.
and what "use" can a house have ? its a house, lol

Yes, there are plenty. At a ridiculous high price, which is why people don't want to buy them.

who the f*** cares about politics ? in the end they do anyways what they want...........

I care.

(...)
the only reason to keep them is ROI.
and compare to RL invests is the ROI of deeds not as good because it counts to the ultra risky investments
and the ultra risky invests IRL have more then 20% ROI.
Please remember in the cause of a bankruptcy , only TT value counts anymore and a deed has none.
i dont belive MA will go bankrupt, but no one knows what happens in future. so doenst matter what people think CLD are risky.......

Actually, in the case of bankruptcy, I don't think we'll be getting tt back either, as we are just one of the many creditors demanding payment. So they are even more risky than you may think.

 

[Svarog]

Please remember in the cause of a bankruptcy , only TT value counts anymore and a deed has none.

MINDARK'S LIABILITY TOWARDS ANY PARTICIPANT SHALL, IF ACKNOWLEDGED, IN EACH INCIDENCE BE LIMITED TO NO MORE THAN THE TOTAL AMOUNT TRANSFERRED INTO THE INVOLVED ACCOUNT BY SAID PARTICIPANT UNDER THE SIX MONTHS PERIOD PRIOR TO THE INCIDENT.

So even if you have a fortune in pure peds but deposited only 100$ during the last 6 months, all you can expect back in case of shit hitting the fan is 90$ (after the withdrawal fee).

 

[AxeMurderer]

So even if you have a fortune in pure peds but deposited only 100$ during the last 6 months, all you can expect back in case of shit hitting the fan is 90$ (after the withdrawal fee).

If u define 'INCIDENCE' and 'shit hitting the fan' I can answer that

 

[Svarog]

If u define 'INCIDENCE' and 'shit hitting the fan' I can answer that

Not sure about "INCIDENCE" and is that the word they really intended to use, but shit will hit the fan if Jan Timkrans enters the office and asks are there any money left he isn't aware of

 

[starcollector]

For me CLD owners are the PPs of Calypso....
In 2011 SEE Virtual Worlds buy from MA Planet Calypso for 6.000.000$(google and you will find out is TRUE)
The same year MA takes back Calypso ( www.mindark.com read Notice after clicking on Partners)
And then they sell to players Calypso for the same amount (60.000*100$=6.000.000$)...
I am right or not that CLD owners are PPs of Calypso ...6.000.000=6.000.000....you speculate but why SEE left???

 

[Piotr]

For me CLD owners are the PPs of Calypso....
In 2011 SEE Virtual Worlds buy from MA Planet Calypso for 6.000.000$(google and you will find out is TRUE)
The same year MA takes back Calypso ( www.mindark.com read Notice after clicking on Partners)
And then they sell to players Calypso for the same amount (60.000*100$=6.000.000$)...
I am right or not that CLD owners are PPs of Calypso ...6.000.000=6.000.000....you speculate but why SEE left???

I barely remember but i think they were payin in parts and failed to pay parts in time, but correct me if im wrong

 

[starcollector]

I barely remember but i think they were payin in parts and failed to pay parts in time, but correct me if im wrong

Read all article here:

http://!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.wordpress.com/2012/09/26/


"And when SDS understand that they have to design their own mobs, items, blueprints and stuff, if they want to compete with Planet Arkadia or Planet Cyrene they brake the contract with MindArk and get out of the virtual business loosing some millions dollars."

SDS=SEE Digital Studios AB (“SEE Digital Studios”) is a subsidiary of SEE Virtual World Calypso, LLC.

 

[Strangelove]

I barely remember but i think they were payin in parts and failed to pay parts in time, but correct me if im wrong

They put down a $1 million deposit and lost it when they could not come up with the rest. MA essentially decided to get their $6 million from the player base.

 

[forgo]

I speculate rising values for CLDs in the future. Its days like these that I am waiting for.

Less than 9 CLDS on auction. As soon as we have a dry auction, the prices will rise by whatever people are willing to pay, which is more, and even more than that. Especially in this game....where people pay crazy amounts of ped for things just to get it now, and before the next guy.

If all of the deeds on auction had a 1500 price, people would still buy them to own them, especially before the chance runs out.

....and some people really don't care what they pay apparently, they just want the 4-5 ped a week.

 

[starcollector]

....and some people really don't care what they pay apparently, they just want the 4-5 ped a week.

Is a certain for you that each week income is 4-5 ped? For me not?....If a hunter use Arkadia weapons/amps/scopes ....they feed Arkadia Studios....If a hunter use Rocktropia weapons/amps/scops they feed NEVERDIE Studios...etc.

When RT and NI launched the BP systems were not in place for PP, catch up is a much more complicated affair...

We need the Weapons, becuase if we dont have them, then we are driving the economies of other planets, who are supplying them... Which means we are financing their DEV and studios and not our own, which means no more content for RT and no Fixes,

I hope your speculation will not affect ANYMORE TT return of hunters/miners see other theards .....If is bad will make hunters/miners quit or less deposit ...think about it ...


Now In Real Life I see people speculate on Wall Street..they go out happy...but also see people crying why?....because they speculate WRONG...

 

[Teiwaz Storm]

Is a certain for you that each week income is 4-5 ped? For me not?....If a hunter use Arkadia weapons/amps/scopes ....they feed Arkadia Studios....If a hunter use Rocktropia weapons/amps/scops they feed NEVERDIE Studios...etc.

You are wrong.
I can use Asi TEN Smuggler as long as I want on Calypso. Not a single pec will go to Arkadia Studios.
PPs get their small income connected to their specific gear when a) craft of this gear requires Planet specific (not found anywhere else) crafting material, b) that gear is crafted on their Planet. If I craft Cyrene's gun on Calypso, and all ingredients can be found on Calypso, Cyrene Dev gets null for this process. And null for me using that gun outside Cyrene.
I hope now you understand how it works.

 

[Fade]

I still can't get over the potential situation where MA just decides that no more payouts will be made to CLD holders. They can do that at any time, can they not? If it was not for that, I'd be buying some.

As to the retort that it would tick off players and there would be a mass exodus... well, they have nerfed similiar investments of players many times before. Would it bother them so much if there was an exodus of players that are not paying MA, but instead are being paid by MA?

Please correct my reasoning if I am wrong.

 

[DISABLED]

1498 is the cheapest pricee on auction atm. The start price for CLDs will be over 1500 PEDs next week (can be exception in case of any force majeure).

 

[Cerberis]

1498 is the cheapest pricee on auction atm. The start price for CLDs will be over 1500 PEDs next week (can be exception in case of any force majeure).

Tax avarages:

Last month - ~3.8 ped/week
Last 3 month - ~4.2 ped/week
last 6 month - ~4.4 ped/week

If tax is 3.8 ped/week at 1500 ped/CLD u need 7.5 year to get peds back. Already better to buy a LA. So i think more and more players will sell amounts of 100-150 and will buys LAs. So i think price wont go up much any more, should stay at this point or go down

 

[Svarog]

1498 is the cheapest pricee on auction atm. The start price for CLDs will be over 1500 PEDs next week (can be exception in case of any force majeure).

The peak is only because of increased activity after the VU, will be back at 1410+/-10 in a week.

 

[DISABLED]

The peak is only because of increased activity after the VU, will be back at 1410+/-10 in a week.

i'm rly tired of doomsayers... i'll pm u in a week.

 

[AtamiKiangola]

i'm rly tired of doomsayers... i'll pm u in a week.

I think MA will add the ability to create fire and you can then burn your CLD, making them even more rare to buy.
If not, I'm still happy I got my CLD's

(now that was a useful addition to the discussion wasn't it )

 

[Piotr]

Already better to buy a LA.

Speaking from personal opinion, i prefer CLD's over LA even if return is lower because:

1: if i need peds urgently, CLDs sell fast at normal price, whilst u need to be lucky to find buyer at right price in short time, and so far CLD price only went up (also increasing 'return')
2: i can use CLDs as collateral to loan lets say imk2 (which i actually do)
3: as playerbase grow (hopin it will) returns will go up too (ofc it can go down aswell)

 

[Etopia]

Speaking from personal opinion, i prefer CLD's over LA even if return is lower because:

1: if i need peds urgently, CLDs sell fast at normal price, whilst u need to be lucky to find buyer at right price in short time, and so far CLD price only went up (also increasing 'return')
2: i can use CLDs as collateral to loan lets say imk2 (which i actually do)
3: as playerbase grow (hopin it will) returns will go up too (ofc it can go down aswell)

you forget that mobs , and mining place change over the time , so a LA may pay good today , and have shit return next update...

 

[Svarog]

Speaking from personal opinion, i prefer CLD's over LA even if return is lower because

Not to mention that you don't have to bother with managing it, advertising, running events etc.

 

[Doer]

1498 is the cheapest pricee on auction atm. The start price for CLDs will be over 1500 PEDs next week (can be exception in case of any force majeure).

And a couple hours earlier, and for days before that, the price was foundering at around 1400. Don't confuse the market-manipulator buyout of auction for a sudden magic change in market interest. It's a mini pump-and-dump process.

For all we know, it was you.

 

[DISABLED]

And a couple hours earlier, and for days before that, the price was foundering at around 1400. Don't confuse the market-manipulator buyout of auction for a sudden magic change in market interest. It's a mini pump-and-dump process.

Don't confuse real world economy and in-game economy. I agree with mini pump process, but could u give me any reason for dumping (with the exception when Maxim is selling his CLDs what i called force majeure in my previous post)?

 

[Doer]

Don't confuse real world economy and in-game economy. I agree with mini pump process, but could u give me any reason for dumping (with the exception when Maxim is selling his CLDs what i called force majeure in my previous post)?

What I mean is that the resellers buy up CLDs over time, then pump up the price with some auction manipulation tactics and word of mouth, sell off their stock, and then let the market cool off and buy up a new supply at the resulting slightly lower prices. This is helped by in-universe events that cause some natural fluctuation in interest and buying. It's not quite the extreme of the pump and dump, but the process of selling off the built up stock does help to cool off the pumped up market price.

The same thing happens (and has been happening) with other resources/items for years, it's just that seldom has such a juicy, high-demand item like CLD presented itself as a target.

 

[forgo]

Is a certain for you that each week income is 4-5 ped? For me not?....If a hunter use Arkadia weapons/amps/scopes ....they feed Arkadia Studios....If a hunter use Rocktropia weapons/amps/scops they feed NEVERDIE Studios...etc.
.

This is not true, cld revenue always gets a cut of any activity in the universe for every player that started on caly.
Many do not realize, hofs on ark, pay into cld ....just less. With exception of ark, rt, ni avatars, the originating pp gets that revenue.

Since a vast majority started on caly, the revenue is much higher, than other planets could be, for years yet.
They could close caly, and cld will still pay.

 

[TiveXO]

This is not true, cld revenue always gets a cut of any activity in the universe for every player that started on caly.
Many do not realize, hofs on ark, pay into cld ....just less. With exception of ark, rt, ni avatars, the originating pp gets that revenue.

Since a vast majority started on caly, the revenue is much higher, than other planets could be, for years yet.
They could close caly, and cld will still pay.

Thats not true, only the planet where loot drops is getting payed (getting income) , and the amount of loot which drops is made by the player which cycle on this planet.

The CLD's are only for outpays on planet calypso !! this is aswell: CLD owner's are part owners of planet calypso without any rights.
60k Deed's = 6 mil US $ which MA want to sell planet calypso.
So what they did. create a outsourced dev team for calypso and share the biggest part of the rest income
from calypso with the investors (CLD owners).

I dont pay automatically in CLD's if i mine on RT or Arkaida.
If it would be like this, RT,Ark and even the "new" Cyrene would be bankrupt already.

Thats aswell a reason why MindArk influenced the Arkadian economy negative with their SIB-gap and the time peroid they took to introduce new guns.
They could have done it all in once. First make new guns, then chanfge system and not chage SIB-levels and leave a huge GAP which made some players stopped , first on ark and later the whole game. I dont wanna mention now names.
But the point is , Arkadia was a pretty uprising Planet and became already dangerous for Calypsian economy.
I think 1 year more success and ark would had 1/3 of whole community as permanent citizens.

Did anyone notice....Arkadian mining sucks completely because A) wayswayswaysways to various now and
B) Most ores selling harder then before, in cause of the changes in Nov/Dec 2012 ?

and C) the revenue this year seems to be more stable then the year before ?
Why ? Arkadia "heavy-industires" were broken under puspose (dev-decision).
Now Ark is only a planet for hunters anymore. i never would go with lvl 5 amps on this planet again.
And crafters only go for small things. The high lvl weapons are nice but comptete to much from cyrene and caly guns.
Ark is busy, but not same anymore. And same as RT became a planet which lives from export.
60% of mining Loot is NON-planetary-specific minerals now !!!
(see here prooven myself) This influenced aswell the ROI of CLD's because many permanent arkaidan "migrated" players went back to calypso now. And ark became more a "weekend" trip. before many players stayed permanently.
Now Arkadia lives from newings and specials.

Well you should look in the general laws between MA and business partners.
New Partners in entropia have it anyways heavy to get a own player base. If on the few they get, a part of the income would being cut, how they should finance it ?
And why should they pay for CLD's ?? CLD's never were talked about they count for the universe !!!
CLD means aswell "CALYPSO Land Deed" and not "Entropia Shares".


Hf all..............

 

[Doer]

It's an established fact that the birth planet of an avatar gets a cut of its loot. This is to encourage PPs to find their own playerbase instead of parasitizing the existing playerbase. I don't remember the percentages anymore but i most definitely remember this from my time on a PP wannabe team.

I would expect that in the case of the CLDs this is share of off-planet loot for a Caly player is evenly divided between the Caly dev team and the CLDs.