My loot theory

[DoubleWolf]

So the 60-70 % is an estimate based on the return on a hunt to hunt basis.
400 ped hunts usually result in TT loot values between 200 and 500 ped. After repairs approx 80 ped return is really annoying on the 200 ped return hunts.

Your decay bill is usually 30% of your costs???

The values you received as loot sound pretty typical, but if your decay bill is that high, it's no wonder you only get 60-70% back. Reduce your decay bill and your returns will go up.

The 90% figure is usually based only on those costs necessary to generate the loot, not any secondary costs like armor and fap. I think extractor costs in mining probably fit into this as well, since the loot is counted toward your avatar on the find (as evidenced by when the global message is received), and not after the extraction. Certainly vehicle costs like oil and damage/repair would be a secondary cost as well.

So if you're spending too much in secondary costs, it will do nothing but eat into your returns over time...

 

[Xavier_Jr]

I use "long term" quite a bit too when talking about loot returns. I don't think you can give a hard number on it due to the fact everyone plays at different speeds and at different costs.

I understand you. It is very difficult to tell to others who plays many more intensively than you; what must to be a "long term". However i am asking the same question to players with many more experience than you. For example as a reference Falkao predicted "long term" as 100k peds turnover. Ace Flyster obtained only 86% of return rate, after 90K peds turnover,



But my question is, principally for avatars with real experience in the game. Thats who really spend money in the game.. How long is a "long term"? To recycled peds daily per 4k / 5k / 7k / (X) K?

I would imagine between 1 month - 3 months should be sufficient providing you are playing at a sufficiently active level (ie a few times a week)

I dont believe "long term" would be a measurement of time (in correspondence "light year" is not a time measurement). I think is a spend measurement. Can you define what is sufficiently active level? 3k/day 4k/day 5k/day or a shooting / day ??




Please lets go, my hypothesis is: With less active players now, "long term" is more long now than two years ago. But we need to have an idea about what is "long term" now; to try our actual game in better conditions...

The best answer, in this thread, at this moment it was told by Sheina. (Maybe 1 million of Peds turnover)

 

[DoubleWolf]

However i am asking the same question to players with many more experience than you.

What are you trying to say?

 

[Xavier_Jr]

What are you trying to say?

What you knows very well.

 

[DoubleWolf]

What you knows very well.

I knows very well what?

What I do know is that I've played this game every day for more than three years, tracked my loot for nearly two of them. I also know that I haven't deposited in over two years and I've doubled my net worth in that time, and it hasn't come from sweating or trading.

So why don't you tell me what I know, smart guy?

 

[Xavier_Jr]

I knows very well what?

What I do know is that I've played this game every day for more than three years, tracked my loot for nearly two of them. I also know that I haven't deposited in over two years and I've doubled my net worth in that time, and it hasn't come from sweating or trading.

So why don't you tell me what I know, smart guy?

Your playing style is like a laboratory for the game. But you can not always extend their findings to those who make the game an "industry".

I said before: Time is not a measurement of playing here. I have many friends with 4 years here, but his level of game always was limited. (10 globals per year)... Not always you can extrapole his results to other people who have the same long time, but can use amplifiers level 13 or kill daspletors...

So simple like that. (We are in the forum a long time. We know each other. And there is a saying in my country that says, "between Gypsies are not going to read the hands")

 

[DoubleWolf]

Then prove anything I've said wrong...

Fact is, it's not as about ped spent (though you seem to think it is) as it is about how much you do, and how many opportunities you give yourself to collect loot.

 

[Xavier_Jr]

Then prove anything I've said wrong...

Fact is, it's not as about ped spent (though you seem to think it is) as it is about how much you do, and how many opportunities you give yourself to collect loot.

As I said before, your opinion is respectable for me. In fact many times we agreed earlier. But this time I'm asking those who have full experience in the game. And, I did my question for them.

No offense ... You and I know quite a lot this game. But what I'm asking. Be absolutely certain, that neither you nor I know.

 

[DoubleWolf]

But this time I'm asking those who have full experience in the game. And, I did my question for them.

Well, you didn't say you were picky about who you wanted an answer from. You posed the question in response to Mega, who is known for being one of the greatest sweaters of all time (No offense Mega )

 

[Xavier_Jr]

Well, you didn't say you were picky about who you wanted an answer from. You posed the question in response to Mega, who is known for being one of the greatest sweaters of all time (No offense Mega )

Yes but Mega has a higher experience in game than you.
How many iron challenges (10k) have you completed..??
How many globals and Uberloots, have you achieved in this game? Do you believe is more than those from Mega? (

I ask to Mega an answer because he puts this theory here...

But I am interested in answers from those who have middle level or higher (with 90% TT return, obviously). (because, usually in this level, people loose a lot of money; for that reason, i would like to know an answer from them)

Besides, do not forget this: It's not about money deposits exactly, if not about spending money (peds recycled) It is not the same.

 

[DoubleWolf]

Yes but Mega has a higher experience in game than you.
How many iron challenges (10k) have you completed..??
How many globals and Uberloots, have you achieved in this game? Do you believe is more than those from Mega?

Fair enough. But you don't have to spend years upon years and millions of ped to figure out how things work around here. There's people in this game that have spent considerably more time and money here than I have that still don't know nearly as much as I do. This much I can promise you

 

[Mega]

Well the thing about theories, is they aren't facts.

And what I have written are theories, that can't easily be proved but could well be disproved - and may be amended and are welcome to be discussed and challenged.

Not that it matters too much but for the curious, I have completed 5 Iron challenges (Argonaut, Hiryuu, Molisk, Foul, Shinkiba) and the Bronze for Shinkiba.

There will be those who cycle much more ped per week than me, and those who do less - but the return % should be roughly the same (IMO).





(Ironically, I've been suffering from relatively bad loot for the past week, so am hoping that something alters to put me back to 90% )

 

[Xavier_Jr]

Fair enough. But you don't have to spend years upon years and millions of ped to figure out how things work around here. There's people in this game that have spent considerably more time and money here than I have that still don't know nearly as much as I do. This much I can promise you

Yes, could be. Many people says about himself, that only knows to do clicks with mouse. That ís true. However, nothing guarantee to you, if your levels of knowledges is scalable to higher levels. To think that, is not good. Because nobody knows if exists different rules in function of levels. That could only be solved having the real experience.

In fact, survive doing mining, with a few of peds, is possible. You only need to find a good spot. With ores or matters with good MU (cooper, cobalt, gazz, etc). Using 10 probes each two hours, and if you see time is good (70% return rate or higher) increase your probes to 20 or 30 in that round. By the other hand, If time is not good, you can go to neas to recover losses (50% of 10 peds is only 5 peds). (3 hours from sweating let you recover 6 peds). With so routine of working, you could survive long time in the game.

However, if you want an experience more exciting, maybe decide to do a hunting round with 300 peds of ammunition. But if you have a bad time. It is impossible to recover 150 peds with 3 hours of sweating. Then you decide to do 75 hours (boring) of sweating. Or you decide to do a new deposit in the game. As you easily can seen, it not equivalent one experience or another experience. Solutions are not scalable.

Thats all, so simple like that. It has nothing to do with questioning your knowledge. I respect your knowledges, as I said you before. Only i am talking about other levels of gaming experience.

 

[Rechinul]

i didnt had the mod to read whole post. Readed first "Theory" then ive decided to "Speak"

id say Loot sistem its like SLOTS. Each "Click" its a New Game always. (so not matter if u loose 1k 10k or 100k, u Must be Damn Lucky to get back your looses / make Profit). I think Game dont create a log with loose / profit on each avatar. They logging chats, and other but for sure ... if they got "Loose / Win" i`d request for my track lol ... wonder how many K`s loose, and how much i have back ) (i guess i got @ 10-15% from whats loose).

Everyone knows that NEW players got more chances to ATH / HOF Big than ... olders.

 

[Leona]

So the 60-70 % is an estimate based on the return on a hunt to hunt basis.
400 ped hunts usually result in TT loot values between 200 and 500 ped. After repairs approx 80 ped return is really annoying on the 200 ped return hunts.
Might be that MA thinks I had my share of high loots (had 6 ubers with a total of approx 30k peds over 4 years, so really not that much) compared to my level of deposits or that I'm on long and steep downward slope still. I do get the feeling that I'm on the low end when comparing return with friends.
All of the $100 per month depo'ed goes to activities, if I buy some thing new I usually have to put in some extra.

So your average daily hunting turnover is like 100ped or..? Because if it is higher, and i think it is, then something doesn't work out here.

 

[Mischief]

Your decay bill is usually 30% of your costs???

The values you received as loot sound pretty typical, but if your decay bill is that high, it's no wonder you only get 60-70% back. Reduce your decay bill and your returns will go up.

The 90% figure is usually based only on those costs necessary to generate the loot, not any secondary costs like armor and fap. I think extractor costs in mining probably fit into this as well, since the loot is counted toward your avatar on the find (as evidenced by when the global message is received), and not after the extraction. Certainly vehicle costs like oil and damage/repair would be a secondary cost as well.

So if you're spending too much in secondary costs, it will do nothing but eat into your returns over time...

What can I say, currently using pixie in argo mission, not much decay there. FG Elec IV however cost some to fix after each hunt and so does the implant. Argo isn't the most eco to hunt nor is MF very eco either so I guess I'll just bite the bullet until Argo mission is over and then see what will come out of it.
I have my self to blame for the low eco, but reason for posting was more to show that the 90% return is very much depending on what you are hunting and how you do it.

So your average daily hunting turnover is like 100ped or..? Because if it is higher, and i think it is, then something doesn't work out here.

Yes, daily turnover exceeds 100 ped a lot. 200-400 ped ammo/hunt is the usual depending on how much time I have. So turnover incl repairs is 250 to 500 ped. And when depo is all used up, well, there are other ways to "play". But as I said above, just in other words - Argo really sucks.

EDIT: Noticed that I wrote "After repairs approx 80 ped return is really annoying on the 200 ped return hunts", in the post. Grammar was way off here since I meant that repair cost was approx 80 ped, not 80 ped left after repair.

 

[DoubleWolf]

EDIT: Noticed that I wrote "After repairs approx 80 ped return is really annoying on the 200 ped return hunts", in the post. Grammar was way off here since I meant that repair cost was approx 80 ped, not 80 ped left after repair.

Ah that changes a lot then. I was calculating you as having a 120 ped repair bill. On a 400 ped cost hunt. That still leaves you with 20%, but I think the way you go about calculating your returns is a little different than what most are talking about. You need to count your total offensive costs versus what you get in loot. So if you do a 400 ped ammo hunt, and let's assume the entire 80 ped of decay was on your MF chip, then your total offensive costs were 480 ped. If your average loots are like you say, somewhere between 200 and 500 ped, then you could quite easily be averaging a 90% return and not realize it if you're not tracking your own data.

Without digging into my own records for this again, I can tell you that on average, about 24% of my runs come back with greater than 100%, leaving 76% of my runs coming back in the red. My worst runs where I had at least 100 loot generating opportunities have never come back with lower than 30%, but about 25% of runs come back with less than 50%.

But if I was basing this more on an estimate, and knew that every time I deposited I eventually run out of money, I would probably tend to think I had a much lower average as well, since a larger percentage of my runs come back negative. The only reason I bothered to start tracking is because I really had no clue what my returns were, and I wanted to see if this whole 90% thing was true. Personally, I've found that it is.

I have my self to blame for the low eco, but reason for posting was more to show that the 90% return is very much depending on what you are hunting and how you do it.

I've found it doesn't really matter what you do, but that every thing is related. What you lose hunting may be gained in mining or crafting. It just depends on what you're doing when the adjustment comes along. A few of the mining logs I've seen come in at lower than 90% return overall, but it makes no mention of their activities in hunting or crafting. I seem to remember reading one (can't remember now which) where they even mentioned that they got an uber in hunting, but didn't factor it into their log because it didn't happen in mining.

 

[Mega]

I've stopped hunting for the moment.

 

[Mischief]

Thanks for info, DoubleWolf.

As you say, it seems I've been calculating in a different way than most do.

Now all I have to do is decide whether I want to keep track of my numbers again or not...

 

[Kimmi]

IT`S OFFICIAL!!!11111

In order to get high loot you must circle the dead creatures corpse 3 times counter clockwise and then loot-click on its right hind leg. Now tell me, how many of you are actually tempted to try?

Posted on EF 2min ago!!!!111

 

[Serica]

IT`S OFFICIAL!!!11111





Posted on EF 2min ago!!!!111

I think Kim's been reading too many of R4tt3xx's posts... or maybe ...

 

[JoseMTacoral]

1) Everything you lose in Entropia is noted, and recorded for future reference.
2) When your losses are paid back is random.
3) Entropia attempts to repay / stop you losing more than 90% of TT value over the long term.
5) If one profession just doesn't seem to be working, try one of the other two.
6) You'll have bad days and good days - see 1).
9) People making Ped in Entropia tend to be v. quiet on forum, spot them, and copy them if possible.
10) Mark-up is important, whether you hunt, mine or craft, try and sell for more than TT.
14) You are paying for entertainment, no subscription. Cinemas, pubs, nightclubs & casinos don't offer refunds.
15) Are you using equipment that you can use at 100% efficiency? Dont complain about losses if not.
16) Hunt / mine / craft within your personal budget. For ex - dont hunt Proteron if you only have 200 ped.

Everything you buy at the TT and all you repairs in the RT are recorded . Also everything you sell in the TT is recorded. The greater the difference in favor of purchases and repairs more likely to get good loot.

It should be noted that in the short run, the difference only improve the odds, so you geting a global, a HOF or a ATH will never be a certainty, only more or less likely.

For the hunter, miner or the manufacturer the possibility of "winning" is associated with the MU of the objects looted. The MU makes possible exceed the 90% of loot return (long term) MindArk offers.
Only MU makes it possible to overcome the 90% returns that MindArk offers (in the long term).

We must be very rational in choosing places to mine, the mobs to hunt or the BP to manufacture, must be very consistent with the skills and equipment, otherwise no loot or markup will help us.

 

[steffel]

Everything you buy at the TT and all you repairs in the RT are recorded . Also everything you sell the TT is also recorded. The greater the difference in favor of purchases and repairs more likely to get good loot.

falsify this by buying loads of ammo from tt and sell it to a friend p2p and then repeat. won't affect your loot at all. if something affects loot, then it must be regarding expenditures in the field, not at the tt.

 

[Karmic]

falsify this by buying loads of ammo from tt and sell it to a friend p2p and then repeat. won't affect your loot at all. if something affects loot, then it must be regarding expenditures in the field, not at the tt.

Steffel posted in a loot theory thread again! I thought we agreed to stop trying to disprove silly theories!

 

[Tekkie]

I have been playing a few years and have my own theories on the loot system. Not going to say too much but I suspect too many people believe what they are told rather than what actually happens. Its easy to confuse as the "cycle" is so long but I assure you, its much simpler than what many of you think (or at least I believe it to be)

 

[Tekkie]

btw... what is this "90% return" shite people always quote? 90% of ammo, 90% of ammo + decay? what is decay? doesn't a stack of ammo decay each time a gun is shot? is that considered as spending or decay?

Go test

 

[travrevyen]

What is Decay? That's the question. Ofcourse nobody knows how the loot mechanism works, well the gameprogammer must know. But I think every mob has a certain value they must give back to the players. So if you spend 100 PED on one mob then it will not give You 100 PED back only 1-2 PED back depending wich mob You shoot. So it doesnt matter how You shoot the mob, its all arranged so when you click loot the mob the Game starts to calculate what You are getting in Loot. Sometimes I think there is mistakes and sometimes there is waiting time called lag. There is nothing we can do about it. Lets hope the future looks brighter.

You can also kill a mob using a sword naked. No ammo and no armor. And lets just say that the mob can not kill me. it does no damage at all and it can not move. Where is the loot coming from? Thats the Question.

 

[travrevyen]

Entropia is Tracking 1 000 000/1 usd

http://www.entropiaplatform.com/entropia-platform/technology/database-logging/

Look what I found today.
"Database Accuracy
Operations of Virtual Worlds and Online Games generate enormous amounts of data. For example, in Entropia Universe millions of activities are logged every hour. As for the economy, all economic transactions in Entropia Universe are monitored and possible to track down to one 1 000 000th of one USD. Since all activities in Entropia Universe are based on the same tracking principle as the economic transactions, all activities an avatar takes part in can be tracked with the same accuracy."

 

[Jennson]

What is Decay? That's the question. Ofcourse nobody knows how the loot mechanism works, well the gameprogammer must know. But I think every mob has a certain value they must give back to the players. So if you spend 100 PED on one mob then it will not give You 100 PED back only 1-2 PED back depending wich mob You shoot. ...snip....

That would mean loot band doesn't raise when hunting the mob more expensive, e.g. Opalo with E-Amp 15

 

[travrevyen]

yes it would mmm damn I think im lost here